Is this cake eating 7

[bustingout]

NLW- I feel the same most of the time as well. Denial vs hope.

Acceptance I think is the key to this as 25 and bustorama mentioned.

Acceptance so that we can swim to the other side, and accept that the other side is the place we need to be.

Bustorama thanks for your comments about the paradox because it helped me see it deeper than I was seeing it before.

NLW you are never alone!

[zig]

no you aren't alone nlw - and i feel the same

thanks for the discussion on the paradox - it really helped me , to read all that everyone wrote

pema talks a lot about not scratching the itch and just so completely accepting where one is that it allows the peace to come through...

we all need that peace - or at least a little bit of it for a while. the trick is to allow that for ourselves - to just give into and accept the reality and not fight it so hard. it's the fighting it so hard that really messes us up so much

[NLW]

Thanks Busting & Zig

Good to know you feel like this too.

And wow, how good is Pema?

I've just been reading the article on patience.

I so need to shut up and let be.

I'm practicing on my D16 from now on. Will post updates...

Wonder if Pema has ever dealt with a teenager? That would be a test for the Buddha himself.

[labug]

I believe she has 2 children. She was a LBS and in response to that experience, turned to meditation and Buddhism.

I think that's the correct history.

[NLW]

Oh Wow labug. Thanks for that info.

I'm even more in awe of her now.

Does she write about her own experience in this regard?

[labug]

I think she mentions it in When Things Fall Apart. He had an affair.

[NLW]

Okay, I need help in respect of a trigger that I'm encountering a lot lately.

In the last three days, when out driving around our suburb, I keep seeing OW's distinctive convertible parked outside of restaurants and cafes that I know H is frequenting.

I also know that he drives her car around. The other day the kids and I ran into him at a cafe and he was driving her car.

The kids know that he drives it, but he has lied to them (and to his parents) telling them the car is just one that belongs to someone who lives with his male friend - and just happens to be the last one in the driveway when he wants to go out, so he takes it rather than swap all the cars around (can you believe the BS?).

Anyway, tonight D16 and I were on our way to town to shop for some clothes for her when we drove past a restaurant that i know H has been spending money at recently. Sure enough, OW's car was parked out front (this was the place she held her wedding reception which H and I, as her friends, attended), to make matters worse.

When D16 and i saw the car, our evening was pretty much done from there on in. She went quiet and refused to look at clothes when we got into town. In the end, we just came back home again (using a different route).

I'm pissed off.
I need to be able to cope with this, though. It's just gonna keep happening.

So, why am I so mad?
Is it because he's out again spending money on OW at a most expensive restaurant, and the kids and i are eating discounted out-of-date sausages for dinner?

Is it because he is with her and having a good time?

Is it because he chooses to spend time with her instead of with his kids (we saw him on the school drop off this afternoon, and he said he had to run because he had a meeting. Said he couldn't watch the kids play sport tomorrow, said he was too busy to see them at all on Saturday).

Why should I be so triggered by seeing the car?
I know they live together.

Yikes.

I try to tell myself it means nothing.
Maybe he's not even there.

Maybe he is there and is having a boring time. And is anxious about having to spend so much money keeping up the facade in front of her.

Anyway, what sort of relationship is it when you have to keep going out to dinner two or three times a week? H and i never did.

Oh, oh... maybe that was the problem. I only have a boring mundane kid-focused existence to offer. H had to cook dinner every night of the week at our house and then do the washing up. Now he gets to eat out at fancy restaurants and sip expensive wines.

Why would he ever look back to us?

What do I want to know?

What sort of relationship stage are people in when they go out to restaurants so often instead of hunkering down at home on cold winter nights?

Please tell me it's indicative of the honeymoon fantasy phase - or else the 'we're getting bored with each other's company and need to get out of the house so that we can avoid getting on each other's nerves/ realising that we've actually not got much to say to each other' stage.

What do you think?

I know, i shouldn't care/can't know. But I figure it would help me deal better with this trigger if I could hear from others an account that might settle my nerves.

One good thing, I suppose, at least he's using her car - and not chauffeuring her around in our car (that i had to guarantor the lease of recently). I figure he's still trying to hide his activity with her by not being seen around town with her in our car.

[bustorama]

Live per, "He is LIVING WITH OW." Period. Act as if he will be living with OW now, 1 year from now, 10 years from now. Because "his living with OW" is your brutal reality. Living otherwise is not accepting reality.

But if i live totally on the basis of reality: that he is living with OW, surely I would not want to have anything to do with him?

You answered yourself =)

Remember. Your current realities can change. They haven't changed while you have been hoping for them to change in a certain way and not living according to your realities. Have faith in yourself and your kids that you will collectively prevail without an adultering husband.

Having confidence in yourself that you can and will prevail is very attractive. The WORLD is yours to seduce. Your wayward spouse will have to try to catch up. And, if he comes back, it will be your choice whether or not you want him.

