I could give you all a history but it would take WAY too long. If you want to look me up, do a search for totallymessedup or grasshopper and you may find my TONS of old threads/posts. I was here for about 2 years a few years ago and was helped by, and helped many others cope with this kind if thing.
Well, here I am again, and I can't say I am 100% sure I want to be here. I am 100% sure I wish I didn't have a reason to be but I do, so here I am.
In a nutshell, my wife had an affair for over a year and using divorce busting techniques learned from the book and from the community here, I feel like I saved my marriage. We have been fairly happy ever since. We are both at 40 years old, with a 9 and 7 year old boys.
What brings me here is lately my wife has been going out with "friends", something that she used to do a lot when she was having the affair, and not too much since until about a month ago. The going out with friends part is not the issue so much as they are friends I don't know, and at least one single man who I believe is more interested in her than just friends. She swears this is just a group thing, that it's not in any way a dating thing, and that she just after 9 years staying home with the kids (she is a stay-at-home-mum) she needs a life again. I THINK she may be telling the truth but...
As a little more context, OUR life has continued to be fine. Our sex life actually has gotten better (it totally died during the affair last time).
What has changed though is that she seems to have very little interest in family stuff. She doesn't clean much at all, she doesn't really interact with the boys as much as she used to, she has chosen to go out with her friends instead of keeping plans with us as a family, etc.
It's looking to me to be more of a midlife crisis than an affair... or both. Oh, and this guy I suspect is interested in her, or at worst may be more than just a friend is 25, as are I suspect most of the others in this group.
I am struggling with how to behave. I have turned back into the ass that was partly responsible for pushing her away long ago and I hate it. I am constantly questioning her about where she's been, going and who she's with (she says I text and call her constantly...which I suppose is true). In response, she says she feels like she's married to her dad and intentionally stops answering her phone sometimes. I have started getting very emotional, angry, paranoid and all the things I fought SO hard to stop being during the affair.
Like I said, I am really struggling with how to get back on track, and last time I struggled with that, I came here... so here I am. I am unsure if I am in the right place but until I find out this is more than just a radical shift in my wife's behavior (midlife crisis anyone?), and is an affair, I suppose this is as good a place as any to start... again. Jeez.
I just want to do the right thing. I just want to get back to my roots I re-grew my marriage from, that I planted here long ago. So do I just "detach" "GAL" "agree" and all that stuff to deal with this? Do I "let" her continue to go out with these people who I don't know, and apparently she has little interest in having meet me? Is it a big d--k move on my part to even think like I have the right to "let" her go out. Is that one of my problems? I am a bit of a controller. Do I trust her when she says no matter what she's NOT interested in seeing anyone else but that she does like going out with these people (including this guy) and sees nothing wrong with it?
I have to tell you, I have been close to calling it quits just on the fact that this FEELS so much like it did when she was having the affair but my whole being wants to believe it's not.
So, hopefully this community can help me now as much as it did then.
Oh, and if anyone really wants ALL my history, I can try to post links. It will take you several days/weeks/months to get through it all though. You were warned
Grasshopper, I find myself back here after a long absense as well. I filed for D after 5 years of H`s MLC. I hate to say it but your W seems to be slipping back, and you know the signs.
I did all the wrong things too after I DB for years. H was coming around I thought, but he was only brewing. My H also sees nothing wrong with what he does.
My history is also very long, just know I know what you`re going through, and only you will know when it`s time to move on. My time has come only because H is still stuck, still doesn`t L me, blah, blah, blah. There`s nothing I can do, except start living my life again. I L my H, I have to let him go.
Thanks Celestial. I think you were around during my first time here. Sorry to hear about your situation. I am not at all sure I am heading towards where I think I am but as you say, I do know the signs as much as anyone. That said, one of the reasons I actually didn't want to come here was that I remembered MANY people here were supportive but there were also a few where were not so much. When I say supportive, I mean 100% committed to helping people save a marriage and in that, 100% committed to doing things that may seem counter-intuitive but as I am a witness to, actually DO work in the long run (e.g. DBing).
So to that, I am looking for help to work on my part of this and I think in reading the MLC sticky thread with the parts from the chapter in DB, I took that first step. There was a lot of help to be found there, and it took me back to when I immersed myself in these thoughts and techniques... and I do believe they saved my marriage.
I understand if this is MLC, it may be a much tougher road this time. I am honestly not sure I am up for it because there is a LOT more going on in our lives (lots of financial/business issues.. that may be contributing factors to all this) and I am already under tremendous pressure without the added issues of my wife's new behavior.
But here I am, and at least for now, I am willing to re-learn the skills I need to give my marriage a chance, so much as I can alone.
God, I hope there aren't many of "my people" still left here after all these years but if you are still hanging around, then you already know what I am about to say and do... I tend to answer my own posts/add to them a lot. It's my catharsis. It's part journal, part call for help. Many people said it helped them not only understand my problems, but theirs as well, so here goes...
Anyway, to add to my OP, the thing that is totally killing me right now is the paranoia, and I KNOW 95% of it is all in my head. More than that I look to her to "fix" it but the things I ask her to do add fuel to her fire of feeling controlled and not able to have a life outside the house. I have to agree that as much as I ask her to put herself in my shoes to understand how her actions make me feel (yea, yea, yea, how I CHOOSE to allow her actions to affect my feelings), when I put myself in her shoes, I must seem like pretty much a crazy a-hole a lot of the time. It must also bring back bad feelings of the man that she learned to dislike so much in the year(s) leading to the affair. No, I don't take any responsibility for her actions back then but I surely do take responsibility for my own that contributed to a marriage that was not very good at the time.
