From my perspective, Retrouvaille was quite successful for you guys. This is what I understand: (1) she feels closer to you now than b/f the weekend, (2) she agreed to continue with the dialogue, (3) she kept pulling you close last night, (4) she experienced "passion" from a kiss like she hasn't felt from you in a while, and (5) she wants to go out together.
IMHO, you have your miracle but just don't see it yet. Congratulations...you reconnected! You guys are on the right path. My W and I go to Retrouvaille this Friday...I pray and hope to have similar results. Wish me luck.
Kind Regards, LFH
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
Hey UD - the testosterone gel has largely done the job, but yeah I've used that before -
LFH - thank you for the encouragement. I came home tonight, she was in the bath and OK with me coming in to talk as long as I didn't look. She said "I still feel close to you!" Said she'd been thinking about me all day.
Doesn't want to do the dialogue anymore - saying that we're good at talking anyway.
Said that she's still mad and wants to hit me - saying that the weekend made her realize how much she doesn't want the relationship to end, and she's mad at me even though it's not my "fault". Says she wants to enjoy this time with me that we have left.
When I tried to nuzzle her neck a little, she told me to cut it out. She kissed me on the cheek at one point, but at another point when we were nuzzling faces, she told me not to kiss her.
Watching a movie with the kids, she wanted me close so she could put her legs on me, but not with my arm around her.
I don't know what to think at this point - and yes, it's just a matter of being patient I guess. This business of pull-push, of not wanting to end it but doing it anyway... I don't know.
Seems some of this is in the right direction, but also seems like it's more of the same - Karen predicted this - she comes closer, I pursue a little bit. So we've reconnected - now do I pull back? DBing would suggest so.
I've got a C appointment tomorrow. Guess I'll have a lot to talk about.
I hope you're right. I hope we can keep stepping down this path.
LFH, I wish you the best of luck for this weekend! It's a good experience. Don't plan on getting much sleep.
Bill, glad the weekend was good for you. We enjoyed our time at Retrouvaille and had good results. The Post sessions are extremely helpful too. They go a lot further than the weekend. Lot's of reinforcement of what works in a marriage. Not just the dialoguing. My H wanted to just talk too. But we had felt so close using dialogue, I didn't want to give it up. So we compromised. Dialogued 3 times a week, talked the rest. Know what? The talking wasn't as good. It got rolled over and we didn't really do it some nights.
Best of luck with the weekend. LFH. I hope you have a good result too. Don't hesitate to speak to one of the presenters and ask for advice on your particular sitch. They are very experienced and have seen a lot of different relationships. They are there to help you.
I'm really struggling today guys. Feeling depressed and distracted. This whole "we're closer now but still getting divorced" business is killing me. We cuddle up on the couch but that's it.
I left her a message a little while ago saying I hope she's having a good day. Cause you know, "we're closer" now. She said she was thinking about me all day yesterday...
I'm glad I have a C appointment this afternoon.
Well, she said it - she realized how much she doesn't want to lose me - but she has this one big problem. I can't talk my way out of it, I can't show my way out of it if we're not being intimate, and maybe she's right that we're "incompatible" - that scares me. She says that she has no hope of her needs being met in our relationship, and the only way she can see to change that is to leave.
Sorry if I'm repeating prior posts- this is just going around and around in my mind.
Yes, Retro was a positive experience - I just feel like I"m hurting a lot more now. I've gone backwards in my detaching. Seems like I've really jumped into grieving now.
Am I being silly? Am I overlooking something significant? Are my expectations too high? Sigh. Feel like my emotions have the better part of me today. Well, most days.
I feel now like our new closeness from Retro is leading to me leaning on her for comfort, reassurance, whatever. And it's hollow, it just makes me feel worse. It would be great if she'd come out wanting to work on the M - but, what she said is that she wants to enjoy the time with me that we have left.
I feel now like our new closeness from Retro is leading to me leaning on her for comfort, reassurance, whatever. And it's hollow, it just makes me feel worse. It would be great if she'd come out wanting to work on the M - but, what she said is that she wants to enjoy the time with me that we have left.
I can see why you would want to try to keep your closeness, but with one of you intent on divorcing, how close can that be? And it seems like this new closeness is enjoyable for your W, but is not good for you. You probably already know what I think: you need to detach and go dim, but I wouldn't bother at this point unless you are really make a serious commitment to that. And I'm guessing you aren't....
Yeah - I'm confused on this one. Trying to get my head around how to build on Retro - but it's kind of predicated on us both working on the M.
Karen, it's crazy-making.
You know, after we got back Sunday night, I popped into my room here, and she came and got me - wanting me to continue to spend time with her.
Right now I'm just going to see what happens I guess.
My C thinks I should initiate a conversation saying, you're confusing me with your mixed signals, I need to know what you want. Well, that's a R conversation, and I can bet what the response will be: I want a divorce. I think my C thinks I'm making it harder on myself by wanting to save the M.
Karen, I know I'm back and forth. Probably frustrating to read.
I will not pursue. I will act as if. I will take care of myself. I will be stonger. And I will monitor.
My C thinks I should initiate a conversation saying, you're confusing me with your mixed signals, I need to know what you want. Well, that's a R conversation, and I can bet what the response will be: I want a divorce. I think my C thinks I'm making it harder on myself by wanting to save the M.
I don't see the point in that. I don't think your W has been giving you mixed signals at all. She has been clearly communicating that she wants a D, but she also seems to enjoy cake-eating and enjoying your support. My opinion is you should withdraw that so she becomes aware of what she will be losing after D. I've never seen cake-eating work on these boards. Never.
I don't see the point in that either. I told C as much - she's said what she wants. Bringing up a R discussion will just result in that again. I honestly think that C sees the healthiest step for me is to move on.
I guess I'm having trouble distinguishing baby-steps from cake-eating. I was in bed reading last night when she got home, to some degree because I didn't want to be "waiting for her..." When she got home, she came in - I guess she needed something out of the bathroom - and she lay down with me for a moment, then kissed me on the cheek before she went to bed.
I left her a message yesterday, and she called back and left me a message about how her day was going. Last night she thanked me for calling her, saying it was nice to hear from me during the day.
Are these baby-steps, or cake-eating?
I asked her this morning about dialoguing and the Retro post-sessions, but it seemed like pressuring her.
One of the Retro couples emailed me, and is asking if she can call / email, talk to W. I don't know if that's a good idea - again, pressuring her to work on the marriage. I suppose I'll mention it to her - I don't know about that one though.
Karen, thank you for the input - I'll full admit my head isn't straight on this. Well, I'm going out tonight to the divorce-care meeting, and W has a high-school reunion this weekend - leaving Thursday. So, we're not going to really see each other for a number of days. If not by design, I'll have some time to just be.
Just as an aside, I'm amazed at how I can go from feeling out-of-my-mind to normal in a couple of hours. I'm afraid that, again, it's the Xanex. I'm really frustrated with myself that I continue to be messed up. I'm looking forward to getting better.
