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A Message from Michele
Active Threads | Active Posts | Unanswered Today | Since Yesterday | This Week
For Newcomers
1 minute ago
I am getting to the point where I do not think LBSs should confront over things like this. I stop short of saying this strongly to LBSs because I know that in my own sitch, finding things and not confronting was nearly impossible. However, at a maximum, LBSs should just say "I know", and not say what or how they they know. The problem is that it is hard to confront without expectations. When I would confront my W I expected sadness, sorrow and remorse. And I would spiral when her attitude was "yeah, I know. I told you I was done."

Confronting is pressure. And the best course of action is no pressure. Even thought I know that is very difficult to live by.
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Surviving the Big D
5 minutes ago
Hi ST. Good to find you here. Keep doing whatīs working for you and the kids. You are their role model now. Sure youīll honor that position.

As R2C says "what is best for my kids is best for me".

Keep shining there man!
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For Newcomers
8 minutes ago
To say that any one variable does or doesn't affect one's sitch is pure conjecture.

Unless you could test it both ways keeping all other variables constant. Who knows?

To that point, I believe that religion has everything to do with the outcome.
34 836 Read More
For Newcomers
58 minutes ago
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Uni. Here's a possible reverse scenario of looking at it. What if W wants to talk, and is concerned with distance because she notices the behavorial change, and she wants to assess if she still has you on the hook or not?

Why would she care if I'm on the hook? Given that I agree with so much of what you wrote (as far as matching my theory of what is going on with W), she's not into the cat-and-mouse pursue/distance game. She's pretty much done, but doesn't realize it yet -- just needs a bit more justified anger to fuel her launch into orbit. I realize I should not be making assumptions about what she is thinking, so I take it with a grain of salt.

I guess what I'm trying to say is my W isn't much of a temp-checker.

Originally Posted by IHCLACS
If you were dating her for a week, would you put up with this B.S.?

Absolutely not.

Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Ever noticed that when they are the ones leaving you are the one that's pursuing them more, loving them more because you're realizing the loss and acting all insecure?

She's been distant for years, hence I pursued and became "emotionally abusive" and must have caused our M problems.

IHCLACS - I agree with so much of your post. It is beyond frustrating. It is maddening. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and theories.
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For Newcomers
2 hours ago
Uni. Here's a possible reverse scenario of looking at it. What if W wants to talk, and is concerned with distance because she notices the behavorial change, and she wants to assess if she still has you on the hook or not? Remember they need to justify THEIR BD ACTIONS AND THEIR WAFFLING FEELINGS TO THEMSELVES that they are making the right choice to leave. Guess who they seek out to justify those feelings? MC. Divorced people, like minded people, affair partners, people who write books empowerment stuff having to do with divorce. They will seek all means to justify their feelings and behaviors with validation.

I'm just saying all my R talks, all my hopes, all my worry and discussion efforts in the last 7 months did was what everyone here said it would do. It cemented their feelings, thoughts and positions. It justified it. I've heard it from the horse's mouth, believe me.

They are F@$#ING CRAZY Uni. Even the good ones... Don't entertain crazy, don't take full ownership for someone else's crazy. Ever. Own up to your mistskes once and only once, and change them for you. Your words to them doesn't mean anything, and don't accept anything less from them then "I want to work on the M, can we work this out" from her. Don't entertain breadcrumbs, half a$$ commitments, temp checks, etc. I know the silence and distance is killing you, and you feel you are making things worse. Truth is its going to have to probably get way worse to get better...Give her so much space that she has to fear losing you, and you no longer fear losing her. Silently work on you for you. If she comes to you to tell check, just validate. If you were dating her for a week, would you put up with this B.S.?

Its like this..... They get these nagging feelings that something is wrong with the relationship months if not years before BD. They can't put a justified reason to the feelings, so they take our flaws, and some of our issues within the R and start making up $hit in their heads to justify the feelings to turn cold, drop ILYBIANILYYA, say I need space, I need to find myself, you're emotionally abusive, you don't wear the right clothes, you are too apathetic, you don't pay enough atention to me, you don't help enough around the house...Yadayadayada..etc... To justify to themselves enough to muster up to leave, and that they are better off without you. They start imagining a life without you, and it starts to look more attractive to them for whatever reason. More money, more security, more freedom, another romantic interest in EA PA..Its better off for the kids that I'm happy, etc..((Insert your reason here.)

