I would concur with many of your statements as far as my past experiences go. No all of the men I've been involved with have had that type of a response, but sad to say....the majority of them have.
Fortunately, my H doesn't question and in fact seems to want my guidance.
Ah, the male ego strikes again: "There are very simple ways-- without an MRI machine, to tell if a woman is faking an O or not."
If you truly believe this, you are simply wrong and the confidence with which most men believe this is a big part of the problem. I know of no aspect of an orgasm that women cannot fake convincingly, except, perhaps female ejaculation. Of course, I understand that some women fake this by peeing a little, but urine is of course detectable.
I do think it is excellent that you apparently acknowledge the possiblity of faking during sex and make it clear that it is not necessary. That will make women appreciate you, even if they still go on to fake occassionally.
I have a very difficult time telling my lover what to do. It has not so much been an issue in the past like it is now. Other people have been enthusiastic and so they tried a lot of different things so I enjoyed the anticipation of "what would he do next?" more than I worried about whether it was the perfect touch. H is so tentative that my reluctance to say anything has definately become a problem.
I would discuss more about this whole g spot thing, or some of those positions mentioned (one of my faves that H has never tried with me) but I am getting too horny. You can laugh but right now I am horny at that "can't concentrate teenager level" and I'm at work so I better get it under control.
Quote: Ah, the male ego strikes again: "There are very simple ways-- without an MRI machine, to tell if a woman is faking an O or not."
If you truly believe this, you are simply wrong and the confidence with which most men believe this is a big part of the problem.
I TOTALLY agree with OT on this. If a woman decides to fake there is absolutely NO WAY a guy can tell whether or not she is faking. For one thing, clearly just from this discussion, women's orgasmic responses, by their own definitions, are so different... from the "little tingle" to the spasmodic contractions, and everything in between... the final authority on whether she had an O is the woman herself. If she says she had one, what is the guy going to do-- argue with her?
All that crap about flushing, erect nipples, even moisture (all the way from simple lubrication to "female ejaculation")-- not consistently conclusive.
NO guy can conclusively tell a fake from the real thing. No way. No how.
Quote: some of those positions mentioned (one of my faves that H has never tried with me)
I also have a favorite position that every guy I've been with has loved, but bf will not do it. The fragility of his E requires that he stick to known things and tried and true stuff.
Ah... there's a good expression "The Fragility of His E" and I don't mean his ego. It's all about the E, not about ME. He gave me a fabulous, heart-stopping, screaming, climbing-the-walls O a few weeks ago with his hand, and I'd love to have that again, but he's not interested. My pleasure is not a high priority. (Boy, do I ever sound bitter this morning...)
I hate to bruise the male ego but will have to agree with OT and Lil on this one for sure. There is no way I guy can tell if his partner has O'd. I know that will drive BF crazy but you might as well here the truth, right? It's not a reflection on how the man is as a lover. It is ultimately up to the W to make herself reach an O. So what's the big deal? Why do guys take such offense? Whatcha think BF?
Wish I would have read this prior to my search and destroy mission and scratched the hell out of myself looking for something I was apt not to find under the circumstances.
Gel we may have to go private so I can get some more info out of you on this one.
I asked the H about this last night. Took awhile to be able to bring up the subject to him not things we normally talk about but his response was enough to make me say male ego may stand in the way for a man to be open to think about this. Of course he has never been good with hypothetical questions anyhow so that may have some play in his response also.
I am taking in this thread and came to realize quite few years ago, that if a woman wants or does not need an O, while I might be disappointed, that is OK and faking is something I can do without. I would rather hear what the woman liked about being together (Lou's great back rubs) than have her think she has to do something deceptive.
When I was younger and less knowledgeable, BB having an O or faking one?, did boost my ego. So I think the younger, less knowledgeable guys still don't know that a woman's O has a lot/more to do with the woman than the man. (not including the wam-bam or guys that don't take clues)
RE: Lil men...we find on this board... who just want to know what gives their women pleasure so they can DO it.
Lil, I am going to take that as the guy is trying to find out what the woman likes but she won't say, or the woman thinks nothing the guy might try, would help her enjoy sex. IE. preverbal ND wife.
All I can say, if BB would say what she likes and give some directions as to what she liked (here/there, softer/harder, faster/slower, I would at least accommodate her several times. I say this, because I think most guys (SSH) that are on the forum would do/think the same way. Am I totally open to all things? No, too many bacteria, if you get my drift.
You said many guys don't take directions very well. I can see where this is true, given the fact some guys have too much ego attached to their sexual beliefs (it should be this or that way), believe others feel the same way they do or feel others like things they like. Some people/guys don't know how varied sexual likes/dislikes are or what each person deems appropriate or inappropriate.
BF Im fine with it if you cant right now' I think this works and sounds good to me. 'There is no need to fake an O. Its insulting when you do, Though truthful, I think this often would come across as insulting to many woman unless there was a great deal of trust for both partners.
There are different tilts to women’s I hear that BF. Learned it through books and the inter-net.
Jumping thru hoops will just make you good at jumping thru hoops......don’t make women horny. What book was that in? Maybe I relied too much on books? Nothing like first/second person experience. I guess books are good sources too.
but you might as well here the truth, right? It's not a reflection on how the man is as a lover. It is ultimately up to the W to make herself reach an O. So what's the big deal? Why do guys take such offense? Whatcha think BF? 
I guess books are good sources too.