I cannot echo Sandi2 enough. Please learn from our mistakes. Even couples with horrible M's that are much worse than yours, do not end up making you think you are sooo much better off. In the end, you'll find SOMETHING in your spouse that is also in common with the spouse you don't like of the other couple. It's human nature to find patterns.
Plus it teaches you NOTHING about how to interact lovingly. So find happier couples or go to some marriage encounters --we loved 90% of those and the ones we didn't find helpful were usually too elementary or basic, so they NEVER harmed our R in any way.
In one instance, I'd say a particular workshop was a turning point in our M. It was NOT "for married couples" so much as for individuals, but like DB says, if you change one person in the R, the R changes too. In fact, though it was 20 years ago, I think if things continue to go well at this end, I'd like to go back to that workshop this August, for our 28th anniversary and maybe have a renewal of our vows!!. (Have NOT discussed this with H, but if it happens, I will surely let YOU ALL KNOW....cross your fingers) And if we don't get all the way back there by then, as long as we are on the road, towards a full renewal, I'll shut the heck up and be grateful. I'm already luckier than many. But look at my timeline, PLEASE...don't think this happens fast enough for any of us.
(( j ))
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Thanks for the input. I had a GREAT weekend and it had nothing to do with W or M. My daughter and I went to OKC for her dance competition and we had a blast! It was one of the best times we have had in a long time. We laughed, joked, and had fun all weekend. She also won first overall in her solo and duet performances in her age group 9-11. I was the only dad there and all of her teammates hung out with me and we had a blast. The last night after her comp. we went to a fondue restaurant and had a great meal and just talked. It was a really good ending to a really good weekend!
W told me today that D couldn't stop talking about our weekend all night last night and told her every detail. That made me very happy inside
Not really sure what is going on with W and her family. Her sister has called me to tell me that she doesn't believe the OM is over and I don't know what to think except that I am going to DB and not worry about what I can't control. Its been 5 months now since this mess started and we are still in it with no end in sight. I know a lot of you have been at it way longer, so you know that it is tough. I will stick with it and we have another counseling session tomorrow. Our MC gave us both a book to read called "Boundaries" by Dr. Henry Cloud & Dr. John Townsend. Our homework assignment was the 1st three chapters by tomorrow and I have read two and they are really pretty good. I could see a lot of what is going on in our lives in these first couple of chapters.
I am really just journaling and updating. I feel better and more relaxed, especially last week. But today I have felt very nervous and uneasy and it may have to do with my uncle just died and my W's aunt is about to die. I have to go to his funeral on Wednesday and I don't think my W is going to go. It's a 3.5 hour drive and I am not sure she wants to do that right now, but I am just assuming.
About our friends, it is a really tough spot. They are asking for our help and it is hard to turn your back on them. Sandi, the problem we have is ALL of our friends are having problems and we never do anything together anyway. Its just her and her friends and my close friends live away, so I don't really go out with anyone.
I am rambling now so I will go read instead. Thanks for keeping up with me and I really appreciate the advice.
I am soooo glad you had a great weekend with your D. Nothing helps like having a good time to lift your spirits. Your D going back home and telling your W how much fun you were, etc., helps too!
About your uncle and the funeral......I am so sorry that you have to face this unhappy event. I would, however, not make your W feel that she should make an appearance. If she knows about it or asks anything, I would tell her when you plan to go, etc. You might even tell her that if she should decide she wants to go that she is invited to go with you but if she had rather not, you certainly understand. It is kind of hard to know how to "word" some of these things. I just know she probably does not want any type of pressure, but it also may depend on how close she felt to your uncle.
Your friends that are having problems in their M and are asking for your help.......the very best thing you can do for them is to be honest with them and say that you cannot help them b/c you can't even help yourself. You are having to go to a C and you would advise them to do the same. I say this as strongly as I know how......DO NOT GET INVOLVED WITH THEIR PROBLEMS!! You will be sorry.
Take care, Sandi
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Just got back from the funeral. W didn't go and that was fine. I told her that I would tell everyone she said hi and she was sorry she couldn't come and she appreciated it. The funeral was sad, but it was nice to see all of them. I got to see my sister again and we had a good time together before we left.
My SIL called me on the way home and cried that she is so sorry this is happening and that no matter what happens, I am welcome at all family functions and will be apart of her and her kids' lives. That touched me and told her that I appreciated it but I am not giving up hope. But that no matter what happens I will make sure that I am a part of their lives.
