This past weekend was odd, good I guess, nice, certainly, but I have learned that reading too much into things only sets me up for disappointment, so I am very cautious.
Just to recap, Thursday was a really bad day for me, H was on phone w/OW when I went to bed early Wednesday night, and I "sorta" lost it....actually I thought I did a pretty good job of expressing my frustration without being accusing, but of course he got mad and I cried....that's the "losing it part....then Thursday we had an email conversation and I got this response from him "I LOVE YOU TOO. I don't know what happened for those 10 long years, but it was so great in the beginning and it has been so much better for the past 6 months. Please just hang in there today." He promised to be home by 8:30 from his long walk that night so we could have some time...he actually got home about 10 after 8 just after me. asked if I wanted to watch some tv or something, so we did, in our usual spots and then he said "I'll sit there with you if you'd like" (on the couch)...of course I liked! so he came and sat with his arm around my shoulder for the evening. We ML Friday, Saturday AM he left for "work", before he left I hugged him and told him I treasured him, and he pulled me close and held me and said "you're my treasure too".....I swear, he sounds so sincere. He got home about 1, complaining he didnt feel well, I put my arms around him for a hug, whispered in his ear that was because he wasnt spending enough "good lovin" time with me...he held me tight again and whispered in my ear "you're absolutely right". Saturday evening it was so pretty, and he asked if I wanted to sit on the porch for a while, so we sat in the swing and just talked for a while. Saturday night when we went to bed, I gave him the 9 page letter I've worked on writing for months and carried around and debated about giving him...I intended to post it here and just wound up giving it to him. I don't think it was bad though, and one reason I held off giving it to him was I wanted to make sure that my expectations were low....I didn't want to expect any results from his response. I finally decided that my goal was to express some of my conclusions from my personal "soul searching" and what I intend to do with my life, so I wnet ahead and did it. I told him I could see some of the reasons in our marriage that might have led him to see an A as the best way to ease his pain, some reasons that I could see we had both kind let things get to that point, and that I intend to never go back to being as miserable as I was....his hands shook some as he read it, and he said "well, thank you" and carefully put all the pages back together....no ML Saturday or Sunday , said his back hurt on Sunday from mowing on Sat., but we sat on the porch and grilled steaks and talked. H was talking about what we would need to do to get the camper back on the road, and how he wants to get into weight lifting/body building big time, and we need to get back to getting his weight room going, and asked if I thought we could still get reservations for a short trip to "our cabin" this fall. both of these last 2 he's been kind of let go by the wayside lately, so I've just let it drop. But I don't know, and am very cautious with expectations, but it seems like maybe he moved closer again. S had a friend over Friday night and spent the night with the friend on Sat. so was "busy", at one point he was standing in the kitchen and was staring at me with huge eyes....I asked if it was my imagination or if his dad seemed "warmer" and he said "MUCH! Where do you think these dinner plate eyes came from?"... I only heard from him by email 2X today, but in one of them he said he loves to hear from me.
So I don't know, SO MANY times it's look like things were in the home stretch and then he runs back to ow, but still I think these are hopeful signs.
I am trying to focus on more of what I need to do...that is tricky, because I'm so used to taking care of everybody else. I've found out about ww meetings, and am trying to decide which might work into my schedule, and am really focused on getting things organized/redone in the house...also redoing some chairs for D and SIL....I splurged and bought a small but nice stereo system for in our bedroom this weekend, and spent more money than I should on candles...(I'm still working on that decorating project) so I'm not sitting around pining for him and wringing my hands but I'm still not at the point where I don't care what happens.
Frankly I'm kind of encouraged by his response to the letter, I was honest about my thoughts, feelings, wishes and intentions, and I was afraid it would cause him to withdraw, but it doesnt seem to have. I told him it was frightening to share that with him....so we shall see.....at least he knows my "take" on the sitch.
Hi Pen, I don't think we've ever posted to each other and I havent been able to locate your threads, so I'm being very presumptous here, but.... I know on Slowly's thread that you mentioned how you would respond to the email her H sent as a former OW....
