Wife has filed, what do I do ?

[micoms]

My wife has filed for D. We have been m 27 years, together over 30, have 4 children S26, S25, D24, & D19. We've been separated since 7/12/07, when she first left I did the typical stuff, cried, begged pleaded,etc. She moved in with our D24 and her BF & son. We were seeing each other, going out to dinner and movies, I'd go to see her 3 to 4 times a week at D's. Didn't give her any time or space.
We even went on a vacation to Fla in Aug together (we had planned last winter). Things were great until 2 days before our return. She got a voice message or text and went cold &distant.We had been seeing a MC, Wife had said she was moving back home after vaca. On coming home she said she was still going to stay with D24.
I have suspected she has had an affair with a co-worker. Now I think it could have been 2 or 3 over the last three years. Our problems started shortly after she took a part time job to help with expenses for S26's wedding. The job was to be 2 or 3 nights per week, but became 5 nights a week, on top of a full time job. She wouldn't get home until 11PM. We had serious problems withD19 when she was 16, she met a 22yo weasle who convinced her to give up everything and runaway with him. She is very bright, 4.45GPA( extra for adv placement classes) and very gifted in soccer. She would have gotten a full ride to college. My W quit both jobs when D came back home. We still didn't do things together, someone had to stay home to make sure D didn't run away. Eventually W went back to work at her Part time job, but now working 6 nights per week, only a weekend night off every 3 to 4 months. She left this job to go to another, working evenings until 11PM. They changed her hours to 4AM to 1PM, and working every Sat & Sun. After this all she would do is work and sleep. I'd come home from work she'd be asleep, wake up for dinner and be asleep by 7PM. Three plus years of not doing things together took it's toll. Her affair with co-worker started at this new job.

After coming back from vaca on 9/02 she had moved back with D24. On 9/26 she told me she wanted a D. I stopped seeing her as often, would only see her at D's house if I was invited over by D. On 10/15 I had quad bypass surgery. She came to see me in hosp every day, but only for about 1.5 hrs. 11/09 she filed D papers. I'm currently not working and won't until 1/15/08, guess her atty told her to file at this time.

I want to still try to work it out between us. Do I drag out the divorce, or go along with it. While we were seeing a MC, Mc said W was having a midlife crisis. W said in counseling she didn't know what she wanted or had any outside interests. Kids were adults now and didn't need a mommy. So do I drag my feet as much as I can, or go along with the D?

Mike

[micoms]

Wanting to hear from fellow DBers about how to proceed, drag my feet or just go with the D?
One thing good about the separation is W was the one to keep in touch with the kids. I have been talking more to my children. S25 & D19 still live in the house with me. (S25 is trying to get a job as a police officer, doesn't want to sign a lease then have to move into the city or community where he is working.)D19 & S25 have been very helpful to me in my recovery. I talk to S26 about twice a week, go over his house to see him, his W & my granddaughter about every 2 weeks. I talk to D24 about four times a week, she works for an eye doctor and gets weekdays off. She gets me out of the house and to a mall to get my walking in.

[ladydi1127]

micoms, I'm all about dragging feet. Not the best person to advise you on DBing, but I think give her more time to think. Sorry to hear about your surgery. Hope you are feeling better. Check our rejoiceministires.org.
LadyDi

[lushmd]

micoms, I'm all about dragging feet. Not the best person to advise you on DBing, but I think give her more time to think. Sorry to hear about your surgery. Hope you are feeling better. Check our rejoiceministires.org.
LadyDi

Sorry to meet you in this venue, but if its of any help, my counselor suggested the same thing (delaying/stalling as much as possible to give the other person time to really think and clear their heads).

[micoms]

Thanks ladydi and lush, that is what I was thinking. I'll have to get an atty now. Got a response on legalmatch.com, atty said court can grant a 90 day conciliation if both parties don't agree. Don't want to run up atty fees too much.

One thing our sep has done for me is I'm closer to my kids now, have S26, S25, D24, D19. W was the one to call them and keep me updated on them. I call S26 twice a week and go to his house About 2x a month. I see D24 at least 2x week, she works for an eye doctor and get weekdays off, takes me to the mall just to get out of the house. S25 & D19 live at home with me and have been a great help the first weeks of my recuperation. W is living with D24, D's BF & our GS (grandson). But both S's she has little contact with, calls S25 about once a month or less, has been to S26's house maybe twice in the past year. She works terrible hours 4AM to 1PM. She will fall asleep anywhere at about 6 to 7PM.

I thought W was reconsidering our sitch, She called S26 on her way to annual trip to Gatlinburg with girlfriends. While talking to her he said she started crying, when he asked her what's wrong she told him she was depressed. Odd your on the way to a fun weekend with friends and your depressed! On 11/09 she filed for the D, haven't been served the papers yet.

Had been making changes, she noticed one> I'm a blue jeans and tee shirt kind of guy, but when I'm going to be around her it's Dockers & a dress shirt. She ask why so dress up, I said it feels nice after spending The last few weeks in hosp gowns & PJ's. Other changes are on hold cleaning & repairs to house, I've been upgraded to lifting, pushing or pulling 10lbs from 5lbs. Also been working on losing weight, lost over 50lbs since Feb, down to 213!!

[micoms]

Any other opinions on what to do? Should I drag my feet on the D or go along with it? I still want to work on making changes for myself and DBing. I want to work our marriage problems out. MC thinks W is in MLC. Our kids and I think she is also, of course she denies she is. I had talked to W about holding off on the D for a few months, I have great medical coverage, if we D she can't stay on it.

I truly am at a loss for what to do. I know if we work on it we can have a new and better marriage.

[christarn]

Micoms, You asked on a previous post what made me change my mind about wanting my H back, and deciding against the D...sorry it took me so long to respond to you, worked all weekend ;(!!!

1. I was born and raised Catholic, catholic schools etc...divorce is something that we don't believe in, a few months after I left, I truely started to pray again, and I try to go to church as often as I can...I made vow in front of God, unfortuntantly, I realized the meaning of it, a little too late

2. I made a vow in front of family, friends and God to love this man until death...most importantly I promised him, and when times got bad, i chickend out...I walked...something I doubt he would have never done to me

3. I realized that 75% of our fights were me trying to be a selfish bitch, I wanted things my way or no way. I went from living straight with my dad (who spoiled me wrotten!) to living with my H, it was treamendous culture shock, about 6 months after we married I went back to school, he was not working steadily, and I was just stressed to the max...I had NFC how to deal with it all, I caved, and walked.

4. I realize now that our main problem stems from lack of communication, and that simple things I can do would help to fix that.

5. My husband saw me thru the deaths of both my parents, he knew both of my parents and that is quality no man could ever replace, and a quality maybe someday he could teach my children about (nobody else could)

6. I miss my H's strong arms to snuggle into when I have a bad day or when I come home from work and just need to vent....or coming home to eat with him...it's the little things in every day life sometimes that matter the most

7. I think most of all just knowing not only did I let our marriage down, I let him down, and I live with that everyday, and I know what it's like to be in these shoes fighting hard every day to not call, text or drive over to see him, it's hell. I just wish that there were more things I could be doing to be actively saving my M, but at this point, I don't know what that would be. So for now, I just wait, wait and pray, pray a lot that maybe one day he will turn around and see that I'm sincere about wanting him back. That he can trust me not to turn and run when things get bad. Until that day comes, I'm here with everybody else riding this roller coaster!

I hope that maybe your W, will see things differently soon for you, take care of yourself...it's the only thing you can do thru all of this! Take care, Christa

[micoms]

Thanks Christa,

Good luck to and your sitch. Like you my W is Catholic.Her father died when she was 3, her mother when she was 14, then she lived with an aunt who is a devout Catholic.

W is in MLC, she said it herself in MC and MC confirms. She has lost sight of who she is in her own words. She has served me with D papers. Talked to an atty, meeting on 26th.

W said herself we can work it out but is afraid of it going back to where we're at now. I know I can't stop her & the D but I hope to slow it down to give her more time to come out of the fog. I've seen glimpses. I broke down an called her Fri night, I know against DB. We talked 1hr, no R. She came over with D24 & GS Sat morn. Good convo, again no R. When she left,walked out to her car to help with GS. Looking into her eyes i asked for a hug, she said ok. Leaning in for hug, still looking into her eyes, I thought about a peck on the lips. Thought better about that turned my head and she kissed me on the cheek. Maybe I see too much in this, but it seems she still has feelings.

Will see her on T-day, We always had it at our house, 4 weeks ago I had quad bypass surgery. I can't do it this year, D24 is having it, I'm paying for food and have to show her what to do. W has to work until 2PM, but will be there. A week ago she filed for the D.

I'm praying us and kids being together will make her think. Kids are against D, they see signs of MLC also.

[christarn]

Quad bypass, wow...I'm a cardiology nurse...where did you have it done at? sorry just curious? 4 weeks out how are you feeling physically with all of this going on?

Are you still in MC? My H, refuses MC....we were doing things for the first few months, but over the past 2 he has really retreated, I don't know why. Wish I did, would try to fix it.

Remember D's take time, lots of time, during this time, work on your changes and 180's...show her your stuff at T-day

Best wishes for a speedy recovery...keep up your walks...and coughing and deep breathing!!!

[micoms]

I live in Ohio, was done at Mercy Fairfield by Dr Patel.Physically i feel great. I referee soccer, typically do 3 games on Sat 3 or 4 on Sun. They say you get in 1 to 11/2 miles of running, jogging and walking in one game. Blood sugar, cholesterol, bp, etc fine, had a physical before problems. Family history got me. Since Feb I've lost over 55lbs!!!. Down to 208, was 220 before surgery. Was over265 at one time. Started cardio rehab last Wed, told them today their not working me hard enough. I don't break a sweat and pulse rate only goes up to 100, starts at 93. Mentally I'm down, with my sitch and unable to do anything, bored outta my mind.

I'm not in MLC my W is. We were seeing a MC and MC confirms. kids also see it. W works horrible hours, 4AM to 2PM no weekends off, two days off during week. D19 goes out during the week,W would go out with her sometimes. D19 told me today W would act like she was 20 when out with her, it was embarrassing. Looking back W MLC probably triggered by D19 then 16 met a 22yo weasel who convinced her to runaway from home. That summer she ran 4 times. This broke W's heart. Came home finally when weasel got caught picking her up from school. Was held no bond, he skipped on last one. He spent 1 yr in jail with 1yr in state pen suspended. When D was away from him she saw what he was. What she tells me now, if I'd have known then what he did to her, I'd probably be in jail now.

Now W lives with D24, d"s BF and GS. Her life is about the same as when she was home. Go to work, come home, sleep, wake up for dinner and back to sleep. I guess I felt rejected because I'd only see her awake for dinner, we'd never go out on weekends because she never got them off. Only about every 3 or 4mos. I withdrew felt her job was more important than me. I never strayed or flirted with other women though some would come on to me.

She on the other hand had at least one EA/PA possibly 1 or 2 more. I know it's part of MLC cycle, I can forgive her. I want to work on M. She wants to run away from it.

[christarn]

sounds like you are making a speedy recovery! When you are refereeing, does the leg that they harvested the veins from bother you at all? My patients sometimes say the leg is worse than the chest!

Wow, your wife has done both to you MLC/WAW...that's tough! Has she actually filed for D or just said it? Is the counseling helping at all? I totally feel you on wanting to work and a spouse that wants to run. My H and I were doing ok (or at least I thought we were) then I went to Ireland with my family for 2 weeks in Sept., things have been different ever since. We went from texting weekly and seeing eachother couple times a month, to maybe texting 4 times a month, and I have only seen him twice since I have been home from Ireland. Wish I knew what happend?

take care of yourself, when do you get released to go back to work? that will help to keep your mind off of some of this, that is soooooo hard to do sometimes!

take care of yourself!
christa

[micoms]

Just had surgery 5 weeks ago, haven't reffed yet since, unless the let me put a lawn chair at mid field and let me call the game from there, lol.

She filed 11/09, received papers 11/16. Guess her atty said file while he's down.

I see her still, she came to the house Sun with D24 & GS. Was pleasant, no R talks. I'll have to talk about D with her though. She wants $1200 a month for alimony, thats 31% of my take home pay. She is in the midst of a MLC. Confirmed by our MC. Had at least one EA/PA. That OM is married. I'll see her T-day, since I had surgery, I can't do it, not allowed to pick up more than 10lbs.

D24 is going to do it, I'll have to show her what to do, if it doesn't come out of a can or box with instructions, she doesn't know what to do.

W sends mixed signals, Sun when she left I asked how about a hug? Got one, I was looking in her eyes when I asked, started to go for about a peck on the lips while still looking in her eyes, decided not to, turned my head, she kissed me on the cheek. She squeezed me tight, hug lasted about 10 sec.

well got to go, by the way I'm not having problems with harvested leg, did at first. Took 15 min walks first 2 days home, leg swelled. Had to slow down on walks and ice leg.

Mike

[christarn]

I can totally relate to wanting to work on something, and having a spouse that wants to run...it plain sucks! Do you have any big 180's planned for T-day..if not get your thinking cap out!!! Go get some really good smelling new cologne!!! and a really cool new shirt!! something sexy!!! Get her to check you out!!!!!!

My H had OW immediatly after I left, I'm over that, nothing one can do about it. I think he feels he's not good enuf for me, which is totally boguss...I wish I knew what I could do, to make him see that it is ok, and I truly love and care about him for who he is.

