hi NLW - i did go and read your post - and i'm sorry that you had to realize that. I don't know why i didn't post back to you at the time. I guess i was going through my own stuff.
what i did want to tell you at the time was that - i had just had a similar realization about my h. it was completely different - but suddenly I saw a pattern, that while it had been barely tolerable during the m, had become SO exagerated after BD as to be completely intolerable to me
It did 2 things for me - completely toppled h off the pedestal, and also ironically made me completely accept him the way he was. I know, odd.
it was as if i finally gave up after 11 yrs of allowing it to bother me.
I also came to the realization that during this crisis, all the "negative" traits of the WAS are really much more exagerrated than they ever were, which makes it so much harder to deal with. and i'm like - ok - how much more peace will i feel if i just let all those go and just accept that this is who he is right now
I hope instead of torturing yourself about whom you chose, you can instead reframe it all so you have some much needed peace
(((((((((NLW)))))))))))
zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
my dear #1 Picnic Sister. so much love to you from me
and why should you be baffled? there is no need. It is what it is, and i'm each day getting more ok with it. As my coach said - why try to stop a running train?
Besides I think for a while I would like to drive my own train and mine is painted hot pink and always stops by a certain picnic blanket
Let your new path be illuminated now in love and compassion.
What a beautiful blessing for me, sweet friend - I am going to put it up on my wall
I very much feel you with me, busting
(((((((((((( )))))))))))))
zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
Thank you keepgoing for your lovely words- they mean a lot to me, especially the part about not traveling alone on this journey
I think that here, we all gain a lot of solace from that and it has made our journey just that little bit easier to navigate because of all the love and support here from each of us to each other
I'm sorry that your h has filed - kg - and i send the same blessings to you - I hope you know how strong and wonderful you are and how capable of surpassing and overcoming all this pain.
I'm with you also, and you are not alone
((((( )))))) zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
TPS Me: 44 H: 42 M14 T17 S10 D7 10/10 H moves out after death of his father-same month 21/04/12 H is 'DONE' 04/05/12 OW/PA confirmed (rumors from 2010) July '14 H ends affair May '15 H moves back home
I don't really know where to start, but i am going to try. I apologise in advance for this extra lengthy post
After reading KG's posts yesterday, I saw that I was not alone in what I am going through, and that it was okay for me to admit to myself and here that things have NOT been going well for me. I went into some kind of major back sliding fog after H filed.
Instead of staying grounded and staying on the bb, I thought I could manage on my own and just do it myself. Now i realize that the main support here for DB'ing is about helping myself, not helping to save my marriage, and I think I left because I thought what's the point of being here, my marriage is not saved, h has filed for D and so that's it.
Everything is not dire - I have grown in some ways alot and had so many insights into who I am and what I am about, and also about how the real dynamics in my r with h really work. Instead of encouraging me, these insights have made me feel so overwhelmed, as I realize how much effort I still have to make to improve myself. In the face of the D which is happening so damn quickly I think I lost my focus and got completely overwhelmed by it all.
At first I thought things were going well. I decided to lean in and just allow. To show h that I was completely accepting of it all and he relaxed so much, that suddenly he was coming around, we were having good conversations, he came to a couple of my parties and our interactions were pretty good. He was relaxed enough to eat a few meals here, invited me to go trick or treating with them, even asked if I would like to join the next kiln firing with him.
I was not getting up my hopes or expectations at all - really keeping in mind that a part of his behavior came from needing to show the world that see - zig and i are really okay, see everybody she is doing fun things and letting me join in, she's not upset I left. I figured that it was more important how I felt, and and as long as I didn't have any expectations then I was fine.
Oddly enough he asked me several times if I was really okay with him being around, and I gave a neutral answer - If you want to be here, it's up to, I am fine if you are here and fine if you are not, it's the same for me.
Then last wednesday, I had an appointment with my IC and was describing the strange oddity that H seemed to want to be around more. and that I had noticed that he seemed to be wanting to be part of my life in this slightly odd way - he was enjoying my parties, loving our new puppy (i mean really loving the pup) etc. She pointed out to me - that right now his focus was not so strong on ow and so he is turning towards you. She said, form what you have described of your H he's a person who doesn't have much sense of self and gets his identity through his relationships. So if there's not so much contact with ow right now, he is turning to get a sense of identity through your life. I'm afraid that after some time when his focus switches back to her, you will be devastated again.
I came out of there feeling sick to my stomach and angry - that I had not seen it that way, and now, that I could see it for what it was, there was no way I was going to enable that. A chat with Cadet had him telling me that he was afraid I was going to be hoovered LOL. Sucked in and spit out. I was not having any of that!!
During this whole time, one of the curious things that h was doing was at every opportunity he brought up something from the spew at BD and apologized about it. I was a bit stern in my response - saying it wasn't that easy for me to believe that he suddenly had flipped his stand on it, but that i appreciated his apology. Idk, p/a on my part?
A big issue that came up after he filed was telling S11. His initial reaction was - why do we have to tell him? I haven't thought about that at all - in a panicky voice.
Also he didn't bring up anything about the D, not even telling me the date we were due in court until 3 days ago - almost 5 weeks after he filed, and considering that in KS it is 60 days until D, ihe has left it late. He called me 3 days ago, and finally told me and admitted that he hadn't given me really enough time to do anything.
He also is under a huge amount of pressure as he has a presentation at uni for his third year review on the 15th of this month. For any who don't know - if you don't pass that, you lose your job!! The D court date is the 27th. Until now he has not even begun to fill out the paperwork, let alone give it to me. He seems to have become aware of that only now.
