Sex-Starved Husband. Will Work For Sex.

[Delil@h]

I'm supposed to take charge and be forceful--but the instant it's too forceful, you can feel the temperature in the room drop. And if it's not forceful enough, you can feel the apathy. But how in the world can you spend ten years beating a man's spirit down and emphasizing that he has no control over his sex life and you hold all the cards--and then expect him to pretend to be in charge?

This is from an old post.... I am sitting at home and I had some time to read your thread.


Does she really want for you to be forceful or is it she wants to feel your passion..?

I explained this to my Husband in regards to :
Taking me from behind, doggie style whatever you like to call it.
I know you did not refer to a position but it brought this conversation with my own H to mind.


* he said....

~ he didnt like to take me b/c he thught he was hurting me etc etc etc .... I didnt like it too hard or too soft etc etc etc.
Similair to what you are saying.....

* I said....

~ I want you to take me from behind and I want to feel your Passion. I want to feel like you cant get enough of me. Like * I* drive you wild with Passion. I want to feel you grab my hips and take me like I am the hottest thing on this planet and you must have me,,, I want to feel your hands pull my hips towards you so that I know you want to F*KC me and you want me..... Like it is me who turns you on and you arent just horny. It makes me feel special and hot when you do it like that.~

* when my H ahs had a few he will throw caution to the wind and take me like that,,, not too forceful not too soft..... just a lot of passion and like he cant pull my hips back far enough to feel me.. Like I am so hot... and he wants to devour me. Now that gets a woman hot or me at any rate....*


See the difference?

I dunno I dont think it is about acting... it is that silent message that you send. Saying "you " make me so hott, baby , sweetie , honey, like noone else.

Just my 2 cents ~Sb.

God bless...
~Ali

[Delil@h]

~SB....

I would print out S&A long post to you and get the books he recommends.
The advice he gave you is priceless... absolutely priceless and so on the money it is scary.

I would work on all the changes he said one at a time.
Dont think about working on them work on them.
The change in your R will be amazing and you will be a much happier Man.

And If your lucky the side effect will be ~ your sex life will get better too.
But one thing at a time and I do think working on you is far more important now that I have read thru your thread.

Most people here would give anything to get advice like that and someone telling you like it is.

I myself listened to WISE posters like Strong and Alive and my Life is so much better now. * ( Thanks Santhony, COG, OT, AMYC ,and may others here who blessed me with their time and effort and support)

When you work on you and stop living like you are believe me it will be brilliant. But it starts with you... these awesome people can post til their blue in the face but it ultimately starts with you.
You can do this... so get started. Little by little every day you can reach your Goals.... I promise, but it will take a lot of blood , sweat and tears on your part. Some major growth.
Anything is possible... let this be the last day you stop blaming her and start living.
All my best to you,
~Ali

[SillyOldBear]

Well, it's been a couple of days and things are moving faster than I expected. I'm not sure how the next few weeks are going to go. Now that things are changing, I'm finding myself worrying about how to keep everything from snapping right back into place.

First for Alimari:
I know what you mean, but I don't think a lack of passion is the problem. When we make love, it's clear that I'm 100% focused on her. There's nothing distracted or lackluster about it. The only trouble I have in that department--and maybe your "h" did too--is that frankly I have trouble with premature ejaculation, so there are times when I have to slow down or even stop lest the whole thing end right there. I've tried to work on this, but it's hard to learn much or change much having sex once every 1-2 months.
Other than that, my trademark is zeal, passion, and fanatical devotion to the job at hand. Or tongue. Or whatever.

For Dancequeen:

please give some consideration to the OTHER SIDE of the fence and see that men are not just "easy" to figure out and make love to and have fulfilling relationships with.

I wouldn't be here if I weren't doing that. Frankly I think I'm trying pretty hard. It may not look that way to you, sitting there reading my floundering and knowing more or less how it turns out in the end, but I've been considering her feelings since I met her. It still sounds like we're talking about pretending to be strong, but only to a point. For instance, I'm supposed to be strong, I'm supposed to be independent, but if I express irritation at someone playing mind games with me, I'm not considering her feelings. That makes no sense to me. If the problem is that I'm acting too much like a weakling, fine. I'm not a weakling and I can make that change. But it defies logic to expect me to be strong and take charge, but do it meekly. I considered her feelings, but that doesn't mean I don't have any.