It's easy to feel rejection when your spouse spends little time with you. Michelle is so right when she stated in DB/DR that marriages usually begin to break down when couples stop spending time together. You have many positives working in your favor, DO NOT give up on that. You are both still seeing a counselor together...big positive. Your children are on your side, which I see as a benefit. And you are all spending the holiday together...make it count!!!

Sounds like your revovery from surg. is going great...keep up the awesome job with your rehab. take care, christa

[micoms]

180's, I think I'll try flirting with her. Maybe wink at her from across the room, tell her she looks great(she does she lost about 50lbs, she said she weighed about 180 at one time, I think she is about 125 now). When I've told her she looks great she tries to deny, I think she has self esteem problems. She has to work until 2PM as always. I'm going to be upbeat, positive, and try to laugh a bit. I look back at myself the last year, I didn't laugh a lot. I was depressed. I felt rejected, her job was more important than time with me. Her hours are 4AM to 2PM, I'd come home from work she'd be in a chair sleeping, wake up for dinner and be asleep by 7PM.

My W has said I deserve some one better than her, she can't be the kind of wife I deserve, etc. I think it is out of guilt for what she has done and doesn't deserve me. I want to work our M problems out. Since we've been S I see things I've done that got us where we are and see some of what she's done. I don't want the old M back, i want a new R that develops into a spiritual, loving M.

As far as cologne goes she loves my Joop, I'll wear that and my smaller clothes that fit so well now. Don't have money for new clothes right now, being out on med leave. I have some clothes I put away years ago form when I lost weight, only got down to 215 that time, down to 207 now. Good thing I'm a pack rat or I wouldn't have anything that fits.

Where do you work as a cardiac nurse? You weren't one of mine were you, lol. You a slave driver on the walks and coughs like mine were? Just kidding, I know it was for my own good.

Mike

[christarn]

sounds like you have your plan of attack down!! sounds awesome!!

I'm a huge stickler on my patients...I've seen one too many have to go back to ICU on a ventilator because they didn't cough and do their breathing excerises and wound up in respiratory distress...not a pretty picture! I work in Springfield, IL at Memorial Medical Center, in the heart and vascular insititute. I love what I do. Unfortunatly it was my drive and passion for my job, that put my M on the back seat.

I can relate on the whole self esteem thing too. My H's is in the toilet, and has been since he was a child. I wish I could do something, something more than just sitting around and praying and waiting...but for now, that's the best route for me to take!!

[micoms]

I had problems with walking at first, I couldn't breathe. They said it happens in men who are muscular, one of the drainage tubes runs between the lung and rib cage.

My nurses worked 3 12hr shifts and had the rest of the week off.

I guess my self esteem suffered also, feeling rejected, her lack of time with me, no sex life to speak of, etc. I'm working on building it back up.

Is the OW out of the picture now? My W had at least one EA/PA that I know of possible another or picked back up with the first one. When the A ended, she would want to quit her job. Must be hard to work around someone you had a R with and now it's over. Her OM was married also. Don't think she's seeing anyone now, but she's going out to bars doing who knows what.

Mike

[christarn]

I also work 3 12's and try to pick up over time, try to stay busy as I can, keep my mind focused on other things.

My patients say the drainage tubes, hurt pretty darn bad, they are usually lying on a nerve, which makes it very difficult to inhale deeply.

I've heard that the OW is out of the picture, but same here, he goes out and drinks a lot, so I'm not sure what the heck is truely going on. I try not to focus on it. Just stay busy and do fun things with my friends on my weekends off. that's all I can do for now. You're self esteem will get back up there in time, believe me! i've been fighting this battle now for 10 months, it does get a little easier in time, it still sucks, but day to day things come a little easier!

well i'm off for 12 hours of slave driving those patients to walk and cough and breath...well you know the drill!!!!!!!!!

take care, start gettin yourself pumped up for tomorrow...
christa

[micoms]

Thanks for the encouraging words. Wish I was going to work, only seven weeks to go. They've called a few times on getting some of my jobs to run again. I am a elevator service mechanic. Been doing that for 28 years, wow thats a long time.

Going to hang out with D24 and GS today, Probably go to a mall and walk around.

Mike

[christarn]

Have a happy turkey day, good luck with your sitch! Show off some good DB moves!! I am spending my t-day 12 hours at work! oh boy!!! take care, christa

[micoms]

Thanks, you too. Got children?

PMA at all time high. Ran into a guy I bowled with fea year ago Mon night. Told me W said I was having A on her a year ago. Went to alley he bowls at tonight and talked to his long time GF(they've been together 15yrs.). She confirmed this, happened a year a go or longer and said W had a couple of guys interested in her (W had been out with GF's drinking before coming to alley. That is isn't what boosted me. Friends GF told me I'm a keeper, she knew the kind of man I am, and I'm the kind of guy her friends dream to meet,I'm a keeper!!

What a boost! Not that I'm interested in somebody else right now, but that is how a woman views me. She also introduced me to a couple of men who had separated and got back together. One was separated 6mos, the other actually was divorced 15mos, dating after 11mos and remarried after 15mos. Sat down in the restaurant and talked to him and his wife.

Every one have a happy Thanksgiving Day, save some turkey for tomorrow.

Mike

[soul_mate]

Glad you had a good day and thats cool that you got to talk with some people that have been through this stuff.

[micoms]

The man who was actually D'd, said they both realized that the grass was not greener when they split. They started dating after 11 mos apart and remarried after 15mos. Gives me hope.

Happy Thankgiving

Mike

[christarn]

Hey there, sounds like t-day went well...and what promising news from your friends at the bowling alley! A D couple who re-married...way cool! I have always said the grass isn't greener on the other side, there is just more to mow!!! My H text me both Weds, and Thurs...which has really got me a little shocked. He sounded in a good mood. So invited to my family's post t-day boozing (tommorrow) he said he mite join...figured it was better than the hell now I was expecting!!

What a boost on your PMA also from your friends at the bowling alley...all in all sounds like good things coming your way!

Did your wife notice any changes in you at t-day? Did she like the clothes/cologne thing?? I bet money it caught her eye!!! Speaking from a women's view!
Take care, Christa

[micoms]

W had to work until 2, she seemed depressed. She disappeared a few times to talk or text on her phone. I wore dress clothes, not the usual blue jeans and a golf shirt. The dinner was good. I tried to be upbeat and happy.

D's BF had to leave about7PM, he was going to get his old job back but they withdrew the job after he gave 2 weeks notice to his current job. He is going to work with his cousin in Nashville. D24 and D19 drove him to meet his cousin halfway. Me, W, S25 and GS left behind. S left and I talked with W. I know against DB. I told her I've been trying to give her the space she didn't get when we first separated. I felt I had pushed her to the point of wanting a D by not. That in the last 2 mos I've taken a good look at my self and didn't like who I'd become. Told her our problems are lack of communication, we never argued and held things that upset us. I told her I am leaving the door open, if she wants to get back together. Told her if that's the case we should date and develope it slowly. At times she looked as if she was thinking about it, but at the end said she wants to still D. I told her I can understand that she is afraid she will get hurt again if things return to the way they are, but
i see the things I need to do to prevent that.

So now I don't know if I've planted a seed for her to think about or just pushed her away farther.

when I talked to the couple that actually D'd, the woman told me she changed her mind when she realized being single wasn't what it was supposed to be and saw her ex out with a date. They dated for 3mos and remarried.

Guess I'll not contact her for a while, hope she thinks about things
i daid and softens her heart on the D.

Mike

[micoms]

Your sitch is looking up!!! Don't get too excited and expect too much. Let him pursue you a little.

Sounds great so far, good luck.

[christarn]

M...sounds like things went well. I would have done the exact same thing in your shoes, talked a little, stated your feelings, and give her something to think about. I think sometimes we have to tell our H/W how we feel, otherwise how will the know? I also understand the whole "needing space thing," but at what cost? So I guess what I'm trying to say, is given the circumstances, she hung around, she was as at free will to leave, apparently there was a reason she lingered, she didn't get up and walk when you started the R talk...so I would say no harm done...just my 2 cents!!!!!!!

so my H didn't come out...but it was ok, i ended up having a great time with my family, and having to take care of my sister. Had he came, I would not have been able to help her, the man up stairs had a plan for me...and it was to take care of my sister!

take care of yourself! How are you feeling? Did t-day wipe you out?

christa

[micoms]

I don't know I think I backslid. She seemed to listen at times but others seemed to shut me out. Guess I'll go a little dark.

How's your sister?

Mike

[christarn]

she's ok...just over did it on the booze...and she feels like a@# today!!!! Something tells me she will do it again!!! I know sometimes it feels like a backslide, but I sometimes think at least you got it off your chest,and how is she ever going to know if you don't state it...

christa

[grid, lost]

micoms,
I think T day went really well. As Christarn says, W stayed and could have walked if she had wanted to. Be proud of yourself for being honest and telling W you are looking at yourself not her for change. Takes a lot off her shoulders.

I keep forgetting to tell H I want him to have the space he needs. You remembered and that had tobe reassuring to W.
We all have to try and keep DB/DR

[micoms]

Thanks christa and grid.

I thought after I told W that it was a mistake. If she is determined to D I guess it wouldn't make a difference but if she is on the fence maybe it's something to think about. I think i'm going to sign up for DB coaching this week. Maybe a little expert guidance would help.

Christa good to hear it was only over indulgance. I thought she might have had medical probblems. I think I might need a night of too much soon.

Everyone keep up the good work!

Mike

[grid, lost]

[.

I think I might need a night of too much soon

micoms,
I'm Irish, a once in awhile night of "too much never hurt anyone. LOL That is as long as you don't drive that is!!!

[micoms]

I've always said if it wasn't for playing softball or bowling I wouldn't hardly drink at all, and I retired from softball. I only bowl one night a week, but since surgery I had to quit for the year. I have had three beers since 10/15 (date of surgery). 5t's been quite a while since I have had one too many.

mike

[grid, lost]

mmmmmmmmm...mmm no sports, no drinking, no dog, no job, W..MLC, Micoms, just joking on this but we could make a country western song out of your stich at the moment. lol


hope U realize I am just joking around about all of this and not putting you down or anything

[micoms]

Yeah, and if you play that song backwards you get all of it back!!lol. W moved in with D24 so I'm in the house with 2 of the kids and the dog.

Mike

[micoms]

Met with my atty today, he thought what W wants for support is high, but said the magistrate makes the call. He's going to file a petition of conciliation. Forces both of us to see a MC. Have to meet with him to sign papers on Wed. I hope we don't have to go through this, what a waste of money.

Mike

[grid, lost]

micoms,
Consider a jump start on the court ordered conciliation and MC. Why don't you find a C who is solution orientated (sp) and will work with DR. theories Might also save some time of one on one time with C. before you both are in same room together. Court is going to only give you so much time max. every day you can.
Don't forget we both have to remember babysteps and GAL.

I hear you on the wastie of money bit ! My stomach rolls over just thinking about it.
Today I cleaned out the pantry in kitchen. Lots of old can goods from before i became ill. Uck! Tossed all of them 2 shelves to go. I am loosing steam fast. lol

[micoms]

I don't think W will go to the MC we saw together, don't want to take a chance on who the court picks, I'll try to find someone who is SO. If W would talk we might get somewhere, maybe seeing a MC will get her to open up. After reading DB and DR, I can see what MC was trying to get us to do, she wasn't very clear about things. she suggested that I give W space, she should have seen me alone and told me and pointed out was only pushing her away.

Lol, I need to clean out the pantry also. There is probably stuff from years ago in the back. Need to clean out the linen closet also, kids have been doing laundry since I can't. They are just kid af tossing sheets and towel in. There are probably old sheet sets from when the kids were young, transformers, care bears and stuff. When I clean it out will give to D24 & S26 for my GKs.

I'll just keep putting one foot in front of the other, it will lead me somewhere, hopefully into a new R with W.


How is you illness, is it permanent or are you healing from it? I feel I'm getting stronger every day, rehab is setting a routine for just me. The program is for people who are 15 to 2o years oder than me who haven't exercised in years. I referee soccer games so until my operation I was in good shape. Met some co-workers for lunch, they said I look skinny, they were use to seeing me weigh over 250. They even bought my lunch, I know I should have said I want to go to a steak house, lol.


Mike

[grid, lost]

micoms,
hi I posted my stich over on KLA and they yelled at me for having multiple threads,,,sigh,,,,
my health is nerve damage from spinal cord injury. I look fine but not. live on heavy pain meds....some days I am good to go and others, NO. oh, nerve damage causes pain in all my limbs.

You keep getting stronger every day, one day at a time. Lunch with co-workers sounds fun. Being home all time sounds nice till you actually have to do it.!!! Become isolated as you are aware. I Love a good Steak.

Better look back in on the pantry. have to run to store to buy baby food for an old cat of mine dying of kidney failure. He loves the baby food and seems to gain wieght onit.
take care

No matter what some good will come out of the C. I hope your wife will be agreement to stop D for a year. That would be big step.

[micoms]

Sorry to hear it's nerve damage. Is it something that will get better with time? My best friends dad had a bruised spinal cord from the Korean war, he cold walk with crutches but chose being in a wheelchair because he never knew when his legs would go into spasms.

