Robbie, that was another big one for me. I used to live in dread of bad things happening. I doubted my ability to handle things. I've thought so many times in the last few years that I have been given a valuable gift. My dread has been taken away because I know that no matter how bad today or tomorrow might be, it is not terminal.
As long as my children are happy and healthy I think I could handle most anything. Not that I want life to take a nose dive or anything but, I now know that if it does I am equipped to deal with it and come out the other side wiser and appreciating the good stuff that much more.
Cathy
Oh Oh Imp!!! WTFers are brushing off the dirt and re-emerging....Diving you say Ole Redness from Tennessee? Oh I have been saving up for you dear lady, I sure have. Funny how the heart can do deceptive things to people under stress. It is so easy to follow the heart the "way things used to be, or the way I was brought up to believe" I should behave. This is a very challenging moralistic time we live in, and the challenge of keeping our heads straight as to what we want in life, what we can provide ourselves in life, what brings us joy without another person in life, is something I have learned to be a priority....the partner sharing these desires will either remain, come back, or be someone you do not even know yet. I spent time looking though the gun sights at that damn mean, vindictive "other person" who "caused" all this pain I was suffering. Nope, I allowed the actions of my walk away to cause me to take a painful view of my helpless situation. My gunsights pointed low "Shoot low boys they are riding Shetland ponies" type of brigade then aimed high as in "God, how can you let such horrible things happen to someone who loves You so much?" Did I take pleasure "winging" my beloved walkaway.....yep. Did it accomplish anything....nope. In the 5 years since the bomb, 4 years since the divorce, I can only tell those of you new to look in the mirror. Look that person in the eye and say "Ok, what did you do to contribute to this mess?", "What can you do, ole green eyed gray haired guy, to change YOUR behavior?" Notice in the mirror there is only you. Not your spouse, not your walkaway, not that cheating SOB who left you for the tramp with D cups. Nope, only you are in the reflection. It is important to have a support group, I couldn't have kept the semblence of sanity I have (so my friends tell me) without this forum. I tend to have a bit different approach when posting, there may be some sarcasm, there may be attempts at wit, but that is my outlook on life. Always find the best in a bad situation.....And what I discovered was a newer, happier with myself (there was a relationship in the near past), less reliant on the acceptance of a partner or others kind of guy. This is not to be construed as non-sensitive to those posting and in need. It is a choice I have made. It is an apparent choice my old comrad IMP has made. When it is mentioned to "take care of yourself", it is flat out, without a doubt the only thing you can do to help yourself and give potential salvation to your relationship which is in turmoil. Invest in your children, invest in your family and friends, invest in yourself with a hobby, a church group, volunteer work, bike riding, reading, music, throwing rocks at traffic,...whatever it is, get to it. The ONLY way a walk away is going to return with a new and changed vigor for love and the relationship is when he/she sees that you are moving on in life, for yourself. I know, never made sense to me either at that time in my turmoil. But a few of us have witnessed a tremendous renewal of love in a formerly near dead marriage. Cathy knows of a particular couple on the brink of divorce in my neighborhood, he having an affair. God put me near her then, to give the website, books and care for her. And she got tough as hell with the man in her house. She took the 180 immediately. Well, I met with her last Friday at an eye doctors office. She is thankful to all of you on this board for the support and caring. Nope, she never posted. She read, and took what she needed to save HERSELF first, and the marriage followed. All cases are different, and I would suspect critical elements could offer objection to my words. That is ok with me. A good friend in Iowa ( I will only mention her pet name of Silo-ho) offers this statement "Act in haste, repent in liesure". Bottom line, patience is key, patience with yourself, patience with your actions, and patience with the line at Walmarts. Tom (Don't let your meat loaf" K
Oh Flo da ho, how nice to see your name on the board again. Remember when we helped you reach your 1000th post? You did one word posts for several nites. Being a slow reader, that was perfect for me. Glad to hear you are still putting on the shin digs in Heavens Waiting Room. I understand there are large piles of clothing at the Florida border deposited by your "guests" huh? People take this "clothes optional" to heart. Take care and we shall watch at you approach 3,000 posts. I am going back into my cave. Spray painting Pickets Charge on the wall keeps me from witnessing the debauchery of life people are doing to others. Plus it is close to the beer fridge. Impster, about the US Senator from your beloved Massachusettes......ahem! No, not the fat drunk womanizing one, the other one!. Perhaps another thread should be started before I break the scope of yours here. Tom "May the force be with YOU, not the loser who walked away" K
Imp, Good response! The success of a venture: improving yourself in this topic instance is thus - 80% of success is just showing up. Show up every day to find the best to improve yourself. The other 20% is beyond our control, sometimes good things come our way, sometimes bad things roll on the path. You mentioned "in 5 years you will be fine". You are fine and happier because you didn't allow 5 years to pass without being honest with yourself, and readdressing the path you wanted to take, the destination you wanted to reach. We reach goals every day, hell I am thankful for my feet hitting the floor beside the bed everyday, for decent health (despite my treatment of my body), and for the Pistons chance of a repeat of a championship, and my children. You know something, Michelle hasn't changed her outfit on this website in 5 years! As they say, if it is working, don't change it, if it isn't, then change it. It must be working Michelle. Tom (southern thinking stronger than ever) K
This is starting to look like a class reunion. And it looks like we are all dancing.
