Working on me and letting it play out

[Accuray]

cbtdad, I completely understand your frustration. Being in a relationship with no sex or physical affection is torture and breeds resentment. That resentment can seep into your life in ways you didn't anticipate.

MWD sent out a marketing e-mail today that included the following:

"You've been fighting to make your marriage work. Be proud of yourself for your commitment to restoring the love in your relationship.

In the end, you can only do what you can do. Eventually, your spouse needs to get on board with your marriage-saving plan. You just have to make sure you've left no stone unturned."

While LBS's are always impatient, and there is a great tendency to want to be rewarded for our positive changes as soon as we make them, there is a reciprocal danger of being too patient and accepting too much.

It is not reasonable to expect you to stay in a sexless marriage. You may want to discuss with your IC how long you will tolerate that in your relationship. Have a timeline. When that timeline elapses you can always decide to extend it. If everything else is going well between you, perhaps its a subject to bring up in MC. It's never fun to rock the boat, or to invite difficulty when so much difficulty has found you all on its own.

My ex was low-desire in our marriage. She really had a non-existent sex drive of her own. If your drive is mismatched it creates all kinds of bad dynamics between you.

At some point I think you'll need to establish that a sexless marriage is not acceptable, and that your marriage needs to be a higher priority than "no priority" on her landscape.

Acc

[Coconut]

Might I suggest the result may be more fun if you hump the counselor's leg instead of your W's.

cbt, I don't think your W's focus is all that different, even now while piecing, it is obvious that the priority in my W's life is the fire academy. It has really put me in a pretty crappy mood since our MC last night.

I'm just letting these emotions work there way through me, cause I wouldn't know what to say if I was to say something, or even what response I would hope to get.. so I will suck it up, and continue worrying about me until I'm ready decide if I'm done..

[Surfer]

Hilarious Doodler. Just don't take cock you leg on the obligatory Yukka plant in the corner. That would be taking the pi55!

[Surfer]

Cbt

One thing that helped me in MC was saying little. The MC usually spends time talking to the person with issues the most. It was '95% WAW time' at our sessions. I found this a comfort it felt like the MC was helping me to win her back and I could simply listen. It also made me realise I was not the problem in the way she was trying to make out/gas light. That stopped me getting wound up when she was machine gunning me too with 'he never, he always' type stuff.

Don't forget to focus and don't vilify your spouse. She is a person that has suffered because she has legitimate needs that have not been met (in her mind at very least) and has felt very alone. Perhaps even think of her as a child and being scared that can help to stop your blood boiling too. Good luck - you'll knock it out of the park.

[cbtdad]

First off Doodler I was laughing so out loud big time. I needed that. Thank you

Ok. I appreciate all the responses. MC is in a couple of hours. So let me say the things that I am feeling. Acc you hit a lot of it on the head as usual. I've put timelines on things. Everything has been going very well except for the physical touch arena. My LL is physical touch. So I don't feel like I'm getting any attention at all. Hers is Acts of service. I have stepped up big time in that area. So therefore I am feeling like I am being the husband she wants, but I don't feel like I have a wife at all. I feel like a friend, a roommate. I have been helping her a lot. I have been paying for us to workout together still, bills, dinner, cooking, and pretty much everything else that is involved in a happy marriage. Except that I am not getting what I need in return. I was going to give this route until mid july. That is when she is done with her first round of classes. So my timeline was basically going to be through July.
But after last night hearing her say that she only cares about S and school for the next year has me pondering that. I am beginning to feel as if I'm her "leg up" or plan B
That she wants to hold me here till she is done with that.
I know that is mind reading, but that's what I am feeling.
The other thing you mentioned was her sex drive. You mentioned her how it can cause a lot of problems. And it certainly has. In the past couple months I think she has been masturbating a lot more. It makes me wonder if she is doing this as an escape or does she have an increased drive from someone else. That is starting to creep in my head again.
I know when I snooped back in May that there was nothing. If there was she was hiding it extremely well and not telling her very best friends. Which would surprise me big time if she didn't share with at least one of them
I can't control that though. If there was then I would be done for sure.
I guess what I am wondering is should I bring this stuff up during MC right now or wait till she is done with class and see how it is next month. I don't want to feel like I am pushing. That would be more of the same

[Accuray]

I wouldn't bring it up tonight, and I would probably discuss it with your IC or a DB coach first. As an LBS, as you know, you *do* have to put in a lot of one-sided effort for a long time. The important thing is to make sure that "long time" is not forever.

The challenge with bringing it up is that if she is physical with you only out of a sense of obligation, you'll know that and it won't be enough. You'll want her to *want* to be with you, and that's not something she can control.