At this time, They are probably not going to take barely any ownership of failures that they contributed to the downfall of the M, re-write M history, and place all the blame on you on why they are feeling this way. They will say, I am reacting this way as a result of your previous behaviors. They have been silently sitting on these feelings for months, if not years, out of fear that if they are going to announce something this drastic, that they are done, then they want to be and feel validated and sure of themselves by other people's validation, because they don't trust their own decisions and feelings. So what and whom they seek, does nothing but reenforces this. Hence why they say in the beginning, "I'm confused I need space" and they start hanging around MC individually, and divorced people. They may not be happy with themselves and their life and how it turned out. They may not be happy with you. They don't know the real reason why they aren't happy. So they have to assign meaning and validity to it. All I know is that they want to flee, and they want change. They're feelings is what drew them into you, and is now what is drawing them away from you. There's an old saying that the one who loves to least controls the relationship. So your mission is twofold you have to become so attractive to her that you attract her back that you are a better option than leaving. You have to love her even less then she loves you, and love yourself even more to regain your strength to work on you. Let her go. You need yourself and your well being more than you need her. I could be right? I could be wrong in my theories.

I find it ironically amusing that they are comparative with our behavioral assessments. But I've been watching there's too and I see a pattern. Try this as an experiment. I want you to look at a picture of you and your W from early on in the R. I'm willing to bet that's some of these earlier pictures contain her putting her arm around you in the picture, smiling happy. It's almost as if when you look at the picture, they are saying " Hey everyone look what I caught, and look what I have, I've got my man!" Now I want you to look at a picture of the two if you, that's closest to BD. I'm willing to bet that picture expresses something along the lines of " I am unhappy and I don't know why and I can't wait to get away from him.". Something else I forgot to mention ever notice that they're the ones in the beginning of our relationship to pursue you more, love you more try harder to appease you excetera. And you are just like hey this is great but are indifferent to it. Ever noticed that when they are the ones leaving you are the one that's pursuing them more, loving them more because you're realizing the loss and acting all insecure?

Again these are just theories of mine, you can take them or leave them.

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For Newcomers
4 hours ago
I am taking better care of myself, since bd I have lost 50llbs believe me this wasn't intentional, my body was so full of adrenaline I just didn't eat. I am doing yoga and running and every month I treat myself to a massage and facial. I have found a new counsellor who specialise in SBT and hopefully with this forum and the counselling guidance will be in ambudance.

Earlier this year I moved h from the mbr when he return from a trip with the ow. That didn't go well, as I was in the spare room, but I am the one working on my m, so I moved back and h out. H has now moved out completely and this is easier to control my emotions, it was needed h has dropped out of life completely. H lives on his phone 24/7 , he ignored the kids and me when we where talking, h was so disrespectful a complete change from the h he was.
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For Newcomers
7 hours ago
One question that I find difficult to understand. Many posts I read indicated that they either reach acceptance within 1 year of BD or else it increases to 2-5 years. On the other hand, there are posts that say it is a marathon and 1 year is too less. Can someone help shed some light on understanding this?

Is there a way to recognize her moving closer to acceptance based on changes? Do any of these indicate anything?
If she did not respect me earlier but is showing more respect now.
If her blaming me for everything has stopped or reduced
If she starts talking about the good in the marriage instead of rewriting history as bad
If she compliments me on looking better since the BD
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For Newcomers
8 hours ago
Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Are you currently 50/50 parenting? If not, how often are you currently parenting?

Also, this apartment isnt big enough to be anything other than temporary. I need another bedroom for anything more permanent.
20 183 Read More
Midlife Crisis
10 hours ago

I just caught up and do hope things are better today

I know those sleepless and sad days

One thing I reacted to

Your comment

Is this it? Is this all there is to my life?

You have no idea how many times I have asked this question in the past 3 years

It is a cry of despair and frustration and self pity

It is real and I get it

But you and so many others have taught me

That no, there is more than this mess

Some days it doesnít seem like it

But yes there is more

Maybe it is the sunrise

Or a kind word from a stranger

Or a hug from your son

Or the joy your animals bring you

50 1,593 Read More
Surviving the Big D
11 hours ago
Thanks guys......i will never say the words again unless she does. Hopefully the flowers and the little card that say Happy Birthday Love J9 doesn't put her over the edge. She is acting normal so me saying it must not have impacted her too much.
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For Newcomers
11 hours ago
Today is Tattoo Tuesday.... it looks like I don't get to see it. LOL!!!!!
I thought she'd be showing it off as soon as came thru the door..... NOPE!!!

