Quote: and would likely let you know when they're leaving
That's my H's expertise. He is really good at it. He stopped doing the rude comes and goes when I stopped caring. I think he figured he wasn't getting any response from me (I used to call him and ask - crying - whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy??? why do you do thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat??? LOL) I guess once I started not responding, it ended all the fun for him.
Your H is DYING for your attention, negative or not. He is feeling so scared and quilty that his defense is an attack, even if it is a passive-aggressive one.
Ya know, it's really weird: I haven't done the begging, pleading thing. At first, I kinda tried to corner my H to find out what the he!! was going through his head. But I never begged him to come home or anything. I guess since I'd been through this before, I just knew better. But sometimes I wonder if it gave me a disadvantage. GAL, 180s et al are so much more obvious if you've done the begging, pleading thing. My H prolly looks at me and just thinks, "Meh, didn't phase her too much. She'll be alright."
Oh well. I do things the simple way, I guess, and that's why I don't understand what he's doing. If I want attention, I ask for it ... or just make sure I get it, ya know? None of this passive-aggressive stuff, though.
But thanks for pointing that out. I've never quite thought of things that way. And I think I might scoot by the library today to see if I can find that book!
Quote: Ya know, it's really weird: I haven't done the begging, pleading thing. At first, I kinda tried to corner my H to find out what the he!! was going through his head. But I never begged him to come home or anything. I guess since I'd been through this before, I just knew better. But sometimes I wonder if it gave me a disadvantage. GAL, 180s et al are so much more obvious if you've done the begging, pleading thing. My H prolly looks at me and just thinks, "Meh, didn't phase her too much. She'll be alright."
I'll do a ME TOO here...I also didn't beg/plead Wanker. My attitude and what I always told him was that if he didn't want to be with me, then I would respect that and let him go. I didn't want to go through the same BS that I did with my exH. It was about 4mos before I did the okay...I am hurting blah blah blah and his response, Why now? Why are you saying all this NOW? Who knows if it would have made a difference if I had said it in the beginning...he was playing games and out to hurt me, I simply let him know that I was tired of playing HIS game and he had won...and yes I did hurt.
That conversation led to one month of complete darkness on both of us and then led to our day together...but truly I don't think it made a difference one way or the other...it was all too late.
Wow, Sassy. Thanks for sharing! That actually makes me feel better. Soon after my H left, I went dark for about three weeks, then "ventured out" by asking him to change my oil. That was right before Thanksgiving. Then I called him one night and asked if we could take the gloves off and talk for a minute. He had just served court papers on me to get me to move outta the house. I had a nice, long validating conversation with him. That's when I told him that what he was doing was hurting me, that I knew he must be hurting too to be able to serve papers on me, and that I was sorry for the pain he was feeling -- or something along those lines. (That was per the advice of, like, one of the wisest DBers I know.) And it worked like a charm!! I just knew it wouldn't 'cause H was spewing venom at me from the time he left until I went dark. The whole "I hate you," "It makes me sick that I'm gonna be sharing a child with you," "You're the biggest f--kin' bitch I've ever met," etc. etc.
But when I called him and made that "validating" comment, he said, "My pain isn't your fault. You didn't do this to me," and "I don't see how you could ever want a relationship with me again after what I've done to you."
It was beautiful. And that's what led into our three-week session of reconciling last month. He would pop in and out, started coming back to our Sunday night "family nights" with the girls and me, changed my lightbulbs in the house, etc.
Then the OW bust. . I still think that was classic.
Anyway, that's a long version of me telling you, Sassy, that I've been reading through your threads, and it sounds like you and I are a lot alike. I guess I'm not too surprised that you would have handled the initial bomb the same way I did. And we'll see how my drama plays out over the next few months ... then we'll compare so we can advise our new DBers whether to initially throw themselves at the feet of their WASs -- even if it's a forced thing -- or just give them space right from the jump.
Hey, we're all guinea pigs, right?? Thanks again for your post.
I'm a little late into your thread so I don't know if you are a reader or not...but since you seem to think we're on the same wavelength here...a suggestion of a book that did more for me than any other book I read. Your Best Life Now by Joel Osteen.