As far as the friends go, I am staying out of everything but my W can't say no and I am not sure I can either, but I am not making myself available right now. She is right in the middle of the new friends problems and comforting her friend. It is ironic that she is comforting her friend who is in the same position I am while W is the same as friend's husband. He wasn't getting enough attention and emotion from her so he had an EA and then dropped the bomb and left. Same sitch as us reversed, however W is seeing it from her friend through her (or my) eyes. Maybe this good? I don't know. She told me last night that she can believe the H isn't even willing to try to work on the marriage? Again, good sign or no?
W told me a couple of times that she had been talking to OM again about him losing his job. I texted him today and asked him to not contact W anymore and he said ok. W called me pissed that I did this. I was probably stupid. 2x4 coming from 25 and Sandi Before that little mishap, I have been doing really good. I guess the 3 hour drive home today was more than I could handle. Anyway, we have another MC tomorrow so it should be interesting as MC wants to talk about OM. Not sure what is going to happen, but I am not sure if it will be good.
Had the MC and all in all it was good. We both put our feelings on the table and I think for the first time, understood each other. MC was very encouraged by what she saw and told us that. We have "homework" this weekend to spend some quality time alone together. Last night, I spent time with the kids and we had a great time at dinner and the park. Got them to bed and since W was already in bed, just told her good night and went home.
Today after work I am going out with a friend and tomorrow hanging with the kids and maybe doing our "homework". After yesterday, I feel more at peace about the OM situation. It was the first time we talked about it in a safe setting with no agendas or getting mad/yelling, etc. MC said that is the only way to heal is to get it out and talk about it and not keep anything inside. I think we did this yesterday and I think it will be the start of something new for me. Don't know if it will help the M or not, but I do believe it will help me finally start getting over the anger and the hurt of this.
I am keeping up with the GAL, doing things with friends, going to sporting events, working out, playing basketball, etc. Still working on the "acting as if" as I have ups and downs there, but I keep plugging along. Looking forward to the weekend and having some fun.
Hey there Here's what I've learned about the OW: I hate to say it, but it's my fault she's still around. If I had just ignored it, it would have died on its own. But I questioned and snooped and she's still around. And really, a little defense for me, she does work right next to him. So until she quits (please help me wish this true) she's going to be a part of his life. But she would be a much smaller part if I ignored it. I think you and I have similarities with our OW and OM: They are both young and stupid. If we both let it go (and believe me, I know how hard it is, how much it hurts) they will go the way of the dodo bird on their own, and much faster than if we keep them alive. When it comes to that crap, I'm an idiot. So I feel your pain. We'll do it together.
“My SIL called me on the way home and cried that she is so sorry this is happening and that no matter what happens, I am welcome at all family functions and will be apart of her and her kids' lives. That touched me and told her that I appreciated it but I am not giving up hope. But that no matter what happens I will make sure that I am a part of their lives.”
Be careful! Why is your SIL so ……..involved with you in this stitch? Anyway, what I meant by “be careful” is that it is not a good idea to make promises to your W’s family/relatives about being around for family functions or part of their lives, etc. B/c if you and W were to D and she remarried, trust me…….she would not want her XH attending family functions. What did SIL mean by you would always be a part of “her” life? Oh, I know she added the boys, but why “her” life? Does she have a husband? If so, why didn't she add his name in the pot? You said something in another post that gave me a funny feeling about her but I didn't say anything. Maybe I am getting to where I'm not as trusting as I once was but she seems like she is showing an awful lot of "concern" for you. Like I said.....be careful.
Quote:
“Same stitch as us reversed, however W is seeing it from her friend through her (or my) eyes. Maybe this good? I don't know. She told me last night that she can believe the H isn't even willing to try to work on the marriage? Again, good sign or no?”
Nope! B/c she is blind to her own waywardness and does not see it in her own M like she can in her friends. So, don’t get all hoped up about it.
Quote:
“W told me a couple of times that she had been talking to OM again about him losing his job. I texted him today and asked him to not contact W anymore and he said ok. W called me pissed that I did this. I was probably stupid.”
See what I mean about getting hoped up by what she said about her friends? And, yeah, texting OM was pretty stupid. One thing, you cannot control the OM and he is probably laughing at you thinking that you are showing how desperate you are b/c you can’t control your wife so now you are trying to get him to cooperate by not contacting her again. If they work side by side……….you KNOW that is not going to happen! Were you surprised to find your W pissed off? That means that the OM went straight to her and told her about your text......unless you were crazy enough to tell her yourself.....but if you didn't then it just go to show he is contacting her.....and which proves my point about her being blind to yours and her stitch compared to the friends. That’s why you can’t get your hopes up over something she says or does. DB rule is don’t believe what they say and only about half of what they do.
