Here is what I did....I called him again this morning, and I did find out a few things.
Also, I gotta tell ya....he has not been asking me any questions about my GAL. And I have not told him either. Our conversations have been essentially going nowhere.
But today, I took your advice and said, "I am getting a life. You just don't know it because you haven't asked." He said, "And I don't want to know." And I said, "And, that OK because I don't want you to know either. But, I've been doing a lot."
You know my story from the rest of my thread. You know how much GALing I've been doing. But for some reason, some of the people on this board seem to overlook what all I've done so far. OH well, that's OK. I'm doing it, and I'm feeling good about it too, so that's all that matters, right?
Thanks for listening.
hugs, poet
P.S. I have been swimming, just not as much at I should.
On the phone call- please stop calling your H. Don't tell him your GALing, just DO IT; the part about "......because you haven't asked" sounded like pressure/an accusation to me.
Give him some space to wonder what you're up to, and time to get curious. This will take longer than you think, but then and only then will start moving towards you.
Glad you're feeling good about your GAL! What are you doing apart from swimming (sorry if I missed it- I read the thread quickly but haven't done the others yet)
Just read this thread. What comes across to me is how stressed out your H is. Any kind of pressure seems to freak him out a lot. So, as many have said, back off the phone calls and try to be more in sync with his one or two points of contact a day. That really is quite a lot (well, compared to my sitch it is). Remove as much pressure as possible, but add some mystery to your life. Also, be supportive and don't criticise or respond negtively, unless you feel very strongly.
Your H is very sensitive to any feeling of being pushed in a direction where he doesn't want to go. If he has a direction, and he's certainly not sure, it's towards D. So, anything that is thrown in his path stresses him, really stresses him (I know you are very stressed too). As someone else has said, he's clinging to a mantra that things will get better once he sorts this out. This is his hope. However, what strikes me as strange is that it feels to me that there must be more stress factors than just your R. Is there anything else going on here or was there?
How did this start? What did he say? How did it come out? Do you know anything about the OW? Who is she and what relationship has she had with him in the past, if any (don't snoop though please).
Hope you're doing ok.
Max
Me 36 W 37 Bomb (Easter 07) Sep (WAW July 07) "It's over" (end Oct 07) T10.5 years, M2 (before bomb)
The finding fun/ get a life tactic is NOT designed for you to behave like a trained seal, checking his reaction at your every move.
The get a life tactic is for YOU to find something to do to make you feel better so you don't concentrate on him. If your GAL tactics are all done motivated to get his interest you aren't getting a life. You are essentially walking forward while looking behind you - it doesn't work very well.
GAL means to do something fun for yourself and NOT tell him, and NOT hope he pays attention, and NOT pursue him. If you call him to tell him you are getting a life you are pursuing him and using the GAL activities as ammunition. My dear, that does not work.
You CAN leave subtle hints around, but it means you must LEAVE him ALONE. If you are swimming, leave the swimming pool schedule on a desk someplace or leave your swim bag by the door. Or even better have some friends come by the house to pick you up and go as a group. But it means you do NOT APPROACH HIM DIRECTLY on what you are doing.
You called him up, told him outright you were doing things, and then criticized him for not noticing - this is PURSUIT. You are not supposed to be doing these activities like a dog rolls around for biscuits. You lose your dignity when you do that, and its not sexy or inviting - its annoying my dear.
The objective is to do these things and leave HIM to THINK, give HIM some space to BREATHE. You are doing activities my dear, but you are sabotaging any positive impact they may have when you call him up to report on them directly.
If you can list what you are doing specifically we can help you with some ideas on how to leave hints for him to see what you are doing. But they have to be hints, expose him in a very subtle way that the OLD YOU is GONE and the NEW YOU is HERE. But it has to be subtle and non-invasive. You have to bait him a bit here and wait for him to bite. You calling him effectively means you are diving in the water to chase after the fish. You will just scare him away.
My advice is for you to skip a call now and then. He said to call twice - FORGET TO CALL.
Leave him some space to breathe, to realize HE is not the linchpin of your existence. When you call him you put a lot of pressure on him to be the exclusive motivator of your life and he can't take that. He needs to feel like you are surviving on your own. He needs to feel like he can breathe around you. HE is walking on eggshells around YOU. That's why he doesn't want to be around.
