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#2059555 08/19/10 06:37 PM
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Hi fellow DBers. Thanks for reading here,

I have been reading forum since mid-June and have read and re-read DR among other self-help books, but I am hopeful for more ideas and support from you good people on my sich. Will try to repay in kind as I can.

Short version of my current sitch is that my wife dropped an "I am Done, I am Leaving you and Divorcing you" bomb ca. April 23. I did the common begging/pleading/promising/pursuing to change/crying/etc. mistakes throughout May while I helped her get her nearby apartment setup. She was very non-functional throughout May while still living at home overwhelmed by waves of anxiety, depression, and anger. She finally moved out late May when apartment was ready, and we have been physically separated since then with no evidence or discussion of lawyering or filing for divorce on her end. She had been in IC at that time which she is continuing, and I immediately entered IC upon her bomb. She continues to decline MC to date, saying she is "not ready for that right now."

I consider her reasons for giving an ultimatum/leaving as extremely justified, and, frankly, she had much more patience than she should have. To be blunt, I hurt her severely by allowing myself to become addicted to online computer games for 2 years, resulting in gross neglect of her and our family, and during that time I ALSO engaged in concurrent EA's with two women from the games in Fall of 2008. The EA's included the women sending me pornographic material (pics and text) that my wife discovered. I had already stopped the affairs at the time that my wife discovered the material, but I compounded her hurt by not re-engaging her and being remorseful when she gave me the chance and by continuing to play the games secretively behind her back because I was so damn addicted to them. Around May of 2009, she discovered that I was still secretively playing the games, and she fully emotionally shut down to me. We began an in-house separation at that time with me sleeping on the couch and hoping she would come around trying to do nice things for her, but she was very angry and anxious about the past EA's and my failure to accept what I should have been responsible for. During this time I did keep trying to engage her, but she pretty much didn't want any part of me. After a couple of months of this, I "relapsed" and got myself hooked on ANOTHER game that I played openly up to the time that my wife eventually had had enough. There were additional serious eff-ups on my part during this period, including the fact that we tried MC around the time that I was engaged in the EA's, and I made out as if everything was ok in order to stop the MC and continue the EA's. Seriously, it's a miracle she didn't leave much earlier.

Her separating from me finally brought me out of my fog, so I can definitely attest to the power that separating/ultimatums can have on a wayward spouse (which I essentially was during this period). My IC has helped me get my personal life back on track in many, many respects. All gameplaying and accounts ended as of the bomb (late April), no cravings or desire to go back at all anymore. Reconnected with real-life friends. Taking pride in self and appearance. Regular exercise (lost 30 pounds while putting on muscle). Regular social outings instead of living in house like hermit playing games. Wonderful relationships re-developed with my girls (who I have 50% of the time). Calmer, less irritable self. Better able to express things I want assertively instead of withdrawing narcissistically. Better able to control self when I get anxious rather than controlling or blaming others. I went 2x/week for IC for the first month and have gone have gone weekly since, so I have been to ca. 20 sessions. My therapist really "gets" me, so I've been able to do alot of work.

I recognize there are issues about my W, myself, and our interactions that led me to withdraw in the way that I did. I have been working on the issues with myself that I can in IC and, some of them have already extended better interactions with my W. I also have been following the DB precepts -- stopped pursuit, validating and listening to her feelings, 180's out the wazoo. She has noticed the changes in me, saying how happy she is that I I seem happier and sorry that it took her moving out for it to happen. She has noticed me exercising and my improved physical appearance. She has noticed me being a much better Dad and being patient with the girls. She also I think has noticed and thanked me for allowing her to express herself and listen to her feelings. We talk longer and about things more varied than just the girls now on the phone. She also had me as her caregiver at her apartment to help her recover from a surgery she had a couple of weeks ago, and that time was positive in our relationship in that I think she regained some trust in me, and I validated her hurt every time she brought it up and expressed how sorry I was for hurting her.

