WAH and LBW separated and dark

[DumpedforMIL]

Well.. clearly you are about to. You are angry. You have lost it. It just really depends on what chair and keyboard you are using.

i've lost it on just about everyone except for h.
i don't think he's ever seen me angry like this.
instead of going off on him, i just go quiet - or b*tch mode.

Things are different.. but not really. We both "created" space. We both are not happy about that.

things between h and i are very different.
i don't make an effort to talk to him.
he makes an effort to avoid me at all costs.
are we both not happy about creating the space between us?
i'm not but i'm sure he is thrilled.

From your reactions so far.. I think you were trying to prove a point. How is that working out for now?

well, i stop trying to prove a point way back in january.
when i couldn't get through to his thick mucus covered cranium that his parents basically pushed me out of the way to get to him, i stopped trying.

I was just being brutally honest. Her issues were hers.. mine were mine. The silly part about it is that all I had to do was think about my GAL activity.. and my hands started hurting. Maybe it was the look of pain on my face..

what do you mean by being brutally honest?
i'm brutally honest when i was trying to "prove my point" and it got me nowhere.

can you expand on why thinking about your GAL activity made your hands hurt?

and i thought when you GAL, you're supposed to act as if you are not hurting at all. why did you let your pain show on your face?

They come to you. See.. they are making bad choices to. It's all the Emotion. Once they can no longer blame you.. cause you are not "around".. Who can they blame? The things they say.. are based in half truths. Think "Fish Story". Things get bigger the more the story is told.

i'm betting that this will never happen to me.
him come to me? when pigs grow wings.
he will always have his parents telling him that every bad thing that's happening to him is because of me.
the car broke down, must be the ex-w that's put a curse on him.
the toast burnt, it was the ex-w and her bad vibes.
as long as his parents are alive, they won't let him come to me. he's never been able to make a decision on his own. they constantly call to convince him that he's doing the right thing. full steam ahead. get EVERYTHING you can from her.

"my h doesn't love me and wants out."

The first part of your statement.. is based in Emotion.. and inference.

The second part.. begs the question.. Why?

That should be your focus. You have touched on it "here". But you have so much to learn.

he wants out because he's choosing his parents over me.
that i totally ruined christmas for them.
that i was threatening to his parents.
that they questioned his judgement in marrying me.
he must make them proud again by destroying the evil w.
he will never go against their word. he believes they are doing what's best for him. that he only needs them and they are the only ones he should trust.
either that or .. marry caucasian and not someone from a different cultural background.
what else is there to learn?

Nothing is any different now than when you were first dating. History.. just makes it a tiny bit harder.

history makes it really hard.

Vindictive.. too. I understand.

yes, i can be. i won't deny that.

I agree. I see the old you returning to the surface.

i'm sure it will cycle.

I think you have your heels dug in on the wrong set of circumstances. It is not the material things that are making you react this way. It is the action of him "digging" at you that keeps you reacting. As long as you keep doing this you will continue to find yourself never moving forward. You will be stuck.. just like you are now.

his digging is showing his stupidity.
i mean, i don't want to be a doormat. and go 'ok, you can have all that stuff back.' but the law says that gifts to me should be mine. but since i'm not a gold digger, you can keep your gifts and i'll return the gifts you gave me.'

It takes someone with heart.. and "gumption" to do something different. It takes someone with a naive perspective to push things. Even if you get all the words wrong.. let your actions stand out.

i have.
i was honest with my paperwork.
i didn't do anything stupid like ask for stuff back or claim a portion of the gifts i gave him.
those are my actions so far.
what would be the best way to defend against that rule bending?

This little "transaction" you find yourself in.. will define you for the rest of your life. Bet on that!

Who do you want to be?

How do you want the world to "see" you?

i don't know how to handle it without being a doormat and giving it all away.
i want to set the boundaries here - i will not tolerate that kind rule bending in his favor.

btw, you didn't touch on my reasoning for why i am obsessed with this unfound infidelity. and that i believe he'd do it to hurt me. i'm supposed to expect a lot more hurtful things coming my way. so you know it's coming. and the day that it does, i will go absolutely insane on this board/thread.

dumped.

[DumpedforMIL]

I hope you are feeling a lot better.

hi lauraoh.
feeling a bit better.
i spent the weekend with friends.
they saw how thin i got and decided to 'fatten' me up with food.
belgian waffles with ice cream, strawberries, and brownie bits.
sushi dinner.
they made it a point to steer the conversation away from the sitch.
but when they gave me time to vent, they just listened.
i got a bit emotional after a few hours of shopping.
i used to shop with h and i'd advise him what clothes to get. it was hard not shopping with him. again, not about the material things. it's the time spent with him.