Now on to the update/journaling:
We went on and had a good day on Thursday. The twins and I had fun in the morning, and when my wife came home she and the baby both took a long nap. The twins picked a restaurant and we went out for dinner, they got presents, and we went to the mall (this is a big deal for them.) I bought the boys comic books, and she let the baby play in the play space. We snuck long kisses in where we could, and she was really enjoying them, so I took a chance at home before we left and told her I wanted to make love that night. She made an excuse, and I shot it down. She told me her period wasn't over. This has always been a dealbreaker for her; she says her period is gross. But I figured I'm being assertive here, and if she gives me a flat no I can always show how strong and nonchalant I am (well, am not, which is almost the same thing, isn't it?) about rejection. I was rubbing her back at the time, so I asked her:
"So, right now, while I'm rubbing your back, does it feel good or are you thinking about your period?"
"Well . . . it feels good."
"And if I kiss your neck like this . . . does that feel good, or do you want me to stop because you have your period?"
"OK, that does feel good. I know."
"All right . . . what if you give sex a shot, and it feels good, too?"
"OK, we'll see. How about a maybe?"

I was overjoyed at maybe. Maybe is better than I've grown to expect. I told her maybe was fine. Actually, I told her maybe was good enough because I was going to put the kids to bed and then bring her to bed, by the hand if necessary. Unfortunately, by the time we got home from the birthday stuff, it was late and the baby was fairly pissed off that his routine had been changed. I caught her eye:
"Honey, I have to tell you something, but if I tell you the truth, you promise you won't get angry?"
"Sigh . . . . what is it?"
"I don't want you to take this personally, but I'm going to have to say 'no' tonight. You're too tired. Let's get some sleep."
"I love you."

I thought that was pretty good. It wasn't going to happen anyway, and better I say so than hang on and force her to take charge and reject me for the thousandth time.

Probably should have kept it in mind for tonight, but I was trying something. But I'm getting ahead of myself. First the triumph of Friday night.

[SillyOldBear]

So . . . . Friday.

When my wife came home from work, I was cleaning the bedroom and sorting clothing to be donated, stored, etc. I was also moving excess furniture out to make space. She wanted to lay down for a bit and then pitch in, which we tried to do. The baby was napping and the boys were off playing, so we had a little time to ourselves. We discussed the night before. She told me it had meant a lot to her that I made the decision not to have sex and took it out of her hands. Now, mind you, being in charge of deciding not to have sex is not something I want to become my regular role, but she made me glad I did it.

We discussed a lot of things. We talked more about her parents; I'd been thinking a lot about our wedding. Her mother had insisted that her father couldn't be allowed in the reception line. I knew that was ridiculous, but I told my wife privately that I'd back her up no matter what--and she caved to her mother. I told my wife Friday that what I should have done was tell her mother that nobody was going to use our wedding to screw anybody else, but I was young and dumb and didn't know any better.
"I did the opposite of the right thing, but I thought I was doing what I should. I was trying to show you that I trust you and respect you. I was giving you what I want you to give me."

She told me about how bad she'd felt that day, too. We moved on to talk about us. The kissing was still good. At some point, she said "How about tonight?"

I allowed as how tonight would be good.

My parents were taking the twins for the night, but the catch was that I was on call from 6 p.m. Friday until 6 a.m. Saturday with the volunteer EMS service. I can stay home when I'm on call, but if the pager goes off, I've got to leave right then. I was contemplating whether it would be funny to post something like "My wife is still conspiring to deny me sex--this time she got some guy to fall off his roof so I'd have to go ride the ambulance." I decided this forum would not appreciate the humor.