That's ok.... she can keep it her "secret". Whatever she needs to work on herself.
I know it's there, she's in a great mood.... even played with the parrots for a min.

What a crazy experience.

80 1,214 Read More
For Newcomers
11 hours ago

I'm new too, so I'm not an expert by any mean..... but give that woman space, as much as possible.
It's super difficult but it has to be done.

My MLC'er and I live together too, and it's really hard with roles (cooking, cleaning, how much to say to one another).
I'm sure you're doing your best, but really..... let her do her own thing and butt out of it. Be nice and supportive, don't cause conflict.

If she's having (or will have) an A, I suggest reading everything on Heart Blessing's site. 100% changed the way I look at all this, and the people here a super good.

I'm at the pre-sep or pre-D stage (won't know until she drops the bomb) so your're ahead of me in that respect.
Read Hearts Blessing's stuff and use the DB stuff. I think in combo that's the best thing. If you're going to stand, you're going to have to endure. Time to toughen up (easier said than done, I'm sure your mind and emotions are racing).

I'll keep an eye out for your posts and stick with ya. You need a friend (and I do too). smile

3 61 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 11:58 PM
Originally Posted by unchien
Originally Posted by IronWill
Yes. Have you tried meditation? That helps a lot too. Part of meditation is realizing that your emotions, your ego, and your thoughts are each separate parts of you. The physical body is also a part - which is often neglected. I never knew this until my R started disintegrating. It has helped greatly. I still struggle with the highs and lows but I'm evening out more. It has not been easy by I keep going.

I have not yet tried meditation, I need to jump on that. In the past the "monkey mind" has made meditation excruciating for me. Do you do silent meditation? How long per session or day?

Regarding physical body - I am severely sleep-deprived (due to the constant worry) and focusing on that first, before jumping into exercise. I've lost about 10 pounds in the last 6 weeks -- not healthy as I was fairly lean to begin with.

Also I've cut out alcohol almost entirely. It used to be relaxing to have a beer at night, but now I don't like the downer effect on my thought patterns.

Hey U -

I started doing an online guided meditation through an app that was recommended by my IC. Not sure if I can post the link here or not as it's not MWD related. But if you look it up you'll easily find it.

At around your point I was meditating two to four times per day for around 10-15 minutes.

Prior to that I had lost 25 pounds in a month. I had stopped sleeping more than 2 to 4 hours per night. I couldn't stop thinking about my situation. I had completely lost my center and was approachingthe bottom of the barrel. I dont even want to think about it that's how bad it was.

I'm so glad I found my way out. Eckhart Tolle has some amazing books about finding inner peace and living in the present. They were a life saver.

Currently I meditate for about 5 to 10 minutes once in the morning and once again at night. The meditation app has all kinds of options - music, time, silence, guided, etc.

I've reduced the amount of alcohol I drink too. I still like my beer, old military habits die hard, but its within acceptable range of 2-3 on a weekend day. None during the week.
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For Newcomers
Yesterday at 10:34 PM

I think your not taking into account that even if you move forward and end up in another relationship that doesn't mean you won't reconcile down the road.

YouTube Athol Kay "Grass is Greener"
36 541 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 10:25 PM
IH... Really great advice here. I think you are in a really crucial point in your R and what you do now is going to set the stage for what is to come. I think you can be there for your family but also find ways to GAL. You donít need to be out every night but try to aim for 2 to 3 nights at first. Just get out... give your W space... act as if... make her wonder a bit and be curious about who you are. At this point, she thinks she knows everything there is to know about you. I know you donít feel like being away from her right now which is exactly why you should be. Force yourself. Find ways to laugh again. Stop focusing on your W and what she is doing. It sounds to me like she has told you where she is at emotionally but hasnít fully checked out yet. She will if you continue to stay around the house and demonstrate your neediness. That is WAY TOO MUCH pressure. Take the pressure off. Show her, and yourself, that you will be just fine whether she chooses to stay or go. Human beings are complicated but also simple... we always want what we canít have...or think we canít. We also arenít too attracted to a ďsure thingĒ...especially a sure thing that will put up with our bad behaviour. That is where the loss of respect comes in.

