I'm not afraid to take a stand.......

[Whiterose]

Well, time for a new thread and it seems the game is not working like H had hoped

One
www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2368775#Post2368775
Two
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2377072&page=1
Three
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2383250&page=1
Four
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2395511&page=1
Five
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2404858&page=1
Six
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2405224#Post2405224

I have a suggestion. Job, would you be comfortable role-playing here for WR? It seems that WR is feeling out of sorts here and very nervous about her encounter with H. My thought is for me to act like H and you act like WR, Job. This way, WR will feel a bit more than ready for her face-to-face encounter with H.

Thoughts, Job?

Thank you Wonka. You'd be reading me correctly. I have it sat down with this man in 7months. It's nerve wracking

I don't actually recommend a face-to-face without a mediator present. Usually the WAS will try to bully the LBS into something that is not in their favor.

Better perhaps to say let's keep this to email, and tell him you will send him your proposal tomorrow (or whenever you will have had time to run it by your attorney).

Consider also the possibility that he's pissed off his attorney (or not paid him) and that's why you haven't heard?

Thank you KML. I will let my lawyer know what he's up to and see what her suggestions about talking to him are. I do feel like it's a conflict for her though, she doesn't get paid if I don't use her, so I'm expecting some scare tactics too.

Wait for his message and if he says to meet him somewhere. Ask him what time and where. I would arrive early so that you can get a good seat near the exit.

I think you should listen to what he has to say. You can try negotiating, but remember...he's looking out for his best interests and not the best interests of you and your sons. This why he's wanting to do this outside of the court...he doesn't want to have to spend his money on court fees nor be "forced" into paying child support at a certain time, nor be ordered to pay delinquent child support that is owed to you for your sons.

Once the discussion comes to an end, advise him that you need to think about what has be discussed and you'll get back to him. You see, I have seen this type of thing go down many times and it doesn't always end well. Why? Because you can't trust the MLCer. Today, he's willing to tell you what you want to hear and tomorrow he'll swear that is not what he said or agreed to. It's he said, she said conversation and if you don't have someone there as a witness to the conversation, then you have no proof that he agreed to anything you negotiated. Do you see where I'm going w/this? You would need to have a document typed up with your negotiated items/terms and the both of you would need to have it signed and notarized because I do not trust this man one bit. If he's not in agreement with having the document types, signed and notarized so that you can give it to lawyers, then the negotiation would be off the table...but you need to keep your lawyer in the loop and see what she advises you what to do. Do not agree or finalize any negotiations w/o her input. Okay?

No, you don't need to vomit! You can do this. You just have to keep your anger and emotions in check. You have to be on your toes and two steps ahead of him.

Ok I'll wait for him to message me again and ask where and when.

Any possibility with Christmas coming he's feeling me out? Seeing how Ill "be" when we get together? On Sunday I posted a status to fb to the effect of it was a great day and I was rather enjoying doing what I wanted when I wanted Wonder if he sAw it and it made him angry.

Note to self....no vomit allowed:)

[Whiterose]

WR,
You do realize that you hold the key to setting him completely free? You have want he wants most...a divorce. If you don't feel comfortable in meeting him, then don't do it. No one can make you do this, not even your h.

I would sit down and make a list of what you feel needs to be discussed. Do not meet him w/o your list in case he asks you what your thoughts are. The list will help you stay focused and also remind you of what you want to discuss. Here are a few things that I would be concerned about:

1. Back payment of child support would need to be paid by December 30, 2013.
2. Reimbursement check or a check in the amount of $$$$ needs to be provided to me by December 20, 2013. This particular reimbursement check was not his to spend. This should have been returned to you a month or so ago. So no slacking on a time frame for reimbursement here.
3. Scheduled child support would begin January 1, 2013 and the payments will be on time or you can have his wages garnished and the check deposited to your account. You can let him think about this one.
4. Visitation w/the boys will be scheduled at least three days prior to doing so (you can negotiate the time on this one).
5. Visits at the home will be done when I am at home. There will be no unscheduled visits to the home.
6. No more discussions w/your older son about the divorce or expenses, etc.
7. All of your personal belongings need to be picked up by December 30, 2013.
8 Provide a list of items in the home that you want. (These can be negotiated). Advise him that once you have accommodated him on these items, there will no coming back and requesting additional items.

You can continue the list of talking points. I think I've tried to cover most of your concerns in the list, but I'm sure you'll have others.

I'll work on a list. And that way when he messages me again I'll be ready if he wants to do it sooner rather than later.