Don't get me wrong, I am not a bible thumper...no offense to any religious folks on board...I am a Cali girl, who's honestly been to Temple than she has been to Church...and I live in the bible belt, where religion and hypocrisy walk hand in hand...but I accidently turned on the tv one Sunday am and found Joel Osteen and was blown away...and have watched his program ever since...he is big on the difference between being a Victim and a Victor, survivor...etc...and I know that I am definitely a Survivor.
I've seen and been through more in my life than most on this board have, and somehow I have survived it all. Ah, the book I could/should write one day...ah the lives that would be destroyed (LOL!!). There are people in life that get it and others that just never will...that makes the difference between being a Victim and a Victor...I think everyone who comes here wants to be a victor, they just need to find their way and I think that is what this board and everyone here does...it's just a matter of where we all go from here.
And yes, the validation thing is huge...the day Wanker and I met and talked and I spent the day validating him til I could take it no more and then called him on it...he backed off like there was no tomorrow and I knew then and there...it wasn't all that he nor I thought it was...but it wasn't for me to help him out of the sitch he had gotten himself into...my rescuing days are over...my horse trainer is a wise man, and he once told me to Stop Trying to Save the World and worry about myself for once...and that's what I am finally attempting to do...that is the hardest thing I have ever done in my life...phew...
Hugs to you baby doll...you have so much courage that I cannot begin to tell you how much I admire and respect you. A big huge hug...
On Lactose Intolerance....well...in a lame attempt to eat right I was eating a bowl of shredded wheat for breakfast every morning and despite eating healthier, my clothes were tight and my tummy hurt. I thought well, maybe too much fiber, so I switched to a less fibrous cereal and still had it. I assumed it was just me being fat and my clothes too tight, but then I realized that my tummy was actually hurting.....I was just swollen and bloated, like when you have really bad gas, except I had no gas. Someone mentioned symptoms their lactose intolerant child had, in a completely irrelevant conversation and I started thinking hmm....sounds just like what i have. So I quit drinking milk/having cereal and eating yogurt and it went away completely. Just to test, a few weeks later I tried it again and I blew up like a balloon again.
SUcks, especially when you make cookies and want milk and cookies....or a new cereal that looks good.
Email & MSN Messenger: Becca_1975@msn.com
Yesterday Is History
Tomorrow is a Mystery.
Today is a Gift.
That Is Why It Is Called "The Present"
Hey, Lisa! I know the feeling about having been through enough to write a book. I've been told I should write a book for about 8 years now, and the hits just keep on comin'! But for some reason, I have to wonder if my life would really be that interesting to people outside my circle of friends, ya know? Overcoming adversity: It would be a great topic, I guess, but a pretty common one. Oh well. I'll just stick to the boards for now.
I went to the library and checked out your book suggestion; I'd heard of it before, so it must mean I need to read it. The one caverna suggested isn't available at my library, so I'm thinking of ordering a few books from Amazon. I'm going to list the few I ran across that look interesting and had good reviews, in the hopes that some of you have read some of these and can say yay or nay to them. Here's the list (and hold tight after that, 'cause I have a question about something):
Infidelity: A Survivor's Guide (Don-David Lusterman) After the Affair (Janis A. Spring) Repairing Your M After His A (Marcella Weiner, Armand Dimele) Surviving Infidelity (Rona Subotnik, Gloria Harris) *recommended by caverna Patterns of Infidelity and Their Treatment (Emily Brown) Affairs: A Guide to Working Through the Repurcussions of Infidelity (Emily Brown)
Okay, here's the $21 million question (though if you answer right, you don't get $21 million ): Would you guys consider my sitch as being infidelity? Here's why I ask: In everything I've read on the subject so far, the offending spouse generally has the A while M. Yeah, mine was obviously contemplating sleeping with OW while he was with me -- he had that 40-minute call to her a couple days before he left -- but it appears he actually left me to be with her. Is that really infidelity? And will any book that you guys know of actually address an A *after* the H has left? Is it *really* considered an A at all, since he left me first?
I guess another reason it doesn't feel like the "normal A" is that my H's blaming *me* for ruining our chance to reconcile because I was the "manipulative bitch" who walked in on him and OW, knowing what I was going to see.
Hmmm. I dunno. It seems to me that in most cases of infidelity, the offending partner feels guilty and wants to actually work on the M -- even if s/he also wants the OP. Mine wants out. Period. Or at least he does right now. So I'm just wondering if any book on infidelity is going to apply to my sitch.