Honestly... I forced myself for the longest time to GAL. I had a New Yearís party even though it was the last thing I felt like doing. I said ďyesĒ to every invitation I got to do something with someone else. I went to my staff party when I didnít want to go. I started exercising more...went on a vacation with my kids and my STBXH Hís mother. My STBXH had an OW and as soon as he admitted it to me, it made GAL that much easier. I had no choice. Also, once I knew for sure that my future is not going to include my STBXH, I decided to start dating. I went on seven first dates with really nice guys who did wonders for my self esteem and also addressed my secret fear that I would not ever be seen as attractive by anyone again. Now Iím dating someone exclusively who may not turn out to be Mr. Right but he has definitely added to my life and I am enjoying being affectionate with him and having that affection returned. That is something that was not happening with my STBXH who had basically been ignoring me for four years. I strongly believe in marriage, loyalty and commitment which is why I put up with him for so long. GAL and detaching enabled me to see, finally, that he is not that same kind of person and probably will never be.

Just do the best you can and focus on you and your kids right now. Let your W do what she needs to do and stop chasing after her. You will be glad you did no matter what the outcome. (((HUGS))) smile
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For Newcomers
Yesterday at 10:07 PM
Originally Posted by Ready2Change
Originally Posted by LB55
I need to get the D moving for my own sanity and health. Regardless of what she wants or does, I am going to get my ducks in a row and schedule the mediation and if needed set the trial date to get this over with. I discussed with my L my desires, and she is going to help me get the process moving. I don't need it to finish ASAP, but I can't sit in limbo because its driving me crazy. If I want the situation to improve, I've got to drive the bus now.
Sounds like a great plan.

Most LBH do not do things that gain them the respect they need that may re-attract their W. This will gain you respect.

You have done an amazing job at controlling your emotions and doing the right thing through out this.

Thanks R2C, I am able to control my emotions well, the thing I am not good at is letting them out when the time is appropriate. I eat them all and it makes me feel like crap. I have lots of conversations with myself in the truck where I yell at her and say the things that need to be said but don't need to be heard.

I am starting to see the disrespect in almost every communication she has with me, and while that boundary is going to result in a temporary reduction in communication, I'm hopeful that the quality of the communication will improve.
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For Newcomers
Yesterday at 09:31 PM
I just feel like with my w I need to pursue, I wonít by the advice on here. Itís so hard to imagine attracting someone without pursuing. When I think how I won my w back in college I had to pursue.

Of course you pursued her before you married her. That is a natural instinct for men. But once she loses respect in you as a man/husband.......everything changes.

I don't think your W is having a MLC. Some of her actions toward having more youthful appearances might cause you to think so, but the same can be said for a WW, too.

I think you M a very spoiled, self-centered, manipulative woman. You picked up where her parents left off and spoil her even more. And the entire time, you resented having to do all the work while your spoiled W wouldn't lift a hand. It seem no matter what you tried, she would not share in the responsibilities that come with having a home and raising children. She's not going to change with you as her H, b/c you can't understand & accept how she is......and she expects everyone to treat her like she's special. I mean, she has the audacity to ask aren't you going to clean the floors (or whatever)? This is the type of female that only a very Alpha male would know how to put her in her place, and she would NEVER try to pull that cr@p on him again. He would get that little spoiled brat straighten out the first time her sense of entitlement surfaced. There are two types men you'll find in this kind of MR. He'll either be a strong Alpha, or her victim.

You have a serious situation that I don't know if you are really aware, and I'm talking about the dynamic between you, your W and your daughter. Maybe your son, as well, but you just haven't written much about him. Here's the thing. Your daughter has some unusual attachment issues tied to her mother. And mother expects you to show up and take care of any discipline if she has a problem with daughter. So, guess who the bad guy is? Also, I think there are little things that happen you don't catch. Like when you saw daughter whisper something to your W, and the W says little D is worried you will use her drinking and use it to take the kids away. That sounded very staged, IMHO. I think your W sets you up, and you don't see through it.

The night she started throwing her tantrum and overturning tables.....acting like Real Housewives of NJ, is when you might have prevented future violent behavior, by keeping the evidence for the authorities. She knew the second she saw you grab your phone that she had messed up big time. But as always, you were busy going back & forth between child and wife, trying to calm everyone down. I think the biggest problem for you is that you desperately want to believe your W will respond like a normal, loving, rationally-minded wife. Maybe you have lived in denial all these years, while she steadily grew worse. She is very manipulative, and I wouldn't be surprised if she had a lot to do with your D's problem.........and especially, in how your D feels toward you. I think there is much more that you haven't shared, which is understandable. ((hugs)) Frankly, considering how easily your W comes unhinged, I would be concerned about how it affects, and will continue to affect, the kids.

