Cake eating WAW in MLC and EA part 2

[robx]

Thanks Rob,

This woman is lying about everything right now. She wouldn't even admit how she found her current lawyer.

She actually asked me this morning whether I would cosign a home equity loan on the condo to try to reduce debt on legal expenses. She is assuming that I would entirely liable for her legal expenses. I said are you kidding? Make me liable for your debts before a court has anything to say about it?

She also demanded that I provide a whole bunch of financial information that she needs "by tomorrow afternoon." my lawyer told me that I have share finanical information but I'm not going to jump through hoops to get it.

You're right in that she's been doing whatever she wants. I certainly am not shy about speaking my mind. I think over the last couple of years she has just been baiting me to see how far she can push before I really bite. That's warped a perspective you get after a while.

Cabbr

Tell her at this point she doesn't get to make demands on you.
If she requires financial information for her lawyer, have her lawyer submit a request to your lawyer and you can fulfill that request once it's rec'd.

Just let her know that you understand that she is angry but that doesn't mean you will allow her to bully you.

Asking you to co-sign that loan is her grasping at straws, she wants things immediately and you don't have to jump at her every request. In fact you do the opposite.

There are consequences for everyone's actions, her karma is biting her in the ass right now. The divorce will be expensive if she goes through with it and trust me, you won't be on the hook for 100%, she will pay her fair share if that's what she truly wants. NO ONE can force you to do anything you don't want to.

Let her file for divorce, let her pay for it and let her learn that living without you means living without your help, every one of these requests from her sounds like she's asking for help but in her usual bullying ways.

Smile and tell her "No Thank you".

[robx]

it's not a warped perspective either,
women test men, it's a requirement, women are hardwired to do it, they have to do it continually to make sure that the mate they are with is strong enough to protect them. It's an instinct that has existed since man first learned to walk upright. Just because its 2009 AD and not 10000 BC doesn't mean those instincts have been phased out & changed. Men are still men, women are still women - that's how attraction works between the two and when you learn what creates attraction you will also learn what kills it and what you may have done to kill it for her to treat you so badly and so disrespectfully. She has stepped over every boundary with you and you allowed her all in the name of love and she slowly but surely disrespected you more & more because of it until she hit her tipping point where inside of her something told her to leave her mate and start searching for someone else more attractive, more masculine, stronger and able to provide her with the kind of security that she needed from you. When she realized that she was stronger than you at a certain point in the relationship that was her cue to start searching for another mate, someone stronger & more attractive than you (and more attractive meaning exhibiting more masculine traits, not necessarily better looking).

Some people may think I'm full of $hit on this, but I'm telling you that there is so much more to this issue than people are willing to concede. There is a science to this.

For the time being you need to stand strong and weather her attacks on you. You need to set boundaries, ie. when she starts talking poorly to you, tell her in a firm voice "that's enough, you will talk to me respectfully or you will go away until you learn to do so!" and then you would leave the room or area and come back when you want. She talks poorly to you again, you repeat this all over again with what was just mentioned above and leaving. You do this a few times for both you & her: you setup a pattern of behavior that you will learn to employ when she acts poorly & disrepectfully to you, it shows that you respect yourself and won't allow anyone to treat you like crap, you are establishing boundaries that people including your wife will learn to respect and she will learn after a while that you won't tolerate her disrespectful behavior and any crap that comes out of her mouth.

It may not seem like it works in the beginning and may take several times to get the desired response you want from her but you will in effect be "training" her to talk to you properly by setting these boundaries. No, obviously she isn't a pet but we train people in our lives to treat us the way they do, if you have a best friend, he probably doesn't treat you like crap & vice versa because you've trained each other to respect each other, the same goes for your wife. Love or NO LOVE, there must always be respect and when she says something really poorly to you, you add on something to the end of what I mentioned above like "and if you ever want to speak to me again, you will APOLOGIZE for disrespectful behavior or you will not talk to me at all and it will be YOUR loss not mine."

And then just walk away.

It works, you want stuff that works, I'm giving you stuff that works, start using it and use it often and then tell me the response you get from her and don't stop doing it, you will see positive results, I wouldn't waste my time typing here if I didn't know that this worked.

It worked for me and the disrespectful behaviors my wife showed towards me and she was originally someone I let cross over every boundary and treat me poorly & disrespectfully now she knows I won't tolerate it and when she does have an outburst I don't even have to tell her to apologize - when I leave the area or stop talking to her altogether, I get a phone call within a few hours to my cell (because I left the area, I have a life and other things to do that occupy my time, my life isn't spent chasing her) and on the other end it's my wife saying "I'm sorry about earlier, I didn't mean to act like that and it wasn't nice of me to be like that".

If you want her to start treating you with respect, you need to start respecting yourself, until you do that, you won't be able to get any changes out of her.

Believe it.

[CABBR]

I think she's been instructed to show some effort in keeping the housein order - something she did not spend much time on in recent years.

Any good D atty would have advised her to do this.

I hope to god you're not co-signing the loan, nor paying her AmEx bill???

Hi PDT,

I told her tonight that I'm not cosigning a loan or paying the charges on the AMEX not related to the family. She's going to go ahead with some motion I think for support. She's been gathering all sorts of finanical data to show her contribution to the marriage , which in the first half was very significant.

