In my sitch, my W did not ike to have conflict if she didn't get her way. She came from a family where the women "ruled" and the men were doormats. Anytime I would object to her point of view she saw it as a low in our marriage and anytime I agreed, it was a high. She told me she was sick of the roller-coaster ride and that she was supposed to be happy in this R. If she wasn't, then God was telling her to leave.
I look at the conflict and anger as signs that we are NOT doormats and need to negotiate solutions that are in the best interest of the family as a whole. We can agree to disagree but should not make any major decisions unless we BOTH agree. Since my W wanted to move 600 miles to be with her family for her own benefit and nothing else, I had to say no because I knew it wasn't best for our family and because I wasn't going to give up my job with no prospects on the horizon.
She felt that, as her husband, I was to sacrifice whatever so she could be happy (that's how her parents were). So, one day she visited her folks, called me and said that unless I moved, I would never see her again. I did, if only to save my family but, in the end, the inevitable happened: her mother took over as emotional support and I was put on the sidelines until I had had enough. Then she left me.
Conflicts are always going to happen. That's a given. The key is to learn to resolve those conflicts as a team with validation, patience and understanding. Because my W always relied on her mother to guide her in her decisions, I always was wrong because she felt her mother could do no wrong.
So in my case, conflict and anger did split us up, if only because I refused to be the doormat she wanted me to be.
I question this. I have a quicker temper than my STBX, although generally I would get upset, think it through, and get over it pretty quickly before we split up. He'd stew forever.
I would think it would be abnormal for two people in a long-term relationship to NOT have any disagreements. Conflict exists wherever you look... two people can have opposing views but it does not mean you do not love or care for them.
I think the REAL conflict occurs when you cannot respect, listen to, or understand the other's point of view. I'm a big girl... I understand that not everyone will agree with me or understand my view on an issue. The problem occurs when one or both partners refuse to negotiate or discuss an issue that is important to one or both. Not every problem may have a "solution," but understanding that something is important to your spouse and treating it with respect can go a long way towards maintaining the love and respect in a relationship.
I noticed this happening more and more in our M. For example, I became increasingly frustrated with the way the STBX handled our finances. Traditionally, he always had. I happily let him do this... he seemed to have wanted to do this since we were married. He became increasingly frustrated about this situation, and he honestly does not have many financial management skills and is not the type who will easily discuss problems... he's afraid to admit weaknesses. I tried desparately to get him to discuss the problems with me as I saw us go further and further into difficulties, and witnessed much money from house refi's going down the tubes with no accounting. Finally, he felt he got off of the hook with this situation by accusing me of wanting to control him through money. I felt disrespected and uncared for at that point... all I was concerned with was making sure we met our obligations and had wanted to work out a plan with him to do so... after all, wasn't I his partner?
I totally disagree, although unfortunately, my H would totally agree with this statement!
Conflict and anger in themselves are a part of life and can even be healthy. With anger, the trick is to focus on what your anger is trying to tell you, and then deal with that. And conflict can lead to growth and change. What is wrong with that?
I suppose what it comes down to is how you deal with conflict and anger. Some people, like my H, can't stand anger. He even said to me once, "How can you be angry with someone you love?" But even a calm discussion where we are not in agreement feels like a "fight" to him. I have become very careful to avoid discussing anything with him when I am upset or angry, and always make sure to seek his opinion on sticky issues. It's very tricky, but I think I am getting better at it, and it seems like we have better discussions. I still think he sees these disagreements as "fights" though. I'm still working on trying to make these discussions very peaceful and calm. I don't know if that will work, but I'm doing what I can.
Actually this was just the oppistie for me. My H would not enter into conflict with me under any circumstances. All he would say is that he would not fight with me because I would always win. I used to think that was because I was just more logical and right more times than he was. AHAH! WHat a mess I was!!!!
Anyway, my H stopped conflicting and just would say whatever I wanted to hear. HE would just yes maam me. That is when our M went down the tubes, when we could not discuss anything of conflict. Since there was not conflict then there really was no M. I kept getting my way, and did not even know that H was in disagreement. H just kept getting more and more resentful, until he finally said one day IDLY I am leaving! And that was it.
Recalling my personal situation, the statement is not correct. My W and I never argued, never entered into serious conflicts, showed no anger to each other. Yet she had fallen out of love. Out of the blue just like a volcano she exploded. She was building this volcano slowly - slowly day by day. And when it exploded everything just fell into pieces. If only I knew then what I know now!