Actually, once the D is final, I think your W will depend on you to keep the kids most of the time. She just has to save face with her friends, currently, and later she will make up some defense for why they are with their dad most of time. Once you are really out of the house for good, and she can't manipulate you to do or pay for the work that needs to get done around there......and the kids refuse to help......she'll start turning on them. But first, she'll get you to handle any problems she has with the kids......just as you've done in the past.

So, my advice about your sitch is to forget about working on the MR. Don't move back into the house. Do whatever necessary to protect your finances. Get whatever professional help your children need. Let go of the emotional rope you have tied to your W, b/c she will manipulate for the rest of your days if you don't get wise to her ways. You should be so lucky if she has nothing more to do with you!

Sorry if my words are painful. I have read the many posts to you from others, and it's been hard for you to follow their advice. You have a lot of fear, but I don't think you are being totally honest (maybe with yourself) about the reasons behind the fear (except maybe the child support). Like I said, maybe you are in denial about some things concerning your W. You seem like a good and decent person. It angers me to see decent human beings hurt by spoiled, manipulative people who only think about what benefits them.

My grandmother use to tell me, "Beauty is as beauty does". I encourage you to consider a woman's attitude and actions as much as her outward attractiveness.
67 1,087 Read More
Midlife Crisis
Yesterday at 09:24 PM
Originally Posted by DnJ
Hello Ben

Originally Posted by BenB
Last week her sister visited us and we started talking about our situation. Her sister asked and my wife had no problems talking about it. To my surprise, she knows a lot about MLC now. She seems to have googled information and says she thinks this is MLC but she doesnīt know how to stop it. Is that normal?


Hmmm. What is normal?

I am surprised as well that your W has googled and found MLC, and thinks she is going through it. That is not the typical running that most MLCers exhibit.

If you recall:

Originally Posted by DnJ
To me it doesnít look like, or feel like, a full blown midlife crisis. She is in some form of emotional turmoil, but far short of the inescapable irrationally driving need to destroy her life to get away. Well, at the moment.

Age 34 is rather young to have the pressure of mortality and life pressing down upon one to the breaking point. It is not unheard of to happen so young, just rare. Perhaps a more quarter life crisis is at play. This is more of a transition from 30ís to 40ís, the entering of oneís midlife.

No doubt your wife is having some second thoughts, feelings, desires, and such. The ďhaving a babyĒ, the growing up required to face that, could stir up suppressed feelings and past unresolved events; which she needs to face and work through.

I do hope she is suffering more a transition than a crisis. However, that is beyond your control. Either of those paths are herís and she requires the space and time to travel them. It is possible she is just entering the starting of MLC, the stage that we usually donít see, the triggering part of all this.

Is she just in emotional turmoil?

Is she still pre bomb drop? And the true MLC is coming?

Or something else?

Ben, time will tell.

Letís look at this by exploring an answer to your question.

Originally Posted by BenB
We have the next MC 5 days from now. They also have a weekend therapy session where we would need to travel to another city. Would it be bad if I suggested trying that? Not sure how she would respond to it. There wouldnīt be any other couples there, just us. And thereīs not much difference. Just longer sessions over 2 days instead of just 90 minutes a week.

You have only been at this DB for a few weeks. On Feb 23, you asked her and she told you about how she was feeling confused - a mini bomb drop.

Mid April you stumbled upon MLC and started wondering about this. May 5 was your first posting.

MC seems to be something she looks forward to. It seems to be helping, or she is just hiding her plans. For what itís worth I think she is getting value out of the MC.

Would it be bad if you suggested a weekend therapy session?

It would be best if she suggested it.

However, a few observations to consider.

She is in some obvious emotional turmoil. She sees herself in MLC - that is a very big thing. Might not be a ďtrueĒ full blown MLC - but it could be in her perception. So the very least she is having some emotional distress and she knows about it.

She needs time and space - not couples therapy. She needs therapy for herself. That doesnít mean professional, I just mean self reflection, confiding, discussing, etc... That probably is not with you. An actual IC would be a good thing, if she wants to go. Again, no pressure.

You have been giving her time and space. She is showing positive signs. Do not get your expectations up, keep them at zero. Realize you may be overlooking some negative signs.

