You've been in what seemed to be a pretty good place the past week or so, and I really didn't want to see you go back to the place where you get frustrated, waiting for the knife to fall.
I can see being angry. Given the closeness between the two of you lately, and given the circumstances in which this came out, I'd probably have been angry too. Unlike you, I might have gone as far as expressing that anger to her this morning - not that I think that would have been a good idea.
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That just makes me truly wonder if things are ever really going to progress past this point. It has just been basically the same deal for 6 months now....her acting like things are, or could be OK and us being this happy fun loving couple...and all along her position has not changed. That's pretty disheartening. Especially after what was going on the last couple of weeks.
This is the paragraph I guess that put me on alert.
I honestly believe what I wrote earlier regarding her words versus her actions.
I think she would have to be an incredibly cruel person to be able to so fully embrace the love and closeness between the two of you, and then turn around in 6 months and say "Well, that's it NDS, one year is up. Nice knowing you."
Is there anything else that gives you reason to believe that she is a woman with that capacity for insensitivity inside of her? I just don't see it in what you have shared with us.
I DO believe that she has moments, flashes in time, where she is suddenly terrified. I believe that every once in awhile her mind reminds her of the past, reminds her of her resolution, and tries to convince her that what she has been reveling in is nothing more than a house of cards that will soon go up in smoke.
I believe she is incredibly afraid of that happening.
Because I believe that she LOVES this life the two of you have been living the past several months. I believe that her heart is completely given over to this man, the one that is fulfilling all those dreams that our wives have of who we will be to them, and who they will be to us.
The cold hard truth for her is that she is facing a much greater risk now than before. Remember, she declared herself done. In your quiet moments consider how difficult it was for her to give up. Think about the joy she feels in THIS life with you now, and then truly ponder what agony she must have felt as she labored over the decision to call your marriage done.
And now you do this.
Now you show her the REALITY that she dared not hope for. You showed her the NDS of her hopes. And each day you are showing her the life that she always KNEW the two of you could have together.
How can she help but embrace it?
And how can she help but fear that it's nothing but a ruse?
And this my friend is why I, and many others, have tried to steer you clear of focusing on hearing those magic words, "I've changed my mind."
You ask for too much, too soon.
What you are getting instead is a woman in love with the life that once lived only in her heart. You get to see the joy, the peace, the satisfaction, the silliness, the sleepy comfort that she finds in the things that you share. You get to see her embrace your time together. You get to see her slowly thaw from the hardness of 6 months ago, into the woman you love.
This will take time.
Every good day with her is money in the bank.
Every quiet, normal evening spent together is restoring a piece of your future.
This is not a woman who WANTS this to end.
This is a woman who is afraid it WILL end.
Those words you don't like hearing come from her fear. Acknowledge that and receive it as both a reminder and a challenge to YOU. Don't recieve it as a slap in the face. Don't see it as a sign that you've made no progress - if anything, it is quite the contrary.
SHE FEEDS OFF OF YOU.
She is so entwined with you emotionally that she picks up on your state. When you have withdrawn in the past, I believe she has too. And when you have withdrawn, don't you think it strengthened her fear that this is all pretend?
You know your course. Be NDS. Every day. Be NDS with all his goodness and his peculiarities. His strengths and his weaknesses. But be the NEW NDS who is man enough to admit his failings and be humble about his abilities. The man who loves his wife more than getting his way.
So, sorry for the 2x4.
I refuse to allow you to screw this up my friend.
Blessings,
Bill
"Don't tell me the sky is the limit when there are footprints on the moon."
nds, let me remind you of something I posted a while back about words that are said.
My W has said:
I'm done. I'm totally done. Get the f*ck out of the house. I have my kids and my career and having nothing left for us. She told me she doesn't love me. She told me not to address her with any honey's, etc.. Don't say ILY to me. I don't want you touching me. Your very presence gives me anxiety and stress. I want to have sex, just not with you. There were so many more that it would take me a long while to type them here. But I think you get the point of where she has been in the past.
A few weeks ago she was moving into a seperate room inside our house. Yesterday at MC she said she didn't feel a need to do that.
She's still with me. She said a few weeks ago in MC that she wants to try to work on our M. Last weekend she kissed me and we made out on the couch.
She tells me ILY. She laughs with me. She likes my company. She said in MC that she feels pretty good and pretty happy. She said she feels like her personal space is coming back to her.
She contradicted most of what she said in the past few months by her actions. The words came later. Some words haven't come at all. But she also wavers - her fear comes to the surface and it shows. My consistency wears away that fear she has.
Words are just words. Think about that. Today you are pissed, tomorrow you feel different. If you express your feelings today you come out pissed off. If you express your feeling tomorrow, you aren't pissed off. Feelings come and go. Sometimes they come out in words at a certain time - it doesn't mean that feeling is constantly there. It just means that feeling was there in that moment.
Words come and go. Steady action stays.
If you change your actions and behaviors you will only reinforce her fear that the changes are not real.
If you remain steady in your actions and behaviors you will weaken that fear in her.
Your changes are real and must be consistent whether she stays or goes. Your changes are made because you want to be the person you have become regardless of who you are with. Look how her apparent change of words and actions feed into your fear that it will not last - now imagine what impact you would have if you change your words and your action.
Has the frequency of her saying 'nothing has changed' increased or decreased?
How about her friend telling you, "Keep doing what you are doing - you're doing just fine?"
No 2x4 here - just a reminder that words are shooting stars - they last a few seconds then fizzle out. Actions are the sun that rises and sets every day, the same way, and can be counted on.