We dropped the boys off with my parents, who offered to take the baby for a couple of hours, too, so we could eat in peace. We went to the store and chose a couple of steaks, which we grilled and ate together, and things were going well. I kissed her neck--from behind, by surprise--and she didn't pull away. She giggled and smiled. I was shocked and trying not to let it show. We picked up the baby, bathed him, and I took him upstairs. I got him all dressed and settled into bed, then went to our room and made the bed. My wife came upstairs in her thin robe (hooray for the thin robe) and I said, somewhat stupidly, "Had your shower, I see."
"Yeah, and I thought you'd be right behind me." Oops.
"I was busy putting the baby to bed and making ours. I'm going to take mine now."

We just about never drink, but she'd picked up a pack of wine coolers at the store and she was sipping at it when I went downstairs to shower. Nothing very exciting happened downstairs, which is not surprising because the hot half-naked woman was not down there.

I came upstairs to find her lying across the bed watching one of her favorite movies in lacy panties and one of the new bras she'd bought the day before (she said she hadn't bought new bras since she'd been pregnant with the baby, and there really is a big difference.) I'll spare you the details from here on, except for a few:

1. She was a lot more enthusiastic than usual and very interested in my pleasure.

2. I really think we both had a VERY good time. She usually swears up and down that she's just had the time of her life when we make love, but in the past it's been hard for me to accept that since she would say it was the best thing ever and then refuse to consider doing it for another month or two. Please don't lecture me; I get it now. I think.

3. I hit the EMS lottery jackpot. I did not get called out during dinner (which is, frankly, beating the odds in itself) and I was not even called out during sex (which has got to be a billion-to-one chance.) I did later wake up to the pager shrilling, and the page went out for an ambulance crew to go to the police department for a female patient complaining of back pain, with the further advise that she was "combative and 10-56" (fancy cop-talk meaning "drunk as a skunk") I rolled over with a groan to check the clock and found that I'd been off duty for 16 minutes and the combative drunk was someone else's problem. It was a glorious night in so many ways.

The next day, Saturday, was today. Today was a great day. I actually did get rejected tonight (I know, two nights in a row is probably pushing things for a guy who used to be relieved to get sex once a month, but what can I say?)
However, it was still a great day and I think I handled the rejection the right way, which takes a surprising amount of sting out of it.

[SillyOldBear]

And thus, we find ourselves conducted inexorably toward Saturday.

We woke up with just the baby and no twins; they were off in another city with my parents at an antique show (it sounds bad, but they share the family passion for old junk, so they love it.)

My wife loves garage sales, and today our town had a townwide sale, so we put the baby in the car and took off. We found a few bargains, talked, laughed . . . it was nice. There was also a small car show in town on our little town square, near our home. We went home, put the baby down for a little while, then went back out to walk our own neighborhood with the stroller. Then we walked uptown together, bought our lunch from the Knights of Columbus, and walked around the car show together. Nothing huge, just enjoying what was on offer together. Later we went home and drove into the nearby big town to do a little political work that was important to me--my wife had volunteered the day before to come into town with me, and again, I was a little surprised, but happy to have her join me. We ended up at the mall again (more time than I've spent in that mall in the last year , but it worked out.) We got the baby his first haircut, then I took him to the playzone while my wife got her long hair cut short. I like her hair long, but I figure she doesn't need me to be so dominant that I forbid her to cut her hair, so I told her the truth when she asked how it looked: "You're beautiful."
(I'm not flattering her, she really is. I said I found her irresistible awhile back, and somebody posted that I should think about why that is. Seriously? She's hot.)

Then I took her to our favorite Thai place for dinner. I did not ask where she wanted to go, because that never works. It goes one of two ways:

1. She has no idea, and she punts it back to me: "I don't know. What do you want?" or

2. She says, "I don't know, where do you want to go?"
"OK, how about India House?"
"I don't like that Indian food. I'm allergic to too much of it."
"OK, how about La Cucaracha?"
"No, I had Mexican last week."
"Uh . . . OK . . . so where does that leave?"
Followed by her choosing the restaurant.

