I’m still so lost -Pt 2

[Kind18]

Realize H is on his path. Most of his blaming is projection since he cannot blame himself. He will twist and manipulate his world to fit whatever it is he feels he needs at that moment.

DNJ is 100% correct.

People in affairs or MLC don’t have the internal strength to admit it, and often have spent a whole life playing victim in their own mind.

It’s impossibly difficult for them to continue forward with a bad view of themselves. So they do the only thing they know how - they project blame onto their husband/wife… that way they can forge ahead with their crappy behaviour and yet it’s not their fault.

Most importantly for you, Patnee, you can’t do or say or be anything which is going to change him or wake him up. You being at fault is his get-out-of-shame free card.

[Sunflyer]

Hi Patnee:

You really do describe well what it can be like to deal with this. The word is "alien."

Your story and DnJ's are shocking and heartbreaking to read. I don't have anything to compare, really. I don't know if my wife is experiencing MLC. But I do see that this is not the person I've loved, not the person I married.

The person I loved wrote me that her marriage vows mattered with the utmost of seriousness. That she would not leave me unless I wanted her to go. That we could work through messes. That is all forgotten now.

The person I loved had a cheerful "Hi!" for me everyday. Now I never hear that. She still gives me a smile now and then; at other times she stares as I walk by, as if I were stalking her.

The person I loved would not throw family photographs into the trash, because they represented happier times in our relationship, like our engagement and wedding. Now she has done that, even if I am not in the photographs. Photographs of her aunts and uncles. Of her with her late grandmother, whom she adored. I saved some of those photos from the trash, when she was not aware.

The person I loved would not speak to my own family behind my back about our problems, especially when I told her not to. Now she has my younger sister telling her that she can "do better" than me.

I am sure that, like the others who have told you their stories, you probably worked hard for your husband. Pulled the moon down from the sky for him. Believed he would be there for you when it got hard, not just when it was easy, instead of running away.

Now, regardless of what happens, you are grabbing that moon down from the sky, for you. You deserve whatever happiness you can create for yourself. May the future smile on you and grant you peace.

[Pattnee5]

Anyhow, your H displays plenty signs of crisis. Read your paragraph of his living conditions and self care. Read it like you read my retelling of my XW. It’s rather clear your H’s state. As unbelievable incredible as it is. (Incredible instead of unbelievable. Our minds are constantly listening and will craft as we ask it to.)

Your H is not living like he is because he wants to. He is because he is driven to. He is in deep depression. Experiencing feelings and torments that are foreign and unrealized. He has no idea of their origin or reason. The sheer magnitude of these feelings is off the scale and equally foreign to him. He has never felt anything so strong, and so uncontrolled.



. In fact, the trigger of our spouse’s emotional runaway train is triggered usually 18-24 months earlier. BD is just when their internal pressure has reached the point of simultaneous explosion and implosion. They are so hurt and broken they blow up everything around them.






D

HI D
Wow wow wow. I always so look forward to your responses and insight and this one has made me tear up. Such a powerful story and words, and helped me immensely. No question whatsoever that my H is in a similar way. The difference is he is so non committal to saying the words let’s make it permanent let’s divorce let’s sell the house etc, just a whole lot of I’m not sure but I think this is what I want.

I went back and googled again the main signs he ticks so many boxes. It never sat right at BD that he didn’t love me that this is what he has wanted for so long. Usually when a person is done they pack up and move straight out no questions straight to divorce do not pass go.

His obvious depression, becoming a recluse, lack of self care, constantly blaming me then shifting and blaming himself, apathetic, struggling to get out of bed some days, anger, substance abuse,
No remorse just constantly feeling bad for himself and no care for the hurt around him, immense procrastination saying he wants to fix himself get help seek medical help yet taking no action, avoiding all social situations and outings, avoiding people, alienating himself,on autopilot robotic , jealous of people around him, everything is a chore( the only thing he ever does is chores, work, gym, sleep repeat), complaining of getting old, flabby stomach, no more muscles, comparing to pictures of himself in his 30s where he had muscles, feeling old saying he’s old, impotence and blaming me the list goes on. I finally see this is a MLc or transition and I am front and centre as his supposed way out.

It truly is a sad thing. I feel sorry for him. I love him despite how many times he tries to kick me to the curb but I know this is now his path and his path alone. Nobody understands this. My family is so angry at him and won’t cut him any slack. They just say” well if he has mental problems he can go and get help” they can’t see that he just physically can’t do it and would rather blame me. They can’t understand how he can create such torment and turmoil on the kids on the family etc.
So many bridges are being burnt yet my love for him is still there.