I agreed with this statement - maybe I still do... maybe I just haven't found a good way to have healthy conflict...
My bf has said to me that he never felt he could say anything to me, because I'd get angry/upset, so he ended up not telling me things, bottling everything up inside, and in the end, we split. My way of dealing with difficulties was to blow up. His was to say nothing, even if he disagreed with me.
My parents divorced when I was 5, after an abusive M - father was an alcoholic. A violent one. I witnessed a lot of this, so I think my 5 yr old mind thinks if people argue, it means they don't love each other. So we didn't argue - I blew, he withdrew...
It's time to learn how to have healthy conflict...
Mel
It's time to live, it's time to love, it's time to do what's afraid of
It's time to breathe, time to relieve, it's time to shine
What were the times like when he felt that "he won"? How did you get there? What was he like afterwards?
Have you ever done a 180, and maybe tried to argue a point from the total opposite stance of how you actually felt? Tried to argue a point from what might be his stance on it? If so, how did that go?
I used to think that was because I was just more logical and right more times than he was.
Have YOU ever NOT been the logical one? Ever come from an emotional stance? Maybe a place that really didn't make much sense? An "illogical" point of view?
Are there any "exceptions to the rules", times when he may have felt satisfied after the two of you had a conflict? Times when things went better?
JJ
Read about Divorce Busting® Telephone Coaching here!
Ah, you hit on a good point. No I have never not been the logcial one. Even when I totally freak out, I got him down the road I wanted by Logic.
I can try not being the logical one and totally arguing a point from a different view.
Not much communication with H right now. In 2 weeks he can file for D, I think he is purposly staying away so he can feel guilt free to file.
I guess the 180 for me is not pursuing not calling not even talking to him when I see him out. (Not not talking to him but not going out of my way either. )
I think that disagreements are part of marriage. I think the people with the healthy marraiges have figured out how to handle these. My W and I used to argue all the time about anything I look back now and say how sad we were. I think the trick to conflict and disagreement is allowing your S to have there own point of view. Making it ok for them to tell you what there point of view is. Validating there feelings even if you disagree. Then trying to work out something that you both can live with. Another big thing is letting the stuff not affect how you feel about your S. Anyway just my 2 cents. Lee
By now, most of us are VERY aware of what we can do to start, or escalate, an argument with our partner. We know exactly what buttons to push to make a "discussion go south". We are experts on what it takes to really tick off our partner.
Take a few minutes to make a list of some of these things.
Now, review this list, and see if you can pick out some ideas about things that you can do that might help to make your arguments less heated, and more productive.
JJ
Read about Divorce Busting® Telephone Coaching here!
My H avoids all conflict, not just now but I see now that he has to some extent in the past. Hence the lying. If he knows or even thinks I will get mad about something he did or is doing he will either A. avoid me. or B. lie to me about it.I don't think this is a very healthy way to live. I am usually a pretty rational person and (atleast not in the past)didn't blow up for small things.I have always choosen my battles but it doesn't stop H from avoiding.Some disagrements are good for a marriage.Shows that you are each your own person. Just my opinion.
My ex-B didn't tell me his feelings until it was too late. I knew occasionally he'd be like "you won't let me do xxx" and it was stuff we'd never even discussed! I had a hard time trusting him over one thing he'd done previously, but when I moved in with him, everything was pretty much a clean slate. If he wanted to go out on Wednesday nights, he should have just told me he was going to do that. We got into a pattern of mostly just spending time together, and he felt smothered - I can see that there were some signs of that, like my previous example. He just assumed things and didn't talk with me about them. And if I got a little hurt over some things, so what? He built up in his mind how I'd react and much of the stuff was really NOT a big deal to me.
On the other hand, he IS talking with a brief ex-girlfriend about what she did to him (she ditched him in front of a group of people they knew for someone else about 4 years ago, it was only maybe a one-month long distance thing to begin with). He had let her live that summer platonically in his apt too. So instead of working it out with the person who is here for him and loves him, he's talking with someone who's treated men like they were as expendable as toilet paper (she has a track record). And he's going in a couple of weeks to see her overseas. So he will discuss things, but in his own time and that might be a long time from now.
I think you do need some conflict in a relationship, in my previous marriage we were two people who didn't approach problems at all and I learned from that. That does not mean everything has to be solved 100%. There are things that people differ on. But it's important to respect the others viewpoint. My ex-b has a pretty violent temper - it isn't often, but he does rage. He'll never touch a woman in anger, but he has pointed his fingers in my face. That isn't a healthy thing, but at least it does blow over quickly.