You need to be casual about him, let him know he can be part of your life, but that if he makes a mistake, if he is late, or has something to do outside of your life that you won't turn into a hornets nest of need. Calling him up to report what you have been doing and criticizing him for not noticing is NOT casual, its NEEDY. No one likes a big ball of need calling them twice a day.
Sorry to bullet my point home here but this has been said already and it doesn't seem to be sinking in. He DOES love you, but you need to leave him alone and give him a REASON to seek you out. You are just giving him reasons to avoid you.
Your phone conversations are the same thing. You are stressing him out. He sits there trying to figure out what to say to you and you are there like some drama queen waiting to react. He can SENSE that. You are putting way too much pressure on him. When you pressure people they RUN AWAY. Unfortunately they end up looking for company when they get to a safe place which ends up making matters worse.
Call him and act like his call isnt' that important, or better yet wait for him to call. Have some friends over and only pay half attention to the call. Leave him feeling like he HAS to CHASE you a bit to get to you again.
There are ways to bring this guy around, but hanging on his ankles over every phone call is NOT inviting or attractive.
What I would like to see you do is make a list here of all the activities you are doing outside of your H and talk about THOSE a bit. I for one am interested in hearing what you are doing.
There are two tactics at work when you find some fun for yourself. I don't like to call it get a life because I find that insulting. I call it finding fun. It better expresses the goal in mind.
Anyways, if you put 100% into you, then it gives him a LOT to think about :
1. Why would I leave this adventurous woman? 2. Why don't I want to be around this sexy woman? 3. Why can't I just calm myself down and enjoy myself with her? 4. Why am I being such a hard-ass when she's being so great? 5. Why am I so scared of something this great? 6. What am I waiting for? 7. Why am I making such a mess of things when she is doing so much that makes things fun and inviting?
Believe me, some of this CAN be triggered in his mind, but you need to
a. STOP your bad habits - pursuit (read up on the stop the pursuit passage in divorce remedy - you arne't following it) b. START some good habits - find some fun and bring that fun into your home and your life
If you do a AND b, it forces his conscience out in the open and lets his conscience to the work for you, it forces those questions on him. But until you do a and b, he will never hear those questions.
If you want him questioning what he's doing then you need to do a and b above.
Also, if you can think of anything specifically that he complained about before he wanted a divorce that would help zero in on what was/still is motivating him to leave.
Conscience can't do its work if you keep harassing him with the phone. I would just stop calling and leave him to call you.
And YOu should end the call FIRST, tell him you are busy and have to go. My guess is you call him most of the time and he ends the call most of the time as well. Do the 180 and reverse that because what you are doing is just smothering him.
I was thinking about copying them and stickying them....but I'd rather the thread be started by YOU.
Why don't you start a thread and copy these gems into them, and I'll sticky it.
I am actually trying not to start any of my own threads, there is a good chance my wife may find this site and read everything I have posted. :P
If I knew it could be hidden or removed in a button click I would put up whatever, but thank you.
I have been reading a LOT of material from a lot of different places and I have also seen the impacts of doing the right things and doing the wrong things.
You BET it does. I'm actually laughing at what an arse I'm being. What a DUNCE I am. Jeeeeesh!
"Sorry to bullet my point home here but this has been said already and it doesn't seem to be sinking in."
Oh, it's sinking in alright. It's just not STICKING! No less the ten people on these boards have told me not to call him, and I still keep doing it. I'm ****in' sick about it. I cannot tell you how programmed it has become.
When he asked my why I keep calling him, I said, "because I want to hear your voice". (shaking my head in terror over my idiocyncracy). I'm thinking about going to a hypnotist and asking her if she can stop me with hypnosis.
Anyways, here is a list of things I've been doing over the past two weeks, besides working long hours, of course.
1. Going to church with and without friends. 2. Renting a storage unit. 3. Applied for a job half as far away from home. 4. Driving to work two hours a day and back two hours for two weeks. 5. Borrowing my H's truck three times and virtually moving in back home (with help from one man in each place - called Angels of Mercy - it's a church thing). 6. Talking to my pastor. 7. Cleaning up the apt. and getting electricity and water shut off. (I'm all moved out now. That was very stressful on me because I was working a full day and then going to the apt. to move and clean, and then driving home two hours). Ugh! 8. Watching movies, but not really getting into them. (I watched the "Bank Job" last night). 9. Eating out a lot and cooking dinners for myself and H too. (I leave them for him, and sometimes he bites, and sometimes he does not). 10. Playing with the dog. 11. Swimming 12. Reading DB stuff on the here mostly and in some of the books. 13. Unpacking and hiding some of my things around the house. (I think this might be what you're calling a "subtle" hint. H did notice the bike, if you remember from an earlier post. 14. And last but not least; just yesterday, I got a call from the mgr. of that job I applied for closer to home. I have an interview on Thursday, my day off.