Yeah it's boring at home all day by your self, you can only watch so much of Jerry!! He was our Mayor and a news anchor in our town. My D24 gets a weekday off because she has to work on Sat, so we hang out at a mall or something together. Took GS to see Santa, they thought i was his dad. I'm 51 but have been told I look to be early 40's.

I'm a meat and potatoes guy, nothing better than a steak medium rare.

sorry to hear about your cat, it's always painful to loose a pet, how long have you had her?

Hope your sitch with H is improving. Anymore gifts?

Mike

[christarn]

Mike, thanks for checking in on me! I will post more later...been busy at work...and now i'm sick...yucky, just wanted you to know i'm still alive...later...and thanks again, for checkin in on me...hope all is well with you, christa

[micoms]

Had session with C today, same C we saw together. I asked her if she thought W was having a MLC, she said she probably was, W didn't have a sense of who she was. I think W lost that when we had problems with D19 then 16.

C said she seen how much I've changed, that I seem to be educated and concerned about what W is going through. I told her I've read several books, on my 8th now. Told her that DB & DR have helped me the most, also told her about online community/support. I told her that after reading DB/DR I saw what she was trying to get us to do in C'ing. She wrote down book and Michelle's names, I told her it would be a great book for spouses to read who are having M problems.

Good to hear from you Christa, sorry you haven't been around because you're busy/sick. I hoped it was because of better news. S just got home, we're putting up Christmas tree tonight. Just got rid of hospital bed, yeah!!!

Mike

[micoms]

GAL time tonight, first time since surgery 10/15. Waiting for friend to call or will go out with S25. Don't know where to go, we'll find someplace I'm sure. W called to day let it go to VM. Said she wants her extra car keys. D19 called about an hour later said the same thing. I told D19 I didn't have them, they were on windowsill in bedroom, W took them when she came for her clothes while I wasn't home. W said she doesn't have them, but I think I saw them at D24's house(W lives with D24).

Well, put up tree Wed night, found out most ornaments are gone, W came and got them. Time to change locks? Still had old wooden ones from when kids were little, unbreakable kind. Some of other decorations gone also. No money for presents this year due to my surgery, out of work until 1/15/08, so I spent the day baking Christmas cookies, these will be presents for the kids. I'm thinking about getting W a digital picture frame, loading it with pics of kids throughout school years, vacation pics, and pics of us in happier times. I'm afraid she's in the midst of MLC, don't know if this will upset her or make her think.

Don't know if I'll be invited for Christmas Eve with her family or not. Ran into her BIL where he works (at a retail store), he asked what's up with her. Told him MLC, he noticed she dresses differently, like the 20yrso, and she seems depressed. Told him both signs of MLC.

Well gotta get off.

[grid, lost]

micoms,
what are the eight books you have read? Well 6 as two are Michelles?
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

Besides DR &DB I've read

Women in Midlife Crisis by Jim & Sally Conway
Relationship Rescue by Dr Phil
Winning Your Wife Back by Gary Smalley
How To Get Your Lover Back by Blase Harris
Men Are From Mars Women Are From Venus by John Gray
Just got The Five Love Languages

Went out with S25 last night. Met S26 and his W and friends at a kareoke bar. I don't sing but S26 had a few drinks in him and he sang a few songs. It was a small place when we left we were half of the crowd. Even stopped on the way home for some Sliders.

Don't know about the holidays, I kinda get depressed thinking about it. Oh well, I'll just keep putting one foot in front of the other.

Mike

[Joeirl]

Hi mincoms,
re dragging feet about D, drag and stall as much as possible, why rush?
its safer to change locks as everytime youre out w will help herself,mine grabbed most of kids photos birth certs, passports etc until I got key back. worst case scenerio W could change locks and lock you out!
1st xmas apart is a bad one alright (as all new) but spend it with your kids do things with them it will make you feel better dont worry about being invited to her family.
i had my 1st xmas apart last year my kids were 5 and 2 then, hardest and saddest part was bringing them back on xmas day (w was demanding bring them in morning, but brought them at 1pm) take care

[micoms]

Hi Joeirl'

My kids are all adult age, but I think my S's relationships with their mother are strained. She has withdrawn from them. She never calls them or returns their calls. Went to a kareoke bar with both S's, S26 said he might not go to W's family's Christmas Eve. He called her T-Day and she still hasn't called him back. He has a D16mos, W has seen her twice since July. She's in her own little world, all she does is work and sleep.

One thing this Sep has done for me is I'm closer to the kids. W used to be the one who call them and kept me updated. S25 and D19 still live with me, I call S26 about 2 times a week and hang out with D24 one day and talk to her on the phone 1 or 2 times. I'm happy for that.

With my sitch, I had surgery 10/15 and will be out of work until 1/15/08, is I don't have money to buy them all gifts. They say it's alright but it still hurts.

Mike

[grid, lost]

micoms,
thanks for the book list. I'll pick up a couple from library. Thank God for libraries and Thank you Ben Franklin for having such wisdom.
micoms, gifts for family, you don't need lot of money for gifts. How about Ds get a date with Dad, say, you two spend an lunch and afternoon at a museum or go to a saturday auction. Ever been to an estate auction? They are so much fun.. How about if you clean the bathroom and do two loads of laundry for S with child.??? How about if you make a spagettie (sp) for D and her BF, don't forget the candles for them. You get to eat in the kitchen! lol Now start the imagination I know you can think of all kinds of stuff to do for them or with them. Most important is set a date to give/deliver your gift or else it will get by you.
When my dad was alive would have loved if he had made a spagettie dinner for H & I.
Go to dollar store and find some cornie item to wrap up as a clue to what you are going to give as a gift. For example, take S & GK to zoo, wrap up a couple toy tigers & lions. What do you think?? Gee this sounds like fun to me.
hope it helps Micoms. Kids evean adult kids want time just time with their parents, they want a special time when can have their mom or dad all to their self. In years to come you kids will comment on it was one of the best christmas presents ever.

[micoms]

Grid,

I decided to make Christmas cookies for kids. They don't have time and I've got all day, lol. They said they would like that. I'll try to find some stuff for GK's. S26 said I've given him so much all of his life that he could never repay me, I had to hang up the phone and call him back, I couldn't talk, too choked up. Read some where about someone whose father said his kids could spend any amount of money on his resent. Only stipulation was they had to make it. Might tell kids that next year. Might make some interesting gifts.

Ongoing thing with S26, he'd ask me or I'd ask him what Christmas present you want, we'd say something that rocks. Last year I made him an ornament, a reindeer on a rocking horse frame. I went to his house, it sits on top of his big screen tv for everyone to see. Gives me an idea, maybe make ornament for D24 and S26.

Maybe a good present would be coupons to babysit GK's for overnight so they could have a night off. Wow I'm on a roll, lol. That would be a present for them and for me, an overnighter with Gk's. My parents weren't really involved with my kids when they were young, but I want to be involved with my GK's. D24 already asked if I'll coach GS in soccer. I was pretty good coach in rec league. Girls told me they would learn more at my practices than at their select practices. I'd let anyone come to my Friday practices, they were on individual skills. Sometimes I'd have 30 to 35 kids at those practices. Had pretty good teams, we went to state tournament five years in a row. Oh the glory days!

Your other ideas sound good also. Guess I might make something that rocks for S26!

Talked to my BF most of the night, he's having problems with his W. Mostly financial and sexual. Her mother died 4yrs ago and has been depressed since. She refuses to take any AD meds. He 's about ready to leave. Tried to talk him out of it.

Another thing to look at for books is amazon. I've gotten my last few books used there and saved some money. Friend said maybe my W should be reading some of the books I've been reading.

One of the things I did for S26 was he came to the house & I told him we have to go for a walk, his W wanted to come and I told her no. While we walked in the neighborhood he grew up in, I told him I was proud of the young man he was. I got quite emotional and told him that these were words I never heard from my father and would have love to have heard(my F died when I was 12). It was quite an experience. We stopped walking and hugged each other and cried. Two grown men crying on a public sidewalk. I wouldn't trade that memory for the world.

I guess it's not necessarily what you buy or how much you spend that matters. Mike

[grid, lost]

micoms,
WOW you must have been some soccer coach! funny how in a sport word gets around about those who not only know thier stuff but are willing to share their knowledge.
30-35 kids at a S practs. that is some respect you got. Means you didn't waste peoples time either. Gave them meat instead of fat! Same thing with dog sport, travel miles just to pract. with a few good coaches.! Time is so well spent and get so much out of the class / workout.

BF tell him to read Dr. John Gray, PhD book on sex and the bedroom, forget the exact title. The guy wrote venus mars books. Might save his marriage if he is lucky. His W will love him if he'd read it.
Wish my dad had said the nice and loving things you say to your kids. Your family is more lucky than you all realize. funny, God made you go through your hellish youth so all your kids could have this Dad who got it!!! One suffered/lost out so 4 kids could grow into great adults!
Coupon for overnight stay with GKs so parents can have a night away to themselves. Christmas day they just might have a tear or two in their eyes when open that present!!! That is a beautiful gift mike. LOL I can just see the PJ party you'll cook up with your GKs. Well one gift down, just a few more to go.
LOL, For some reason had to read your lines on the christmas gift that rocks etc. about three times for I got it. Kept thinking of gift that rocks as in stone rocks. lol DU.
Well it is late and need to get some sleep. Spent the evening with friends helping another widow friend put up her christmas tree. Nice time just took a lot longer than I thought all would.
First have to drag berner dog Power Girl in from outside, 10 above zero and she is so happy outside. Hard to get her to come back in, they love cold. Of course with neighbors can't leave her out overnight. Wouldn't anyway, she has to much indoor coat to stay out all night tonight.
later,
grid, lost

[micoms]

grid,

that was one thing W brought up in C'ing, I spent too much time with kids, she felt ignored. I just pray for another chance.

Wow, 10 degrees, I'm whining about the 30's. GK's are 2yo and 17mos, I'll have my hands full, but it will be great. GS2 gets excited when he sees me, runs up to me yelling papaw, papaw,papaw. He tries to talk, but I don't understand everything he says. Our S's were 13mos apart, they developed their own language like twins do.

Our lab is about 95lbs and loves it outdoors except when it's cold.

Gifts that rock is something between me and S26, Two years ago he got me a singing chipmunk that sang rock songs. So last year I made him that ornament as my gift that rocks.

Mike

[christarn]

micoms! I'm alive!!! hehehe!! Glad you got rid of the hospital bed! I bet that felt good!!! I liked your book list! I've also read a few more:
Getting back together by Bettie Youngs and Masa Goetz
Love Smart by Dr Phil
Take back your marriage by william j. doherty
fighting for your marriage by howard j markman,scott m stanley and susan l blumberg
how to improve your marriage without talking about it by patricia love and steven stosny (this one was reccommended to me by my DB coach!)

Some of these I just read chapters or parts that pertained to my specific situation. But during the first phase of all of this I was just trying to learn anything and everything I could, so I read anything available on saving a marriage. I did do some searching online (amazon) and found more titles of books I would like to read...just haven't had time!!

My birthday was this past week, so took a few days out to party!! Otherwise work has been extremely busy. We had a 6inch snow storm, and i think everyone shoveled snow and caused themselves to have massive heart attacks When I left work tonight we were full and had at least 8 patients waiting for beds!!

I hope all is well with you! It sounds like you have been staying busy also!

keep on fighting the good fight,
christa

[micoms]

Christa,

Good to hear you're still kicking. Started reading 5LL. They predicted the white death here also but only got about two inches then rain. They were predicting 6".


Doc said I can go back to work 1/03. Can't wait, though my route is now gone, was absorbed by everyone else. Supt said something about using me to the best of my abilities, he wants me to be troubleshooter, fix problems on others routes they can't fix.
Had Co Christmas party at Dave and Busters, restaurant and game room. Big old Mike broke down, they got me a card and took up a collection, from 15 guys they collected over $500. When I opened the card and saw all the money, i had to walk away, tears were leaking from my eyes. Branch manager asked if I was ok, I said i was overwhelmed. I tried to get around to all the guys and thank them. Several times my voice quivered and my eyes got watery.

W filed for D, served me 2 weeks after I got home, wonder why she didn't have me served at the hospital? I guess she was being nice huh. I haven't talked to her since T-day, trying going dark. Don't know if I'm invited to her sisters house for Christmas Eve. S26 is bitter with his mom. She has only been to his house 1 time in the last 9mos. She's seen our GD twice since about May. He called her T-day, she still hasn't returned his call. He said he might not go to his aunts house for Christmas Eve.

How are you doing with H? Last I heard he was connecting a little.

Mike

[christarn]

Mike...I'm sorry to hear that your wife served you with D papers, that must have been tough. How is the going dark thing going? Have you seen any reaction from her? Your poor GD, and children, this must be difficult on all of you, especially with you recooperating from surgery and the holidays.

That was soooo nice of your co-workers to give you some holiday money. I would have cried my eyes out! I love Dave and Busters. We do not have one around here, but some friends of mine live in Nashville, TN and we go there and hang out...it's always a blast. Did you have fun at the Christmas party? We're you able to unwind at all? It's been almost a year since my H and I have been seperated, and still have problems going out and just relaxing and having fun, I am constantly feeling like something is missing.

As for my sitch, I wish I could say it was better, but I don't know. We text occassionally. We see each other ocassionaly. It is what it is. For now, I am ok with that. I am not ready to move on, and I still feel hope, so I will keep fighting the good fight...maybe someday it will pay off I figure the way 2007 went for me, it can only go uphill in 2008!!!

