WAW - Very confused and devestated - pt 5

[AnotherNightmare]

So do I move up to orange belt yet?

That is a tiny 2x4 for you for temperature taking. Make sure it is not a habit of yours, even on this BB.

But I agree with spellfire. Your most recent post does sound a lot more focused on yourself. So continue in that direction.

AN

[confusedinpa]

One of the things that has helped me is something I had posted at towards the end of AFWAW's locked thread

"I'm not sure what kind of music that you are listening to now, but part of my breakaway from the Mr. Nice Guy persona had been to listen to stronger music. I found I had been listening to soft, touchy, feely music as I was down and it was keeping me down. I have started to listen to more upbeat, stronger music to keep me focused. For example, depending on your taste, Kanye West - Stronger or Poison - Open Up and Say Ah album, etc.

You need to create an enviornment that you're not going wallow around in the muck, but an enviornment that will boast you up."

Others had posted other band/album options as well.

I had noticed, that most of us are around 40 here so I've been listening to more 80's Freestyle and rap music too (can't do the rap music with the boys in the truck though). Biggie Small has some pretty powerful stuff too.

[PortlandDad]

Classical and Smooth Jazz are my "feel good" music; probably because it is so different than what my W listens to.

My W really gets into Rap and Hip Hop, so I can't listen to a single note of that without feeling a twang of loneliness.

Different strokes, eh?

[MrBond]

Yep you definitely get the orange belt from the DB dojo.

There were three key things that happened last night that you should jot down mentally:
1) You told her you were not a mindreader which she actually listened to by clarifying about the foot rub.
2) She initiated the spending time together and not you. And you would have been fine either way if she didn't.
3) You were doing things that made YOU happy and not her.

Great job!

I wouldn't worry about an OM in the picture. Your W has been very good at telling you what she's doing and doing what you've asked her. When my W was going through the OM stage, she was secretive, defensive and quick to anger like she was just looking for a fight.

But your W has been very transparent which is why we all believe that you have a great shot at saving your M.

Keep it up!

[LR1]

Confused,

Way to go man! I need some of what your having because I am heading that way but just getting on board. Keep it up and I hope to be there with ya soon.

LonelyRzr

[confusedinpa]

Yep you definitely get the orange belt from the DB dojo.

There were three key things that happened last night that you should jot down mentally:
1) You told her you were not a mindreader which she actually listened to by clarifying about the foot rub.
2) She initiated the spending time together and not you. And you would have been fine either way if she didn't.
3) You were doing things that made YOU happy and not her.

Great job!

I wouldn't worry about an OM in the picture. Your W has been very good at telling you what she's doing and doing what you've asked her. When my W was going through the OM stage, she was secretive, defensive and quick to anger like she was just looking for a fight.

But your W has been very transparent which is why we all believe that you have a great shot at saving your M.

Keep it up!

Stuck808,

Thanks for the optimism relative to saving the marriage. I'm still not feeling optimistic about the marriage but I am gaining more confidence that I will be able to be happy and enjoy life whatever direction it heads down.

I do get sad about my kids, but I know that the way best thing for them as well is for me to be strong - not a nice guy nor the macho guy, but the integrated man.

I am sorry to hear about your situation and her behavior. What my wife seems to have been trying to do though is to push my buttons to get me mad/upset. My therapist/our counselor and I feel like she's trying to do that so she can justify staying mad/angry. It is hurtful when she does things like that, it's starting to seem silly/chlidish to me now when she does things like that.

You have really given me a lot of tools/advice on how to handle these situations. I do appreciate your input and support.

Thanks!

[confusedinpa]

Confused,

Way to go man! I need some of what your having because I am heading that way but just getting on board. Keep it up and I hope to be there with ya soon.

LonelyRzr

You can easily have some of what I've been having. It's all the support and advice that has been in my threads/posts.

What it has really come down to is finding it within yourself to decide when you are done feeling sorry for yourself. Dig yourself out of the muck. The only person that could possible be happy about being in the muck is the person who put you there.

It's similar to what happened to me when I was younger. When I was growing up in the projects in Brooklyn, I had a very hard time as I was the clear minority. I was also over weight and wore "welfare" glasses. It was a common occurence where I had been beaten up/mugged/shot at/taunted so I cried almost everyday.