I would also like to know how to stop bf "mind-reading" me...! He builds up these scenarios in his head of how I'll react, and then avoids me or lies to me...
Maybe I've given him reason to think this way from my previous reactions - I don't really understand how to have conflict in a constructive way, so maybe I just bulldoze...
Can I learn how to do this? Mel
It's time to live, it's time to love, it's time to do what's afraid of
It's time to breathe, time to relieve, it's time to shine
Quoting Mellers: I would also like to know how to stop bf "mind-reading" me...! He builds up these scenarios in his head of how I'll react, and then avoids me or lies to me... Mel
Is this a guy thing? It drives me nuts, because obviously for nearly two years (the time we were living together) he built it up in his mind that he couldn't do things. And he said he assumed that from things I'd said - things that had nothing to do with the matter he was upset about.
And now he's gone off the deep end.
The hard part also, and I really have to remember that Ex-b has a very ugly side to him, is that he won't usually tell me what he thinks until he is in a rage. And he will rage, sticking fingers in my face within an inch of my nose. The last time he did that was right before I left and I finally told him not to do that. He told me he could do it if he wanted. He has also told me things I should and shouldn't be doing (like which friends to talk to) while when I asked him to not discuss me with his friend, he said she was a friend and he could do what he wanted.
He was a little controlling when I lived there - but generally I just blew him off and he loses the rage very quickly (usually 5 minutes or so). But it's ugly, it's condescending and when he mocks me during it, it's really horrible. This wasn't something that happened often, but it's a side of him thats come out a LOT recently and it's something I need to concentrate on. Not just the really wonderful side of him - there is a lot of that. But the bad, and it's like a whole Jekyll/Hyde thing.
Some friends of mine really pounded into me today that it was verbal abuse, and they are probably right. It wasn't often, and I will take the bad (to a point) in a relationship when there is tons of good. But he does have problems and issues and I just try to picture in my mind the times that he is ugly and mean and hurtful - and it helps me detach some.
My H and I had many disagreements. I felt it was normal. However, I would usually avoid conflict because when we did argue he would start to put me down and walk out the door and leave. Then the next day he would act as tho nothing had happened and all was well. I did not feel it was normal for him to act this way. I would retreat to the bedroom and hide so he woudln't leave. Now, that he has left me I am sorry I did not try to get him to talk about whatever it was and listen to him. I got defensive because he was defensive. It was always bitter. He has a son that he brought up who is 22 and a daughter his ex has raised that is 18. I have a daughter 12. When we got together I felt it was grand the way he and his son were so close. He gave his son everything and even wrote out his checks for him to pay his bills. Then I realized they were dependent on each other and their were times I was jealous because I was left behind while they did their thing. My mistake was to voice that opinion because he has never let me forget that I was jealous of his son. He even walked out of counseling when I brought it up and wouldn't go back. He has never really bonded with my daughter except to degrade her. I am closer and do more things with his daughter than he does. Sorry, I had something to say when I replied and I got caught up on this and forgot. I will try to read it once more an dreply again. I miss my family. 8 weeks is a long time without him. All the bad times but I saw a light at the tunnel.. I Just read Michelle's book too late, but I am still trying.
OK OK I got it now. All my life I have had disagreemensts that were never resolved. I hold in my anger then blow. I am 42yrs old now and am finally telling people just how I feel. With my H I was afraid of his anger so i would hide. Not good. He hated the silent treatment. I do not have a problem with agreeing to disagree. I think it is the easy way to get along. We are all different and it is normal to not see eye to eye on everything. Compromise is the key to life. I am looking for ways to change discussions with my H. He is instantly angry with me over anything anymore. I want to talk to him bad and have a decent conversation. It been 8weeks since he left and I have had NO contact in 2 weeks. I am scared to call or see him because I can't think, my heart beats out of my chest because I just want him to come home to me. I want to tell him what I read in Michelle's book and that I CAN fix our lives and we CAN be happy again. What do I do? Please, tell me something. I am waiting for my DB books to come in mail. I read Sex Starved Marriage( I had it for 3 months. If only I had read it before he left) but I need help now. Anything. Thank you
I have a similar situation. W's mom RULES her dad. W wants to rule me. I won't be a doormat either. If she cannot respect me and treat me as an equal, it IS over.
We haven't finalized the D yet so I still have a few months to try and save the relationship. But is takes two to tango and if she won't try at all I know it is over.