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU EVERYONE
Was not expecting this this morning and it through me for a loop

[job]

Here's what I just posted on your other thread:

No, I don't think Christmas and your FB page have anything to do w/this. I think his attorney has gotten in touch w/him and has advised him that he's in hot water over the child support, etc.

Just remember, your lawyer is there to protect you and help you get what you need. I don't like the idea of him wanting to sit down w/you at this late date to try to negotiate a settlement. It makes me very uneasy. But you have to be the one to decide what you want to do...but always keep in mind, they don't play fair and when it comes to money and their freedom, they'll do anything or say anything to get what they want. Look at wishing,hoping is going through. If your gut says don't do it, then don't. Your gut will never lie to you.

[Wonka]

I'm gonna play the nasty H in this process so you can be prepared, if you do elect to proceed with the meeting.


WR, I want this whole thing F-ing done and you're holding this up! You need to understand that I pushed for court because you can't be responsible.

I cannot afford to keep paying a lawyer. I feel that you're dragging this all out. Let's get this all done and over with today/tonight.

The fair value of the house is $000,000. I want the house to be put on sale as soon as possible. What's holding you up?

You f-ing got the kids involved in the house stuff! It is dead wrong and it shows that you're not a good mother!

I want the china cabinet, socks, shirts, my tool set, etc. etc. I want them by tomorrow!

I've been trying to get information from S19 and S14...and I feel that you are interfering with them! They must respond back to me. How hard is that?

Now...about that Christmas list. Are you going to tell me or will you be uncooperative as usual?

I've been supporting you and sons all of my life. Enough is enough! I will only pay so much in child support. It is my money too and you're not getting any of it!

Court and lawyers are up to no good and too time consuming. Can't we do this ourselves like adults?

[Wonka]

Here's another option you might want to pursue.

Call your lawyer tomorrow [or as soon as you can] and tell her that H has requested to meet with you to discuss the specifics. Ask your lawyer for her opinion on the meeting request. If she advises you not to do so without her present, then you'll inform H that you have been advised not to meet with him. This way, it will give you an out and this can be verified by H.

Ask your lawyer if the mediation route is something that can be explored instead of the court route. Discuss the pros and cons of both so you can decide on which way you want to proceed. In my case, I went to the mediation route.

[Whiterose]

I'm gonna play the nasty H in this process so you can be prepared, if you do elect to proceed with the meeting.

Wow Wonka. This is just......wow. I know I need to be prepared for this but I don't think someone can ever really be......

WR, I want this whole thing F-ing done and you're holding this up! You need to understand that I pushed for court because you can't be responsible.

So that I understand, h, you feel that court was your only option because I was too slow to respond to your requests. I'm sorry you feel that this was not moving along at a pace that you anticipated.


I cannot afford to keep paying a lawyer. I feel that you're dragging this all out. Let's get this all done and over with today/tonight.

I agree lawyers can be costly. I am open to hearing your thoughts on the division of assets.

The fair value of the house is $000,000. I want the house to be put on sale as soon as possible. What's holding you up?

I feel that you are saying I'm holding up the refinancing of the house. My lawyer, when she sent your lawyer my financials, mentioned in her letter that the bank is waiting on the signed separation agreement listing the amount of child support and spousal before I can secure a loan.

You f-ing got the kids involved in the house stuff! It is dead wrong and it shows that you're not a good mother!

I can understand how you would feel like that is what I've done. I would like to assure you this was not the case. I talked to teachers, psychologist, Dr L and have done online research. All felt that one of the stressors for children is the lack of control they feel over the situation. Allowing them to have a voice in the decisions of what can leave allows them to feel like they have a voice. It also allows for an opportunity for the children to express feelings and a chance for open dialogue.

I want the china cabinet, socks, shirts, my tool set, etc. etc. I want them by tomorrow!
I have given you all of your personal affects. Once I've received the back child support and the money from the medical cheque, given to you in error, I will talk with the boys and get back to you with a list of items for you to review. We may need you to return some of the tools to offset the value of some of the furniture.

I've been trying to get information from S19 and S14...and I feel that you are interfering with them! They must respond back to me. How hard is that?

The boys each have their own phones and email addresses. This is a conversation you will need to have with the

Now...about that Christmas list. Are you going to tell me or will you be uncooperative as usual?
I can understand why you would feel I'm being uncooperative, given my past actions, but the boys will be responsible for giving you their own list. I've asked them to keep it different from my list to avoid any duplicates

I've been supporting you and sons all of my life. Enough is enough! I will only pay so much in child support. It is my money too and you're not getting any of it!

Child support is a fixed number determined by the government. I am not able to change these numbers.