MySitch Me-47 STBXW-41 D-5 S-8 ILYBNILWY-01/08 Want a D- 01/09 Physical Sep-01/10 D filed-06/10 Got 50% custody=09/11 Ride that wave!
No 2x4 here - just a reminder that words are shooting stars - they last a few seconds then fizzle out. Actions are the sun that rises and sets every day, the same way, and can be counted on.
steady, This is very wise, thanks for posting this.
Me: 41 W: 41 Married: 17 years Together: 19 years 16-Sept-2008: "W: I want to move out." 16-Jan-2009: Separated, wife moved out. 31-Mar-2010: W, and kids move back home! D 14 S 12 D 11 S 7
2 minutes to post, and feeling like a jerk....again.
She canceled plans with "best friend" last night and we stayed home and watched movies and had snacks.
Today we were supposed to go to her brother's for dinner. She called and made an excuse and we stayed home to watch football and have dinner together....WTF.
I am writing in between us watching the game, doing laundry together and making snacks....and drinking margaritas.
Actions...not words. I will check in tomorrow guys.
new abbreviation: ANW (action not words) or slang "Root beer"
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
I didn't get much of a chance for replies to any of the posts on the last thread before it locked, but I did read everyone's.
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I agree a 100% with Bill...and would like to add that maybe you should refrain from the alcohol indulgences when she is indulging...it can cloud things...it can complicate things...my H (when he started making the move home) used alcohol a lot to drown his feelings...but instead it caused them to surface...he would say things like he "loved" me..."wanted" me...but then not remember in the morning...I think it helped him to not feel responsible for his actions...
Lin The drinking thing has been a bit of an issue for the 2 of us since the bomb. Before that, I had pretty much given it up, but my wife still drank, and sometimes that was an issue as she had a tendency to over indulge.
After the bomb, one of my 180's was to start taking her out, being more social and that led us back to the bar scene a little more than we had in the past. It has sort of snowballed into the 2 of us overdoing it at times, both while we are out and a home.
As for your comments about you and your H, I am not sure, and have not been since the bomb, how to take her when we have been drinking.
It is rare that R talk, or reminders about the sitch come up when she has been drinking...just the opposite, so as for which feelings tend to surface, it's hard to say. Most times our partying leads to some pretty fun, crazy and intimate times, but she has never slipped up and said ILY, I need you, or given me any indication that what she really wants is to work on the R because of she was drinking.
Lately I have noticed that she is more talkative and relaxed without the alcohol, whereas before...earlier, after the bomb, she had a tendency to just clam up and be very distant during the normal everyday time together.
Either way, the drinking has to be curtailed somewhat, and we both know it, and have talked about it. Lately we seem to have more nights leaning towards "normal every day" without alcohol, so I think we both are trying.
I think she would have to be an incredibly cruel person to be able to so fully embrace the love and closeness between the two of you, and then turn around in 6 months and say "Well, that's it NDS, one year is up. Nice knowing you."
Is there anything else that gives you reason to believe that she is a woman with that capacity for insensitivity inside of her? I just don't see it in what you have shared with us.
Bill Out of all the recent posts, that question jumps out at me.
Forgetting all the drama and talk about words vs actions that I have had lately.....and playing a little "what if".
She does not have a cruel, insensitive or deceitful bone in her body....but would it be cruel or insensitive of her to stick with her...our...original plan to get things in order and plan for a separation?
Granted, neither of us has stuck to those original goals, but it was my promise to her not to fight her when the time came. I told her when she had enough to tell me...if she wanted out, to tell me.
This sitch has not made an awful lot of sense since day one one, but that was the deal...it was like "hey..I know you want out, but we are here together. let's be civil to each other, let's have some fun. we can't just be here in the same house and walk by each other like we are strangers, right? We don't hate each other, you have just had enough of my BS.".....That has progressed over the last six months to what we have now.
Maybe progressed is the wrong word, as it really has not changed much since the week of the bomb. I know we are close, things are good, but for the most part she has never gone back on her word, and I have always given her the impression that I have accepted what she wanted.
Does she take me at my word, and is that what makes it OK in her mind to allow the closeness and embrace the time together? Maybe she thinks because, when the subject comes up, and I tell her that I do not need to be reminded that it will not hurt me when the time comes....that it would not be cruel to allow these times and then pull the plug, because I know exactly what I am doing?.
As a matter of fact I ASKED for this arrangement...I could have left the day of the bomb, or told her if she wanted out of the marriage to leave..get out of the house, but I didn't. I asked for time to accept the sitch, time to get our affairs in order..etc....and she gave it to me.
Then I drag my feet...I treat her the way she should be treated, but make no move to give her what she wants, and she reminds me once in while "don't get your hopes up", but never asks when or how we are going to get to the original goal...separation....strange.
nds, let me remind you of something I posted a while back about words that are said.
My W has said:
I'm done. I'm totally done. Get the f*ck out of the house. I have my kids and my career and having nothing left for us. She told me she doesn't love me. She told me not to address her with any honey's, etc.. Don't say ILY to me. I don't want you touching me. Your very presence gives me anxiety and stress. I want to have sex, just not with you. There were so many more that it would take me a long while to type them here. But I think you get the point of where she has been in the past.
Steady Trust me, I think of your sitch and those words often when I think of my sitch. You and your wife have come a long way in a few months. Your wife opened up to you about the bad feelings she has had towards you, and now the good...lots of communication from both of you.
Unfortunately that is lacking with my wife and I, so like I have been 2x4's into realizing more and more....