Her positive signs are encouraging. I know you two are living more like room mates right now, thatís ok. Her progress is small and in a good direction, so keep doing what you are doing.

These weekend sessions happen frequently, I am guessing on that but pretty sure. So, you need not push for this weekend or even the next. You have lots of time. This is not going to resolve quickly, do not push it. Let her set the pace.

Ben, to me, she is looking to see if you will accept her and what she is going through. She confided about MLC. She still watches TV with you, laughs, enjoys your company and humour. She is emotional confused and needs to figure it out. And wants to figure it out, that is really good.

Originally Posted by BenB
She has mentioned to the therapist a few times that she wants to get out of this bubble and was hoping that by moving out, she might have a reality check and experience how it is to live alone.

I have an employee who became distant, angry, lost, and scared - he is a confident big guy so this was really strange for him and me.

Only a few months ago, he came to me, and confided about the problems he was having. Him and his wife had their first child 8 months ago. He was so panicked about this new life he was responsible for. Everything started unraveling for him...everything. Stories about his past, about a fire, about demons and family events from his youth - it was such a thing to witness. He knew something was wrong, he knew he wanted it to be different, he just didnít know how. His solutions were becoming rather singular and involved him not being able to live like this, moving out was an idea. We talked a lot, he listened, and he got help in the form of IC. He had lost all confidence at work and at home; he had to go off work for six weeks, then back on light duties. He is back fully now and much better.

Your wife is looking for trust, understanding, and compassion. She hasnít spun completely off the rails. She might, but at this moment she hasnít. She needs and wants to figure herself out. She is walking her path. Keep supporting her.

Like my employee, your W might not need to follow through with her ideas of moving out if she can sort things out while at home.

So, would it be bad if you suggested weekend therapy?

Maybe, I donít think she is ready for that yet. Focus on you. Let her set the pace she is comfortable with.

Ben, she is confused and still finding herself and not committed to the M. Therefore she is not fully in the M. That is how you need to approach this, and you are doing well. Continue to GAL, be a little mysterious, be friendly, talk, and accept being roommates for now.

Remember before you were married - dating. Her asking you to go to a movie (yesterday). That is a good thing. Go have fun with her. Go have fun without her.

Focus on you. Give this some time and see what happens.


Thank you DnJ,

My W and I had IC with our MC a few days ago. She went in first and after that it was my turn. During my session I told the therpaist that my emotions are up and down but not as much as before. And that I still wonder about her deleting our wedding photos on Instagram, or archiving to use the correct word. This makes me wonder if there has been any communication with other men either via instagram DM or Facebook messenger. I explain to him how Iīve been trying to detach and not think about that as I will never know but the thoughts pop back up in my head every now and then. Also, as far as my W can tell, I havenīt reached out to her at all for a while now. No conversations initiated, no hugs, nothing.

But he now suggest that on our next MC session together, I should ask her what is on my mind. So basically, why did she delete our photos and has she had any commincation online with other men. This goes against everything I have learned since I came to this forum so I donīt feel comfortable doing that but he says he will set it up so that I can ask the question in a good way. Iīm really unsure about that as that would be the first time she would see any sign of jealousy from me. My W does not see me as a jealous person.

What are you thoughts on that? Next session is on Thursday evening.
29 487 Read More
Midlife Crisis
Yesterday at 08:35 PM

I read what you wrote to Gordie on his thread. It really got me thinking. You have changed so much since you first started posting (at least in regards to your relationship with H, but I believe it to be more than that). So much that it got me thinking about myself and I realize how much I have changed too. How you described your feelings for H summed up really well how I've been feeling about W. I don't feel like I love her anymore. Or, actually, I know I loved her and the person she was. She has not been that person for some time and I do not love who she is now. I don't hate her, but I don't love her either. I feel like I may still have love for her bottled up somewhere deep within myself, but it isn't really for HER, its for who she was, and maybe who she could become in the future.

I really wish you had not been living with H for the last 6 years. In the beginning I did not want W to move and it was very difficult on me when she did. But, in retrospect, I do not feel like my healing/detaching really began until she moved out. In a manner, her moving out might have saved me from hating her in the long run. I think that had she been living at home treating me bad for the last year that I might have ended up hating and resenting her eventually. Currently, I just don't think I love her anymore. I hope you are able to live away from H soon.

I hope you are doing well today! Thinking of you!!