So this time, I simply said our favorite Thai place was open and we'd go there. She objected that we might not find anything for the baby to eat there. I replied that we'd stop and get him some chicken nuggets (guaranteed toddler-food) and repeated that I wanted to take her to our place. She relented. We had a great dinner together. We'd been continuing to kiss like lovers all day, and I'd been dropping hints that I'd like more. Now I told her as much--we'd go home, get the boys, put everyone to bed, and then I'd like us to go to bed early. She first told me she'd be too tired. I told her I thought it was no good to decide at 6:00 that you will definitely not be in the mood at 10:00. She countered "How about I say maybe?"

Again, I was actually just going for broke. Maybe sounded fine to me, and I told her that. I've long thought of "maybe" as meaning no, and honestly, I still think it usually did during our marriage so far, but I'm trying to take her at face value as much as possible, so I tried to assume that "maybe" meant "maybe." Well, we went home, got the boys, and tried to get the boys to bed, but they were hopped up from their trip and stalled and hemmed and hawed until we forced them to bed. I put the baby to bed while my wife finished with the boys, and by the time we were both in the bedroom we were tired, no doubt about it. We had talked during the afternoon (after "maybe") about Davis' idea that we should "just do it." It made sense to both of us, because she's that spouse in the book--if you happen to catch her willing, she makes love like a freight train and seems to enjoy it as much as I do, which is saying something. I say "seems" because I used to wonder every time whether she was faking. How could someone who enjoyed sex that much, I wondered, hate the idea of sex so much when she wasn't having it? I think I get it now . . . . maybe.

Anyway, I kissed her, I touched certain parts of her legs and back that she loves, I played in her new short hair, but all was for nought. When it was clear she wasn't responding, I asked her how she felt. She told me she felt bad, because I was trying to kiss her and help her get into the mood, but she was "laying here cranky and tired and not even trying."
Now, not to sound selfish, but this is something else I don't completely get. If she's metacognitively aware enough to tell me that she's not really trying to "just do it" and she actually wanted to make an effort, then why not just go ahead and make the effort? Who's stopping her?

Anyway, I didn't say that. I again told the truth, but did it without saying directly everything I was thinking.

I told her:
1. She couldn't get discouraged too easily, because it might take a long time to make much difference.
2. I wasn't angry at her (which was true, I wasn't.)
3. I'm not demanding sex every night; I just want her to think about it, because I want there to be some chance on an average night that maybe we might make love.

So, that made her cry and hug me and that was nice. I'm really not angry at her, but am I disappointed? Well, I'm on the internet at 2:30 in the morning my time, so that probably tells you everything you need to know about that. And now I'm going to bed.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Anyway, I kissed her, I touched certain parts of her legs and back that she loves, I played in her new short hair, but all was for nought. When it was clear she wasn't responding, I asked her how she felt. She told me she felt bad, because I was trying to kiss her and help her get into the mood, but she was "laying here cranky and tired and not even trying."
Now, not to sound selfish, but this is something else I don't completely get. If she's metacognitively aware enough to tell me that she's not really trying to "just do it" and she actually wanted to make an effort, then why not just go ahead and make the effort? Who's stopping her?

Hey Pooh, if you ever figure out the answer to THAT one, let me know. Cuz I'm 23 years in, and I still haven't solved it.

Puppy

[SillyOldBear]

Even that had a more or less happy ending. I spent a long, restless night, and when I woke up I had certain devilish thoughts running through my head, but it was clear she was going to sleeping in and I was only bothering her, so I got up when the baby cried and changed and fed him. He lay back down, so I went downstairs to make breakfast. (the bigger boys slept in until almost 11:00 a.m.--grandma and grandpa had worn them out.)

The floor in the kitchen was in terrible shape, so I decided I'd sweep and mop before I cooked. I had scrubbed about half of it clean of mud and dog hair and baby cracker crumbs when my wife came downstairs, gave me a long kiss.

"Whatcha doin'?"
"I'm gonna cook breakfast, but nobody was awake and I got fed up with the floor so I'm cleaning it first."
"Oh. Well, I'm going to take a shower. Wanna come?"