When I started 6th grade, my mom had finally bought me a football. We didn't have any money but it was something I had really wanted so it was a big deal. The first day I went outside with it, I got mugged and beat up and it was taken from me. At that point I decided I was done crying and feeling sorry for myself. It's hard to fight back when you're crying.

Unfortunately, the childhood coping mechanism that I put into place was I shut down all my emotions and kept myself just mad/angry. That was the last day I was beat up or felt sad, but didn't realize that was also the last day I had felt anything.

That's how I went through life to survive all the hardships . I was homeless for a period of time, ran out of money for college and had to quit to save money (I did return to finish), friends getting shot/killed - all before I finished college. I used to drink a lot - particularly through college and the first few years of working. That was the only time I was able to "feel" anything. I actually started drinking at 12.

I would just go out with "frat rat" girls and "club/party" girls through out the years. My wife was the first girl I had dated that was not one that would jump on top of a bar and start to strip (like from the movie Coyote Ugly). I allowed myself to be vulnerable to her, but I let my childhood coping mechanisms take over when shortly after we were married we thought she had less than a year to live. Fortunately it worked out to be a false alarm but it shocked me back to the mode of not feeling anything because I was afraid of the loss/pain.

That was the start of the the emotionaly neglect for my wife and kids. Her bomb shocked me back to reality.

I understand now that living involves feeling emotions and only you can control how you want to live your life. I can easily decide that this is too much to handle and shut everything down again but that is not how I want to live my life. I want to enjoy life. I realized I missed so much, myself as well as with my wife and kids. I'm not going to miss anymore of life.

That realization has come to me over the several weeks of my therapy and rereading all the advice/input that is in my threads. I've also been reading the books that have been suggested to me.

What it comes down to is that life is a choice. Only you can chose how you want to live. I made the wrong choice in the past. I would be a fool to make the wrong choice for the now and the future.

What it comes ultimately down to is me.

[spellfire]

She is testing the new you. I wrote to robx about this in his thread. I used a wall analogy (not to be confused with putting up emotional walls), but it is also referred to as being a rock in Hold on to Your NUTS. Here it is again, maybe it is applicable to you now:

When she says things like that, I believe she is not telling you "the writing is on the wall" as much as testing you to see if you really have changed. Your job is to prove (via action ie. not overreacting to hurtful comments) that you truly have changed and you can pass any test she presents.

Think of it this way...you are a wall. Women need to know the wall is strong, safe, and secure. Previously she found the wall was weak and she was able to punch holes in it at will with hurtful words. The wall would crumble (react) for the most part. now you have figured out why the wall is weak and have reinforced it, patched it, braced...however you want to think of it, but the key being you have truly changed. She has surely noticed that the wall that let her down before is certainly looking much stronger. How does she know for sure though? She is gonna go test it out and see if she can punch those holes again.

Your job is to expect the punches, anticipate them and be ready to take them. Okay so here she comes with a good solid punch…
she wants to see if this wall is gonna hold for her…

"We've been fighting so long and have experienced failure so long, how could we be different and have a successful, happy marriage?" *insert batman style sound effect here*

Pretty hurtful thing to say to someone who is devastated by the separation. So what are you gonna do? React and get in a fight (old crumbly wall) or (knowing it is a test of your resolve and not necessary an assessment of the relationship) stand strong and prove you are no longer going to get sucked into the old patterns?

You asked if you have to agree so as to avoid conflict, and said it's hard to remain neutral when she’s knocking the R so much. Reframe that assumption. She is not knocking the relationship, she is testing your resolve to truly be a different person.

When these kinds of comments come up, don't get mad. Realize you are "talking a little test". Feel those competitive instincts kicking in? You can pass this test. If you recognize it as a test of your resolve it doesn’t feel nearly as bad. This has helped me tremendously in my R. I used to get sooo defensive, now I can defuse just about anything she throws at me. Not only is it a test to me, it has almost become a thrill, because it feels so good when you see the surprise on her face that you did not fall back into the old habits. One time my W got really upset, since she made all kinds of assumptions about how I would handle a certain situation. I stood strong, explained to her my position as she fought the tears, then without even asking or telling her, went over and gave her a big follow up hug. Minutes later she was on the phone taking care of the issue like nothing had ever gone wrong.

This is where boundaries come in. The wall analogy actually fits in rather well with boundaries too since it is one lol. Make your position known, just don't let her punch holes in your wall.