52 1,070 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 07:15 PM
I hear you Halzy. It's easy for me to give that kind of advice but yet follow it myself, because my personality and responses are an open book and I typically don't think them through before saying things sometimes. I'm getting better and selective at what I say with ambiguity and reveal. Early on in my sich, mybw wanted to set the agreements of Separation so that we wouldn't date anyone. I saw this as controlling. I said to her that you are the one that's walking away you don't get to make the terms of engagement or the rules any longer. So we both agreed that as long as it doesn't involve our son whatever we do is our personal business. I haven't dated but I will admit I'm very tempted to, just for explicitly the social aspect of it, since I can't always keep going out alone and my friends are typically busy. I would like to join more personal interest groups but time doesn't permit me to do so because of work and travel and custody schedule with son. But yeah if you want to have some fun go out there and do it man, even if only for a confidence boost. Just don't cross any ethical boundaries, if you do and you get caught that can be used against you in court depending on your state and whether it's a no-fault divorce state or not.
67 1,219 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by Living
Know this...this stuff takes time. That was a tough pill to swallow for an impatient person like myself. However there is no way to rush it. Try to take things one day at a time. Youíre going to fall, dust yourself off and get back up. Youíre going to make mistakes, be kind to yourself.

I think Iíve broke all the DB rules at least once. Lol! I can totally admit it. However what I will tell you is DB techniques really do work.

This isnít an easy road to walk. However, we must have faith that we will come out of this stronger than we were when we started this journey.

Please know that I still slip up. There are times when I still let my H upset me. Iím better at controlling the need to react. Iím learning that not every action deserves a reaction....Take time for yourself. Self-care is essential during this journey. And again, just know healing takes time. This too shall pass.

Sending you encouragement and love. Youíve got this, just keep the faith!
18 550 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 06:33 PM
Originally Posted by AnotherStander
Originally Posted by Gekko
That's the trick AS - where to draw the battle line.

She has also proposed we just do a temporary schedule for now so I can move out of the house. I'm not too keen on a temporary deal but I really do want out and into my own space....

It's really up to you but I will say that this happened to me: in the 11th hour when the D was ready to file my XW suddenly hit me with additional unexpected expenses in the D settlement. I think it was something like 15k, so not a small amount. I asked her via text, very politely, if we could sit down and discuss these added items because I didn't understand her description. And believe me that is putting it mildly, what she sent me was absolute gibberish, it was incomprehensible. What I got in response was surprising, it was a fuming rant that I needed to lawyer up and we would let the lawyers fight it out in court, and "believe me, I will tell them everything and you will come out on the losing end". I literally had no idea what she meant by "tell them everything", her response just stunned me. All the D negotiations had been quite peaceful up to that point, and here she was suddenly turning into the wicked witch of the west.

Anyway I felt all the depression and anxiety that I had finally put behind me starting to creep in again, and the thought of a prolonged court battle and possible slip back into depression really had me concerned. 15k wasn't worth some possibly very serious health issues to me, especially at a time when I was in a very fragile recovery. So I finally replied back "I simply wanted you to explain where you came up with these amounts as I didn't understand your description, but if you feel this is fair then I will trust you and sign off on it." And I did, and I don't regret it one bit because it was all over, signed, filed and done shortly after.

Divorce is compromise and usually neither part walks away thinking they "won". Try to negotiate a settlement you can live with, even if it's not the one you would have preferred.

I literally had the same thing happen. EXWW was threatening to tell the judges "everything". I had already spoke with several L's. I was doing nothing to worry about. I simply responded to her telling her that she isnt going to bully me.

I had to repeat that recently when she started demanding I owe her thousands of dollars in household expenses.

That reminds me, I need to call the court to see if they added the child support to the divorce or if there isnt any expectation of child support.
71 1,518 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 06:04 PM
Originally Posted by SoloUk
Living, I was recommended to read your sich by ready2change.

I have read every post, every comment and over the last few hours, I have cried for you, and for myself.

You have been amazingly strong, even when you veered from the db path, but my God emotions are strong and powerful aren't they.

I am on this path and have so much to learn, to let go. You have been and still are an amazingly brilliant women, who is walking her own path with her head held high. Maybe one day I can be standing in your shoes.

Keep going forward, you deserve peace and light in your life x

SoloUk, thank you so much for the kind words. Iím glad that reading my thread is helping you. Sending you lots of hugs. Know this...this stuff takes time. That was a tough pill to swallow for an impatient person like myself. However there is no way to rush it. Try to take things one day at a time. Youíre going to fall, dust yourself off and get back up. Youíre going to make mistakes, be kind to yourself.