So . . . that went well. Then I cooked her breakfast and we ate together with the twins still abed, and the kissing continued. I honestly have no idea why we didn't kiss like this before. I had every intention of changing, but I don't think I really made much of a change--but life is certainly different. Now she's off in the bigger nearby town picking up the twins' birthday cake for their pool party tonight, and the baby and I are typing this post. He's a big help at the computer.

Random vignettes and ideas:

1. Yesterday, I leaned too close to my wife and nearly killed us both. She was driving and we were on our way out to see the garage sales and have fun. I said something she liked, leaned a little too close to her and . . . she decided the road could take care of itself, turned 90 degrees to her right and attempted to kiss me passionately. This time it was my fault, because I shouted a warning as we continued to roll toward the intersection--and the car stopped at the stop sign ahead of us--which caused her to break off. I missed out on that kiss, but on the upside we didn't die in a car wreck, so we've got that going for us. Later I demonstrated the technique of waiting for a red light before kissing one's spouse. A few times. It was a good time.

2. Now that I've talked to all of you for awhile, things I never really noticed are blaring out at me. It's often an odd sensation. Years ago I bought my wife a book of "women's erotica" written "for women, by women" and edited by a Ph.d. I know; who could have guessed that this would not be a good way to awaken passion in my wife? A dirty book edited by a Ph.d should be a surefire thing. Anyway, a few days ago I found it as I was clearing the bedroom and took a look through it. There was a story about a slightly older woman working with a college student described as "stereotypically handsome." She's excited by him but worried that he thinks she's too old. He tells her he's going to take her to a local beach because she can't leave without seeing it. She demurs, but he answers every excuse firmly and continues to driver her to the beach. Eventually, of course, they have hot sex on a blanket.
But that's not what really stopped me cold. What got me (this would be a day or two after S&A's long post) was this line:

"She had been dating an appropriate man, a lawyer her own age. He never took her anywhere; he was forever asking her where she would like to go."

There was no other description of this loser; clearly the author was confident that mentioning this one aspect of their relationship would be enough for (female) readers to get the message that it was awful. This could not be good. This guy was obviously written in as the unnamed throwaway boring guy the heroine is going to dump as soon as she gets home. And the description of him sounds like a description of me. Never "take her to" the movies, dinner, a park . . . . always ask her where she wants to go. I was so sure that was the right thing to do, I thought I was being such a good husband. But here this author can sum up the archetype of a terrible relationship by casually mentioning the way I treat my wife.
Not good at all.

[Delil@h]

OOOH la la ,,, you are both doing so well.
I am soooooooooo happy for you!!!!!

*The only trouble I have in that department--and maybe your "h" did too--is that frankly I have trouble with premature ejaculation, so there are times when I have to slow down or even stop lest the whole thing end right there****

OMG?
Now that you mention this my H said this same thing to me..he has to hold back some or here will too.
I used to feel like it was me and when he explained this to me it helped so much.
I had been complaining that he didnt moan enough or let me know enough and when he explained it to me I burst into tears. Here I am so hot and I turn him on so much and I felt like I was unattractive... UUGGHH !
He always had this look on his face... too serious ....like he was holding his breath....


I am sooooooooooooo happy for you....
See you are attractive.... When my H mops the floor it turns me on too....
Take care,
~Ali

[SillyOldBear]

I don't think it could have been the mopping of the floor specifically. I don't think she can turn on a dime that fast. I've been doing more housework for a couple of years now, but I think she felt the same way I did about her attempts at sex--it wouldn't last, she couldn't trust it, it was just something I was doing to spare her feelings.

She is still reading the SSM book, too. We talked yesterday and agreed that we're surprised at how happy we are together now. I don't think either of us realized how unhappy we were before. Now my work is making this last more than a few days.
Last night I was--well, not too tired for sex, exactly, I don't know if that will ever happen again--but tired, and happy. I didn't need sex. I told my wife I was tired and she'd better keep her hands to herself. She laughed, and if she felt relief at the prospect, at least she didn't let it show. We went to sleep together. It was nice. I think I'm in love.

He always had this look on his face... too serious ....like he was holding his breath....