Cathy, cis, and Tom, thank you for all your words here. There is so much truth to everything you said. And even R2, is moving along nicely in his recovery and has some excellent view on this subject.
If there is one theme that is coming out in all the posts, it is the fact that even though we have been through hell, we have all survived. When cis first asked the question, I had so many thoughts gothrough my head and I was going to explain what I meant by never giving up on me, but you all (or Tom if we want to go Southern, y'all...ah that 10 years in FLA is paying off) have hit many of the points.
When the bomb hit, I was fit to be tied. In one second everything you think about life has been flushed down the toilet. Anger was at an all-time high. I threw magazines over the wife head. I told her it was better than the alternative. But at a certain point in time, I looked in the mirror and said to myself, now I never have to be the same person who got me to this place.
The funny thing is that in many respects I am the same person. Why would I want to give up being a gregarious fellow who smiles all the time. On the other hand, it gave me a chance to look back and see that the thing that allowed me to go awry was not staying true to my principles. When you capitulate to a lower common denominator, then you have problems. I smoked dope every day for 15 years. The only person I was kidding was me.
And even so, it doesn't mean that with new awareness, that you don't make mistakes. It doesn't mean that those traits that you have still don't come back to get in the way. But rather, you have a new view of accepting things about yourself and learning how to effectively channel your energy. For instance, one of the things I have had to deal with is this. I have the ability to do simple tasks more rapidly and more efficiently than most humans. Also, I have an ability to do rocket science. Where I break down is in the middle. When things are realtively easy (to me) but a slow-moving, I start climbing the walls. So then it makes sense to move in directions that use my strengths and recognize that I do have to do those mundane tasks that will drive me batty. My coworkers would say that I drive them batty in those times too. Right now at work, I am dealing with that.
I would like to share with everyone a quote that I always have nearby.
Quote: It is never too late to be what you might have been - George Eliot
One final thing. I can truly say that I am a happier person today thank I have ever been. I can't jump as high as I once could (come to think of it my hops are pretty much gone). I can't lift 300 pound boxes anymore. and let's not even go into the aches and pains that lingers. But I go to bed with a smile on my face at night and I get up in the morning and know that it is a great day to be alive. And that is what life is all about.
For me I would have to say that there are a number of things I have taken away from this board...one of the most important being this:
Healing is a process. There are steps or levels that you must come thru at your own pace in order to truely heal. We can't move on until we as a person are ready. Looking back at past mistakes it's easy to say I should have done this or I should have done that...but at that time we weren't at a place where we could. We can't blame ourselves for not being then the person that we are now.
It's like the old saying about wishing you were 21 again but knew then what you know now. How things would be so much different. I guess we could say the same about our marriage. Wishing we were back there but know then what we know now. Things would have been very different indeed.
I think that holds true when we look at our X. If they are going to heal and become a better person then they need to go thru steps and levels as well. It's easy to see the level that they might be on, it's even easy to see when they have dropped a level, but we can't make them move on. They have to do that on their own. Maybe they will and maybe they never will but we don't have the power to change that.
Here on the board, we can point other's in the right direction. Point out things that maybe they could be doing and point out things that maybe didn't work the way they had hoped. We can even give stories of others who were in similar situations and express what worked and what didn't..but again, they need to move on on their own, just like we did.
I think a good example of other DBers and the steps they need to take on their own is this: There are a heck of a lot of women (men as well, but mostly women) on the MLC area who's spouses are just plan treating them badly. We over here in surviving want so badly to tell them that they shouldn't be taking it, that they are being used, that they are being abused. When we do say it, they hear it on one level but don't seem to be able to truely act and correct things.
Why is that? Because one can't walk away from abuse unless one has the self esteem to recognize that they don't deserve to be abused. So..in those cases self esteem is the first step in getting out of an abusive situation.
I guess all I'm saying is that we have survived or are very close to the end of that journey, be careful when we go back and talk to people who are much further behind. They want to hear our thoughts and wisdom but aren't always ready for what they are going to hear.
I'm not sure if any of this is making sense but for me it's an important thing to remember.
Gigi
Last edited by mastateflower; 05/26/0504:11 PM.
"It's not what happens to you, it's what you make of it." Zig Ziglar
It is most definitely a process. That fits well with my original notion of equilibrium. We have ups and downs and eventually they dampen and we can become more stable. I won't do the math, but it works well here.