So, today, we are a bit under 3 months since she moved out. She is less anxious, angry and depressed than when she moved out. She still has ALOT of fear about letting herself be vulnerable to me again, though, and says she can only be friends with me "right now," that she is not ready for MC "yet," that she still has things she wants to work on herself (regaining self-esteem, bettering some other aspects of our life). She is sharing some more aspects of her personal life with me now that she had walled off previously, and we are talking about aspects of our personal lives other than just the kids. Most recently, she has hugged me more (5-6 times in last 2 weeks vs. 2 times in previous 3 months) and even called me "honey" and "baby" which she had not done in over a year. I've seen progress on my list of short-term DB "taking stock" goals that I made in June. She also told me a couple of days ago that she was confused about what she wanted (this was right after she called me baby and I asked her if she was talking to me cause I was so surprised she said it). That she felt herself drawn to me again, but she was scared, and maybe we would be better off being friends or "best friends." I told her I understood that she was scared and even terrified, and I understood why she felt that way and that I was sorry for hurting her. Told her I was committed to helping her feel safe eventually. I also told her that I did not see being just "best friends" as viable for me in the long-term. She thanked me for listening to her and her feelings.

That's more or less where things stand now, I will post more on the next message.


Me-53
W-49
D22,D18,D15
T-Since-12/2001
Married-9/2004
She Moved Out-5/28/2010
Piecing start-04/2011
Now-together
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http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2079304
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I'd say keep doing what you're doing, as you're dead-on-track. 2-6 more months of this, and I'd bet anything you two are back together.

IF you take it SLOW . . . and EAAAAASY.

Puppy

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So, it seemed like we were regaining some connectedness and trust over the last 2-3 weeks, but I may have messed things up a little last night. Part of my effort to 180 is to be very responsive now to things when my W requests help from me at her apartment (in contrast to my neglect before while computer addicted). So, I put together her furniture, etc. etc. (sidenote, she always asks me my opinion of stuff she bought and says she is buying things we could use if she moves back in). So, yesterday, she asked me to come over and put together a storage unit things for the girls' room and hang up some pictures and art pieces on the walls. She asked me to do this in part because she is still recovering from her surg and can't really do it herself.

So, I come over and we have a good dinner with the girls, I put them to bed while she is working on finding a new job on her laptop, and we laugh about some funny kids' videos. Positive, small-talk interactions, but fun vibe like we used to have. She also showed me her boobs and asked if they looked good (her surg was a boob reduction) and had me feel them again.

I start putting the stuff together and hanging up pictures, and I get bothered by a coat hanger thing that says "HOME." I get into self-doubt internal talk about why am I putting up this stuff for her in her new "home" and facilitating her leaving and staying away. Then, she tells me that she is chatting with 5 friends on facebook (3 women, 2 guys that I do believe are just "friends" though there may be slight EA aspect to them) and that annoyed me because I started thinking, I'm hanging up your HOME sign for you my separated wife who won't do MC and you're happily chatting away with friends? I started feeling taking advantage of and doormat-ty but tried to control myself. W noticed something was wrong as I was on my way out the apt and asked what was up, and I told her I was feeling a little taken advantage of and that it was difficult for me to put up a HOME sign for my separated W.

She gets defensive and angry and says I am accusing her of abusing me. I stay calm and say I understand she feels angry and accused. I tell her I am not accusing her, I am letting her know how I felt, and I didn't really want her to do anything or say anything, I was just expressing my feelings to her. She started getting anxious saying I was trying to control her and who she talked to (a strong theme between us about her feeling controlled). I told her I could see how she felt controlled, but this wasn't about who she was talking to. I wasn't even sure what it was about or what I wanted (if anything) other than I was having these feelings and was sharing them with her because she asked me what was up. Eventually I left. I thought about it some overnight and called her in the morning to apologize for hurting her and making her feel anxious and controlled. I told her that I had gone over voluntarily to help her on her invitation and she did not deserve for me to treat her that way since I had agreed to what I was doing. That I should have done a better job of controlling or managing my own insecurity/anxiety about putting her stuff up rather than trying to control or change her behavior. I asked her if she could forgive me and she said yes.