Yeah, that's the look. There are all these "remedies" for premature, but I've never made any of them work very well, and none are very sexy. Have you read about any of these ideas? The most famous is called the "Valsalva Technique." You're supposed have normal sex until you begin to feel like you're going to climax, then "bear down" as if attempting to defecate with some difficulty. When I was younger, I made it work while masturbating (just as an experiment to see if it worked) but it rarely works with my wife. It also has the added bonus that in the middle of hot sex with your wife, you stop and do a perfect imitation of a man attempting to poop out a football, after which, 9 times out of 10, you climax anyway (and she's got to be wondering why, since you looked like you were having a stroke a second before.)

So if your husband has ever stopped in the middle of intercourse and made a face at you like he was pooping, understand that he was trying to be sexy for you. Don't ask him why anyone would ever think that was sexy; he doesn't know.

Our final solution to premature ejaculation was to stop worrying about it. That was one problem we were on our way to solving before I read SSM. My wife can't climax from penetration, but she can move mountains with clitoral stimulation, so we almost always end with me giving her head no matter what else we've done. One night she told me "Look, just go ahead and don't hold back. It's not fun for me if you hold back. You always make sure I come anyway." So now that's what I do.

[Bagheera]

Our final solution to premature ejaculation was to stop worrying about it. That was one problem we were on our way to solving before I read SSM. My wife can't climax from penetration, but she can move mountains with clitoral stimulation, so we almost always end with me giving her head no matter what else we've done. One night she told me "Look, just go ahead and don't hold back. It's not fun for me if you hold back. You always make sure I come anyway." So now that's what I do.

Bravo to both of you, Bear: this is exactly where you need to be at this point. At the same time, if the parallels that I have drawn between your wife and mine hold true, then in order to engage in the kind of lovemaking that your wife dreams about, you'll need to achieve a good level of ejaculatory control. Luckily, Premature Ejaculation (PE) is one of the easiest sexual problems to alleviate, and can be 'cured,' if you will, with just a few months of dedicated work on your part. I've done it.

Confessions of a Premature Ejaculator

I grew up in a strict, religious household with domineering, critical parents. My mother, in particular, was terrified of teen-aged male sexuality, and did her utmost to monitor my every erection to make sure I didn't do anything 'perverted' with it. As a result, I learned how to secretly reach orgasm quickly and efficiently during masturbation -- along with a good dose of guilt to go with it. Given a few years of this, and you get a man with sometimes severe PE problems when it comes to sexual interactions with a women, particularly with vaginal penetration.

For most of my marriage, my wife and I adopted the solution that you describe above, and while it was alright (note the lukewarm tone), we both wanted more from our sexual encounters. Last year, after I began my campaign to rebuild my marriage and get my wife on board to do the same, I set out to solve my PE problem once and for all. There is a lot of misinformation out there on the web, a lot of 'quick and easy' solutions that don't work, so I can hopefully save you the headache and point in the proper direction to solve PE and master ejaculatory control.

Recommended Reading

I'm going to recommend two books to you, and I hope this isn't seen as advertising -- it isn't. I've culled through a lot of coal to find the diamonds, so hopefully my sharing them will be seen as just that:

The first book is called The New Male Sexuality, by Bernie Zilbergeld. It was recommended to me by our current sex therapist and contains the detailed exercises that he uses for solving PE problems in his clients. Note that PE problems only take up one chapter, but the rest of the book is a very good and insightful read.

The second book has the absolute cheesiest title ever, and is called How to Make Love All Night (and Drive a Woman Wild!), by Barbara Kessling. It's ostensibly about teaching men how to achieve the so-called male multiple-orgasm (MMO), or 'orgasm without ejaculation,' which allows you to carry on to more orgasms until you're ready to have a 'final' orgasm with ejaculation. However, the book's real value is in the ejaculatory control training and exercises leading up to the MMO. Once you've reached the point where you can 'plateau' your arousal state indefinitely while actively thrusting, and then have ONE very nice orgasm when (and only when) you are ready, you may not even care to go on the MMO.

