I can understand the desire not to get a L. it is a lot of $$ and given the amount of your assets it might not make a ton of sense, especially when you go the route of "send all the docs to my L." However, I think you are entitled to some degree of spousal support and also you should TOTALLY go after the pension, or at least don't take it off the table. Keep it there as a bargaining chip even if you decide you are OK to leave it be in exchange for 3-5 years of spousal support or something like that. Also I think in most states, the value of all his tools and pocket knives and other possessions, as long as they weren't gifts or inheritances and he didn't bring them into the M, are half yours. So if he takes all his pocketknives and tools and they're worth $10k total, you get $5k more of the cash.
Don't let him bully you into no mediation. Talk to a L and understand your rights in your state even if you have to pay for the hour or whatever. Totally worth it.
Know in your heart that what is he saying is BS. Total BS. Erase it. Let it roll off you like beads of water.
You got this.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
Do you have an estimate of how much a L would cost? Myself, I had no idea going in. The information I had was from rumour and those sensational stories that get passed around. My own lawyer dealings were a modest flat fee. I paid $4000 for my L and $1000 for her’s.
Maybe lawyers the US are higher. I hear it is. See rumours. Most products in the US are less expensive than in Canada, so why not lawyers. Point being don’t get ramped up with unfounded expectations.
Now, if H gets wound up, that is when you especially need a lawyer. Either way; H all amicable or fighting you tooth and nail; your mental and emotional health is important.
I left most everything up to my lawyer - the house deed, car ownership, overdraft, pension, homesteader rights, etc. Plus a bunch of other stuff I didn’t even existed. You do sign a lot of papers.
In truth, if I had to do all that paperwork now - and I’m stable and mentally a-ok now, I wasn’t back then - I’d have trouble. There is so much to do. And my divorce was rather easy. The legality, negotiating, and paperwork is something that should not be tackled by those involved. You are emotionally compromised and mistakes will be made.
I came through this mess rather efficiently, effectively, and regret-free. Not fighting W, keeping the business in the hands of the lawyers, is one of the things that helped. Sure, her and I (and the kids since she had to include them) talked and “negotiated”, and she changed her mind, changed the agreement seven times. That’s only what I know about, can probably times that by 100 for how many times she changed her mind without telling us. MLCers are confused!
Until the settlement is on paper and awaiting their signature - it’s all talk.
In the spirit of helpful disclosure, you had asked how you make a MLC do something. I said you cannot make them do anything, which is true. However, if they think feel it’s their idea, they might do it. Notice feel, not think.
My MLC wife wanted a quick divorce. She was driven by freedom, not money. She actually is quite a rare one, leaving her kids and wanting minimalistic finances. We were separated in 60 days after the night of BD, her dumping her kids, and moving in with OM. What a three hours that was!
During those 60 days she has a surgery that took her out of commission for 30 days. She was pretty anxious to get the separation finalized. Lawyers wisely slow down the process; even with that, my situation is a bit record setting. Speedy and a bit famous; I am a bit known, but she is well known in the lawyer circle.
It is hard to negotiate with an MLCer; they are so entitled. XW walked around our house like it was a shopping centre as she was deciding what she would take or not. It’s tough not to blow up in face of all that smugness. Remember play the long game, stay indifferent.
Of course I was a mess and just kept drinking my STFU smoothie. I listened to my L and followed his advice. I suspect he knew much better than I what he was doing. Ha, that’s a dumb statement - of course he knows better. He’s a lawyer!
Leverage. To negotiate you need to know what the other wants. MLCers drop lots of clues, listen carefully. XW wanted out. The way things happened my L crafted the agreement and sent the signed copy to her L. Her L would get the agreement to her in a few days. XW would then review. Oh the delays of the system. Lol. She felt she was the one holding up her freedom. She even told me her resentment to her L, to the financial planners, to the delays, and she didn’t want to wait. She felt the delay and she wanted to feel better.
If they feel something is their idea then they will look into it. XW hated the drives to the city an hour away to see her L. She hated coming back empty-handed. Hated her L for making her see another planner.
I didn’t create this leverage. Nor did I actually formally use it. But, I saw it play out. I listened to my lawyer, my best friend, my parents, my uncle who all said let her sign the papers, get this done - even though I felt differently. Yep, I assure you I was emotional compromised. Sure glad to have had good smart people in my corner, and that I actually listened.
By the way this is all before I found this place. I do know, I’d have felt better if I had these wise folks sharing their hard earned wisdom. I felt terrible about the agreement for a good long while. When I did find this place, and people who walked before me - again, I listened.
Three years. XW got what she wanted - all of it! No kids. No pension. No alimony. No house. No cars. No dogs. What?!? No way! I assure you, it’s true. Its such an odd situation.
Your situation is unfolding. It will most likely head off in a direction you can’t even guess at the moment. Listen to the compassionate wisdom of this place. Getting through this healed, regret-free, and forgiving is possible.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Please, please check out lawyers and find one as soon as you can. Do not allow him to manipulate you into doing something that isn't going to be good for you. Right now, it's all about him and how much he can get away w/in the way of making sure you get what you are entitled to.
Here's a thought. When you can, start purchasing gift cards and hide them away. You can use them at a later date if money gets tighter. There is no paper trail unless he discovers them.
Last edited by job; 07/26/2008:23 PM. Reason: added link to new thread
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