Take care of yourself. Glad to hear your recovery is going so well!

Not that this is anything special, but I had a patient who has been with us the past couple weeks and his chest incisions and the wires they used to close the sternum (bone over the heart) became infected. The bone turned into mush...no joke. They had to take it out, for days we were doing dressing changes over the heart, right there, the heart beating right there! It was so crazy. They ended up taking a muscle out of his abdomen and placing it where his sternum once was. I guess the moral of my little story is...you are doing awesome, especially with everything going on in your emotional/home life...so kudos to you!! Keep fighting the good fight!!

Christa

[micoms]

Christa,

Just got home from a Christmas party. Had a good time, saw a lot of people I hadn't seen in a while. Had a great day, baby sat GS while D24 and BF went shopping at their house. He is 2, we played on the floor, he was climbing on me and kissing me on the ear, played cars and kicked a soccer ball around. D has already asked if I will coach his soccer team when he gets old enough. Fixed their toilet, leaking hose on washing machine and leak under kitchen sink.

W came home while I was watching GS. First time I've seen or talked to her since T-day. Gave her compliments, told her she looked good. Asked her if I'm invited to Christmas Eve at her sisters, she said if I want to come. Told her kids are coming to the house Christmas day except S26, she could come if she wanted to. Also that I'm making New Years dinner, all the kids are coming over for turkey dinner and I'd love her to come. Also said I will be making pizza after I get back to work, all the kids will be there for some of Dads world famous pizza, the kids always called it that. I asked if I could take her out to dinner one night, she said ok.

Glad I didn't know about the horror story with your patient, although with all the morphine I was getting,I probably could have cared less, LOL.

It's good to here your sitch is at least the same. Is he initiating contact? I haven't had much of a chance to GAL with my recovery, also most of my friends are married, I wouldn't feel right going to a club by myself.

You keep fighting the good fight yourself.

Mike

[christarn]

Mike..just wanted to say happy holidays! hope all goes well! talk more later! christa

[micoms]

Christa.

Thanks and Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you. Went to SIL's house last night, W was there. Had a good time, our kids were all there also. I had wondered about S26, W hadn't talked to him in 2 months. It was good to see my niece and nephews. Caught W looking at me at times, when I'd look her way she'd look away. At the end of the evening she initiated a hug, I had a crock pot in my hands so I couldn't hug her back. I'll see her again on New Years at friends house.

Had kids over this morning for exchanging gifts. Due to surgery I had no money for gifts. Guy's at work took up a collection and gave me over $500. Spent some on GK's, the rest went to a new hot water heater, it went bad, water temp wouldn't go lower than 190 degrees. Gave D's certificate for a dinner with Dad, the boys a night out with Dad.

Here's to hoping the new year brings us closer to S's.

Mike

[christarn]

Mike, I am glad you had a good Christmas. Mine was good also, my H, ended up texting and asking me to stop by, a plesant surprise. We have been chating a little more. he has two lab pups, which i have been helping him with (vet visits etc) I am trying not get my hopes, which is hard, but I have learned each time I do, I end up getting hurt. So back to Christmas, we hung out with a friend of his, and drank some beers in the garage. After our friend left, I said something, which came out wrong and hurt him and lead to a monster argument. I hate the fact that I have a tendency to want to say something true and from the heart and my mouth gets in the way and it comes across as being an insult, which I never mean it to be. I ended up staying and apologizing the next morning. He understood and was thankful for the apology. Yesterday, I took the pups to the vet and stayed we had dinner and I gave him a Christmas gift, I felt bad, nobody in his family had gotten him anything for Christmas, so this was the only gift he had received. He was happy, it wasn't anything major, a t-shirt and sweatshirt from Harley in Ireland(i went to ireland in oct this past year). We hung out and played with the pups and just chatted, it was good. I spent the night, and this morning we went our seperate ways...which sucked big time for me. I guess we will see what happens. I am praying that 2008 is much better for us, for you and all of us here on the boards!

Sorry for my ramble!

take care,
Christa

[micoms]

Christa,

I know about reading too much into S's words or actions and getting my hopes up. I'm not reading anything into the hug W initiated Christmas Eve.

I'm glad he accepted your apology, the overnight stays sound like some steps in the right direction. I have a black lab myself, she's 5yo. The smartest dog I've had, she goes crazy for chasing a ball. She's a dainty little thing, only weighs 90lbs, big for a female.

Good luck, remember to keep the mouth in neutral while the mind finishes what to say.

Mike

[christarn]

Yes, the lab pups are simply adorable, I find myself becoming way too attatched to them. We have 3 pit bulls, I took them when I left. He said he would never get another dog, so I found it rather strange when he did. But they are so darn cute, one can't help but just love them!

One of my new year's resolutions is to work on not being so open or blunt with what comes out of mouth. I was trying to tell him that part of why I left was it was hard on our marriage when I went back to school, and he was on the road 5 and 6 days at a time...we had both been drinking, he felt that I was ridiculing him for doing what he had to do to support us, which is not what I meant...I was trying to say, I don't do alone well, I have really learned over the past year...I just plain don't do alone well at all. But he took severe offense to it.

Ya know mike, looking back, and knowing now what I know, I was just plain out acting like a spoiled brat 9 times out of ten. Growing up, I never had to compramise, or really work over time to pay bills etc. Believe me we did have pertinant issues at hand, such as my H's enjoyment of partying (alot!!) but nothing that couldn't have been resolved. But I guess hind sight is 20/20. I guess I have just grown a lot over the past year, and I am hoping that he sees that!

Have you heard from your W since Christmas? Any plans for new year's eve?

take care
Christa

[micoms]

Christa,

I can't imagine having two labs. Ours is a handful. She has food allergies so we have to feed her special (expensive) food. 100% duck and potato.

My W said in the past she felt I ignored her, I spent too much time with the kids. We had problems 10 yrs ago, and worked it out. The major problem was my job. Had a contract that had overtime calls that kept me out 2 to 3 nights a week. Only got 2 or 3 hours sleep those nights. This time it's her job. Her hours and no weekends off.

I know every time I try to talk to W I shoot myself in the foot. I need to keep my mouth in neutral myself.

My W always paid the bills, I never spent money usually. The only purchases I made for myself was nice camera equipment. Nothing outrageous just a good camera and lenses. Took pictures for two of my brothers weddings.

Going to friends house for new years eve, W will be there. It's at my best friends house, we've known each other since high school, but didn't hang out together until college days. Our W's are best friends also. I'll try to act as if and keep my happy face on. Hopefully she'll notice.

Mike

[christarn]

Mike, sounds like you have a good plan for new years eve. When are you cooking pizza? My dad used to cook home made pizza (he past away 4 years ago) it was the bomb!! I'm the only one he showed how to make his home made crust to. I haven't made it in years!

I am going to a friends house, haven't heard from the H, he said he may go to his brother's house in Wisc. for a long weekend. I figure we were together 4 days last week, he needs a little time away from me...make him miss me. His last memory was a good one, and that's what counts!!

take care,Christa

[micoms]

Christa,

I'll do the pizza thing sometime in Jan. I used to make it every sat night until my brother got a job as manager at a pizza place. He'd sell me a pizza cheaper than I could buy the cheese if I made it. Had trouble with the crust at first, but it came around.

Have a Happy New Year.

Mike

[fooled again]

Hi micoms,

Thought I would pop over to your thread to say hello and see how you are doing. I'm thrilled to hear you will be going back to work soon. That will sure help keep your mind off things and make you feel 'useful' again. Homemade pizza was always my thing and we used to do it on NYE. I was planning it for this year as well, since H said he was going to come over. I make my dough from scratch, cut up all the ingredients and then let people make their own creation and we all get a taste.

Christmas for me was tough, but could have been worse. I've had some suspicions that my H has had contact with OW, but of course, no concrete evidence. It started making me crazy but thanks to some good advice from people on my thread, I'm forcing myself to turn away from all that and trying to focus on myself. It's really hard, but it's amazing how much better I feel. It truly is a "State of Mind" that makes all the difference, for me anyway. But watch, in a week, or maybe a few days, I'll be back down again, guaranteed. As long as I can pull myself back up again...

It's good that you will be spending NYE w/ friends and seeing your W is a nice bonus. Sounds like your Christmas turned out to be really nice too - I was so touched reading about the fun you had with your GS2 - baby kisses are the absolute best thing on heaven and on earth. I love my D6 now, she is amazing and smart and funny and we have great talks, but sometimes I miss when she was really little, that pure innocence takes away all the hurt and negativity, at least for a little while. You are so lucky to have so much love around you from these little people.

I wish you a very Happy New Year and may your hopes and dreams come true.

FA

[micoms]

fooled,

Thanks for stopping by. I babysat GS again yesterday , D had to work and her BF had a job interview and had to work afterwards. He had a great time playing with our dog, a lab. He would chase the dog then the dog would chase him around the house.

I think W was involved with OM at one time, but not now. I did all the snooping then, now I see the man I became while doing that and I don't like him. It seems I never found any concrete evidence, I would think she did a good job of hiding things. She is in a MLC, our MC we were seeing thinks so also. MC thinks there was a traumatic experience from her childhood or teenage years that's about to surface.

I had a hard time getting the crust right, but finally got it down. I even make my own sauce from scratch. I also make the sausage for the pizza, start with regular sausage and add spices to it.

Mike

[fooled again]

micoms,

I know what you mean about the person you become while snooping around - I did not like myself either, and it's no wonder my H moved out. I wish I had discovered DB a year ago, then maybe OW wouldn't have been such an attractive alternative. I felt very close to insanity. But I did find evidence, every time, lots of it. I don't know if my H wanted me to find it or if he was just sloppy, but whenever I took that step and started digging, I found what I was looking for.

Unfortunately, the urge to snoop is so strong right now b/c he's being distant. I did so last week and found something suspicious, but not concrete. I could feel myself becoming that person again, confronted him, he denied anything was going on, and now there is more tension b/w us. So it didn't do me any good. But it did make me realize that I absolutely have to make more of an effort to focus on myself and keep my mind off what my H is doing or not doing.

Fun times with your GS. I want to get a dog for my D6 - she has been desperate for one since she was 4, and as an only child, I think it will help her to feel less lonely when she can't see my H, that she has a buddy who is always around. I grew up with a dog and she really was like my buddy and a member of the family. And labs are such a wonderful breed.

Mmmm - I'm thinking about pizza right now. I've made sauce from scratch, but not sausage. Wow! You are a serious pizza man! I usually do good salami or prociutto, but precook it so it's crispy. And precook some of the vegetables (caramelized onions, roasted red peppers, etc.) to bring out the sweetness. Yum-O.

[micoms]

fooled,


I never found anything concrete, but the little things did add up. I asked a friend of hers if she was or did have an A with R, a co-worker. She said she refused to answer, she did in my book by not denying. I know the A was a symptom of our R. W is also in a MLC, A's are common in that. MC thinks she is in mlc also and thinks she had a traumatic incident years ago that's about to resurface. W won't go to C'ing for herself, I wish she would.

It seemed the more I snooped the less I found and the more suspicious I became. I admit I still backslide but I try to not do it. I think if she some how caught me snooping it would be the end of us. She is somewhat paranoid, she claims I have followed her, paid someone to follow or had my brother follow her. None of the above. Told her if someone is following you it must be OM's W.

I always had a dog except when I first got married and lived in an apt. Parents got my first dog when I was 3, had to have him put to sleep when I was 21, it was like loosing a brother. We had a wiener dog that had a seizure and died after we had her 14 years, my mom has her for two before we got her. I think a kid should have a dog, they give you unconditional love.

All this talk of pizza has me getting anxious to make some! In my area there's no truly good pizza, just the national stuff, cheap on cheese and toppings. S25 works near a good place, sometimes he'll bring that home.

Called W, left VM, invited her over on NYD. All the kids are coming over, told her it would be nice to see her with them. She's convinced a D will solve our problems. I got the typical stuff, I deserve a W better than her, I need someone who will give me what she can't... I don't want one but in my state if one party wants a D, nothing the other can do to stop it.

Mike

[fooled again]

Hi Mike,

Yeah, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if alot of our S's have A's b/c of MLC. I think that's what happened with my H, and even mentioned it to him b/f I found out about the A (trying to remember if it was b/f the A even started). Sure, have an A to solve your problems - makes perfect sense. But then I guess MLC is kindof like insanity anyway, from what I understand. I wonder if I'll have one (MLC, that is)? I doubt it - I think all the work I'm doing on myself now will help me avoid one.

And of course, a D solves everything too, doesn't it? I think just about anywhere now, if one S wants a D, the other can't stop it - at least here in Canada. You're wife is right, you do deserve a wonderful W. She just doesn't believe she is that person. Neither does my H. I guess we just have to be their friend and be supportive and let them figure out their issues. More and more I'm starting to "get" that concept and realize that I can't do much about it. I guess that's why it's so important to GAL and work on ourselves when they are confused and/or having an A, or confused about an A.

My H came over yesterday late afternoon, and my D wanted to go out for pizza to our favorite place - real Italian pizza, wood oven and a thin, crispy crust. I couldn't say no since I had pizza on the brain, so I guess I'll make something else tonight for NYE - I'm thinking big, juicy home-made burgers loaded with caramelized onions, sauteed mushroom and dripping with really good cheddar, a side of garlic mashed potatoes and a nice salad - oh and a great bottle of red!! My D6 loves it when I make her mini burgers, just the right size for her little hands.