Oh, and to add some classic MLC triggers, there has been a rash of deaths in the family and I know it's affected my wife a lot. Lot's of that "considering her own mortality" going on. Me, I've just learned to love my family even more cuz they might not always be there. Pisses me off that she doesn't have the same reaction. I suppose that's part of my problem in expecting her to react to things how I do. Note to self; work on that.
Can you defuse the fear and resentment trigger about going out and cultivating a separate life by discussing it in MC? Is it the amount of time she spends out, that you don't do the same, that you don't have shared time out together? Is this something that can be discussed openly in counseling preventatively so you don't alienate W by allowing yourself to be triggered (and understandably)?
What I'm suggesting is a neutral environment to discuss her view of you as "paranoid and controlling" and how you act that way due to fear and her prior affair. How to stop this cycle if she's casting you in a parental role and you are going along with it out of your own (justified) fear?
THANK YOU so much for replying. I am really struggling right now and you have said some really helpful things and asked some thought provoking questions. Let me answer/respond best I can;
First of all, I am out a LOT. I have a full-time job and then I also work as a wedding photographer on the weekends. That's part of the problem. W sees me as being gone all the time and really, lately, we have less and less to show for it. She says she just needs to have friends again. She needs to have adult interaction. She says she has a hard time believing me, but I want that for her. That said, I have a long history of being somewhat anti-social and distrusting of her friends, even before the affair so...
Direct answers:
"Can you defuse the fear and resentment trigger about going out and cultivating a separate life by discussing it in MC"
She totally rejects any kind of therapy. I went when we were going through the affair. It helped a lot but she never showed any interest in what I was doing or going herself.
"Is it the amount of time she spends out, that you don't do the same, that you don't have shared time out together?"
Not really (yet) and yes. So far, she's only been out a handful of times, and says that's all it will ever be. Maybe once a week, once every couple weeks. Then again, on Easter we had plans to see a movie as a family after my parents left and all of a sudden after they left she said she didn't feel like going to the movie and she was going to go out with her friends instead. That hurt. Of course we had an argument about it, all the while she remained fairly calm and informed me that I was over-reacting and making a huge deal out of what was just a group of friends having dinner. Never mind that this one guy is the only one of these people who ever seems to call her.
"Is this something that can be discussed openly in counseling preventatively so you don't alienate W by allowing yourself to be triggered (and understandably)?"
I am trying. It seems like I do well for a bit, then go back to being triggered and act like an ass (as you say, justifiably so sometimes). For her part, she does things that don't help like staying out much later than she says, not calling, etc. She claims that my need for her to check in is a lot of what's making her feel like daddy is watching over her.
The rest of what you suggested may be addressed by those responses.
I am going to try to stop allowing myself to be triggered by the same things over and over.
One important part of my history is that my wife admitted the first affair shortly after it started and really didn't try to hide it. This time is different because she is still claiming that she has no intention of being with this guy and no matter what his feelings are (and I am fairly sure what they are) she is ONLY a friend to him. She even made sure to tell me that she loved me and only wanted me but just needed to have a life too. That was one of the first convos we had when she went out with these people the first time. Since then there have been HUGE blow-out fights and lots said (especially when she's been drinking) that have done a lot of damage. That's part of what I want to try to stop.
I can't help but feel like I am over-reacting to a certain extent. I know all about EA's but I also know that there are plenty of people who have friends of the opposite sex. I am trying to rectify the fact that I actually DO trust my wife to a certain extent. I believe her when she says nothing is going on but what I don't believe is that there will never be something going on. Do I just work on my issues and for lack of better word "trust" her for now? I want so much to do that but it's really hard.
I didn't read all of your 268 pages of posts but it doesn't look like you posted in MLC before. I will give you links to the resources for you to study. The LBS link should be particularly helpful for you to start to work on you.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
Remember that in the stages of MLC it does NOT go 1,2,3,4,5,6 but can get all mixed up and repeat itself and have more than one stage at once. Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
Last edited by OldPilot; 04/06/1004:50 PM. Reason: Links did not work now they do
GH :I can't help but feel like I am over-reacting to a certain extent. I know all about EA's but I also know that there are plenty of people who have friends of the opposite sex. I am trying to rectify the fact that I actually DO trust my wife to a certain extent. I believe her when she says nothing is going on but what I don't believe is that there will never be something going on. Do I just work on my issues and for lack of better word "trust" her for now? I want so much to do that but it's really hard.
It's a tricky situation. Seems you both need to negotiate something that makes everyone happy or you will drive her further away by doing things she perceives as controlling.
Can you spend more time with adults together in groups as a couple and regular schedule more of a shared social life?
Can you go on more dates alone together?
Seems her wanting a separate social life is reasonable if you also both maintain a shared one.
You're not going to KEEP her from having an affair by fighting with her. Maybe if you started individual counseling to help you with your triggers and invited her in to one or two sessions at some point years later she would consider it. You could tell her you would like for her to come for her to help you on YOUR stuff maybe. I don't know. Just a suggestion. I would only bring it up once though and not let IT become an issue too.
Seems like you did a good job the first time to put the M back together but it's hard when you have lingering issues that W won't help with. Maybe there's a way to discuss these things with her in the future in a non-confrontational way so it doesn't lead to an explosion.
Seems like discussing it late at night when she gets home late after drinking is a recipe for disaster. Just make a rule against that and follow it.