Court and lawyers are up to no good and too time consuming. Can't we do this ourselves like adults?

I'm open to discussions to help resolve this as easily as possible. I will not be making any firm decisions tonight but will let you know once I've had a chance to review our conversation.

How'd I do????????????

[Wonka]

If I were in your shoes, I would not meet H in person at all. For the many reasons we've outlined here. Would be best to go through this by phone or via email as you'd have solid proof of what H said to you.

Again, that's your call to make. I'd wait to see what H texts back before responding. And I'd consult with the lawyer before making any further moves.

[Whiterose]

I'm torn. I agree with you but also agree with Job.....I need to have the appearance of trying to be accommodating. I can leave at any time and will sign anything.

He hasn't gotten back to me so we'll see what his next move is

[AJM]

I rather like the idea of running it past your lawyer. Put the brakes on the process - not unwarranted - you need time to assess the ideas and concepts and it would be very unwise to jump to an agreement. Your lawyer is there to advise you of these types of things.

And you do hold all the right cards. He wants something you have. That's how negotiations work. If you take the emotions out of it, and you should, you'll see it differently. You do however, need to come to terms with the idea he is going through with this. The sooner you do that, the better for you and your family. Once you do that, and once your realize this is an Irish Love Story (no happy ending) you'll be much better able to handle this.

Your marriage is over. Your relationship with him is over (as you knew it). There are the legal matters to be dealt with, and as my grandmother once mentioned, "If (he) wants to go, pack his cra* and help him!"

I think it's time you went the other direction and pushed little baby out the door. For your own sake, stand up and refuse to be treated this way emotionally. And then you can get down to business.

As for this: [I had asked their opinion based on info from drs and educators and research saying it was helpful for kids to be a part of sons of the decision making and this was a good one for kids to feel part of the discussion with.[/quote]Spot on. I did the same and don't regret a bit of it. There were things I didn't let my ex take. I tried to get her to sign the sep agreement for a very long time. I'm glad I did. And I gave her pretty close to what she asked for - in my case she didn't know what to do with that and I didn't need it. In your case, it's likely different.

If you think he'll be fair, I remind you he is not paying child support now. He should be but isn't, right? He will be less inclined later. Take appropriate action now so that later you have that to fall back on. It's not punishment, it's about getting what you deserve. It's now or never in that regard.

Speak to your lawyer and see what the lawyer advises.


Peace,
AJ

[Whiterose]

I rather like the idea of running it past your lawyer. Put the brakes on the process - not unwarranted - you need time to assess the ideas and concepts and it would be very unwise to jump to an agreement. Your lawyer is there to advise you of these types of things.
I understand....I plan to email her tonight to let her know what is happening

And you do hold all the right cards. He wants something you have. That's how negotiations work. If you take the emotions out of it, and you should, you'll see it differently. You do however, need to come to terms with the idea he is going through with this. The sooner you do that, the better for you and your family. Once you do that, and once your realize this is an Irish Love Story (no happy ending) you'll be much better able to handle this.

Your marriage is over. Your relationship with him is over (as you knew it). There are the legal matters to be dealt with, and as my grandmother once mentioned, "If (he) wants to go, pack his cra* and help him!"

WOW AJ....that was quite the 2 x 4 upside the head.....I know that we can never have what we had, but, what makes you so sure that he won't put the brakes on at some point?


I think it's time you went the other direction and pushed little baby out the door. For your own sake, stand up and refuse to be treated this way emotionally. And then you can get down to business.

As for this: [I had asked their opinion based on info from drs and educators and research saying it was helpful for kids to be a part of sons of the decision making and this was a good one for kids to feel part of the discussion with.

Spot on. I did the same and don't regret a bit of it. There were things I didn't let my ex take. I tried to get her to sign the sep agreement for a very long time. I'm glad I did. And I gave her pretty close to what she asked for - in my case she didn't know what to do with that and I didn't need it. In your case, it's likely different.

Thank you for letting me know that you also did the same and it was best for your kids

If you think he'll be fair, I remind you he is not paying child support now. He should be but isn't, right? He will be less inclined later. Take appropriate action now so that later you have that to fall back on. It's not punishment, it's about getting what you deserve. It's now or never in that regard.

No,he's not,and both he and his lawyer are ignoring us (me and my lawyer) I was thinking, that if he messages me again, I can say I'm willing to meet and discuss child support first....if he gets angry I can let him know we're at an impasse and we can allow the judge to decide and leave.

Speak to your lawyer and see what the lawyer advises.


Peace,
AJ
[/quote]