It was a nice night, though, no tension, just a fun family time. Afterwards we went for gelato and then D went to stay at H's place overnight. H'll be coming over w/ D for NYE; not sure what he's doing NYD. I'm not asking. He stayed overnight Xmas Eve, but I'm not broaching the subject for NYE. I'll just let whatever happens happen.

After the past couple of weeks, I've decided to do a major 180 as one of my NY resolutions. No snooping/spying (I took what you said to heart), no talking about my bad feelings, suspicions, fears, no asking for reassurance that A is over, no initiating talks about the future or him moving back home. I have to concentrate on me b/c worrying about what he's doing is just making me crazy. I just hope I can keep it up.

I hope you have a wonderful New Years! I wish you good luck, good health and good times w/ your kids!

FA

[micoms]

fooled,

Burgers! What time is dinner? How long of a drive from Ohio? Just kidding. That's all the stuff I'm not supposed to have since surgery but a little cheating every once in a while wouldn't hurt. You won't tell on me will you?

I don't think W is seeing anyone now, but in the past she did. Don't know for sure if it was a PA but I think it was. I think that's where she gets that I deserve someone better than her, because of her guilt and shame. She was a very moral person. She recently lost a lot of weight and I think she is enjoying the looks the hounds are giving her. I never noticed she lost weight until she lost about 25 or 30lbs. I told her when I look at you I don't see if you're overweight or skinny, I just see you on the inside, weather you are 5 lbs or 50lbs overweight I don't see it, I just see the inner you.

It's good H is coming to spend NYE with you and D6. You might ask if H wants to spend the night at some point during the evening so he knows there's an open invitation. Would your H be open to a date night once a week with you, get a sitter and just the two of you go out together?

Have fun tonight, don't have too much red wine tonight.

Mike

[fooled again]

Thanks Mike,

You made me smile, and I needed that. Sorry, but I think it's a bit too far of a drive; I'm really bad w/ US geography. Oh, I just looked at a map! WAY too far - you're on the wrong side! Besides, you really need to get healthy and strong. Eat lots of veggies and lean protein (I'm big on good nutrition). There will always be burgers waiting for you when you are able to have them again.

You know, aging is really hard on W. I look very young for my age, but it's still hard. I too lost alot of weight since I found out about the A (like 20lbs) and it does feel good to get that attention from other men. But for me it mainly makes me feel better about myself and reminds me that my H's A was not about me. And it reminds me that the OW has alot to worry about if she thinks H is going to ever lose his attraction to me. What we W's really want is for our H's to notice, to go on and on about how great we look and how much they want us. It's nice to hear you're loved for who you are, but at my age, I NEED to hear that I look good and that I'm still very desirable. Yes, its weak and insecure, but it's a fact when we 40+ women look around and see all those beautiful young things flashing flat tummies & tight as*es. (I won't even talk about big fake b**bs!) Maybe that's why more women are having MLC's (I used to think it was just men - now I know better).

I might just suggest to H that he stay the night after we put D to bed. I'm really trying to do a 180, so I'm not sure. On Xmas day when I asked if he would stay again, he said no and I was upset, didn't cry, but he knew it bothered me. I hate the feeling of being rejected like that. But I suppose I have nothing to lose as long as I can keep my emotions from coming out, stay cool like it doesn't really matter.

He called this aft but I was at the gym (it felt great to work out again - I've been sick with a cold for awhile). I took my time calling him back and sounded upbeat. We talked about tonight. I haven't called him in a couple of days, but my D calls him whenever she wants on her own, and he always wants to talk to me.

We did start going on a couple of dates this month. He seemed a bit distant, but that may have been b/c I paid, since he is not working. He's having a really tough time with that, he is such a proud man and has expensive tastes, and he has lost so much in this mess. So I really don't know what is going on in his head. I may be way off base about the OW, but I just don't want to be blindsided again, so I'm being cautious.

You have a great time tonight too and tomorrow. Oh I can hold by red wine very well, thanks. Besides, it's good for you. I mean me; not you right now. And who knows what it may lead to. Actually I know exactly what it may lead to...

FA

[micoms]

fooled,

My W and I both look young for our ages. I went to a party NYE and talked to some people I had never met before. One guy asked me what I do for a living. I told him and he asked when I started in that business. Told him in 1979, he was shocked he thought I was about 40, I'm 51. Both my W and I have lost a lot of weight. She has lost about 50, I'm approaching 65. I started to lose weight before this sitch started. I started back in last March.

I guess I didn't tell my w how Great she looked, but i's hard to talk to someone who is asleep all the time. She works crazy hours 4AM to 2PM. All she does is work and sleep. MC thinks she is in MLC and the sleeping is due to depression.

I've been working out a little also, doing cardiac rehab, had bypass surgery 10/15. Put in about 10 miles on the bicycles another 2 on the treadmill and a little upper body stuff. Can't believe how weak I've gotten since surgery. Walked out of rehab today and felt great.

Gave W a digital pic frame for Christmas, loaded it with pics of the kids and of family vacas. I'm hoping she sees the pics and realizes that we had a lot more good times than bad.

I'm going to see if she'll let me take her out to dinner one night.

On a bright side I visited Dr Phil's website and e-mailed my sitch in. Got a call tonight from someone on his staff wanting more information. She sent me an e-mail after talking to me and wanted contact information for everyone involved and family pictures. I'd love her to go if they choose us. I'd also like to go to Retrouvaille with her.

Mike

[christarn]

Mike...that is so cool about Dr. Phil's people actually getting back to you! Have you read any of his stuff? I have read a couple of his books...good stuff! The idea of the pic. frame you got for your wife was way cool!! Glad you're doing well! take care, Christa

PS keep us posted about the dr phil stuff!!

[fooled again]

Hi Mike,

I see your point about your W sleeping all the time. I guess she kindof checked out of your M awhile ago, by taking this job she ensured that there wasn't much you could do, seeing as you couldn't even talk to her most days. It further confirms the notion that alot of this really is all about the S, they have to deal with it and find their own way out. Whatever we do to help or affect them is like spinning our wheels. Which leads back to GALing. All DB roads seem to lead back to GALing.

I'm not sure if it was an MLC that led to my H having his A - though I do recognize and accept partial responsibility for the issues in our M that made the choice easier for my H. We had stopped communicating in any meaningful way. He lived his life, work, travel for work, socializing w/ coworkers & clients, sports. I had my life which revolved around my D (I was a SAHM). The only interaction we had was in our home and mainly concerned our D and a couple of mutual friends. We never went out on dates, tho we did ML once every couple of wks.

But I think it was his travel that killed us - I resented him for being away so much so I shut down and when he came home I punished him by withdrawing my affection. I have to admit that I was close to being a WAW; it's taken me awhile but I see that now. He was away and lonely, so he started going out when he was on the road, stopped calling home, which made me more angry. When he was home, we were like roommates, and I was critical of him and he of me.

And now... My GALing is about fitness, friends and my interests. Oh and we are getting a dog - that will add a fun distraction to my life and my D's.

I'm happy to hear you are doing so well with getting back into fighting shape after your surgery. The body & mind are so inter-connected - you need to be strong physically to be strong mentally & emotionally. It's the only way I would have survived the last 1.5 years with my sanity.

Digital picture frame is a great idea for a gift. Maybe you're right and it will spark some good memories, let her see that her life hasn't been all bad. When you're depressed, you have such tunnel vision - all you see is negativity. It may not sink in right away, but it might get her mind going. You should switch pictures every now and again (does yours have a memory card you can swap out?). Then she may get curious as to what you'll put on it next - maybe pictures of places she's wanted to go, or works of art she likes, old, old family pics of her growing up, you know what I mean?

With the Dr. Phil thing, does that mean you'd go on TV about your sitch? Wow, I could NEVER do that - I'm way too private. But I have watched some of his shows, and he seems to have some pretty good advice about M's. Good luck w/ that & let me know if you get on so I can tape it.

So many people have recommended Retrouvaille. My H and I were raised Catholic so the religion thing wouldn't bug us. The thing is that my H is very, very private about his dirty laundry and he has always maintained that we can fix our own problems. I would really like to find a way to get him to go with me to something like this, but I don't know how. Maybe my detaching and forcing him to choose to approach me about working on our M will be my segue into that conversation. I'll see.

He seems to be acting much more loving toward me this week, as I have been trying to detach and give him more space, keeping my emotions, fears, suspicions to myself. I talk to him pleasantly, except yesterday, and don't ask for much, always assuming that he has other things to do. I haven't called or text him in 5 days. He has been proposing that we do more things together, suppers at the house, etc. He did stay over NYE, but left after brunch to watch sports w/ his friends NYD. I figure I'll just do my thing and not ask him for anything, continue to let him call me when he wants to talk. Detaching is the hardest thing I've ever had to do, especially if I'm to do it so that I can respond to his positive actions towards me without pursuing him, and ignore the negative actions that make me feel anxious. But I guess it seems to be working in that he's pursuing me to some extent.

Of course, when I let myself think it, in the back of my mind is this thought: "Is he lying? Is he really doing what he says he's doing or is he with OW?" I guess detaching is about giving the S enough rope to either hang themselves or pull themselves back to us.

Okay, once again I've gone on too long with my post. Keep up the good work getting back in shape. Good luck with asking your wife out for dinner.

FA

[micoms]

Christa,

I read his book, Relationship Rescue. I had forgotten all about sending something in to his shows website, I sent it 6 weeks ago. I was shocked when I got the call last night. I guess it's no guarantee anything will come of it, but my W does watch his show and respects his work.

I didn't get a lot of pics loaded into it when I gave it to her. I've been loading pictures into the computer through the scanner all day. I'm hoping W will see pics of kids when they were young and vaca pics and remember times weren't always bad and start remembering the good times instead of focusing on the bad.

Mike

[micoms]

fooled,

I also realize that I partly responsible for where my M is today. I could have talked to W about the effect her job was having on us but I thought she knew ans it might be considered too controlling to tell her to quit. Her not being home (working evenings) or awake evenings has gone on for over four years. My hobbies are bowling and refereeing soccer games. Last year I bowled twice a week, only once a week until I had surgery and refereeing soccer games. I've bowled the whole time we've been married but only one night a week. Refereeing lasts about 12 weeks in the spring and another 12 weeks in the fall. Other than that I was usually around the house. I would come home make dinner for the kids clean up and take a shower. Throw in yard work, not a lot of time left. When W got new hours she would usually make dinner.

One of the things she was upset with is house repairs. I put them off while running with the kids when they were young and involved with sports. All four kids were pretty good at soccer. S26 played on a-level select and on a team that played in Europe, S25 played b-level and went to Australia to play in a tournament, D25 never played select but played on the boys high school team (there was no girls team that year)and started a few games as a freshman. D19 was the best of them all. She played at the high level of select. Your team had to win the premier division of another league to apply for the league she played in. Her coaches were N Kentucky's womens coaches as an 8th grader. W traveled all over for tournaments. New Jersey, St Louis, Virginia, Indiana, Chicago, Tennessee are some of the trips we made with their teams in addition to local ones. D19's team was even invited to a Disney Invitational. Her team won the State Cup three times, runners up twice and finished in the semi-finals every other year.

I've read you can look back and find a traumatic event that triggered the MLC. In my W's case it was when D19 was 16. D met a 21yo weasel who convinced her we were the enemy and she ran away with him. My W's heart was broken. D ran away three or four times that summer until the weasel was caught. we had a protection order against him to stay away from D. If I'd have known then some of the things he did to her, I'd probably be in jail. He was physically and mentally an abusive person, she was afraid to leave or break up with him. When he went to jail for a year she finally saw the light. Looking back I think that's when my W started into depression. I didn't recognize it then. I tried to take her out to dinner 2 times a week or so. never on weekends because of her job. Never doing any thing together on weekends I think caused us to drift apart. We used to go out dancing once or twice a month, I really enjoyed that but her job stopped that.

I was shocked when I got the call last night from the Dr. Phil Show. I had sent them an e-mail about 6 weeks ago, I'd forgotten all about it. Doesn't mean we'll be on yet or if W would even go. I don't think all the therapy he does is just on the TV.

My W s Catholic also, I'd love to go to Retrouvaille with her.

Congrats on getting a dog, every kid should grow up with one. It will be a brother or sister to D and give both of you unconditional love. I have a black lab, she's a big baby, a 90lb baby. Pretty big for a female.

I've read that when we detach S starts to come closer. I'm glad you got to share NYE together.

Mike

[grid, lost]

Retrouvaille? what is this??

everyone keep track of micoms/Mike, he gives great advice!!!

grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

Retrouvaille is sponsored by the Catholic Church, it's is a weekend experience with follow up meetings. It's open to all denominations. The web site is http://retrouvaille.org. you meet with a priest or minister and three couples who have been where we are. I found out about it on a post here don't remember, but I've seen it mentioned several times.

I've never been, but it has to be more intensive than MC. It starts on a Friday, ends on Sunday. Follow up sessions are usually every other weekend, don't know how long those sessions are.