She approached it like she was doing me a favor to minimize expenses and interest because I'd just have to pay later.

She offered me a 3 day custody situation today. I said I want 50%, she said how can you do that if you work full time? I had previously said that I'd be glad to have after school care or pick them up from her.

I told her I feel sorry for her - she asked why, I just said for a lot of reasons.

I told her this whole thing is really foolish. Today I took my sons on an outing to a military fort museum - she declined to come. My older son asked repeatedly why she couldn't come with us. She just said she had things to do and that he should do stuff with Daddy. My son kept bemoaning that she never eats dinner with us, is always shopping or going out, etc. He's starting to sound like me.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I know you have every right, but you're not going to be effective telling her you "feel sorry for her," and calling her "foolish."

Try to validate, while not agreeing (assuming it's something disagreeable) by saying "I understand you feel this way, but this is what I've decided would be best for the kids," or "I understand you're upset, but this is what I'm prepared to do. If you want to fight it legally, I suppose that's your right and I can't stop you, but for now this is what I've decided would be best."

Puppy

[CABBR]

Hi Rob,

It's a weird dynamic with my wife. There is definitely this blue streak of entitlement and indignancy when I try to do a realty check. But she checked out so long ago emotionally that I'm just barking up a tree. She really hasn't given a crap about her marriage in a very long time.

While I have let the situation fester by not being more proactive. I'm a little too much type A if anything. And my W is really turned off by my confrontational approach. She finds me too much the way you describe. She avoids confrontation and feels there are many things she shouldn't need to say.

When I talk to her tonight, she's not being rude or particularly disrespectful - only in the fact that she seems to be certain I will eventually pay her legal fees and will end up with one day a week and every other weekend.

Tonight, she's still harping on about what I did. When I said fel sorry for her and this whole thing is wrong, she said you can't seriously think I would get back together with you after what happened last week. I said you act as if you are blameless, that you did nothing wrong. I told her OM's W thanked me several times for telling her. My W says I hope you're proud about it. She's so self righteous - it's surreal.

[CABBR]

I know you have every right, but you're not going to be effective telling her you "feel sorry for her," and calling her "foolish."

Try to validate, while not agreeing (assuming it's something disagreeable) by saying "I understand you feel this way, but this is what I've decided would be best for the kids," or "I understand you're upset, but this is what I'm prepared to do. If you want to fight it legally, I suppose that's your right and I can't stop you, but for now this is what I've decided would be best."

Puppy

Thanks PDT, I have to remember that part. To validate, but not necessarily agree. I have to try to avoid having the discussion get heated. I was calm, but certainly the level of agitation was climbing.

[GH31]

It works, you want stuff that works, I'm giving you stuff that works, start using it and use it often and then tell me the response you get from her and don't stop doing it, you will see positive results, I wouldn't waste my time typing here if I didn't know that this worked.

I have done the same thing with my W that Rob describes and it does work.

That doesn't stop my W doing very deranged and sick things (see my thread) but she apologizes when I call her on her spoiled brat behaviour, which I always do.

[CABBR]

PDT,

We have been going to a cottage on a lake, which is about a day's drive for us for more than 20 years. My W inherited the cottage with her brother, with whom I get along with well. We go there every year for our primary summer vacation. It's a beautiful spot and there is another cottage next door owned by my SIL who can be difficult.

If I want to take the kids to the lake, there is absolutely nothing my W can do about it. I can take the kids for summer vacation and avoid my toxic SILs or do something else entirely. My W would probably arrive later and bring them home.
My sense is to do something else, even though it will cost a lot more money, which I'm not going to have before too long.

[CABBR]

Puppy, Greek,Coach, Robx, thanks so much for your support.

So yesteday, I received a copy of the summons and complaint and an acceptance of service form, which I have to sign and send to my lawyer. I imagine it will be filed this week. First time I have ever been named as a defendant in anything. What was really nice was seeing the names of our children in a civil complaint - that was really swell.

Right now I'm just looking at my W with pity and disgust. We've got two great kids and as Puppy says she is not going to be a hero for them.

My lawyer has all the financial information from the last few months. My W's lawyer is preparing a proposal with respect to interim parental rights and responsibilities and "other issues." I will also have to give my W some kind of allowance. In my state you can file prospectively. There is a 6 month waiting period. They said the date of separation was July 1, so right after Christmas my boys will get an extra present of having their family split apart. I believe my W wants to live for the next 6 months as if we were living in separate homes and dividing the parental rights and responsibilities in the same way. I'm not sure whether this is something a court would grant but will know more once the "proposal" is submitted.

Cabbr

I went out last night to the hobby store and got my younger son some model RR track that I'd been meaning to get for a long time. I set it up after they went to bed and told him about it in the morning. He was thrilled.

I have to travel to the west coast today on business returning on a redeye on Friday morning.

[AlexEN]

cabbr,

Looks like we'll be going down this legal path in parallel with each other...

I know laws vary from state-to-state, but let's let each other know as issues come up, as it sounds like your wife has the same kind of expectations as mine does...

-AlexEN