And BTW, I'm also planning to get some books on healing, so please don't assume I'm "stuck" in trying to figure out the problem. This is just how I am. I like to get into the minds of all kinds of people, and that, in turn, seems to help me.
That being said, any feedback on whether the infidelity issue actually applies to my sitch at all would be greatly appreciated.
Now, Becca ... that *sucks*! But I'm glad you found out what the problem was. I seem to be having a swelling, bloating feeling going on right now in my stomach, too. Wonder what that is??!! Don't eat anymore cereal. Capeesh??
Hi, I have just caught up with your story. And I want to share something....
My H was sleeping around while I was pregnant. And continued to do so after the baby came home. I was absolutely clueless stupid stupid stupid. He wasn't having an affair - just lots of sex with different women that was not me.
That baby just turned 10 a month ago, we had two more after that.
My sitch wasn't as bad - my H begged me to stay. He was so remorseful, blah blah blah. I was SHOCKED beyond belief. He was my Knight in shining armor. Duh Duh Duh.
Well - we did stay together and I do not regret it at all. My H had serious issues - that were not apparent to me. He was seriously immature in some ways and got his ego fed and fed and fed by his ability to get other women in bed. Whenever he felt inferior, or like he couldn't handle this grown up life (and expectations) he went for a roll in the hay. Like once every six months or so. (for like 3 years).
He got some counseling - then got some really good counseling - and he is a grown up now. He does not cheat anymore and I honestly believe he has not since the day I found out. (Baby was 8 months old). He honestly just could not handle it. He did not have the tools to deal with it all. When we got married we bought a house and were trying to be adults.
I know now that it had absolutely NOTHING to do with me. He didn't know how to make himself feel capable and important so he let stupid girls do it for him.
Here's my one warning though. I am hanging out at these boards because H told me recently "he doesn't have any more to give". etc etc etc. One big problem we have had - until only very recently - is that I never really forgave him. I said I did. I wanted to. I believed he no longer acted that way. But I just could not get over the fact that he didn't love me enough not to do that.
Again - it had absolutely nothing to do with me and how much he loved me. He had low self-esteem that he built up by cheating. (His parents were always pretty shitty to him - I think he's relied on girls to make him feel good since he was 12).
Anyway. I am really sorry that you are living through this. I don't know what will happen, but I wish you all the luck in the world. Just remember remember remember that this is NOT your fault. He needs to grow up.
Hmmm...just thinking of all the ways I can spend my 21million dollars...you can pay it out monthly...no complaints here.
Yes, dear, that is infidelity...if you are in a committed relationship and one person becomes involved in an A, whether EA/PA it's all the same...infidelity...whether or not he had phsycial contact with her before he left you or not is perhaps also a 21million dollar question...but that's neither here nor there...
I really only read one book on infidelity...being honest here...most of the books that I skimmed through were on healing after the fact...and nothing about what or how to handle the sitch when your WAS was gone. So I found DB/DR and then realized the whole GAL and that was when I turned the focus on me and decided to find me again and read all that I could about not necessarily healing, but more about spiritual growth and self-improvement. I think one of the best books I did come across was MakeUp Not BreakUp and then of course Mars and Venus. Both great R books that more than anything delve into the differences between men/women and distancers/pursuers...learned probably more in the MakeUp book..and then the Good Feeling book. Personally I think these 3 should be in every household in America but that's just me.
I've followed your sitch for a while now and I also have alot of admiration and respect for you. I, too, waver from day to day, thinking .....I am done with this man (and I use the term loosely); let's have some fun with his idiocy. Then I realize that using my H for amusement purposes will not result in what I ultimately want. (although I am not sure WHAT it is I want these days).
My H also says he is done. I think, at most, he was having an EA at the time he left, although the OW did not surface (to my knowldege, at least, til after he was gone about 2 months)....
It's sort of like, which came fist the chicken or the egg (the OW or the MLC)? Like you, I can't find too much written about OW's AFTER the H moves out.
I think both situations involve the H feeling he is entitled to his A. And I'm not sure it really makes a difference when the OW comes into the picture. I do, however, know that whether or not H is still married (by law), he considers himself to be "single".