I know every sitch is different, but when you were OW, how would you have responded to getting a letter saying that things in the A currently werent meeting his needs that included a list of things that needed to improve? on the list were sex, compassion, not holding grudges, seeing things from others point of view, apologize, see your part, need for reciprocity in the relationship and an explanation of what that is, and several others...
I hope you don't mind my asking, I'm just really curious ( I found this handwritten list on my husbands dresser about a month ago after one of his sleepless nights)
Deb, so rarely do A's have a clear-cut ending. I do think, like you, that your H is working his way back to you. I see more positives than negatives...especially now. Just keep doing what works, and you will be fine.
I know it takes a while for these things to end. It sucks, but you have to let him go through the process, or he will always feel unresolved.
Hi Nevanna, thanks so much for your input, I've not been at all good about posting to you, but I do lurk on your thread sometimes...I'll try to do better! It helps to know you see positives. sometimes I "feel" them and then it seems like it's back to "square one" or even further back, and I get so frustrated. I don't know, it is big for him to sit beside me on the couch with his arm around me, and propose "little things" like sitting on the porch. I don't think he's done this since we were dating. It's interesting though, he seems almost kind of timid about suggesting these things. I LOVE them, and I always make sure I tell him how much I like them....my theory has always been that behavior that's rewarded is repeated, so I guess I'm putting that theory to the test. It just seems to take forever though. Can you believe I used to be less patient than I am now?
thinking, thinking, thinking, always thinking on this stuff. It occurred to me that "pursuit" to a certain extent seems to be a very effective technique with H right now, in fact it seems to be the only thing that has really positive results....I don't know if I posted last thursday, but I got an email from him that said "I don't like it when you pull back and withdraw"...
It's occurred to me yesterday and this morning that I HAVE always been somewhat distant, because I thought that was the way I "should" be (not sure where I got that idea), but also I really thought that was what H preferred. At the same time, I truely believe now that H NEEDS lots of displays of affection and verbal affirmation....he would never ever admit it or let on, but from the way he responds, I've come to believe that he must be/have been feeling really empty and alone inside, and that's how OW got her shot at him. I'm convinced some of this, much of it in fact, comes from his childhood. His parents are well-meaning, but terribly judgemental and "cold" towards their boy children, not to mention being intrusive. So here we have arrived at this mess, not because we didnt love each other, but because we didnt understand each others needs and were afraid to really push/explore....so we just pulled back and retreated and became more and more miserable and distant and hurt and vulnerable. Sad Interesting that this seems so crystal clear to me this morning and it has taken me so long to get to this point of being able to see it. I feel in my gut that this is right, though.
I was sound asleep, and heard H exclaim "oh crap" and he jumped out of bed and ran, I think, into the bathroom...woke me up, I was thinking "WTF????" well it seems the alarm he sets to go off at 5:15 so he can call OW didnt go off ( I DID NOT sabotage it, I SWEAR on the Bible!) and he told me later the clock said 7:45 and he ran into the bathroom so he could see his watch...it was actually 5:45. I don't think he had time to call OW, if he did it was very short, like about 2 minutes!!!!!! wonder what she thinks of that?
I stumbled into the bathroom kind of disoriented, H said he forgot my coffee, should he go get it? I told him it was ok, I'd get some in a bit....and bless his heart, about 2 minutes later he stopped in the middled of shaving, with shaving cream on 1/2 his face still, went downstairs and brought me a nice mug of fresh, steamy coffee. I was so touched, I saw that as a real act of love, and told him thanks, that was a very loving thing, and hugged him.
Last night I was "hit" by the thought of how terribly down and discouraged and alone and depressed he must have been when I was so distant. Before I left for work, I hugged him close, told him I loved him and that I've been such a fool...he hugged back and said he had also been a fool....then he suggested we would need to find some "naughty time tonight"...told him it works for me.