Mike

[grid, lost]

,All this talk of pizza has me getting anxious to make some!>

Ok Mike
I have to ask , will you share your pizza sauce Recpt. or is this a Mike secret speciality??
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

All this talk of pizza has me salivating myself. When S26 left the house NYD he asked when are we going to do the pizza night? Seems the kids are looking forward to it, maybe I should do it once a month.

I really don't have a measured out recipe. I use a couple of cans of crushed tomatoes add some minced garlic, oregano, anise, fennel seed and a little crushed red pepper. I cook it down until it is thick. I just add more spices until it tastes right. I know it's frustrating not having any measurements. I would call my Grand mother for a recipe for one of her dishes, She would tell me add a small handful of this ,a little bit of that just a pinch. Now thats how I cook. I make a hamburger potato and chicken with homemade egg noodle soup (you can eat it from a plate), I just add spices let it cook awhile and add more if it needs it. Made some of the potato soup last week D24 took some home with her, she wants more.

Well got to go, going to see if W wants to have dinner with me tonight or tomorrow. If tomorrow I'm going bowling with S25 tonight.

Mike

[fooled again]

Mike &, Grid,

Oh my, more pizza talk. Talk about helping maintain a PMA - that'll do it for me. I always wanted to make my own sauce - the canned stuff is so bland. Think I might try it myself.

BTW Mike, we have the dog for the w/e as a trial run. She is a gorgeous, lovable golden retriever, and my D6 is thrilled beyond belief, and having trouble getting to sleep (no surprise there). I do believe that this dog will help us both get through some of the lonely tough times. It's that unconditional love you mentioned.

Have fun bowling!

FA

[micoms]

fooled,

Ended up not going bowling, I couldn't have done it anyway due to surgery. I bowled in a league until I had my problem, I average 200+.

I've got a black lab myself, smartest dog I've ever had. She's a big girl, 90lbs. A 70lb female is considered big. She is a field breed, loves the water. Goldens are good dogs also. Is your dog a puppy? Using a cage is a great way to housebreak a dog. We did that with ours, labs are a den dog they like their own "den". She was mad when we put the cage away, she still lays on the floor were it used to sit 5 years later.

Used to use the canned pizza sauce to start with, added garlic and fennel seed to dress it up. When kids were in high school their friends would ask if dad was making pizza this weekend and would stop by to see if any was left over. Most of their friends call my W and I mom and dad.

Mike

Mike

[fooled again]

Mike,

Any word on your W going to dinner w/ you? Too bad about the bowling, but that'll come back too.

The dog is 1.5 yrs old & needs a new home (owners are moving). She has a lot of puppy still in her, but no housebreaking necessary (yippee). She's big - close to 70 lbs. I know very little about Golden Retrievers or about dogs for that matter. She's lovely, but does have a couple of training issues that need to be addressed. I was thinking of getting her a kennel - thought it might make her feel safe. Thanks for the tip.

I was thinking about MLC & what you said about a traumatic event triggering it. My H's nephew was killed about 1 yr before his A started. They were very close, H was like big brother to him. I had figured out awhile ago that my H was having problems dealing with that, & I guess he shut down, b/c afterwards I was never able to reach him - he was angry all the time. What books have you read on MLC?

FA

[micoms]

fooled,

Called W last night, a friend of ours died of a massive heart attack Thursday night. My W and his W were girl scout leaders together for D19. W ran into him while shopping and talked to him for a while Thursday morning while shopping. Asked W about dinner last night, couldn't last night. Said she might be babysitting GS while D24 and BF go out tonight. Maybe I'll stop over D24's house to talk to her about the Dr. Phil thing and maybe Retrouvaille.

Try to find some obedience classes you can go to. It's more for you the your dog. When we got our lab W wanted me to take Cammie to classes, I told her she needed to be the one, I knew how to handle a dog and she needed to learn. First class trainer told her the same thing, so she did a lot of the training with our dog.

Dr has a chapter on MLC. I've also read Women in Midlife Crisis by Jim and Sally Conway, as well as resources on the net. There's some good info in the MLC section of bb. From what I've read it usually hits a woman when her youngest child is between 16 to 18 and especially if the youngest is a daughter. W denies having a MLC even though she said it in MC she thought she was. C said she is and tried to get me to remember if W ever talked about a traumatic event that happened to her in childhood or teenage years. I can't remember anything. Seems to think she has a repressed event that is starting to come forward. I need to talk to her aunt or sister about that.

Mike

[grid, lost]

The dog is 1.5 yrs old & needs a new home (owners are moving). She has a lot of puppy still in her, but no housebreaking necessary (yippee). She's big - close to 70 lbs. I know very little about Golden Retrievers or about dogs for that matter. She's lovely, but does have a couple of training issues that need to be addressed

.
fooled,
hi, reading your post for a couple days now. Wish to offer, if need any suggestions for working with your new dog I'd be happy to help you. I do a lot of dog training, etc. Mike can fill you in a bit as we have been posting for each other. Mike and his postings have helped me so much!
anyway, keep posting and if need any doggie input I'm here is you wish.
grid, lost

[fooled again]

grid,

Thanks for your note and I appreciate your offer.

Yeah, Mike is great and has good advice, and good recipes too (I'll bet he has many more up his sleeve that he's just waiting to share!!) And he has me looking at my H in a different light than just a lying cheating bast*rd, that maybe the real issue is MLC and/or depression. There seem to be some consistent behaviors.

My D is ecstatic about the dog b/c she has been begging (literally) for one for years. This one kindof dropped in my lap, so I decided to make this decision myself and bring her into our lives. I know having a dog will help my D when she is feeling sad, confused and powerless over my H & I's sitch. My H is appears to want to be involved w/ the dog too, so I don't know if that is a good sign, or not worth analyzing at this point (fantasy family vs. fantasy affair?).

Back to the dog. My biggest issue is getting her to come when she doesn't want to, and b/c she's so big (about 70lbs), I simply cannot use brute strength (I'm about 120lbs). She's not ours yet - we are in transition from her other family, so I'm not expecting much as it's our first w/e with her, but I can see that this is a huge safety issue and the first thing I need to address.

I'm planning to take her to obedience lessons asap after she comes to live w/ us permanently. I recognize that I need to learn how to handle her properly. I would appreciate any suggestions of books, websites, etc. I have alot to learn about big dogs.

FA

[grid, lost]

All this talk about Pizza, I couldn't take it any longer!!

Just finished off two slices of NY style pizza with extra cheese, real cheese !!! mmmmmmmmmmmm..so good
grid, lost

[fooled again]

We should change this to the Pizza thread! Now you've got me going too.

Tell me grid, what's the difference b/w NY style pizza, Chicago style pizza, and... are there any other "styles" of pizza? I only know thin crust, thick crust, "cheese in the crust" crust, but then again, I'm Canadian.

FA

[grid, lost]

Yeah, Mike is great and has good advice, and good recipes too (I'll bet he has many more up his sleeve that he's just waiting to share!!) And he has me looking at my H in a different light

Mike is the best and he has helped me out so many times I've stopped counting. Mike is my sounding board in regards to my WAH. As a guy he has been excellent help in seeing an issue from a guys point of view. This has really helped me. Most of all his input helps me in my stitch with my frustration whih can to quickly lend itself to anger. I am learning about anger these days, too. I sure Mike has many more goodie recipes, lol. Mike we are all waiting. BRB dogs are into something I can hear them! .... back..all is clear. lol

My D is ecstatic about the dog b/c she has been begging (literally) for one for years. This one kindof dropped in my lap, so I decided to make this decision myself and bring her into our lives. I know having a dog will help my D when she is feeling sad, confused and powerless over my H & I's sitch. My H is appears to want to be involved w/ the dog too, so I don't know if that is a good sign,

Good for you MOM! Thank you for saving this dog a trip to an animal shelter.
I can only imagine how ecstatic your daughter is over her new dog! I being a person who has Always had a black dog following me where ever I've gone since age 10 months. Believe me I can relate to how happy your daughter is. thank you mom and mom, you are so correct, daughter's new best bud will bring much comfort and security into her life, more than you can imagine. Soon you will not be able to keep them apart.!
First, before issues, like to add couple thoughts. Teach your daughter to give treats to her dog from palm of her hand not from her fingers. This helps to force dog to slow down and to not snatch treats from her hand. Also helps assure fingers are do not accidentally become part of treat. Teach your daughter to Not stare into her dog's eyes or face. Please note I'm saying "stare" not look. Staring into a dog's eyes can some times be mistaken as a challenge to fight. Have you ever been around two dogs as they go into a fight? First they stare each other down. Wolfs do this in wild and is where this eye game comes from. A child is eye to eye with most dogs. So staring into a dog's eyes can sometimes be unnerving to a dog. Another thing, watch and be sure the dog is ok with others being around them and their food dish while they eat. Try the following for Positive reinforcement and to increase a dog's comfort level when there is food in their dish. With a dish of food on floor and dog eating Bend down and add a few bites of a dog's favorite treat. Say couple pieces of chicken or steak, cheese what ever they like and praise and praise more!!. Do this only if the dog is being friendly and not defensive of his dish.


(fantasy family vs. fantasy affair?).[/quote] LOL I like that! Very good line. Might add, rather impossible for H to be training this dog if he does not live in household. Maybe you and daughter should train your dog first and then H can start working with the three of you. Other wise I would think dog become quite confused.

Back to the dog. My biggest issue is getting her to come when she doesn't want to, and b/c she's so big (about 70lbs), I simply cannot use brute strength (I'm about 120lbs). She's not ours yet - we are in transition from her other family, so I'm not expecting much as it's our first w/e with her, but I can see that this is a huge safety issue and the first thing I need to address.

Correc Correct, the come command is all about a safety issue and can save a dog's life. OOPs, teach your dog to wait at door and not to go through till you release him to go through. IE: Wait, you step through door and then tell dog, ok now. Dog comes through dooor. This is another good safety command.
Come command, remember,dog is = to a two year old child. short attention span and only live in the moment. That is why punishing a dog a few minutes after doing something wrong does not work. All the dog knows is you are mad and has no idea why.
Come, most dogs go away from us for two reasons, first "leader of pack" (another topic) and second, what is in front of their nose is sooooooooo much more interesting than you are. that simple. usually start teaching a come command on leash. dog moves to end of leash call him, and reward, food and voice. Use something like a small piece of cheese as reward. In house, if dog is laying at the other end of room, call him to you and have a piece of cheese in your hand, reward. Carry little treats with you and when dog is not paying any attention to you call his name and come, dog comes reward. You may at first have to squat down to dog's level first few times to invite him to come to you. When ever where ever the dog comes to you make a big fuss over him, give him a food reward as well, use a squeaky voice (dogs love squeaky toys!) yes, make a fool of yourself. Notice how well the dog responds to your squeaky voice.
What leash to use for training and where to find oneNow if you check in a store like Agway, Petsmart, Tractor Supply, not Petco, maybe able to find cotton leashes, 6ft, 10ft and 20-25ft. Use these for training, as the nylon leads can really burn your hand if dog pulls quickly. Or use leather leash.

I'm planning to take her to obedience lessons asap after she comes to live w/ us permanently. I recognize that I need to learn how to handle her properly. I would appreciate any suggestions of books, websites, etc. I have alot to learn about big dogs.

Very good. Both will enjoy, training only takes 10-15 minutes a day, no longer. You will meet new people, have lots of laughs, and be so proud of your dog and self.
Books, let me check on titles for you and get back to you.
Here is one that is short, basic and fully explains training and pack behavior. Title: Choice to Heel. sorry, I Have to look up author.
Ok, well FA, you can see I can go on and on when comes to dogs. If you like feel free to email me privately, email me at: [e-mail]
or I an post here if you wish.
hope this helps, now why am I on these boards??? is it something to do with H??? Do doggie training posts count as GAL?? LOL
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid, fooled,

Just got home from S26's house. Watched one of my favorite football teams play tonight. Who ever plays Pittsburg!!!

You guys are too kind. Just wish I had some advice for myself for my sitch. Will see W tomorrow at friends funeral, tried to call her to see what time I could meet her, no answer. Probably was sleeping as she always is. Will talk to her afterwards about Dr Phil. Would also like to discuss possibility of Retrouvaille.

That was one of the issues in our M, I felt ignored, her job was more important than me and I withdrew. She on the other hand thought I spent too much time at the soccer fields. When refereeing games I would be home usually by 5pm. She even came up a couple of times, I guess to see if I was running around with someone. Every time I was either still doing a game or just finished. A lot of the people at the soccer club she knows, it's the athletic association of our church.

Rewards is excellent training, to punish your dog you have to catch it in the act. My dog gets into the trash sometimes, if I catch her in it I make her sit by the garbage can and look at it for a while, kind of like standing in the corner, lol. I agree come is important to learn. Other commands that get her attention Cammie (her name) snack, just bring it (she'll go get her ball)and park it. Use this one to get her to sit at the door while putting on her leash before going outside. Be sure to get your dog toys to play with, try to avoid old socks for tug of war, she won't know the difference between that old sock and a brand new one. Also I use a collar that has a plastic snap on it, if collar gets hung up on something plastic can break before injury.

LOL, I was the soup and sauce man around the house. Make a chicken and homemade egg noodle soup you can eat off of a plate, Potato soup that I add hamburger, bacon or ham to, and a beef barley soup. Man you got me hungry for some of this stuff now. I also make a taco meatloaf the kids love also, except D19, she's a vegetarian. Along the way I made a lot of stuff that didn't turn out to get the good ones down right.