Oops, I forgot one. H's always taken the garbage in the past and dumped off on his way to work. H's not doing that now, since I started coming home every night. So, today, I drove around looking for a place to dump it because the dump station is not open on Sunday.
Plus, I went grocery shopping today and made another meatloaf. I also bought some chicken and will make something else tomorrow night after I get home from work at 8:30 p.m.
What's the next question? I have to go back and look.
Thanks Mark. I'm hoping I can FINALLY let this phone stuff stick poet
Also dont "Try" anymore love ... please "do" the things you are being told will work. I know they seem hard but they are quite neccessary for your sanity and his.
Remember it may not seem like it but he is hurting too and needs space.
The advice he gave you is stellar alot of good things.... all my best to you and I hope you are doing well! I always took it as a blessing from God when I got male POV from fellow posters.... I always seemed to have it during my 2 years here. For me personally it helped keep me centered and see things differently. They seemed to look at my behavior and spit out a solution or tell me to stop this or that. Well I must add Brandnewday and Oldtimer were awesome with a one sentence 2x4 too and they were Women. Well you know what I am trying to say ....I hope. I never had Male friends and all my Women friends would say just leave him. Men somehow see what needs to be done ,when we are letting our emotions run amuck, and find solutions. They are more rational than emotional.... IMO~ of course and I am sorry if it doesnt sound PC. I really feel it helped me tremendously. Ok I probably made no sense.... IN OTHER WORDS~ Use these blessings S~ Please!!!
This one's a thumbs up for me, I think, for not reacting.
I was just on the phone with my brother, and we were talking about H and the D. He was suggesting to me that I should definitely tell my atty. about the meds. and how they are messing me up and how I can't seem to make any decisions right now because I'm too stressed out. He wants me to find out if I can slow the D down that way. I'm going to have to ask.
Anyway, my point is... while on the phone with my brother, H called in, and my brother said, "Don't answer it," which I didn't, of course. My brother was also telling me how my nephew up and left his own wife and moved to the big apple and left her with a six-month old baby (how immature is HE)? Ugh.
Anyway, H didn't leave a message but then immediately called the home phone, and my brother told me not to answer it. His comment was, "Do you think this might be a life threatening situation or is he on his death bed and needs to tell you something?" Of course, I said no. "Then don't answer it, and pull the plug and take the phone off the hook." I didn't do that part.
But after I got off the phone with my brother, H called again on my cell and left a message. He sounded low (maybe even tearful, a little). I was concerned.
His message said, "Ya know, you call me and I do answer, S. I might get mad at ya, but I do answer every now and then. And I guess you're mad now. You say you're not going to call; for me to call you but then you don't answer. So, I, I don't know what to say, S. Goodbye."
Ok, so I felt his hurt and called him back. He did not answer this time. So, I left a message explaining I was on the phone with my brother, and if he wanted to talk that I'll be here.
He called back few minutes later. He was annoyed with me because I did not answer. I tried to explain to him that I was listening to my brother about my own nephew's troubles. He left his wife and baby of six months, and I guess I was sounding a little upset. H says, "You sound upset." I say, "Yes, it's upsetting." H says, "You don't have any reason to be upset, it's not you, etc., etc."
Jeesssh!
I'm really beginning to see how unscrewed his head is.... Gosh, is he made of wood?
Anyway, I tried to validate his feelings about that as best I could, saying it's my family and it is upsetting, and I will try to understand your way of thinking about it, blah, blah.
Then, I asked him if he got my message about the meatloaf. He said yes. I told him to take half of it, if he comes home tomorrow.
That was his cue. He immediately jumped on it.
H: Are you coming home tomorrow? Me: I don't know. H: Are you coming home evrey night now? Me: Ya know, you keep asking me the same questions over and over, and I keep giving you the same answer. I come home when I feel like it.
Then he got mad, and I blanked out the rest. He ended up hanging up on me. And NOW I know what Neil means by what he says when he says, "That's his anger, not yours. So, don't react."
