more turtles by my side...

[zig]

hi dakota - thanks for your words.

that is quite a development in your sitch. have to go over and catch up on your thread

i'm really not "worrying" about what he's doing, you know? i'll admit i've been a bit worried about his blood pressure lately as he's been so incredibly tense and worked up. but i also noticed that i worried about it in the same way i would about a friend and had NO urge to say or do anything about it.

i do know i'm doing good - more than great - i think back to how i was in jan and march when he went on those trips - and i am nothing like that this time. i do feel the dates a bit - but even that has passed - i acknowledged it here, to myself and to a friend, had a tiny little cry and then after that i was really okay - more than okay and still am

when i think or talk or write here about h, it's more observing now, rather than being "involved" as i used to be for the major part

i don't think i'm a rockstar - but heck i'd say i suddenly have a starring role in my own life - probably for the first time.

thanks for peeping in - and keep us up to date with your latest, eh

hope you're well
zig

[zig]

thanks ng - and it was not so difficult to turn around back to the picnic today - also because i wasn't so messed up to begin with.

it feels as if sometimes H feels responsible for your feelings or wants you to be responsible for his..


yes ng - he has felt very responsible for my feelings from the beginning, and taken them on as his burden to bear all these years. when they were negative, he took on the martyr role of i have to bear zig's stuff. now they have not been negative for a more than a year - and so instead he tells me all the time how i feel(he told me always before too). well, until 10 days ago when i said in a really serene voice that i would like him to stop doing that.

now he doesn't have me to be martyrish about - he's started being martyrish about the details of the situation he's created for himself. i'm not taking that on, not feeling bad about it, but just seeing it for what it is - slightly crumbling walls - ones he created which are not mine to keep up, nor fix.

my focus is me - definitely - and is becoming more and more so as each day goes by

thanks ng -

zig

[zig]

journaling:

i've had a wonderful day altogether. the morning was a bit rough - but really nothing like before, and then i did some wonderful new designs today that had me thrilled - as well as my intern. and that was delightful to experience even though there were the other things.

then went to pick up s - and we had a really great evening together.

i must confess that we sat and watched some of the honey badger clips on you tube and laughed together. i kept apologizing every time randall cursed - which made us both laugh even harder. watching it with a kid actually makes the guy sound even more outrageous because you're so much more aware of the bad language!!

s seems really happy to be home - and we made popcorn and watched a movie and then were delighted to find that netflix had added TinTin to the instant watching and then of course we had to watch one of those episodes

we've got our weekend filled up - two of his friends will come over for the day tomorrow and then sunday we'll go over and spend the day with mil, swimming and helping her get some stuff done at her house, and then stay for dinner.


so surprisingly i'm feeling the most peaceful this evening than i have ever felt during this sitch.

i have no idea why - i think i just let it all go and decided to stay here, right now, and enjoy what i have. i really am on my own path and i am feeling the edges of that path on either side of me so much more clearly now. it's getting defined more and more - the edges were so blurry before..

brits words reminding me was the cinched today - that in a few weeks this will have passed and i won't even remember the intense feeling of it. if it's going to be a faded memory anyway, i think i may as well fade it now - and save those brain cells for the positive ones i could have instead

[zig]

thanks starsky - for posting this - it was excellent to read. i really appreciate it.

i will say though that i almost feel a bit of anger/frustration from you towards me for the way i'm handling my situation with my h. i really hope it was not based on that post this morning - that is not the attitude i am taking.

i don't know if it will help you to understand where i'm at right now if i explain, but i will anyway.

I treated h like shite from the beginning - in his eyes. I criticized him from morning to night - non-stop. i didn't see my comments as criticism at the time - i didn't understand that what i thought were "observations" , he took it as me constantly telling him that i didn't approve of him at all. setting aside everything else (his own behavior etc), there was no way for me to know how i eroded his confidence and self-esteem, as he did mine. we did a real number on each other.

we lost each others trust completely.

when i woke up and started to realize how my actions had affected him and brought us to this sitch,my biggest 180 was to stop all the anger, all the judgement all the right and wrong. i can't say i am 100% successful at that yet (human weakness), but i have done it to the best of my ability.

i went dim from september to april - set all kinds of boundaries - following suggestions here on this board - and all i saw was h withdrawing further and further.

i could see it was not working. when i started dropping the boundaries (which incidentally reminded him non-stop that he was doing something wrong) and allowing him to come closer - stopped being mysterious, started picking up the phone right when he called etc - all those little things - the change was dramatic. within a week he was getting more friendly, opening up to me, and spending time here.

i don't know if you have kept up with all the posts i have written - but here are some of the things he has said in the last 3 weeks, things incidentally that i never expected to hear from him ever: "i was really happy during our marriage, I see the possibility of us being together", owning some huge things that really were hard for me, telling his favorite stories about me to friends at s's b'day party, telling me that i am an amazing confident woman whose got her sh!t together

so tell me starsky - should i stop doing what works here? i don't see this trip as an indication that things are getting worse. i just see it as part of the path he is on. i have detached a lot - but even you have to admit that no matter how much detachment, we still have emotional reactions.

i find it really interesting that when i posted a couple of days ago about feeling vulnerable about the dates coming up this week, there was no response, but when i got a bit flippant and said i might pat him on the rump in jest - i practically got bombarded

so where was the real support here, i might ask?

i know that your concern is that i am treating myself in a correct and healthy way for myself, and respecting myself during this time. and i so appreciate that you are so active in helping us all find that for ourselves - you do this board and the people like me on it a great service

i know that i still have a lot to learn, and really really want to. i have a long way to go still in learning how to be in a relationship with anyone, let alone h. sometimes i get confused about what is the right thing to do - not just for the sitch but for myself, and i come here to ask.

