It's automatic when you feel it

[Cinco]

Hi Mama,

CB is right. In my case, if I backed off completely, waited for her to give me the total green light for ML, it would only happen about twice a year. We did that for about 3 years straight, she was content, I was not, and in my weakness I ended up having an affair. I hate to think about all those wasted years while I waited for her. I basically stopped trying anymore during many years.

We are now ML about once a week and once in a while it is actually very nice. There is still something missing though. All of the desire comes from me. She placates me with sex but really she has no desire or interest in it for herself. Without the enthusiasm from her for me and wanting this for her own pleasure, it falls short of what I truly desire.

I have made it known now that I want a certain frequency of ML, I have that now (although 2-3 times a week would be better). I have made it known also that I want her to want me, I don't know if she will ever want me in this way again. I have been trying to decide if I can live the rest of my life in this one-sided sort of way.

I said in a post above that it's not an awful marriage. I want it to be a wonderful marriage though, that's what I truly desire.

You can read my sitch at the beginning of this thread It's Automatic When You Feel It . There are links to all of my threads, starting almost a year ago now, at the bottom of the first post. There is a lot more to my story.

Cinco

[Jayce]

Hi, #5. Glad the "beads" worked. The dampness later isn't much different than from sex w/out condom. I always kinda liked that. Reminder that I got laid :-) H says Liq.Silk burns?! Astroglide got sticky. KY always does. Don't know what to try next. Silicone based? Passionate Marriage is not a quick, slick read. I go back & read parts twice. Will read it again. The 'anxiety leading to growth' parts are true. I know H's resistance is cuz he's way out of his comfort zone. Doesn't like to let much out & hates change. We got to boring sex once a week & now, surprise, he initiates more, obviously into it & trying a little new stuff. Still not talking, tho. Says "I don't talk". Maybe that'll come eventually, too. Took 1 1/2 yrs. So you only have 6 mo to go ;-)hang in there!
Jayce

[mamanpc]

i agree with you Charlie - it is indeed a Catch22, but not in all situations... personally i wouldn't at all want that we not ML at all anymore! but i understand that there are other 'LD' people who would in fact be contented with that situation. However, there is the element of 'doing a 180' that could pique your partner's curiosity and, perhaps, after an (inevitable i'm afraid) 'dry spell' regarding ML, then there could be more interest afterwards... i know that it's very hard to know what to do - even more so when i am not in your sitch. Each one is so unique...
I re-read the SSM and the DR books constantly, there is so much in there that almost every word, every sentence is important. I know that i need to work on MYSELF as that's the only thing that i CAN work on, doing 180s, trying to listen more, work on my own level of desire, etc.
Communication for me is key - i am in fact someone who really LIKES sex - but i dont have 'the urge' as often as H, AND my likes/dislikes in that arena are very different from his. Thus the need for me to learn to communicate in a way that he listens and understands (and then maybe accepts!) hwat i would like to do. The problem i have is that i get turned on by things that seem very boring and nonsexual to H: talking/bonding/non-sexual massages...

[mamanpc]

And cinco, thanks for the link to your thread - i will go have a look at that.
personally i couldn't imagine having sex only 3 times a year! and i have the same discussions with my H about him 'wanting me to want him'... there is a lot of interesting stuff on that in the Passionate Marriage book. I am going to read multiple passages of that book again, because it takes time/thought to digest everything that's in there.
Also re-reading SSM again as there are so many things in there that i need to do...

[Cinco]

June 20 (tomorrow) marks one year of my posting here.

The more I look at my marriage the more I realize that this is still a journey within myself and to find what I want out of life and out of my relationship. It's not only about sex but wanting to truly connect with another person. I wish I could say my marriage is all fixed (it's not). I am in a better place to figure out how to move forward with my life though.

The most important difference is I'm in much better touch my emotions now. I am allowing myself to really feel things again. No more dulling my senses or ignoring them. Also I am voicing how I am feeling to my wife. She knows what is on my mind now. This was not happening much at all before in our relationship or with anyone in fact. I think I said it once before, "How can I be intimate with someone when I don't reveal myself fully to them?"