Reinvigorating your sex life is something she needs to decide she wants to do, and getting there requires starting slowly with some building up to it. It's all about her mindset however. If she's not committed to it thinking that it's the best thing for both of you, you'll know and you won't be satisfied.

I would discuss with the IC first.

Acc

[cbtdad]

Just got done with session
It did come up
Wasn't awful
I will post more when able

[Coconut]

Reinvigorating your sex life is something she needs to decide she wants to do, and getting there requires starting slowly with some building up to it. It's all about her mindset however. If she's not committed to it thinking that it's the best thing for both of you, you'll know and you won't be satisfied.

Acc

Just wanted to give my 2 cents on this, since I just went through it in the last two weeks. I asked my W where she was emotionally 2 or 3 times as far as being intimate (although we where touching non sexually at the time, which is further along than u are right now). She didn't get upset about me asking, but really couldn't answer, she could only say that she's getting closer (but who really knows how long it takes).

Anyway, about a week went by after the last conversation about it, and I started upping my game, rubbing a little more and did what I knew would turn her on physically and we had physical intamicy without the emotional attachment. I knew the emotional wasn't there and it did concern me a little afterwards, but I was satisfied (PT my LL as well). I then preceded to repeat that initiation for the next four days, my W nvr gave any negative feedback afterwards, and although I knew the emotional still wasn't there for her, I made sure the physical pleasure was, and we both enjoyed it and I was very satisfied. I did make inside jokes about it, sent funny memes about morning sex, etc., trying to make it lighthearted.

Anyway, I stopped initiating and went back to non sexual touching for the last 4 days, because I don't want her to feel pressured into satisfying my needs, but those few days filled my cup and allow me to try and fill her needs without torturing myself. I think it's good we got the awkward first time out of the way, and if I can hold out until she's emotionally ready I think it will be mind blowing next time.

CBT, have you discussed moving back into the MBR, or is that not something your ready for yet? Have you tried initiating non-sexual touching to see how she responds? I find a back rub while watching tv in the bedroom was very well received when I first attempted.

[cbtdad]

So MC session was more of the same. I did a lot of talking. W did a lot of facial expressions and listening. This is how it is with my W. It's very hard to get
Information out of her. Our MC knows this but actually does a very good job extracting things and speaking her "sarcasm"
Surfer, I meant to reply earlier and tell you this
I try hard to sit back and let her do all he talking, but that just doesn't happen with her
So anyways when MC asked W how the relationship was going she said that's she has no complaints. That she has a lot on her plate and that I haven't made it any more stressful which is a big improvement.
Finally W admitted that we are really working more on being partners and not really having a "relationship"
Which is funny because that's what I was about to bring up.
She said that she thinks this next year is really good for us so that I can focus on me and that she can focus on school and then we could see where we are
Acc, I saw your post after the session otherwise I wouldn't have even brought up the things I was thinking about. They did come out when discussing where I thought things were. I said it's really tough feeling like I'm being a husband to my W but that I don't feel like I'm in a relationship.
I discussed my concerns for the future, etc
I said that other than PT that I am extremely happy with everything else
W got kind of agitated at that. She said at one moment in the beginning of the session that I said how good things were and that I see progress, etc
But now I'm saying if I don't get that one tiny thing this won't work, etc
I hate that she sees it as a "small thing" I explained to her that pt is my love language and she knows that. So it's not a small thing to me.
She said she sees a lot of progress and that's why she is in MC.
Acc, I really think more than anything it's just gonna take more time than I thought just like Sandi talks about. I'm just going to have to take it week by week and go from there depending on how I feel I can last. I know I can't last in a sexless marriage forever. I think my next assessment will be at the end of July and I will talk with my IC about that
Cnut, I appreciate your post my friend.
Yes, we are still in separate rooms. PT is tough for my wife. She doesn't like massages, back rubs, holding hands, etc
Yes of course in beginning when she was courting me and the limerance was in full force then she was good with all that.
We haven't discussed me moving back in. I'm not sure I'm ready to
That is probably something I will shoot for at the end of July
I know my W has a lot of individual work to do for this to work as well
For now I will continue to do my part

[cbtdad]

W and I had a good night last night
Just hanging out and having some wine and listening to music on the back deck.
I really let her talk about school and her world a lot while I just listened
After MC session yesterday I really told myself just to dig in and see what happens
This morning we were working out together and I noticed she hasn't shaved her legs in a while
Oddly it was kind of comforting seeing that
My reasoning is that if she was having some hot and heavy affair I would assume that she would be shaving her legs. Not sure if that's weird that I'm thinking that

I guess it's comforting because honestly if there was an OM then I would be done
That's my boundary at the moment
Pretty simple