confused, because the advice i got from the db coach conflicts heavily from a lot of it on the board. confused because after 5 yrs of not "being here'" and having no real emotional connections, i still struggle at having so many emotions to deal with

here's a maxim i have lived by for the last year:
h stood by me while i was in crisis for 5 years, if not possibly 10 yrs. I want to stand by him through his. only he and I really know the sh!t he had to bear and the sh!t i had to bear. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt right now. i hurt badly because of what he is doing during his crisis, but i don't get to choose how he has his crisis, just like he didn't get to choose how i had mine.

but i do get to choose how i am during his. he didn't handle my crisis well at all, in fact really really badly, and i do believe it propelled him into his. i choose not to continue that cycle, and i believe that i have broken it.i am absolutely sure that during this year he has come to recognize that.


so this is where i am at. if you see anything in what i have written that causes concern that i am not doing right by myself- i would really like to hear about it

i appreciate all the feedback i get

thanks

zig

[Brit45]

Your empathy is beautiful. That was a very touching read to know that you see what he went thru! Good for you

[bustingout]

Zig,

((( )))

I am sorry I have not been around the past few days. Of all of the times you have been there for me and now these past few days I could not offer the same to you.

I understand the feeling of self preservation and almost numbing oneself to emotions ( I did the same the day of our eleventh anniversary in May, which was ten days after he got into PA). And it's almost as if we have to hold our breathes to get through the tunnel.

And once we are through we are ok again ( as ok as we can be in these ditches).

When you recapped your sitch just now I felt so close to you. It is very similar to mine ( my crisis spurred his crisis) and your approach of standing by while in
crisis is inspiring.

It does get confusing on how to act. I have had some conflicting advice between my coach and the boards as well, and I guess it all comes down to doing what works. I just spoke with my coach yesterday and she gave me advice that scares the living sh!t out of me, but I will try it. If it does not work, I will course correct.

It is also confusing I think because we as LBS I don't think we actually realised for a long while how unhappy our S's were. So when this hits us we have to first take some time to recover from the blow and then the slow process of understanding how so many things we thought were working were actually the things that were not working.

So we have to relearn so much. And that is hard and conflicts with what what we thought we knew so well for so long.

Plus of course, what works for some does not work for others.

There are many times that I feel maybe I never knew my H at all. Maybe everything i believed was so clouded by my own stupid judgement that Maybe it wont matter what I do. And I work hard at accepting the fact that I really am a single parent right now and that what I thought was mine, my family, my future,
was only a part of my journey.

I can't say what is right or wrong for you. But I can say that you are an inspiring, thoughtful, loyal friend that I am so happy to have in my life. I think its ok to struggle with these questions and realities that we face and have never been prepared for or expected to face. and maybe that's part of the lesson.

It's hard to stand for our Ms when our Ms no longer exist practically and in the eyes of our WAS.

And that's why we are all here together. To stand together and face this
together.

I hope you are feeling better today. I cleaned up the picnic blanket and got some fresh drinks, glasses and updated the playlist. Join me again?

[reachingHigher]

zig, I love the commitment you have to H and yourself. I love your thinking and doing truly for you, at the same time taking advice and processing it.

I love how you enjoy your S10.

My IC's mantra is always "balance, balance, balance".

I think you have to trust your gut feeling sometimes and continue to evaluate your sitch as it progresses.

You are doing some great work and an inspiration to us all!!!

[vera be fierce]

Your empathy is beautiful. That was a very touching read to know that you see what he went thru! Good for you

^^like!!

[labug]

I keep hearing confusion being brought up and I'm not so sure it's confusing but maybe that's because I've been at this for a while.

As long as I am being true to myself and not allowing MY boundaries to be crossed, I'm good. The difficult part is figuring out those boundaries and being strong enough to state them and enforce them

No one can tell me what my boundaries are, that must come from me. I can't tell another person what their boundary should be.

Like all other advice here, take what you can use, leave the rest.

There are no experts here and I would guess that anything anyone might try has worked for someone.

[Starsky309]

Zig.

No, I have not read your entire sitch. What sort of crisis were you in for 5-10 years? I was unaware of that. If your husband stuck by you thru your own prior infidelity, drug use, or some sort of other life crisis that would probably change my view somewhat.

I'm not agry with you at all! I hope that isn't coming across. Frustrated? Sure. Know this about me: I absolutely DETEST affairs, with every fiber of my being, and I will help anyone who wants my help to fight them. I've seen first-hand what they can do to a family, and have counseled literally hundreds of people thru them. I don't believe in rewarding bad behavior, and when I see what I perceive to be someone doing that, I usually speak up.

I'd have to go back and read what sort of "boundaries" you were laying previously, and what specifically happened that you are defining as "not working." I will say this, however:

One of the misconceptions about DBing, in my opinion, is the "Do what works" thing. The problem is that people mis-define "works" as being "what doesn't make her/him angry" and "what makes her/him act nice towards me." Instead of as "what moves me further along down the path toward a mutually-healthy and committed marriage."

Sometimes one has to take a short-term "hit" in the "nice" department in order to solidify a healthier, longer-term gain.

Is your husband being "nicer" to you right now? Depends on how you define "nice." I don't think there's anything "nice" about continuing to cheat on your spouse, no matter how friendly you treat them when you're around them! In fact, I would say it would be far "nicer" of him to end his affair, even if it means he's then depressed and a bit snippy with you as he goes thru the withdrawal.

If you feel what you're doing is working for you, then I certainly don't want to have my posts upset you. I try to offer my help in those situations where people are noticing that the "be their friend" thing ISN'T working, and are ready to try a tougher approach.

Peace,

Starsky