I'm still not sure what our next step will be. I know that I am not currently having the realtionship that I desire. So we will see. At least I hope we will be able to talk through this and figure it out together.

Jayce - Yeah the anxiety leading to growth is so true. My father dying made me really reflect on my life and question how really happy I was with it and how I wanted to live the rest of my days. I realized how lifeless my existance was and I wanted to change that.

Mama - I am gald to help you in any way. I know I haven't been very active on the board lately but my story here may help someone in some small way.

Cinco

[Jayce]

Hey Mr.5, One little thing - you are in a warm climate, right? I caught that one description where you said something about after you ML getting dressed & going to sleep?? If I didn't misread that...why???? We love cuddlin' nekkid as we fall asleep. Every night, not just when ML is starting or done. Being skin to skin feels good and keeps a level of intimate contact that allows for events to occur spontaneously, or just touching, tickling, playing. It requires trust and conveys a sense of complete acceptance. Even if ML isn't frequent, there's the comfort of knowing your partner enjoys holding you, the full length body contact. It is sensual and for anyone who has gotten away from mutual sensuality,a way to gradually regain it. It doesn't represent constant pressure to "put out" it represents closeness and a base level of connection. At least to me, and evidently to H also. Even tho there have been some world class rough patches, since he quit with the T-shirts & shorts last year, we always have the comfort of touch at night. (Its hard to reject someone when you're naked with them, right?)
Its not as 'in your face' as hugging till relaxed. It is maybe more gradual, long term relaxing, in the dark with no one to see while your feelings evolve and become clear. It is what I would miss most if I were alone.
Jayce

[Cinco]

Jayce, you don't know how many times sleeping nude has come up between us. She has said that she is afraid she will have to get up suddenly in the middle of the night when our D needs something (she's almost 17 now). So she always wears something in bed. Maybe when our D is out of the house that that my change.

Even last night we ML and I didn't get dressed afterwards.... but she got dressed. She did snuggle my nude body while we were going to sleep and that felt nice.

I see what you are saying. It's the same as going to bed together every night. It doesn't mean that you will ML that night but it leaves the opportunity for it to happen open every night. You at least get cuddle time every night. It is important.

Cinco

[Jayce]

Do you ever wonder if there's a reverse madonna/whore syndrome? Like whore/madonna as in a woman who was hot,open, up for experimentation, "did" guys, generally enjoyed sex, then after marriage-with or without kids-feels she has to be the ..what? demure wifey? Ladylike spouse? Feels if she shows her true nature, husb. will think she's likely to be promiscuous..or way more experienced than he's comfortable with?
After reading about so many 'cases' in all the books including Passionate Marriage, I wonder about it sometimes.

I figured that's what you'd say about your W & sleeping nude. Your D knows not to bother you guys when you're in bed. Trust me on that one. As kids get older & grow their own hormones, they know parents "do it" but don't want to see it, hear it, think about it, or God forbid, interrupt it! Big LOL! Knew a woman who always said "what if there was a fire?!?!?", You'd grab a robe, right? or the sheets? Oh well, if D goes away to college, maybe that'll change. Hope so.
J

[Cinco]

I think you are referring to the whore/mommy complex Jayce. She is hot and sexy and all until the day she gives birth (it actually starts during pregnancy). "I'm a mommy now! How can I show my little girl how to grow up to be a proper woman if I am acting all slutty and kissing on dad."

I agree with you on the kid knowing we're "doing it". I am certain that she has gradded her iPod at least a few times after realizing, "ewww, mom and dad are at it again."

Cinco

[saffie]

Hey Cinco,

I was reading something you wrote in that other world about you wife never saying Thanks or talking about the 'best sex'. You know what I mean. They locked the thread before I could reply.

I know I beat up on you a few times over there buy that really made me want to cry. ((((HUGS))))))