Well tough tonight, spouse told S7 and D4 that she is moving to a new house on Saturday. Said might be a surprise for them so they were excited. I was relieved she told them as she had planned to just take them to house. At same time I would have liked to be there.
we then talked about child care arrangements which we agree equally, she wanted to schedule for rest of year, I want a month in advance. Whatever I say she latches onto the negative or takes it as being aggressive self centered behaviour. I worked really hard at being detached yet we still ended in tit for tat conversations so I left the room to separate myself from the sitch.
I still fluffed it though as we could not agree on setting the schedule, she wanted to do it a year in advance and I want to do it month by month. I let myself get drawn into her baiting me about living her life around my schedule and I mentioned her seeing OM. Annoyed at self for falling into trap.
She is finding it very hard but believes that separating is best and her divorced friends have said it is right to do. I can see why MWD says it isn't the answer as you still have to communicate with each other so problem does not disappear.
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
thank you for your reply. she moved out on Sunday to new house which is just round the corner. Quite difficult for us all and the children in particular. she has compensated by buying them mini iPads as presents at new house and then on sat a quite expensive toy each. both these actions were without consultation and I was very angry, in the case of the iPads I did not remain detached.
We have also been doing counselling for last 5 weeks. WAS sees it as pointless, thinks nothing will change, I cannot change etc. All very understandable from her perspective and straight out of DB for WAS. I have been trying hard to show I am listening. one strong message from the counselling has been that she has a deep desire to be heard, going back to her adolescents and she felt I did not hear or listen therefore I was taking her foregranted and could not possibly care.
A 180 to this would be to listen attentively and really validate what she is saying, I find this difficult to do mainly because if she will expect me to agree with her and she has always been very controlling. I am. To sure she realises she is doing it, I am going to be assertive but also need to demonstrate that I am listening.
This is my email to her answering her questions and W annotations.
in summary I think 180 is to really listen and I need to do without giving her control
Me
Hi WAS
I have corrected the typos in red so it should make more sense. On the boxes I have not moved anything and mum said she has lifted vacuumed and put back. I have no idea where they are, do you really think that I would move them and then withhold that information from you?? Sorry, I was not implying that you had taken them. I will check again tonight and you are welcome to come and look.
I do not understand why you bring the question of trust regards the passports. You raised the passport as an issue - do you not trust me?
WAS
"Of course I trust you, I just think it is fair that we have one each?
ME
I think it would be better to have the passports held neutrally that is all. "
I have asked for advice, either they all need to be with advocates or we hold one of each. Whatever we decide also needs to apply to the !! and && passports.
There are no fleeces for Lily so if you can send one of them back please. She has a pink fleece in her wardrobe at St Honorine, hanging up. I think your mum bought it recently.
WAS "What jumper do you mean? Her school jumper?"
ME
We need to complete the sale of the house, I am waiting on the bank confirming they are OK with the valuation, there was some questions in relation to the extension and access to the party wall.
The division of the “other stuff” in the house should be simple. You should have all the stuff the you brought into the relationship. I think this should be easy to do and just needs to be equitable and resolved in the next couple of months. I will put down my thoughts by this weekend.
I want to check you are OK if I pack up the remaining stuff from the wardrobe and bathroom?
WAS "Do what you wish"
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
I should add that her lawyer is drafting consent agreement so we share the children 50 50 which we have put in place.
We have verbally agreed a price for me to buy her share in house, I am not expecting this to be drafted without a surprise.
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
I have corrected the typos in red so it should make more sense. On the boxes I have not moved anything and mum said she has lifted vacuumed and put back. I have no idea where they are, do you really think that I would move them and then withhold that information from you?? Sorry, I was not implying that you had taken them. I will check again tonight and you are welcome to come and look.
I do not understand why you bring the question of trust regards the passports. You raised the passport as an issue - do you not trust me? Of course I trust you, I just think it is fair that we have one each? I think it would be better to have the passports held neutrally that is all.
I have asked for advice, either they all need to be with advocates or we hold one of each. Whatever we decide also needs to apply to the NZ and UK passports.
There are no fleeces for Lily so if you can send one of them back please. She has a pink fleece in her wardrobe at St Honorine, hanging up. I think your mum bought it recently. What jumper do you mean? Her school jumper?
We need to complete the sale of the house, I am waiting on the bank confirming they are OK with the valuation, there was some questions in relation to the extension and access to the party wall.
The division of the “other stuff” in the house should be simple. You should have all the stuff the you brought into the relationship. I think this should be easy to do and just needs to be equitable and resolved in the next couple of months. I will put down my thoughts by this weekend.
I want to check you are OK if I pack up the remaining stuff from the wardrobe and bathroom? Do what you wish.