In the initial conversation, I was calm and responded appropriately. I myself brought up the issue of telling S - and he still wanted to avoid it. We ended with agreeing that he needed time to think about it. He mentioned several times that this was happening too soon and he should look into pushing the date back. I took a risk and asked if he would consider a legal separation for now, if he wasn't planning to get married in the near future (quite a strong reaction of "I'm never getting married ever again"). He didn't really know what it was so I explained and said that many couples decide on that because then the spouse can keep the health insurance.
He did not want to consider it - the reason being - I want to own my new house on my own and if we are still married then we own it together. I said that's ok then, i just wanted to throw it out there. A bit later he sort of implied that a legal separation would not suit his other relationship.
But in the last couple of days - I have really messed up. I really pushed on the issue of S, and and about telling him and we have had some conversations which when i look back on, I groan with how much I HAVEN"T learned, and even what i thought i had learned and understood, i simply could not put into practice. I overwhelmed him, and myself.
But oddly I saw so much more clearly - where I still control, where I am still p/a and where i still - as NG pointed out to me - talk circles around him and don't let him find his own way.
In spite of that - his overriding concern through it all and the conversation he wants to have the most - even more than the one about our s, is "what is yours and my relationship going to be now?"
I have been very reticent and not given much at all. I told him that i didn't really want to be friends, that i needed less contact, that truthfully this last year has been terribly hard on me and I have done it for our family but now I need time on my own ...to heal? he added in and i said yes.
Since then he still keeps asking me what our r will be, and i say i' don't know it will just pan out, and that if he's trying to ask me something he will have to be very very specific as i don't really understand what he is asking.
On a side note - he has told no-one that he has filed and the D is imminent. he's implied that does anyone except you and me really need to know?
in yesterdays crazy conversations, i did lose it about him needing to acknowledge that s was affected - i know - old f'ing story - it's like my brain literally can NOT go in any other direction when it comes to S. He finally only did when i used reverse psychology and finally threw my hands up and said - ok fine from now on i am going to completely agree with you that s is completely hunky dory (his words) and i am just not going to worry about it. then i got accused of not listening to him and that he had indeed been saying that of course s is affected.
what i saw the most yesterday was that - when i am calm and friendly and pleasant, h holds his ground in ridiculous stances on issues - for e.g.. why do we need to tell s we are getting d'ed. but when i finally get fed up and lose it and get really frustrated - then suddenly he wakes up and wants to deal with it. I HATE that that's our dynamic and I hate that i get pulled into it, and I hate that i cannot change that.
but most of all I hate that I cannot tell which issues are really important to hold my ground over and which arent'. Was it important to hold my ground on telling s? would it have been better to trust that of course he would see it given time. did it really matter in the big picture? was my old ever=present impatience and wanting to make sure everything was done right still rearing it's ugly head?
I suspect that all of the above are true. and so i still feel horribly depressed and overwhelmed at how much there is to do, for me, in becoming a person that deserves to be in any relationship.
I could go on and on about h's messed up ness that triggers me off, and how he is messing up, but what is becoming more and more apparent to me is how messed up i am and how much i need to work on myself. My list of negative things about myself is growing longer and longer LOL and it is paralyzing me to the point where I am not even able to push myself to work. I have moments of feeling good, but they don't last very long. and of course, i don't need anyone to tell me that I have still way too much focus on h and what he's doing and where he is at. I cannot tell if this is a temporary reaction to his filing, all i know is that I am not strong right now.
In myself, I see many things - I see how I get discouraged and lose all hope and give up (too soon? or is it better I give up now?) , I see how when I feel that I am called to step up and be challenged, I actually freak and want to run away. I see how when others see really good qualities in me and see my strengths, I get overwhelmed and want to deny them and cannot follow through. But mostly I see that when I feel hurt and betrayed, I want to run away and hide and lick my wounds in isolation rather than step up fully to the challenge and say, yes, I can over come this. I also see so strongly that when someone doesn't do what i want, I am so angry. The new puppy is helping me to see that in spades - a constant reminder that it is a real challenge for me to stay still and non-reacitve if things aren't going my way. I also see how incredibly selfish I can be in very subtle ways, and that my generosity of heart is ultimately dependent on the recipients response. That i am the opposite completely of unconditional love, even though i can emulate it temporarily for rather long periods of time!
I know that these are all traits that I share with all other humans - everyone has elements of these as challenges in their lives. For me though, they have been life-long issues, that when they all come to the surface I feel helpless to address them and change them in myself - truly on a fundamental level. I realize that I have "practiced and strengthened" them for many more years than the time that i have taken to address them, but i cannot right now find the patience and self-compassion within myself so that i am not completely down on myself about where I am at.
In the face of what I lose because of who I have been and still struggle not to be, it feels imperative to "fix" all this asap - and even though i realize that that is NOT the point, my mind keeps going there. I still have trouble separating h's crisis from where I am at.
I think it's time for beginners mind - to start from scratch and to start by learning to focus on myself and my life - not on h's. he seems determined to forge ahead with the D, in spite of all these "signs" that he is confused, not sure etc. It is time for me to really wake up and see that and not stay under some illusion that maybe tomorrow he will change his mind.
But mostly it is time for me to come back here and seek the love, support and advice from the people who truly know what i am going through and can help me to focus on what is important for me and who can 2 x 4 me up the creek when i need it most.
(((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))) zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
SD - your reminder gave me a jolt In the depths of my despair, (because I am recognizing that i have the personality that goes from trying very hard directly to despair when I don't achieve what I think I should) I had totally forgotten that there were things like Goals lists
How ironic is that!!
Thank you for the hug, afa - your compassion comes through even though your reply was brief. It helps me to be more kind to myself
I hope you are both doing well today
zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
and mine is painted hot pink and always stops by a certain picnic blanket 