I think the history you share makes it a litte EASIER with a man. In general, according to Dr. Laura, men are much more likely to forgive and "get over" past hurts.

i don't know.
h has his parents constantly telling him that he's doing the right thing. so it's unlikely he will ever forgive me.
after 4 months, he's still pissed off at me.
for ruining christmas, for going with the law instead of his proposal of 75% for him and 25% + engagement ring for me.

my h has been keeping score and he plotted to get me out of the house so he can claim the entire house.
is he really going to forgive me? i don't think so.

And they don't really want to teach someone new all their little idiosyncrisies.

this i agree with.
but it still doesn't stop me from thinking that he'd sleep with someone just to hurt me.

Think long and hard about before all this--who was the first to "make up" after fights-say they were sorry and want to be done with it all? For me, that is my H.

h said sorry once in our entire marriage.
he never thought he was wrong. why would he? his mother was always telling him that he was right.
he often blamed me for any arguments.

And as you concentrate on some things about your H, and let other things go, you will "know" him even better than before. And can deal with his fears and insecurities in a new way.

this side he's showing now is very unattractive and mean spirited.
but i get what you mean. it's all about give and take.

i want to try and keep a positive outlook. but it looks awflly bleak.

dumped.

[Forrest Gump]

"i've lost it on just about everyone except for h.
i don't think he's ever seen me angry like this.
instead of going off on him, i just go quiet - or b*tch mode."

You say that.. but you stated that your actions are seen by him as exactly the same thing.

"things between h and i are very different.
i don't make an effort to talk to him.
he makes an effort to avoid me at all costs.
are we both not happy about creating the space between us?
i'm not but i'm sure he is thrilled."

There you go inferring again.

"well, i stop trying to prove a point way back in january.
when i couldn't get through to his thick mucus covered cranium that his parents basically pushed me out of the way to get to him, i stopped trying."

Welcome.. to his world.

"he wants out because he's choosing his parents over me.
that i totally ruined christmas for them.
that i was threatening to his parents.
that they questioned his judgement in marrying me.
he must make them proud again by destroying the evil w.
he will never go against their word. he believes they are doing what's best for him. that he only needs them and they are the only ones he should trust.
either that or .. marry Caucasian and not someone from a different cultural background."

"Caucasian".. define that. I mean you. You just threw that at me. Not that it really matters. You defined he is white. What are you?

"what else is there to learn?"

Gimme a sec on that one.

"btw, you didn't touch on my reasoning for why i am obsessed with this unfound infidelity. and that i believe he'd do it to hurt me. i'm supposed to expect a lot more hurtful things coming my way. so you know it's coming. and the day that it does, i will go absolutely insane on this board/thread."

It's because you don't understand what drives you. You are looking for a reason to make it easier to walk away. Put it behind you. Blame him. This has the distinct smell of a Physical LL. For you.

You focus on the action to much.

For a East Coast girl.. you stay up too late.

Go to sleep.

I will be back in the morning.. it is almost 1 am here.

[LauraOh]

So you say that your H has only come to you and apologized one time?

This is one of those little idiocyndracies that he'd have to have a new person figure out.

So YOU did it--how quick was he to want things to be smoothed over? In other words, how hard did you have to work on him?

Clues to how to behave now....

You keep forgetting--there were things in your R that DID WORK. And you have a few more "tools" in your belt to how to make them work better in the future.

Don't think he would sleep with someone to "hurt" you--You have given it a go too (in your head). You were wanting to escape the pain. He may think it would have that affect as well. He has GOT to be lonely if there is no one else. Only his parents supporting him? How old is he??? It's got to be humiliating.

[AJM]

I had a friend who went through something almost exactly like you describe. Very similar situation, except she has a son. in-laws, etc. Know what? The in-laws didn't have as much impact as you might think. Some. The OW. There was one, kind of. Most of it was in his imagination. She tried very hard to make it work. Really. She's a great lady and didn't deserve what he gave her. In the end, he moved out. Pursued the other woman. She gave him a choice. He took the other woman. Then after a while realized he'd made a mistake, told his parents to go away, and wanted to come home. Too late. She got a life and is very happy in it without him. Really. She figured out that he is not what she wants out of life and is going to go find what she wants and will not settle for less. To do that, she figured out what it is she needs. She did that so that she could communicate it to him when the time was right. Just turns out he couldn't provide that. Too bad for him, right?

what do you mean by being brutally honest?
i'm brutally honest when i was trying to "prove my point" and it got me nowhere.