[25yearsmlc]

Don't live per, "He is LIVING WITH OW now" (and may not be in the future).

Live per, "He is LIVING WITH OW." Period. Act as if he will be living with OW now, 1 year from now, 10 years from now. Because "his living with OW" is your brutal reality. Living otherwise is not accepting reality.

You might hope that things will be different. But you do not live based on that hope. You live based on your reality.

Hey Busto, Good to hear from you!

Bit of a rambling post coming.

I'm feeling a bit like I'm back where I started on this idea a few posts ago.

I admit that I have hope. I just can't shake the belief that my H will eventually want to come back to us.

But if i live totally on the basis of reality: that he is living with OW, surely I would not want to have anything to do with him?


but you are making progress by not losing your temper around him and he's flirting, right? I mean, isn't something here working?

What's with "have nothing to do with him"?


And I certainly would not be wanting to try to 'seduce' him - as DB coaches so often suggest. This would be immoral.

really? Why would It be "Immoral"? Did you tell the coach you thought that way? He is your h.




My 'reality' is that I am dealing with a man who is in severe emotional turmoil and who is lost. If it were me going through this, I would hope that he'd have the desire to stick with me.

So, it's back to the old dilemma: Go dark/NC or be alluring, desirable, friendly compassionate, show unconditional love.

What seemed to work FOR YOU? And what do you risk by choosing the latter approach? How can it hurt you to be kinder and warmer to him?

I mean, if it does not work, I get stopping (DB 101).

But if it does work, then what's the question, REALLY?


Certainly doing the latter seemed to work for OW. He told her it was over - definitely - and yet she hung around for several years, never gave up, and lured him back.

Let's keep the focus on what you can control...YOU...

besides, a ton of mind reading is going on here. I don't know what she did or thought or acted like. I don't know what he really told her about who he was choosing or what gave her hope.

I wasn't there.

REGARDLESS, back to YOU...
---
I get that H is gone.

But, no you don't. You believe he'll return someday and you say you notice he comes around more. So, which is it?
--

What I really want to ask is a little bit more info on what you mean by:
"Act as if he will be living with OW now, 1 year from now, 10 years from now."

Given that i have no choice but to accept this, and am being friendly, detached (as much as i can) and not pursuing, not sure if I am doing what you're suggesting.

Not sure either.

[ncl]

NLW,

I'm sorry I haven't checked in lately. It's been a busy summer with our 4 kiddos!

As you probably knew I would, I strongly second all that Busto and 25 have written to you. Your last few posts are filled with mind reading and expectations. Please, for your own good & that of your kids, LET HIM GO. That does not mean you've given up on ever reconciling! Live YOUR life to the fullest. Take him out of the equation. IF he decides to come back (and that's a big IF you don't even need to be thinking about RIGHT NOW given your current reality), YOU will have the choice to decide if that's what you want in your new and improved life.

I suffered through marital problems for 4 years, and it makes me sick now how much time I wasted being miserable, walking on eggshells and waiting on my husband to change his ways and his mind about me. It wasn't until I truly let him go AND he knew I meant it that things first improved for me and eventually for my marriage. It wasn't until I dropped the expectations and instead created and enforced boundaries that respect, friendship, and TRUE love returned to my marriage. And even if we hadn't reconciled, those boundaries would still exist for me so my husband (or would be ex in this circumstance) would know how to treat me as his ex-wife and co-parent.

NLW, you are such an intelligent and loving lady. Please stop punishing yourself for what you believe is your fault for your marriage ending. You've recognized where you went wrong, you've apologized profusely, now let it go! And when he brings those things up to you, put a stop to it by telling him you've already apologized for the past and are moving forward. Period.

Letting go/LRT/NC takes a LOT of courage, but once I made the choice that going that route was best and healthy for ME (couldn't control his choice of path so focused only on mine), my life became richer, fuller, less stressful. Focusing only on my goals (and no longer R ones, other than having a healthy co-parent relationship with H) was so empowering, because it was something I could control...improving me for ME, my kids and my other loved ones.

Go back and read DR again. Start over without expectations and mind reading. Remember that going dark and LRT doesn't mean you act rude to your H when you HAVE to interact (regarding kids, house, car, $), you just stick to the business at hand.

You deserve a better life than what you are allowing yourself. Don't allow your husband to control your happiness and peace any more. He's gone. Maybe forever, maybe not, but definitely for now. Live in that reality and don't just make the best of it, make it FABULOUS.

Take care, ncl

PS...you are still obviously very angry and resentful about the money he is carelessly spending (and I would be, too!). The ONLY way you are going to stop him from wasting your money is by contacting your lawyer and getting an enforced (by the courts) financial agreement in place. Please, if you still haven't done this, strongly consider doing so. You need to protect not only your future, but that of your kids. And I really hope he no longer has access to your kids' accounts he drained. I know I'm giving you a 2x4 here, but it's only because I care about you as a DB friend!