Otherwise, GAL and the other things sounds good. But you need to forget about OM not contacting your W b/c I can promise you he is getting some type of benefit out of that R with her! Otherwise, he would have put a stop to without anyone telling him. He is not an honorable man and therefore don’t expect him to honor your request about staying away from your wife. Besides, if she continues to pursue him……………well.......
How does your W feel about these homework assignments the MC gives you to do?
Sandi
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Couple things...Good for you with the daughters activities. REALLY HUGE...she will always remember this...kudos to you for this.
And Glad to see you wrote that no matter what happens in the M, you're still doing some of these assignments b/c you'll be a better man. Also I liked the Boundaries book more in the later chapters as I felt the religious parts turned H off at the time... but as the book progresses and gives more examples of inappropriate behavior, it helps more. At least for US.
I don't necessarily agree with Sandi about the SIL comments. (I Don't know HER situation.) But I liked that she said you'd be included and for the record, I said the same thing to my bil when my sister divorced him, but I said it ONE TIME...and later on, when troubles were brewing with my h, I told HIS family that they'd have access to the kids and I'd never block that and I think it helped them. (Sure made it easier to reconcile...don't burn bridges there).
As for the friends with marital troubles, why not suggest DBing? Seriously, give them names of MC's and books you thought were good and move on to a diff topic. If your w says an off the wall comment that shows NO insight and you are baffled at how blind she is, you might say "you're kidding right? I mean, when you say 'h' won't even give the m a chance and you tell ME this, are you being sarcastic or serious?"
I found that If you say this with a sincerely hurt looking face, it may get through to her and not anger her. I did it to H when he saw something "backwards" and I pointed out, gently, that I assumed he was kidding b/c in the sitch my h was referring to, He was in the SAME position as someone he was criticizing and I asked him if he was teasing me or being serious and he asked me to explain. I replied as non-judgmentally as possible, something like "no offense and I don't want to argue, but I thought you were being sarcastic b/c...well, can you see how what you are doing looks a lot like the same thing to me & the kids as what 'x' is doing to His family?" And I followed that with a comment showing I did not expect a reply & I left the room before he could answer. He didn't answer or if he did, it was to say something like "No I had not thought of it that way..." He said something about a month ago that suggests the comment got through. (And at least I called him on it without a fight ensuing...sometimes that has to suffice or you'll feel too cowardly for letting a crazy ass BS "Insight" from THEM pass un-noted).
Next--Um, if you wanted to "register" your feelings about w texting OM, why not tell HER? She probably thinks she was "being honest" with you...but as Sandi pointed out, the OM apparently went and told her so he did the opposite. (Gee, he sure keeps his word. Why didn't he get some balls and say "I love your w and will talk to her all I want" OR, "No, I won't promise that"?? B/C he is a coward and a liar...let HER find out for herself...)
But I have said the opposite of this to others when OM calls the h and "asks permission" then I say to at least once say "HELL NO!" so he cannot ever claim you knew and didn't care enough about your w to try and fight for her, blah blah blah. But he did NOT ask or call you nor did he admit anything was happening and doesn't she still deny it too? And isn't it possible she's having an EA with him anyhow?
Listen to SLH and learn from her on that one...
FYI I am/we are going to Europe to see d20 perform and our house sitter arrives Monday night. Telling you this so if I don't post for awhile you'll know it's not personal AND ALSO I WANT EVERYONE TO ENVY ME... plus remind you that yes, H will be with me and ALL our children to watch d20 so it'll be the first vacation as a full family in...A LONG TIME...since maybe 2003? For point of reference, in 2006 for my 25th wedding anniversary, I took MY KIDS to Europe, and had no h. (Was definitely the Best money I ever spent then as it did wonders for PMA AND showed kids that we were still a family and could have a blast with or without h/dad). So yes, this trip is a big deal on many fronts. I recall posting here about the trip too...seems like so long ago in some ways and so recent in others.
MIL has terminal cancer (h is with her now) and I am praying she remains stable for this time period...As selfish as it sounds I really don't want her to die right before or during this trip so H can enjoy himself without that in the back of his mind. It's already got to be draining him. If you have some extra prayers to send, please send them our way for MIL and thanks.
Sorry for the hijack, take care, and listen to these posters!! You have good ones! "Ciao!" (yeah, eat your hearts out but hey, we EARNED this...so will you..) (( j ))
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Man! Ain't that a kick in the head? I kept coming back to check, hoping I would see where he had come back to post......but nothing. I hate when this happens!!
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I kept coming back to check, hoping I would see where he had come back to post......but nothing. I hate when this happens!!