This got missed I think. Being brutally honest with you and with him is how I read that. Be honest. Not mean or vindictive. But honest. Not for a "goal" but for the sake of being honest. You have nothing to lose on that front. Being honest will always be the right thing to do even when painful at the moment.

Remember that you did have very many good times. You both saw something in each other that you liked and loved and respected. You didn't make a mistake. He stopped living up to his commitment for reasons only he knows. But you have to focus more on you. You can have acceptance of the situation, but you may not ever understand it. Same for all of us. Time to say goodbye to the previously held dreams and hopes you had with him, and instead focus on you. There will come a time when he may want to try and come back. You may or may not let him, but you will utterly fail if you cannot stand on your own two feet. It isn't fair what he is doing. His lies. His trying to cause pain. His pettiness. It just isn't fair. But it is an opportunity for you when you are ready to see it.

Focus on you. Do at least one thing for you every day. And do at least one thing for somebody other than H as well. Start with that. You are worth it and you will see that very quickly, that you have to rebuild your self-esteem. He does not define that - you do. No matter what happened between you and H, you did not deserve this - that's his craziness coming into your head. Your self-esteem is still there waiting for you to discover it.

And remember that you have to work on you before you can work on anything else. Really. And you're worth it!

AJ

[LauraOh]

Very nice AJ. Thanks for that!

[LauraOh]

And do at least one thing for somebody other than H as well

This is a huge thing in my sitch--I have found people falling out of the SKY (or so it seems)lol all of a sudden that need help.

They think they are being a burden--they just don't know that right now they are such a BLESSIONG to me!

I tell you, between abandoned Russian teenagers and divorced friends that need unique help that I am "tailor made" for, it seems beyond bizarre that this is happening.

Open yourself up to it--they will come out of the woodwork and you will be amazed at what is out there. They will bless you more than you could ever imagine.

[Coach]

Well.. clearly you are about to. You are angry. You have lost it. It just really depends on what chair and keyboard you are using.

i've lost it on just about everyone except for h.
i don't think he's ever seen me angry like this.
instead of going off on him, i just go quiet - or b*tch mode.

Things are different.. but not really. We both "created" space. We both are not happy about that.

things between h and i are very different.
i don't make an effort to talk to him.
he makes an effort to avoid me at all costs.
are we both not happy about creating the space between us?
i'm not but i'm sure he is thrilled.

From your reactions so far.. I think you were trying to prove a point. How is that working out for now?

well, i stop trying to prove a point way back in january.
when i couldn't get through to his thick mucus covered cranium that his parents basically pushed me out of the way to get to him, i stopped trying.

I was just being brutally honest. Her issues were hers.. mine were mine. The silly part about it is that all I had to do was think about my GAL activity.. and my hands started hurting. Maybe it was the look of pain on my face..

what do you mean by being brutally honest?
i'm brutally honest when i was trying to "prove my point" and it got me nowhere.
can you expand on why thinking about your GAL activity made your hands hurt?

and i thought when you GAL, you're supposed to act as if you are not hurting at all. why did you let your pain show on your face?

They come to you. See.. they are making bad choices to. It's all the Emotion. Once they can no longer blame you.. cause you are not "around".. Who can they blame? The things they say.. are based in half truths. Think "Fish Story". Things get bigger the more the story is told.

i'm betting that this will never happen to me.him come to me? when pigs grow wings.
he will always have his parents telling him that every bad thing that's happening to him is because of me.
the car broke down, must be the ex-w that's put a curse on him.
the toast burnt, it was the ex-w and her bad vibes.as long as his parents are alive, they won't let him come to me. he's never been able to make a decision on his own. they constantly call to convince him that he's doing the right thing. full steam ahead. get EVERYTHING you can from her.

"my h doesn't love me and wants out."

The first part of your statement.. is based in Emotion.. and inference.

The second part.. begs the question.. Why?

That should be your focus. You have touched on it "here". But you have so much to learn.

he wants out because he's choosing his parents over me.that i totally ruined christmas for them.
that i was threatening to his parents.
that they questioned his judgement in marrying me.
he must make them proud again by destroying the evil w.
he will never go against their word. he believes they are doing what's best for him. that he only needs them and they are the only ones he should trust.either that or .. marry caucasian and not someone from a different cultural background.
what else is there to learn?