Also, you mentioned that people going through this need to move through it on their own. One of the things that has bothered me though and one of the reasons I started the thread is because in some cases I have seen a reluctance to engage in conversation. And I don't know if I totally agree with the notion that people are not always ready to hear. This is personal to me, but I always wanted to hear. The problem I had was synching up my emotions with my brain. But I can't imagine what I would be like today if I wasn't willing to hear anything back then.
Thanks for stopping by. Are you taking any classes out there in those low-cost state universities?
When I say that people aren't always ready to hear, it's just in reference to people not being ready to accept the reality of their situation. We have to continue to share with them to help them move to that reality. This can really take some time!!
No classes for me yet. I need one year of residence before the cheap rates kick in but yes, I am planning on going back to school at least part time.
We've bought a house here and I'm back working full time as an accountant. I'm still suffering from accounting burn out but I'm at a small company with extremely friendly people and that really helps. Still hoping for a career change somewhere down the road.
Still working on my own issues. Still have trouble working with the X but the 3,000 miles has made it much much easier. Now it's just try to keep him informed as to S16's statis (courts say I have to) and keep tabs on S19. S16 is bouncing back finally and D24 is doing wonderful here. S19 (who stayed in Mass) is the only one who still struggles thru. Wish I could get him to move but he just won't.
Heard you guys were getting wet this week. Cold as well I hear. We had a nasty hot weekend but things cooled right down yesterday - only hit 91!!
All from here...Gigi
"It's not what happens to you, it's what you make of it." Zig Ziglar
This is a wonderful thread! Lots of familiar names of those who spent time together in the trenches. I consider myself an old-timer - bomb dropped almost 5 years ago and divorce final 4 years ago. I like this lively and positive discussion of the lessons learned along the way. And there is MUCH to learn if you remain open and receptive.
Quote: What is one thing that sticks with you even today that you learned as you made this arduous emotional journey? Something that you apply to your life on a continuous basis.
(Hi Cis!) I've learned several but what I apply to my life on a continual basis would be acquiring acceptance - a willingness to cope with WHATEVER comes my way (including a certain amount of sadness) And I say ACQUIRING because I certainly wasn't born with it. I spent a great deal of time running with my eyes closed, avoiding anything and everything that was remotely uncomfortable or unpleasant. I've learned that if you continue to run long and hard enough, you'll eventually run into an inescapable corner. The only way out of the corner is to accept where you are. So, accepting was a virtually unthinkable concept for one who is accustomed to resisting. But with accepting my then current state of affairs came some unexpected benefits. It allowed me to walk away from the struggle. My separation and inevitable divorce was like playing a game of tug of war with a 1000 pound ox - a war that I simply couldn't win. There is wisdom in knowing when to drop the rope and let go of the struggle.
Acceptance also helped me to assess where I really was and then discover a better path for the future. I am exceedingly happy to report that I AM happy again. It's much different than what I imagined at this stage of my life but I believe that it is actually better. My opinion and self worth isn't all tied up in someone else's approval or disapproval of me. It's easy to get all hung up on what might have been, could have been, etc but what is only fantasy because what might have been wasn't. And that's part of acceptance - seeing the situation as it really is, not as you wished it to be.
I think another simple but important lesson that I apply on a continual basis is one I've learned from my dogs. It's the importance of living like a dog. My dogs remain strictly in the moment and live in the present tense. No looking back and ruminating on bad experiences in the past. Looking ahead is limited to the anticipation of what's for supper only. They don't get all hung up on a future that might or might not be and don't beat themselves up about past mistakes. Who would ever imagine such a lesson so profound from a creature that from time to time eats his own poop? LOL
TomK - just one question - is Portage Lake as desolate and barren in the summer as it appears in the winter?
WOW, it is a real ho down. TomK, do I have quarters for you. Thing is you are going to have to come to the FL Party to collect. Would love for all over you guys to be able to come down. Flo da ho here has had a great experience with all the people on this board. Being able to laugh at myself (Remember when I thought WTF meant Women That F.... Tom, who all were in your stable? Silo ho, Flo da ho, Hiho, Moe ho..... What I have come away with is the fact that I can not control anyone else and since I realize I do not know how I will react to a situation, I have learned not to judge anyone. My advise to the newbies would be to make sure you take care of the financial end right away while the MLCer is feeling guilty. That changes and they begin to believe you are the cause of the breakup. I have purchased a small townhouse very close to where I work. It is more than enough for me. I don't have to worry about yard work. Nursemom moved from Ohio to within 5 minutes of me. She and I are having a big singles only birthday bash on Sunday (mine is on Saturday and hers is on Monday). We may have as many as 80 single people at our party. Tom, your quarters will be adding up since you had Cathy and Moe give me lessons on how to excel in quarter collection.
"Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good." Hopeful