[LR1]

Spell,

Great analogy! I will print that out.

Thanks,
Barry

[confusedinpa]

I thought I was going to lose my shot at an orange belt tonite.

I had woke up this morning and decided to have a good day. Thought it could be the start of a trend - two good days in a row.

It started off well. My wife woke me up as she usually did so I can hop in the shower while she is doing her make up and hair. We chatted and joked lightly while I was shaving. Boys were up by the time I had gotten out of the shower. Before I left for work, I gave my youngest a hug and a kiss but then he chased me down for another one. My wife and I hugged good-bye and kissed on the check. I said "Have a great day today!" and I left for work. I usually say that in the morning before I leave, but I actually felt it then.

My wife wound up calling and leaving a message for me towards the end of the day (I didn't take the call) as my oldest is off school for a school holiday so she wanted to know if I was off that day. I emailed her my work holiday schedule and told her to let me know which day it was because I may be able to take off. She replied back right away that I was off as well, as a bonus it was on his birthday! I was pumped about that since it would give him and I some extra one on one time (it's tough to have since the birth of our youngest and this situation compounded it).

She then emailed me a menu of a resturant of that we had talked about last nite that she wanted to go to. I emailed me her back (after 15 minutes) that it really made me hungry since I missed lunch. She emailed me back right away that she was making steak, twice baked potatoes and veggies for dinner tonite. I emailed her back right away that sounded yummy and I'll see her at home.

She wound up calling me as she was leaving work and we chatted about miscelaneous stuff.

I had made myself a captain morgan and coke while I helped my oldest do his homework. When she got home from work, we hugged and kissed on the check again. I could tell she was stressing about as my youngest was really giving her a hard time. I took him from her and the three of us sat at the kitchen table at ate some chips as the two boys drew pictures.

My wife was making dinner and I could tell she was still stressed. I didn't let it bother me, nor did I comment, as I just enjoyed my time with the boys. Then I noticed she pulled out the martini glass. I asked her to make an extra blue cheese stuffed olive for me. She did.

We ate dinner and had some light conversation. She seemed pretty stressed/irritated about her day. I just let her vent as I empathized with her. My oldest wound up spilling a drink towards the end of dinner. I started to clean up, but apparently it wasn't fast enough for her as she snapped at me about don't just sit there holding the towel. I told her relax, I got it as I wiped it up. I didn't let her bait me into an argument nor upset me.

After the kids' bath, I saw she was down in the den. I didn't go in and just took care of some stuff for me. I called the boys when it was time to read books. My youngest came out right away to grab his books, but my wife said she was showing my oldest some pictures on the computer. I poked my head in and she showed me the pictures as well, then she started to show me other stuff on facebook.

I read the books to the boys, she sat down in the living room with us. Then while the boys and I were watching there show, I could see she was reading some official looking mail. I could tell it was agitating her - I assumed it was something related to our custody mediation that was coming up on March 30th.

We put the kids to bed, I came downstairs and saw it was exactly that. I went to do something else in a different room but when she came down she showed me the letter and said I had gotten the same thing. I just oh, I didn't see it yet. I asked her if she wanted to watch Lost. She said we could do that or talk about custody. I had really started to scramble as she continued to talk - I ws trying to remember the verbal ju-jitsu to avoid talking about this one. Fortunately my youngest came out because he had to go to the bathroom.

After I helped him, I went right to the television to grab the Lost DVD. She said she would rather watch something shorter, so I fired up TIVO instead. We watched Two and Half men (a show we watched betfore we started with Lost). We did stop in the middle to talk about various light topics. She was acting really tired, but I could also sense that she was stressed/agitated. I smiled inside as I thought it was a nice change of pace as she's waiting for me to make up my mind.

At the end of the show, she said she was going to bed as she was really tired (it was only 9:15 PM). We kissed on the check good nite and she went up to bed. This now breaks the streak of being intimate two Thursday's in a row. Hopefully, this will also break the streak of major setbacks/blowups two weeks in a row as well.

Her mom is suppose to watch the kids this weekend, so I'm looking foward to a fun weekend. If my wife wants to have fun too, then great, if not, I don't need her to have a fun weekend.

I have some thoughts, but could use some good specific examples of verbal ju-jitsu if she brings up the topic of deciding on a custody agreement again. Anyone have any suggestions/examples?