Well tomorrow won't be a fun day, but I'll get through it.

Mike

[micoms]

Grid, fooled,

Just got home from S26's house. Watched one of my favorite football teams play tonight. Who ever plays Pittsburg!!!

You guys are too kind,I think I'm blushing. Glad I have been a help. Just wish I had some advice for myself for my sitch. Will see W tomorrow at friends funeral, tried to call her to see what time I could meet her, no answer. Probably was sleeping as she always is. She of course has to work, in at 4AM. Will talk to her afterwards about Dr Phil. Would also like to discuss possibility of Retrouvaille.

That was one of the issues in our M, I felt ignored, her job was more important than me and I withdrew. She on the other hand thought I spent too much time at the soccer fields. When refereeing games I would be home usually by 5pm. She even came up a couple of times, I guess to see if I was running around with someone. Every time I was either still doing a game or just finished. A lot of the people at the soccer club she knows, it's the athletic association of our church.

Rewards is excellent training, to punish your dog you have to catch it in the act. My dog gets into the trash sometimes, if I catch her in it I make her sit by the garbage can and look at it for a while, kind of like standing in the corner, lol. I agree come is important to learn. Other commands that get her attention Cammie (her name) snack, just bring it (she'll go get her ball)and park it. Use this one to get her to sit at the door while putting on her leash before going outside. Be sure to get your dog toys to play with, try to avoid old socks for tug of war, she won't know the difference between that old sock and a brand new one. Also I use a collar that has a plastic snap on it, if collar gets hung up on something plastic can break before injury.

LOL, I was the soup and sauce man around the house. Make a chicken and homemade egg noodle soup you can eat off of a plate, Potato soup that I add hamburger, bacon or ham to, and a beef barley soup. Man you got me hungry for some of this stuff now. I also make a taco meatloaf the kids love also, except D19, she's a vegetarian. Along the way I made a lot of stuff that didn't turn out to get the good ones down right.

Well tomorrow won't be a fun day, but I'll get through it.

Mike

[micoms]

Went to a friends funeral with W and D19. His W and mine were girl scout leaders together. He was a boy scout leader and I saw a lot of leaders from when I was involved in boy scouts. Got some strange looks when we shook hands, scouts shake with the left hand. We waited in line 2 hours for visitation, the line was just as long when we left.

w was pleasant but in the crowd couldn't talk about DR Phil, will call her tomorrow. Need to give her new prescription card also. first court date for property settlement is Wed, what a bummer.

Don't want to D but powerless to stop it. Wonder if she's got someone waiting? Just a wicked thought that creeps into my mind. I wonder if it will take her seeing me or hearing from friends that I was seen out with a women to cause her a little jealousy? Don't want to use anybody that way though.

Mike

[grid, lost]

[quote=fooled again]We should change this to the Pizza thread! Now you've got me going too.

Tell me grid, what's the difference b/w NY style pizza, Chicago style pizza, and... are there any other "styles" of pizza? I only know thin crust, thick crust, "cheese in the crust" crust, but then again, I'm Canadian.

HI fooled again

I live in NYS in area often ref. Upstate NY. Upstate, north and well west of new york city. I am sure you know NYC is famous for their pizza and I believe were USA pizza originated from. anyway, NYC pizza is very thin crust, spicey sauce, real cheese. NYC pizza shops are on every corner. So upstate, many of the pizza shops make a sweet sauce pizza, with medium to thick crust as compared to NYC pizza. So when I say I had a couple slices of NY style pizza I am ref. the pizza is spicey like in the city. Actually the guys running the shop I get my pizza at, their grandfather had a shop in the "city". lol
Few times I have had pizza in mid west it is a sweet sauce pizza.
Now to tell the truth I have never ate pizza in a Canadian pizza shop before.

[fooled again]

Mike,

Wonder if she's got someone waiting? Just a wicked thought that creeps into my mind. I wonder if it will take her seeing me or hearing from friends that I was seen out with a women to cause her a little jealousy? Don't want to use anybody that way though.

It's not outrageous (or wicked) for you to think that - and I really hate to be the suspicious one, but that's what I would be thinking too.

Going out w/ a woman would not be "using" her, it would be enjoying a night out w/ a friend. It would only "using" if you were deceiving the woman into thinking it was more than friendship. The important thing is that your W would see that you can enjoy the company of someone else if she's not interested in being that someone. "Big Yellow Taxi", by Joni Mitchell - "you don't know what you've got till it's gone".

The biggest problem I have w/ DBing is trying not to appear to H that he is my only hope for happiness in my life. I want to make sure he knows (and I know) that if he decides he doesn't want me after all my efforts, and I think I will one day (don't know when) reach a point where I'm done waiting for him to come back to me, I won't spend my life as a spinster, pining away for him. I'm going to go out and have fun and try to meet someone else - why shouldn't I be happy? I've got an awful lot of love to give to someone who wants it.

So if you want to show your W a glimpse of a future w/o you, and let her see you going out and trying to be happy, what's wrong with that? I think she needs to see that.

It's like me telling my H about the new gym I'm going to & the mtg I had w/ a trainer (a guy). There's nothing wrong w/ H thinking about me meeting other men out there. I don't make him think I'm seeing anyone, it truly is all innocent, but he does need to know that I'm something special and if he doesn't want me, someone else out there will.

Good luck w/ your property settlement. Maybe the reality of D will start to hit your W as the "red tape" starts to unravel. Hopefully she may start to rethink things or at least slow down the pace of it.

I'll be thinking of you tomorrow, and I'll say a prayer for you too.
FA

[fooled again]

grid, lost,

I used to live in Ontario, so I know where "Upstate New York" is. I've even crossed Lake Champlain on a ferry on my way to Cape Cod.

Okay, thin crust is better, but once in awhile a like a thicker crust if it's really good & kindof crunchy. Spicy sauce, mmmm! Real cheese? I'm sorry, I don't understand - that's like saying "real water". Do people actually use "fake cheese" on pizza? How tragic!

Canadian pizza is pretty much the same as American pizza - we have Pizza Hut, Domino's, Little Cesaer's, etc. and lots of family owned little places, but most do the "commercial" pizza. But for real thin crispy pizza, you've got to really search. We go to a place in a trendy area that makes thin crispy crust pizza in a real wood oven. Oh my it's good, but expensive, so it's a treat. The only problem with this place is that I'm positive H has been there w/ OW. I try not to think about it, though, one of those triggers that I'm trying to reprogram in my brain. I will not give up my fav pizza place b/c of OW; I will not let her ruin the good things in my life. Glad I got that out of me. But honestly, some days I just want to move to another city.

Anyway, I also like to make pizza at home too, but can't seem to get the crust as crispy as I'd like. Mmmmm. I think this will be a w/e to make pizza at home!!! Maybe I'll try Mike's sauce recipe.

FA

[micoms]

The national pizza places are the worst. Ask for extra cheese and you can still see the sauce through the cheese. The best pizza i've had is in a little town outside of Cleveland, they have death by pepperoni. Triple pepperoni, double cheese and bacon. D19 was into modeling and had to be in Medina every other weekend. We found that place when S25's soccer team played in a tournament up there.

I guess you're right fooled, if two people are just out enjoying a night out together it wouldn't be using each other.

just got home from D24's house. Her BF called me and wanted some company, he's out of work right now and staying home with GS. W came home from work ans was surprised to see me there. Talked a little bit about her work, she had to lift a lot of heavy boxes and was tired. She fell asleep of course. I was planning to leave about 4PM, she had gone upstairs to take a nap. I knocked on her door, asked to talk. Asked if D24 was in need of money for groceries, I'm getting a disability check and a vacation check soon I could buy some groceries for them. I also brought up Dr Phil, She said you think I want to put my M problems on national TV? I said I'm willing to do anything to get our M back, if it means airing my dirty laundry to the world so be it. Told her they are going to call her, I gave the show her phone # and address. So it looks like a no go. I talked to her about wanting to work on our M, that when we S I thought she had issues she had to work on. I didn't read DB or DR until we came back from vaca late Aug. and now I see I did every thing wrong, that I had issues that i needed to deal with, I needed to change myself. Told her I should have told her I loved her, hugs and morning and good night kisses and more affection every day. That I am willing to make those changes.

Told her about Retrouvaille, how it is run and I would like to go to it with her, that I don't want to leave a stone unturned to try to save our M. I told her I know she's afraid I will only make changes until she come back and then go back to the way I was. It won't happen this time and she will never know if she doesn't give me an opportunity to show you. Do you want to look back in 3 years and wonder if we could have made it or not? Told her that Retrouvaille says there are four stages to marriage, romance, Disillusionment, Misery and Awakening. We are in the misery our R has never been worse, with some guidance and work on our part we can experience the awakening. She said she doesn't think MC helps, we went to it twice and it didn't work. I told her that this was different, its a whole weekend, not just an hour every other week, with things given to us to work on and follow up visits for 12 weeks. That if we do this our M will be better that it has ever been and more than we could dream it to be.

I asked her to think about it and that I want to get the love back that a H and W feel. I know what it could be and want it to be. Let's hope she thinks about it.


Mike

[fooled again]

Mike,

You're up late! I really hope your W does think about Retrouvaille and allow the idea to just sit there for awhile and maybe take root, not just say no to it immediately. For me, often it takes awhile for an idea to make sense to me. At first I may think its a terrible idea, but after awhile it starts to make a little sense, then it grows some more. I would have guessed that she wouldn't go for Dr. Phil - that would be a tough one for anyone, and the notoriety of everyone knowing your issues would be too much for a lot of people, myself included.

At least she listened to you and didn't just shut you out. You were able to tell her how important she is and your M is to you and that you are trying to find concrete ways to work out the problems in your M, not just asking her to come back and "you'll change".

You know, I didn't read DB or DR until my H moved out, and even then I didn't "get" the message until a few months ago. I kept looking for a recipe to fix my marriage. But we can all look back and see the mistakes we have made, things we did all wrong, situations we handled badly. I know I make mistakes nearly daily, or at the very least I am inches from making mistakes, often pulling myself back at the last second. Like today, but I won't fill your thread with my sitch. Suffice it to say that DBing is a moment by moment challenge for most of us, forget day by day.

Don't beat yourself up about your mistakes. You're doing the best you can. I wouldn't push Retrouvaille, just let her chew on it for awhile. She may come around, if only to say she tried everything, and it just may be what changes things. I've got my fingers crossed for you.

I hope tomorrow goes as well as it can for you.

FA

[grid, lost]

[quote=fooled again]grid,

so I know where "Upstate New York" is. I've even crossed Lake Champlain on a ferry on my way to Cape Cod.

Okay, thin crust is better, but once in awhile a like a thicker crust if it's really good & kindof crunchy. Spicy sauce, mmmm! Real cheese? I'm sorry, I don't understand - that's like saying "real water". Do people actually use "fake cheese" on pizza? How tragic!

FA,
Yep, there are places that use fake cheese !!!!! Sorta like the fake crab meat we all eat.
Best pizza are the local generation after generatin shops. THe national chains are nothing compared to local shops. As micoms was saying. I am sorta temped to try and make my own pizza as well after reading all the pizza posts and mikes input.
Lake Champlain, have never had the chance to go there, yet. lol
i live way south and west of there. base of finger lakes of NYS . Ever been to finger lakes wine country?
Fun Come in winter and on sunday, wineries that are open are a hoot. After all, in the middle of the winter all the wine makers have to do is drink the wine !!!
grid, lost

[grid, lost]

I guess you're right fooled, if two people are just out enjoying a night out together it wouldn't be using each other.

Careful Mike, going out with another woman could be quickly or maybe I should say, in state we are all in, will quickly become EA !!! that is no different than a PA and EA is not what you want to do at this time. Trying to make your W jealous and mad because she hurt you is not going to work. Think about this long and hard. Don't you believe that is how all most all PA start, "just friends". ???
Believe me, I am not made of stone and am starting to get very lonely. Wish i had someone to just share the day or evening with. Really starts to get into your head. Last couple days I have been thinking about this all a lot. Am considering giving this stitch till year 2 and by then, guess it is over and I need to accept that. Start to pick up and build a new life and with some hope find another to share some of my life with. So I do understand how you are starting to feel.

Told her about Retrouvaille, how it is run and I would like to go to it with her, that I don't want to leave a stone unturned to try to save our M. Do you want to look back in 3 years and wonder if we could have made it or not? Told her that Retrouvaille says there are four stages to marriage, romance, Disillusionment, Misery and Awakening.

This is good, W did not say, NO ! She is giving all of this some thought. Maybe just maybe like you she will at least three years from now want to be able to look back and say I tried everything.! Keeping my fingers crossed for you.
Have any dates in which you two could sign up for? Maybe next time you talk to W have a couple dates and ask her which would work best for her to go with you.
How did court go?
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

My atty didn't show up, he was caught up in another part of town. It is continued until 10/23. Talked to W's atty, he is her cousin, I've met him several times and we have gone out to dinner a few times together. He asked me how I'm doing since surgery. told him physically I'm fine, mentally and emotionally I've never felt so bad. Told him I don't want this D, she is the only one who wants it.

I don't think I'm ready to date, just was blowing off steam. I did talk to her about a few things while at D24's house. I said I know she is afraid that I can't change and if I do I'll go back after she comes home. She agreed that would be the case, I said that wouldn't happen, I've read a lot of books on R's and see the things I need to do. I don't think I did a good job of listening to her when she talked, I defended my point of view too much. She did say that I told one of her girlfriends H that W had sex with three men. Told her he didn't understand what I said, I said to him she may have had 3 EA's don't know if they were PA's, but it doesn't matter to me.