I don't know, I keep reminding myself "no expectations, no expectations, don't believe what he says", but it FEELS like we are inching closer together in the teeniest tiniest increments. I believe we are both terrified of being hurt again so badly by the other.
I told him last night I was working on another letter, and he told me he loves to get them.....I never would have guessed that, ever, after all these years.
I think it was PSLuke who mentioned she'd thought of trying to be the OW, so I'm thinking really hard along the lines of how i might start to do that, how I might romance him a little at a time. He really seems to crave it. so weird.
weird, weird, weird, weird. Who would EVER think that an almost 50 year old guy would crave "romantic" attention from a woman????? It seems so juvenile, except, I don't believe he has ever gotten it in his life EXCEPT a tiny bit from me when we were first together, and of course from OW, who picked up on this unrecognized need and REALLY dished it out! H never dated much, because it was something his family really looked down on for guys and worked hard to "squelch". This seems so adolescent because it is. He missed out on those experiences at the developmentally appropriate time and that's why he's so driven now by this need. OK, not a problem, I can do this and have fun doing it, especially when it seems to get such positive results. Why the heck did it take me so long to figure this out? Lord, the pain and misery we would have all been spared if I had.
And, H doesnt know how to ask for what he needs, he never learned that either. I don't think I did either. So it's almost like we are just beginning to make the effort to learn to know each other all over again. I really do believe he is making the effort, his steps are just so tiny you could miss them if you didnt look hard. When he asked me if I wanted to set on the porch swing Saturday, he had first asked if I was finished working outside and he should lock the door????? I said something about no, I was going to go work some more....some how it got the the point of one of us saying it was such a pretty evening we should go enjoy, and H said "I was going to ask that but I thought you were busy so I would just stay in and out of your way "...then he asked if I would like to go swing, and of course there's little I would like better....So I see we have been missing each others cues for YEARS.......
Of course then I remember a post someone made to me months ago about that we can't "love them out" of the MLC or mess their in.....and I confuse myself.
I guess the important thing is to try it with eyes wide open and see what works...do what works and stop what doesnt work. Obviously being the cool strong, distant type hasnt worked with H....down deep I don't think that's the "real me" either....I've just learned to be that way to try to avoid being hurt.
Maybe we can sometimes "love them out of it" if that's where the problem originated?
Quote: At the same time, I truely believe now that H NEEDS lots of displays of affection and verbal affirmation....
That's my H as well. I learned early on in my DBing that the H loved hearing ILY and getting gifts.
Quote: I was sound asleep, and heard H exclaim "oh crap" and he jumped out of bed and ran, I think, into the bathroom...
LOL!! Sorry, this is just too funny...
Quote: I believe we are both terrified of being hurt again so badly by the other.
Yes. My H has said as much on more than one occasion. He's amazingly vocal for a WAH.
Quote: Does any of this make any sense?
Yes...reminds me a lot of my own H...
I don't believe he ever got appropriate attention from his family. He pathologically avoids criticism, and seeks out any and all company he sees as being "on his side"--anybody who builds him up or makes him feel good about himself.
, said his back hurt on Sunday from mowing on Sat., but we sat on the porch and grilled steaks and talked. H was talking about what we would need to do to get the camper back on the road, and how he wants to get into weight lifting/body building big time, and we need to get back to getting his weight room going, and asked if I thought we could still get reservations for a short trip to "our cabin" this fall. both of these last 2 he's been kind of let go by the wayside lately, so I've just let it drop. But I don't know, and am very cautious with expectations, but it seems like maybe he moved closer again. S had a friend over Friday night and spent the night with the friend on Sat. so was "busy", at one point he was standing in the kitchen and was staring at me with huge eyes....I asked if it was my imagination or if his dad seemed "warmer" and he said "MUCH! Where do you think these dinner plate eyes came from?"... I only heard from him by email 2X today, but in one of them he said he loves to hear from me. 
"...then he asked if I would like to go swing, and of course there's little I would like better....So I see we have been missing each others cues for YEARS.......