I think Iíve broke all the DB rules at least once. Lol! I can totally admit it. However what I will tell you is DB techniques really do work.

This isnít an easy road to walk. However, we most have faith that we will come out of this stronger than we were when we started this journey.

Please know that I still slip up. There are times when I still let my H upset me. Iím better at controlling the need to react. Iím learning that not every action deserves a reaction. One thing is for sure, Iím no longer trying to save my marriage. I still have a small ounce of hope that maybe things will workout but Iím done doing all the work. If my H decides he wants to leave, I wonít stand in his way. Heck I may even hold the door for him on his way out. Lol!

Take time for yourself. Self-care is essential during this journey. And again, just know healing takes time. This too shall pass.

Sending you encouragement and love. Youíve got this, just keep the faith!
51 1,283 Read More
For Newcomers
Yesterday at 05:46 PM
Hit a major birthday milestone today, signature line updated. Woke up to the kids bringing me a bag of hand painted crafts and magnets, t-shirt, and handmade card with stick images of the three of us. That put a smile on my face...and theirs, we were all excited. Gosh I love my kids.

No gifts or even a happy birthday wish from my W as of yet. I started thinking what I would want from her and these things came to mind: a long loving hug, a passionate kiss, sex, a commitment to end her affairs, desire to move home, agreement to attend Retrouvaille, an apology. Any of these would be appreciated. I accept that none of this is going to happen today. Iím okay with that and will continue DBing.

Iím planning to take the kids to a Japanese Steakhouse tonight with my parents. The kids will enjoy the hibachi show in front of them. Last night, S8 asked W if she wanted to go to dinner with us. He did this on his own. She said maybe. Her choice, Iím fine with it either way.

Iíve been keeping busy getting the house ready for my birthday party this week. Pool deck, lanai, and front walkway paver blocks are sealed with a nice wet look finish. Pressure washed the driveway. Assembled a new patio set last night for additional outdoor seating. Still need to give the inside of the house a thorough cleaning and mow the lawn. One of the baseball moms is coordinating and planning much of the party. Catered taco bar is on order from a local Mexican restaurant and Iíve fully stocked the drink reserves. Looking forward to the party with good friends that are very supportive of what Iím going through.

No real talk with W over the past few weeks. Primarily text messages only regarding the kids or horses. Sheís been running hot and cold towards me. We both attended D4ís pre-k graduation show last week and W asked if I could stay a little longer in the classroom after the show. I did and our daughter appreciated it. I also texted her that I had decided that Iím taking the kids to California for a week and a half next month. I did not offer for her to join us. She replied she needed to think about that. I followed up a few days later and she said that was fine to take the kids on the trip. She also asked that we switch weekends with the kids so she could align with the weekends divorced BFF has her kids. I replied that is fine. W also regularly sends face emojis in her texts to me to express her feelings. Not reading anything into it as she probably does that with everyone. Two nights ago, W took the kids to divorced BFFís place and they stayed there late on a school night. I always expect some spew from my W after she has been BFF. As such, last night, S8 had his first baseball all star practice, which I am coaching, and W offered to watch our D4. I replied that wasnít necessary and that D4 can stay with me at practice. W replied ďwhateverĒ, I did not respond. Later in the evening she sends me a text apologizing as she keeps forgetting to bring a tool back to the house that I requested last week.

Iím trying to keep my focus and thoughts off of her and just live my life the way I want to while making the most of my time with kids. The mindset and actions continue to be leave her alone.

I need to get busy planning the detailed itinerary for the California trip with my kids. I want to make sure they have the time of their lives!!
79 1,222 Read More
Midlife Crisis
Yesterday at 05:11 PM

In short I still love w because I choose to do so

I still choose her

I believe in the vows and for better for worse

And in our humanity and inhumanity

We hurt each other

The old m is dead

A lot of stuff has happened

Idealism has given way to realism

We are different people

Can we make it through this reconnection phase

One day at a time I believe that we can

But it will take more time

I am happier than I have been in a long time

I can now look back with some distance at the damage done

Itís still there in the rear view mirror

But itís really hard to move forward while looking back

This is not sweeping things under the rug

It is an acknowledgment of where we are today

I have dealt with the past within myself

And I hope some day we can also address it together

But I am at peace that today is not that day
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