Next Retrouvaille session is in April. Sent request for information and an E-mail asking about follow up visits. W works retail and has to work weekends.

The kids are hounding me about pizza night, it will have to wait until I get some paychecks after returning to work. I'm ready to go back, just don't want to be a downtown guy. I'll give it a try, if I don't like it I can always go to another company, though it would be hard to leave I've worked for mine over 20yrs. All benefits would stay the same if I did. A guy at another company has been after me for years to go to his. He's going to retire soon, I could take over his route.

Mike

[grid, lost]

[quote=micoms]Grid,

Sorry this post turned out to be really long!!

My atty didn't show up, he was caught up in another part of town. It is continued until 10/23.

Good, Good, Good!!!!!!! Delay, Delay, Delay !!!! LOL Might ask your attorney if he could find a few more NO Show , situations for you.

Talked to W's atty, he is her cousin, I've met him several times and we have gone out to dinner a few times together. He asked me how I'm doing since surgery. told him physically I'm fine, mentally and emotionally I've never felt so bad. Told him I don't want this D, she is the only one who wants it.

Mike, I know this is going to sound really cold. But please keep in mind I have worked for several attornies and have hours of professional work with them. I've watched the sharks in action and they are no dolphines!
Strongly suggest you not talk to W's attorney about anything to do with you, emotionally, money wise, health, the dog, personal property, your job. In D you would never believe how opposing attorney can take the smallest item/thing and turn it against you in court. Please for your own well being and to GAL, let W figure out what you are doing, if talk with her attorney, stick to sports, current events, and the weather, or community projects he is involved with. Little attorney ego stroking never hurts. lol serious. What about your dog, is she/he (dog) registered with AKC and if so is just your name on her papers? Honest we have a cut throat attorney in town who is famous for using family pets to get what he wants for his client. Since H helped me so much with showing, out of respect for him (HA!) I double register the dogs....always saying if you leaave me and ever mess with my dogs, you will wish...you can fill in the blank. First day I saw him after leaving me, slapped all papers down on table and said you need to sign these papers and give up ALL Legal Rights to the dogs. H signed off with tears running down his face. I must sound like a real B**ch, I am telling you the truth about the attorney game. W's attorney may even have talked to you for just that reason. Remember the attorney see it all as just business. In court, attornies will try to tear each other apart, walk out the door, shake hands, and be best of friends. HONEST. That said, be careful and Now you are going to work on Delay the D, GAL, and R with W. Right ??? Isn't this what you would tell me, Mike?

I don't think I'm ready to date, just was blowing off steam.

Awe, good to hear and certainly know about venting, you are my number one vent receiver from me. As you tell me this is where we vent and blow off steam. Off the boards we work on Gal and R if possible.

Next Retrouvaille session is in April. Sent request for information and an E-mail asking about follow up visits. W works retail and has to work weekends.

Had an idea which might help you with Retrouvaille and W. How about if next time you discuss Retrouvaille with W, reassure her or is it validate her fears and concerns about you. Tell her you fully understand she will need to take her time about moving back with you. That is should W deside to work on R. She can take as much time as she needs to feel comfortable and you will not judge her. W works weekends, mike focus, try not to use this as an excuse to put off, delay, or pass on Retrouvaille. Every employee has personal and family matters that require time off. Her boss should understand this even if she has to push the issue a bit. Once you are back working if possible each paycheck put just a bit aside for emergency, as in W looses job to join you @ Retrouvaille. Realize I'm really far reaching, still should this be her concern (loosing job) you can always say have extra aside for "just her" so she stays financially afloat. Just a thought. LOL, can you see I really want to see W give you a chance, just a chance. ??

The kids are hounding me about pizza night, it will have to wait until I get some paychecks after returning to work.

Bet the kids are after you for your famous pizza. Can I come and have some too???? Or how about over nighting some to NYS?????? MMMMMMMMMM There are others on these boards who are drowling (sp??) for your pizza. Darn to far for a drive by house call. lol

don't want to be a downtown guy. I'll give it a try, if I don't like it I can always go to another company, though it would be hard to leave I've worked for mine over 20yrs. All benefits would stay the same if I did. A guy at another company has been after me for years to go to his. He's going to retire soon, I could take over his route.

Now stop that!!! You are to highly respected and wanted for your company to leave you in a dead pan situation. Besides, if you do have a make a change of jobs, ask for more money from company #2. Then when you tell present company your new offer, they'll have to give you more money to stay. Think of it as a game of pool, stand back and clear the table deck!!!

[grid, lost]

<Next Retrouvaille session is in April.>

mike,
ok, 3 months away ..hm hm.. maybe there will be a way to Delay, D, till after W and you attend Retrouvaille. lol I am starting love this word associated with you, "Delay".
I would love to talk to some one who has gone . Sounds like a very beneficial investment of time and emotion. Wish my H were spiritual and had an interest in such. Then again, maybe that is part of the problem, a Retrouvaille would aid him in finding his own spirituality (sp).
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

When I talked to W's atty(her cousin), he asked how I was doing from surgery. Told him fine physically, but down mentally due to not being able to do anything and D. Told him I don't want D, W does, he said he knows and hopes the best for us.

W's work isn't very good about weekends off, if she wants one she has to work 10 days straight. Follow up visits are every other Sat for 12 weeks.

I think W doesn't think I can change and is afraid if I do make changes they won't last and she will have to go through this again. I don't know how to assure her that won't happen.

Pizza night is coming soon! Probably in Feb. Can you freeze pizza and ship them like white Castles? My brother lived in S Cal and I sent him 100 White Castles. He said you would have thought he was dealing drugs with the amount of people in and out of his house for them.

Already talked to another company before I had my surgery, friend works there and said they were willing to pay over scale for some one for university hosp, many different makes of elevs, my specialty. The super wouldn't give me any extra, told him I won't take a step backwards in pay. My friend has talked to his boss for years to hire me. My super found out another company had talked to me and the Thursday before surgery we had a meeting about it. He wanted to know if I was unhappy, told him no but money talks. If someone offers me adjusters pay(which I was getting until we got a new branch manager) I'll take it, it would be an extra $180 per week, said money talks.

W was supposed to go shopping with D19 tonight but she fell asleep and just woke up and canceled. I need to take my Christmas money and gift cards and get some new clothes that fit! Kind of waiting to lose what I put on over the holidays first. Went from a 42" waist to 36", 2xl shirt to l. Then I'll look good when i go out, clothes won't be baggy. I do have some pants only one size too big.

Mike

[grid, lost]

When I talked to W's atty(her cousin), he asked how I was doing from surgery. Told him fine physically, but down mentally due to not being able to do anything and D. Told him I don't want D, W does, he said he knows and hopes the best for us.

ok, just be careful. D attornies are the worst. Bad Bad.
I would hate to see you being a nice person and have it turned on you.

Guess you can see I'm a bit protective of my dogs. lol Always remember all dog show people are a bit nuts. lol

W's work isn't very good about weekends off, if she wants one she has to work 10 days straight. Follow up visits are every other Sat for 12 weeks.

WOW, that sucks!!! Guess the two of you will have some serious soul searching. Which means what are the highest priorities here?? Whats more important, attempting to save M or a $10/hr. job with Wal-Mart.(if she does go and give up her job, a couple bucks in savings for her might help her, what do you think???) OOPS, ment to say, W will have some serious soul searching, not you. I know where your heart's at, that is for sure Mike. Heart is in the right place for your M and that is why your here. Right???

Think W doesn't think I can change and is afraid if I do make changes they won't last and she will have to go through this again. I don't know how to assure her that won't happen.

Yep, H said the exact same Words to me, over and over. OF course first he had an endless list of wrongs everything from the way I poured coffee to the way I answered the phone. Then H 180 and now, doesn't come up with an answer to the question. Actually I never ask him, now. MCLers!!! This will pass. this is exactly why you need to find a way to get W to go Retro. with you. Say if worse comes to worse, ask her to go one weekend for you, so you can have closure. Bet she would do that for you. If weekend went well, she might forgo job and finish balance of weekends. Remember MA, keep thinking positive.

Say on a brighter side, H and I actually had a nice and NORMAL chat today on telephone. I really really wish could convince H to go to Retro. After reading other couples stories, there would be hope for us. I know there is. I sent for info. Have you gotten any yet? Two locations near by me. What about for you and W? Locations near by?
At times, if I can remember DBing, H and I chat just like old times or at least almost like old times. I pray can keep learning the DB. My best chance for first base.
BTW, change one of my goals, lol, it is : convince, no help H see going to the Retrouville (sp)would be worth while. He has to at least go with an open mind. Now the question is how do I measure success towards this goal.??? What would H be doing different if my goal is succeeding?? ________ not sure of the answer.
Copied web page listing four stages of a marriage and Sent it to H in an email. Ask him to please read even though I realized he would rather not. Also ask if he realized relationships were so structured, ect. Mike do you think he will take this as pressuring him or chasing??? lol Was I to direct by any chance?? lol Need to start a bit of "put my toe in the water and test it". Maybe I put my foot in instead. ROFL, joke is H most likely will not even comment on the email!! Dear. Life is not easy.

Pizza night is coming soon! Probably in Feb. Can you freeze pizza and ship them like white Castles? My brother lived in S Cal and I sent him 100 White Castles. He said you would have thought he was dealing drugs with the amount of people in and out of his house for them.

YUMMIE !!!!! Keep me posted. Yea, I would certainly think you could freeze and ship like White Castles. Yea, why not? Food is Food. BTW, we do not have White Castles out here and I have never had one or seen one. lol How many boxes did it take to ship 100 WCs??

If someone offers me adjusters pay(which I was getting until we got a new branch manager) I'll take it, it would be an extra $180 per week, said money talks.

WOW, POP! that is an additional 9 grand a year!! You are good, very good ! Way to go Mike!

Went from a 42" waist to 36", 2xl shirt to l

.
WOW You have Lost Weight !!! How much have you lost???? Is this mostly from just watching what you put in your mouth and rehab. work outs?? How much have you lost???
At rehab, are they starting to say, Mike slow down and don't loose much more???? Way to Go.

[grid, lost]

MIke,
sorry my prior post is so choppy. Can see I am tired.
Stay positive with W. From your posts, do believe something is going on with W. Ice jam in her brain might be starting to break up. She sleeps and works all time sorta have to feel a bit sorry for her. That is all she appears to do with her life. How awful!
Have to get some sleep. Must rise early tomorrow.
H will not be up again till 23 of Jan. Gives me more time to get the money together for a coach call or two.
grid, lost

[micoms]

Grid,

W goes to her best friends house (W of my best friend) and he says the same thing, Why do you put up with such crappy hours and every weekend for $10/hr? Around here 410/hr jobs are every where or at least a job in retail where the store open at 10AM and closes at 9PM, still early enough to see a movie afterwards and store opens late enough for regular sleep hours.

W actually told me some things that upset her that I did. She said while I was in hospital I would wink at her. I don't remember, I was on morphine and percoset at the time, maybe I thought i was flirting. I didn't do a good job of just listening, I tried to explain. Should have just listened and validated, encouraged her to say more. It was the first time she talked about anything. I did ask her if she still cares for me, yes. I asked if she was upset when I was around, she said no. I told her I got the feeling that she was always pissed off when I'm around.

You might wait a while before asking about Retrouvaille, seems he is coming around, might push him away right now. How often does he come to you? Try more dinners, was there a meal you made that was his favorite? When we first got M'd W only knew how to make meatloaf, when we went grocery and got 3lbs of hamburger, I knew we were having meatloaf three times that week. Now I would give anything for her to come over and make that. I told W about Retro, I wonder if I should send her an e-mail about it or not, she doesn't read her mail regularly.

Put White castles in 2 styrofoam coolers with dry ice, put them into boxes, sealed them up and my Mom went out to visit him, she carried them on as carry on luggage. Around here is what you eat on the way home from the bars. I do have them every once in a while. They are little burgers about 3" square steamed on onions on a grill.

S25 asked tonight about pizza night. asked him when I should do it. He said his brothers birthday is at the end of this month and his is at the beginning of next, some time in between. D19 talked to D24 tonight and D19 said she asked when I'm going to do it.

At one time I got adjusters pay, new branch manager came in and said that agreement wasn't with her so there was no agreement and took it away. Told super, fine the extras I do go along with it. Had wiring changes to make she asked if I could do it. Told her yes, but the question should be would I do it. No thats adjusters work, send to engineering dept.

I'm approaching 65lb weight loss. I was up to nearly 270. I got down to 207 before the holidays, put on a little during them. Down to 212 so far. Watched what I put in my mouth. Started back in March, stopped eating lunch. I work out in the field so lunch was Wendy's, Burger King etc. 1700 calorie lunches. I was down to 220 at time of operation, Left hospital at 230, They pumped me full of fluids. I didn't have a heart attack, angina pain, no damage to heart at all. Couldn't do a stent because of location of blockage. They went in to do 2 and did quad bypass. Worst blockage was 70%, another 60% and two more were 45 to 50%. People ask me if I can tell the difference, I can't I feel the same. Maybe it will show up when I get on the soccer field again.

Mike