Alasdair
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
First, generally speaking members don't post personal names of spouses or children. It is fine if you do not have a problem with that. If you do and want that info removed from a post, click the "notify" link at the bottom right of the post in question and indicate instructions for a mod.
That said, you are welcome to do what ever you want as far as letting your W know how you feel and what you want. What is coming across quite clear though, is that you are really trying to control the outcome.
For example with the child care, what does it really matter if you do a one year schedule? If you keep pressing for a month by month, she is likely to think that you are trying to control her / not listening to her. It is coming across the same way with the passports.
Right now... she is not wanting a future with you and so will resist anything that keeps her tied to you, in any way. As much as it might scare you, it will either be the reality, whether you want it or not, or she will get the freedom she wants and realize that it still does not make her happy.
As far as the gifts your W gave to the kids, that is not uncommon. Your W is trying to soften the blow with gifts. When a man does this, they are sometimes called "Disney Dads". Understand that kids are smart and this still won't stop their pain.
You may very well get more mileage out of DB if you get to "letting her go", stop trying to control the outcome, continue to build a great R with your kids, and work on yourself to become a man only a fool would leave. If that does not save your M, then she is a fool and you have made great strides to any future R or M you may have, with whomever that might be.
Hi Kaffe thank you on a couple of fronts. First leaving names in was an error so I have notified the mod to remove.
Not doing very well here am I? I felt like I was detaching but do not want to be walked over. If I buy her out of the house then I have a large attachment to this whereas she would be free to leave and move should she wish. this worries me though at moment looks unlikely that she would leave. Should I just forget about the settlement of the house and the custody arrangements and let her choose the timing of this?
I read a post this morning about WAS being unhappy and looking for happiness elsewhere, I get this and suspect that with all the freedom in the world she will not be happy. that is not for me, I am going to let go.
I am really trying to let go. I have great relationships with the children and focus on my time with the children. i am not going to be a disney dad or even compete with this behaviour, they are intelligent and will see it for what it is.
I have also been cycling 30 miles daily so starting to feel fitter 11 days into my charity challenge of 30 rides in 30 days.
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
You'll sometimes hear us refer to this as "letting go of the rope".
We can not control someone else, really. I am sure you know that, it is just hard. Something deep within human nature begs us to control. It's instinctual. Yet, at the end of the day, she will leave... or not... not by what you do or don't do, but by her choice.
One thing that becomes clear with WAS or MLCers is... they assume the road out is easy. Once they realize what they have to do, their resolve does not seem so clear.
Just the obstacles to leave can help them change their minds.
So, let her do the work if she wants to leave or she wants to D. If there is ever a time you need to act on something such as a response to D, then you will need to do so, within the constraints of time set out by the order. You always have time for due diligence. You may not be M, but there is the financial dissolution that will have to be dealt with just the same, as will custody need to be dealt with.
In the mean time, work on yourself. If she decides to stay, you need to be the best man and father you can be. She could stay and remain unhappy. So being detached and focused on your own growth can change the sitch enough that she decides to change herself and work on your R.
My partner left the house two weeks ago and we have had little contact other than about the children. Last week she emailed to say she had a draft agreement from the advocates for the finance and also the custody arrangements. She asked what I proposed to do on the pension. I asked what she proposed and asked to see the draft agreements, she replied she wanted to complete them before sending to me. I sent her my proposal by email on what the split should be.
I set out how I think the pension should be split, I know she will not agree and feels it is unfair. This morning she asked if we could get together to discuss the agreements and we agreed to meet next week one evening. She called an hour later to say she had seen my email and did not think it was fair and equitable. I held my ground on my views but remained detached and did not get emotional during the discussion. I listened to her view and validated it without agreeing and remaining in the boundaries I have set.
I was surprised she called as it is her first morning with the children since Friday so why would she check her emails then. I also could hear she was angry and said I did not think we should talk about it when the children could hear, I could hear them in the background.
Have I understood detachment better, I am not holding onto the rope. She has moved to want to have the legal agreements drafted and I am giving my view which will be what In my view is in my best interests and the children's.
RW
Me 44 WAS 41 T 11 S 8 D 5 DB November 2012 EA and PA discovered December 2012 WAS moved out 4 May 2013 Share residence of S and D 50/50 WAS moves in with OM 1 September 2013.
RW, she asked for your proposal on the pension for her draft and yet did not divulge her proposal on financial and custody? That seems a little one sided and more than that, like she wants to negotiate pension at this time, without negotiating the other parts.
I think you should have no opinion or suggestion regarding HER draft, at this time. If she's going to do this, she needs to be doing that work FIRST, without your input.