Nothing is any different now than when you were first dating. History.. just makes it a tiny bit harder.

history makes it really hard.

Vindictive.. too. I understand.

yes, i can be. i won't deny that.

I agree. I see the old you returning to the surface.

i'm sure it will cycle.

I think you have your heels dug in on the wrong set of circumstances. It is not the material things that are making you react this way. It is the action of him "digging" at you that keeps you reacting. As long as you keep doing this you will continue to find yourself never moving forward. You will be stuck.. just like you are now.

his digging is showing his stupidity.
i mean, i don't want to be a doormat. and go 'ok, you can have all that stuff back.' but the law says that gifts to me should be mine. but since i'm not a gold digger, you can keep your gifts and i'll return the gifts you gave me.'

It takes someone with heart.. and "gumption" to do something different. It takes someone with a naive perspective to push things. Even if you get all the words wrong.. let your actions stand out.

i have.
i was honest with my paperwork.
i didn't do anything stupid like ask for stuff back or claim a portion of the gifts i gave him.
those are my actions so far.
what would be the best way to defend against that rule bending?

This little "transaction" you find yourself in.. will define you for the rest of your life. Bet on that!

Who do you want to be?

How do you want the world to "see" you?

i don't know how to handle it without being a doormat and giving it all away.
i want to set the boundaries here - i will not tolerate that kind rule bending in his favor.

btw, you didn't touch on my reasoning for why i am obsessed with this unfound infidelity. and that i believe he'd do it to hurt me. i'm supposed to expect a lot more hurtful things coming my way. so you know it's coming. and the day that it does, i will go absolutely insane on this board/thread.

dumped.

[Coach]

I hope you are feeling a lot better.

hi lauraoh.
feeling a bit better.
i spent the weekend with friends.
they saw how thin i got and decided to 'fatten' me up with food.
belgian waffles with ice cream, strawberries, and brownie bits.
sushi dinner.
they made it a point to steer the conversation away from the sitch.
but when they gave me time to vent, they just listened.
i got a bit emotional after a few hours of shopping.
i used to shop with h and i'd advise him what clothes to get. it was hard not shopping with him. again, not about the material things. it's the time spent with him.

I think the history you share makes it a litte EASIER with a man. In general, according to Dr. Laura, men are much more likely to forgive and "get over" past hurts.

i don't know.
h has his parents constantly telling him that he's doing the right thing. so it's unlikely he will [color:#FF0000]ever forgive me.[/color]after 4 months, he's still pissed off at me.for ruining christmas, for going with the law instead of his proposal of 75% for him and 25% + engagement ring for me.

my h has been keeping score and he plotted to get me out of the house so he can claim the entire house.
is he really going to forgive me? i don't think so.

And they don't really want to teach someone new all their little idiosyncrisies.

this i agree with.
but it still doesn't stop me from thinking that he'd sleep with someone just to hurt me.

Think long and hard about before all this--who was the first to "make up" after fights-say they were sorry and want to be done with it all? For me, that is my H.

h said sorry once in our entire marriage.
he never thought he was wrong. why would he? his mother was always telling him that he was right.
he often blamed me for any arguments.

And as you concentrate on some things about your H, and let other things go, you will "know" him even better than before. And can deal with his fears and insecurities in a new way.

this side he's showing now is very unattractive and mean spirited.
but i get what you mean. it's all about give and take.

i want to try and keep a positive outlook. but it looks awflly bleak.

dumped.

Watch how you talk to yourself. You spend too much energy reading his mind, believing and feeling for your H. Put the focus back on you.

[Coach]

Letting Go Takes Love

To let go does not mean to stop caring,
it means I can't do it for someone else.

To let go is not to cut myself off,
it's the realization I can't control another.

To let go is not to enable,
but allow learning from natural consequences.

To let go is to admit powerlessness, which means
the outcome is not in my hands.

To let go is not to try to change or blame another,
it's to make the most of myself.

To let go is not to care for,
but to care about.

To let go is not to fix,
but to be supportive.

To let go is not to judge,
but to allow another to be a human being.

To let go is not to be in the middle arranging all the outcomes,
but to allow others to affect their destinies.

To let go is not to be protective,
it's to permit another to face reality.

To let go is not to deny,
but to accept.

To let go is not to nag, scold or argue,
but instead to search out my own shortcomings and correct them.

To let go is not to adjust everything to my desires,
but to take each day as it comes and cherish myself in it.

To let go is not to criticize or regulate anybody,
but to try to become what I dream I can be.

To let go is not to regret the past,
but to grow and live for the future.