Thirdly, do a Google or Yahoo search on "Kegels PC muscle man men," and read up on the advantages of strengthening and regularly exercising your PC (puboccocygues) muscles. Kegels are NOT just for women, and are very beneficial for men too, particularly those with PE problems. Start a daily Kegal routine now (Kessling's book will put you on one too), as it will take a few weeks to get that muscle group up to snuff with regard to ejaculatory control.

What Doesn't Work

As I said, there is a lot of stuff on the web regarding PE that doesn't work very well. Two techniques to steer clear of are:

(1) The 'squeeze' technique: this is an old method whereby the penis is removed from the vagina as orgasm is approached and the glans manually 'squeezed' to back the arousal state back down. Not only does this interrupt everything, but it also doesn't teach you how to control your arousal via any other method.

(2) The mental 'distraction' technique: this is also an old method which encourages you to distract yourself mentally by focusing on something outside of what you are doing, such as thinking about your ugly Aunt Petunia. Forget it. The techniques you want to master are ones that encourage you to focus on your body and sensations, your partner, and to stay 'in the moment.'

What Does Work

Good ejaculatory control involves a medley of techniques, not just one in particular, that you use in tandem with each other, depending up the circumstances. Your goal is to maintain an arousal level of about 6-8 (on a 1-10 scale) indefinitely, until you are ready to 'drive home' to orgasm. You'll find that this control is very much a 'mind game,' such that as you gain experience and confidence, you'll be able to maintain control more automatically and less 'mechanically' using these techniques:

(1) Thrusting Speed control: faster thrusting builds arousal, slower thrusting lowers arousal. This technique begins with the standard 'Stop - Start' procedure (which tends to interrupt the action and enjoyment for HER), but does become less extreme with practice and experience.

(2) Thrusting Motion control: certain positions / angles are more stimulating than others, so a short-term shift to something less stimulating can be used to drop your arousal level. In my experience, however, those positions which are most stimulating to me are also the most stimulating to HER, so again, this can lead to an interruption in her arousal too.

(3) Breathing control: rapid, shallow breathing builds arousal, slow, deep breathing lowers arousal. This is a very important technique to master, along with thrusting speed and PC muscle control.

(4) PC Muscle Squeeze: This is Kessling's primary technique, and works quite effectively after you've built up that muscle group, either in the form of a series of short, 'hard' squeezes or one long 'hard' squeeze. Note, however: a 'light' squeeze can have the opposite effect and enhance your arousal, so take care.

(5) PC Muscle 'Push': because the PC muscles tend to slowly tense up as your arousal builds, you can reduce your arousal level by purposefully relaxing them, or 'pushing' with them. Your comical description of the 'Valsalva Technique' cracked me up, but is on the right track. The difference lies in that a true PC Muscle Push does not involve your abdominal muscles -- only the PC muscle group.

(6) Mental Sensation Shift: this technique is the most difficult to master (I'm still working on it), and involves mentally shifting your sensation focus from the orgasm-building head of your penis to somewhere else, such as the shaft or internal prostrate area.

With lots of practice, this gives you SIX ways that you can either build or lower your arousal level, and with time, do so without interrupting your partner's arousal buildup.

Final Hints

The key to going from a PE prone man to one with good ejaculatory control is practice, practice, practice. This involves a 2-3 times daily Kegel routine, and a 2-3 times weekly 'exercise' routine --> beginning with masturbation exercises and working to partner exercises. In my case, my wife wasn't all that keen on the sex-as-an-exercise idea, so I went as far as I could go "by hand" on my own, and then incorporated the remaining, penetration exercises into our normal lovemaking.

As I said above, the entire program will take a few months to several months to complete (depending upon the individual), so be very patient and forgiving with yourself, accept setbacks and stall points along the way, and don't proceed on to the next exercise until you fully master the previous. Also, don't over-exercise your PC muscles by doing too many 'reps' and such -- they don't work well for ejaculatory control when they're tired and sore.

If you have questions or comments at any point along the way, holler at me, Bear. I'm still aghast that I admitted to my own PE past here on these forums, but hey, that's what we're here for -- to help each other.

Best regards,

Bagheera