I would say looking back now you are correct I would say 12 months pre BD I started to see the shift in behaviour, but just assumed it was a bad patch, because this man was my best friend and would always share his thoughts and feelings, would always stand up and seek help when needed. He was always so loving and caring and even just before this whole process wrote me the most heartfelt letter of declaring his undying love for me( only 1 year before BD). Then the alien slowly started to move in. The version of him now is one I have never seen in my whole 17 years of being married to him.I didn’t marry the alien. This alien moved in to H body about 18 months ago and I want him gone already.

Thankyou for your encouragement, I still am putting one foot in front of the other now and learning to be impartial to what he does or doesn’t do. I’ll keep standing solid in the wings and see where the story goes. My life and my kids life will keep moving and he has to run to catch up now,(no more me dragging him along)

I didn’t think it was a MLc I never wanted to label him and always found it easier to just take the blame. However I now truly know I am not to blame, this is not my fault I did not break him( I’ve been trying to save him) and he needs to find his own way out

Thanks again DnJ you truly have helped me in so many ways with this

[Pattnee5]

I should also really mention that while I am not going to go out of my way to make a big deal about the anniversary tomorrow( it’s just another day) I am torn whether I send him a message acknowledging that while it may not be a happy one, in my eyes he is still my H I still love him dearly and know in my heart after the bad always comes the good. I was thinking a letter under his door at the end of the day so there’s no pressure . But then my other half of my brain says to “tough love him” and let him live in his mess
I think until he tells me we are done for good and calls it final I need to assume he is on a seesaw in his head and I need to keep standing tall
I know it goes agains everything DB 😞

[Kind18]

Absolutely don’t.

Under no circumstances should you even acknowledge your anniversary.

Here’s a few incredibly good reasons why:

1. It reminds him you’re a love sick puppy dog ready to take him back, and so reinforces that he’s free to be a d*** as long as he wants. The “look at me, I still love you” dance is, in his eyes, a “here’s a green light to go and blow up your life while I wait for you” dance.

2. Men want what they can’t have. If he messages or acknowledges it, just completely ignore. It seems like a tantalising bait to take, and I expect you’ll crack because you think you have to show him you love him, but the only way he will miss you is if there’s radio silence. Don’t take bait.

3. Why would you want to acknowledge someone who goes back on their vows? Who doesn’t respect you enough to try and save the marriage? Have some self respect - you deserve someone loves and respects you just as much as you do them. “Happy anniversary” from him should be met with “oh that’s today? … I’m going out.”

Personally, I’d book a night out with friends. Go out for dinner to a nice restaurant and then go out dancing or to a bar afterwards. If you have kids, tell him he needs to watch them. Turn your phone off, go and have a great time!

[Terapin]

Kind is 100% right. DO NOT acknowledge it. Especially don't be the one to initiate it.

[Pattnee5]

Thanks Kind and terrapin. A fleeting moment of my hormones. I hate being a woman.I decided I would write a card and hide it and file it away. He may never see it depending on our circumstances in years to come If one day we ever get through this and in happier place I can give it to him to show I never forgot, but for now I will love him from afar. Funnily enough he already said he has had a bad day worried about tomorrow feeling sick about it having a meltdown about it and doesn’t want to see me or the kids. I just responded that I had no intention anyway as I had planned a day out with them and dinner. To which he replied maybe if he feels up to it he may come by, to which I responded sorry we are busy 🙄🤣
What a game.

[Pattnee5]

Hi Patnee:

You really do describe well what it can be like to deal with this. The word is "alien."

Your story and DnJ's are shocking and heartbreaking to read. I don't have anything to compare, really. I don't know if my wife is experiencing MLC. But I do see that this is not the person I've loved, not the person I married.

The person I loved wrote me that her marriage vows mattered with the utmost of seriousness. That she would not leave me unless I wanted her to go. That we could work through messes. That is all forgotten now.

The person I loved had a cheerful "Hi!" for me everyday. Now I never hear that. She still gives me a smile now and then; at other times she stares as I walk by, as if I were stalking her.

The person I loved would not throw family photographs into the trash, because they represented happier times in our relationship, like our engagement and wedding. Now she has done that, even if I am not in the photographs. Photographs of her aunts and uncles. Of her with her late grandmother, whom she adored. I saved some of those photos from the trash, when she was not aware.

The person I loved would not speak to my own family behind my back about our problems, especially when I told her not to. Now she has my younger sister telling her that she can "do better" than me.

I am sure that, like the others who have told you their stories, you probably worked hard for your husband. Pulled the moon down from the sky for him. Believed he would be there for you when it got hard, not just when it was easy, instead of running away.