This is a tension I go through in lots of our interactions. A significant part of my 180'ing with her and depositing love units by being responsive when asked to do something I can do. This is based on my neglect of her before and showing her my love of her by being responsive to her even for things like helping her get "her place" all set up. In some ways, though, this seems like it could degenerate into doormat behavior. But, at the end of the day, I hurt her terribly over a fairly long time. We aren't even 3 months into separation and things seem less negative than before so it seems to be "working" in some way. It's just hard to control that inner voice that says you are helping her leave and stay away. My other inner voice counsels patience, and stay the course as does my IC. Thoughts?


Me-53
W-49
D22,D18,D15
T-Since-12/2001
Married-9/2004
She Moved Out-5/28/2010
Piecing start-04/2011
Now-together
Thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2079304
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My immediate thought is to be very careful that you don't swing the pendulum too far, too fast, the opposite way.

I see this all the time on here -- particularly with men -- whereby they overcomensate for their past, boorish behavior, with overly-placing, supplicating, doormattish "Mr. Nice Guy" behavior.

Which kills atttraction JUST AS MUCH as the former boorish stuff, interestingly.

This is what I meant above by "SLOW and STEAAAADY."

Puppy

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Busto,

I too neglected my wife by playing Warcraft for years. Surprised she put up with it for as long as she did.

We're both in a tough spot, though I hope I can forestall a separation. Good luck to you.

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I hear you, Puppy. I don't think I've reached that point (yet?) because she sent me a sweet thank you card for the stuff I did helping her over the surgery and even when I left last night on not so good terms she thanked me for the stuff I had done before I left.

I get that she has to retain respect for me and not see me as her lackey or boy valet or some groveling, not self-respecting, do gooder that will do anything because I NEEEEEEED her. To help me corral this possibility, I actually just ordered NUTS earlier today (I heard that one is helpful in this respect, right?). Supposed to arrive on Saturday.

Thanks much for your reading and feedback. I'll update soon and will keep being the 180ing, helpfully responsive, GALing for self, validating tortoise.


Me-53
W-49
D22,D18,D15
T-Since-12/2001
Married-9/2004
She Moved Out-5/28/2010
Piecing start-04/2011
Now-together
Thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2079304
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Yes, "N.U.T.S." is an exceptional book, and will help you focus on which of your boundaries are actually your Non-negotiatble, unalterable" ones.

I want you to be very sensitive to your wife trying to use your area of SPECIFIC weakness (your prior infidelities) as weapons to justify any current behavior of hers in the same area. It's VERY typical.

Puppy

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Originally Posted By: pinhead

I too neglected my wife by playing Warcraft for years.

Man, I'm not alone! If I could go back in time and never install that F'd up lifestealing POS game, I would! I shredded everything related to that game. It was one of my W's BIGGEST complaints. In hindsight it was really the beginning of the end of my marriage.

Damn it! It really makes me mad how much I was too late.

Originally Posted By: Puppy Dog Tails
Yes, "N.U.T.S." is an exceptional book, and will help you focus on which of your boundaries are actually your Non-negotiatble, unalterable" ones.

I want you to be very sensitive to your wife trying to use your area of SPECIFIC weakness (your prior infidelities) as weapons to justify any current behavior of hers in the same area. It's VERY typical.

Puppy


I second that. I'm already reading it again.

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Agreed. I played it from launch until April of 2010. It probably was one of the biggest reasons she emotionally separated from me. Now, there are reasons why the game was so attractive to me, that I can't blame the game. But still. I'd like to have those years back.

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Originally Posted By: pinhead
Agreed. I played it from launch until April of 2010. It probably was one of the biggest reasons she emotionally separated from me. Now, there are reasons why the game was so attractive to me, that I can't blame the game. But still. I'd like to have those years back.


Well I never played anything like it, so it was just SOOO addicting, played it for 3 years. During that time I failed to realize my W detaching, how much friggin time went by and how fast, and really how I became the laziest person on the planet. Add in my addictive personality and it's been an absolute nightmare for me. I'm not even happy with the "good" times while playing it.

I know we can't change the past, but I'm so happy that I've began "constructive" use of my time and life.

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