Now, regardless of what happens, you are grabbing that moon down from the sky, for you. You deserve whatever happiness you can create for yourself. May the future smile on you and grant you peace.

Hi Sunflyer, I have been trying to construct my response to you all day thinking about it and now that I have time to sit I wanted to respond. Firstly Thankyou for your words( I’m certainly grabbing for that moon for me).
I had a quick read about your W situation and your situation and I am so sorry. I think something DnJ wrote above spoke so true to my heart. The whole maturity thing and acting like an 18 year old a teenager a kid. While I don’t know what your wife is going through emotionally, I can say women’s hormones suck and they fluctuate like crazy. Is she having a MLc? Maybe. But I can say that we want love we crave affection and in moments where we act like irrational teenagers there is someone else ( whether it’s physical or emotional) especially if she is distancing you. We want to be held and comforted. We wouldn’t push away that comfort if there wasn’t someone else.
I went through a terrible timewhen I was 30. Looking back now it was the worst time of my life. H was ignoring me immensely( worse than now) stopped wanting to come out and spend time with me or get intimate , throw in a bit of post natal depression and some crazy hormones, I started chasing my youth, started acting like a silly 18 year old going out drinking and partying with friends.And when one person paid a bit too much attention to me I made the worst mistake of my life which I still live with and had a PA and an EA. I thought I was done with H I would run away from my life my problems and be with this new person.However I do remember in that moment I rewrote my narrative and spun my garbage to validate my behaviour. I hated looking at H, felt alot of anger toward him for no reason other than he wasn’t loving me.I lacked love when I looked and my husband who was non existent in my life who never wanted to be with me hang out with me. I justified my irrational childish behaviour. And then one day I snapped out of it, the secret came out I felt immense relief and I fought for my H even though I broke him. I finally saw him again, saw his love his dedication.
I never wanted to leave him I just wanted him to see me and the only way I thought to get his attention was to do something so hurtful.I never forget the immense relief when he confronted me and then I fought like crazy for my marriage
Long story short he pledged his love we went to counselling we did a lot of work and for 9 years never had any issues( he regained his full trust and never brought it up). Now I am reliving that all over again as the alien has resurfaced that hurt and using it as the upper hand. I do deserve it I do feel so incredibly guilty even though I had forgiven myself and he had forgiven me. I don’t think that’s the full blame for what is going on now but it certainly is a card he is using a lot. I look back at myself then wnd can’t believe I was they person. I have grown and done alot of work on myself and will never be that juvenile 18 year old mess living in a 30 year old body. But I too remember the tunnel was dark, the routine was rubbish, H was not a good version of himself toward me and I made poor life choices. Which leads me to today, keeping myself afloat, weathering the storm wherever it will take me, refusing to succumb or seek comfort in anyone else’s arms as I did many moons ago. As a female our hormones are uncontrollable at times but there is no excuse for our behaviour and poor choices. I am glad my H fought for me, I felt relief when my secret secret was out. It was a horrible place for me to be and in a way I do deserve what I am going through now.
I do hope your W can sort her feelings out. I think my resilience and determination now comes from deep within those times and the growth I have done. I am dreading menopause but I have learnt a lot about myself, and one of my biggest lessons is my H can push me as much as he wants with his rubbish behaviour now ( possibly repeating his past behaviour) but I will never falter into the disgusting arms of another.
I really think a MLC between man and woman is so very different. I don’t think mine was a MLc rather a maturing as DnJ mentioned. One I desperately needed to get my reality check

I do wish to send you strength and love just as I need it too.
( as you can see with my thoughts today about the impending anniversary and if I should reach out-those lovely hormones have reared their ugly head)

[Kind18]

to which I responded sorry we are busy

This is how you DB. Calm, measured, responses which feel wrong but are actually the best way forward.

I guarantee it made him stop and think “Wonder what she’s doing if she says she is too busy for me to come over.”

You’re the prize here. Start acting like it, and maybe he will realise it too.

Well done Pattnee.

[Pattnee5]

Thankyou Kind
As I said I feel like I have finally found my voice and my courage( all bar my fleeting moments of wanting to profess my love to him in which case you all keep me in check).
His complete turn around of “oh maybe I will see how I feel and come say hi” after he just said “ I don’t want to see you tomorrow I am an emotional mess” was absolutely mind boggling. The indecisive. He looked so completely wrecked in the brief moment I saw him. He said he was emotionally wrecked. Had his head on the table. I felt so sorry for him😞 he complained I smothered him ( and I corrected him and told him I didn’t smother him I showered him with love when he needed it most)
Now a broken man and his emotions and I just sit and watch. At least the emotions are starting to surface I guess.
Anyway one step ahead of the other one day at a time