I'm Back! (2)

[Terapin]

Friend zoned? IDK, maybe.

Friend zoned = not sexually attracted.

It's funny though cause during BD, she actually said something along the lines of 'we have nothing in common. If we weren't married would we even be friends or talk to each other?'

That is the point of relationships...enjoying the differences. My lady does not fish, but she enjoys watching me fish.....I enjoy watching her sing Karaoke...but would not go if she wasn't into it.

I do however think I"m being too friendly/available to her.

Most of us are. There are ways to be friendly that are not needy. There are so many ways to increase our behavior to be more attractive. Pulling away is one of them. There is an art to it. I enjoy the seduction side of relationships. From my ladies responses, I believe she does as well.

I'm sure at some point this week she'll want to have another 'talk'.

So I really like this statement:

What do you do when you get married? You take someone who’s just as useless and horrible as you are, and then you shackle yourself to them. And then you say, we’re not running away no matter what happens…If you can run away, you can’t tell each other the truth…If you don’t have someone around that can’t run away, then you can’t tell them the truth. If you can leave, then you don’t have to tell each other the truth. It’s as simple as that, because you can just leave. And then you don’t have anyone to tell the truth to.

So if you do have another talk, use that statement as a guidline for YOUR LISTENING SKILLS. Do not preach it. Do not use it to keep her tied to you. Be the safe person she can talk to, even if you completely disagree. Listen to understand her. Her story. She is a fascinating person. This is a rare skill.

As you do this, take note of all your feelings you have. Process them later. Example:What made you feel angry? Most likely a growth opportunity.

If she mentions anything about being friends again, I'm going to reply with Nick Nolte's quote in 48 Hours 'we ain't brothers, we ain't partners, and we ain't friends'. lol

Like I said last week, I can feel myself detaching more every day. Not that I don't want to save the M, but the thought of D is no longer 'scary'. I've spent 20 years trying to meet all of her needs, while she rarely puts any effort into meeting even one of mine. I'm too old for that crap.

[Terapin]

So W has been selling all kinds of stuff on Ebay (her clothes, shoes, etc). I'm assuming it's to come up with the money for a retainer fee. I guess I gotta do the same. I don't have much to sell though. Maybe blood or sperm. lol

[Terapin]

So, W and I just had another 'talk'. As far as reconcilliation goes, the M is over. She asked me if I reviewed that stuff, and I told her I did. I again said none of this is my choice or decision, but I'll support her. She again asked why I would even want to stay married. Probably a mistake on my part, but I told her that in addition to believing D shoudl be the last resort, the last few weeks have been nice, and it didn't seem like we had to work that hard at it. She said 'I've been nice and happy because I feel like a huge weight is off my back now. I figured you felt the same'. Then she went on to say some stuff about 'growing apart, not in love anymore, etc'.

The good news is, at least initially, W and I seem to agree on most things (selling the house, dividing debts, 50/50 custody). No spousal or child support, and we each take our student loan debts. I told her I'd consider giving her my vehicle in exchange for some household assets.

She asked if I would help pay her lawyer fees, as well as the filing fee. I just laughed.

Oh well, it's been a long strange trip. Mentally I'm feeling ok. Still can't believe it's ending, yet in some ways I always expected it.

Thanks for all the help and advice folks. I appreciate it more than you know.

[Terapin]

Oh yeah, she also said something like 'sorry if being nice and having fun with our friends gave you false hope or anything, but a few nights of hanging out doesn't erase years of issues'. I should have told her to F off

[Kind18]

Well done Terapin. You sound strong and calm.

Wanting divorce is not why any of us arrive at this site. But sometimes, it gives closure to have it done.

Your different interpretation of why things were better last few weeks is interesting. A LBS will see better interactions and return to how it used to be (fun, happiness, less arguing) as a sign things are getting better. But she was happier because she convinced herself you were on board with divorce and so the pressure was off her.

The more I study this and read, the more I realise this is a constant theme. The rubbish behaviour of waywards/walkaways is because they carry guilt over the their behaviour and breaking vows.

It’s why you should never try to interpret what they are thinking or doing. It makes zero sense and is a ticket to the crazy house. All that a walkaway/wayward wants is for people to tell them what they’re doing is okay. If they don’t get that - they respond with anger, bullying, threats and even violence. It’s a sad insight into the human mind.

Keep your chin up. Remember that you’ve passed the worst of it. Life will only get better from here.

One day, you too will realise that actually deserve someone who values and loves you as much as you do them.

[Terapin]

Well done Terapin. You sound strong and calm.

Wanting divorce is not why any of us arrive at this site. But sometimes, it gives closure to have it done.

Your different interpretation of why things were better last few weeks is interesting. A LBS will see better interactions and return to how it used to be (fun, happiness, less arguing) as a sign things are getting better. But she was happier because she convinced herself you were on board with divorce and so the pressure was off her.

The more I study this and read, the more I realise this is a constant theme. The rubbish behaviour of waywards/walkaways is because they carry guilt over the their behaviour and breaking vows.

It’s why you should never try to interpret what they are thinking or doing. It makes zero sense and is a ticket to the crazy house. All that a walkaway/wayward wants is for people to tell them what they’re doing is okay. If they don’t get that - they respond with anger, bullying, threats and even violence. It’s a sad insight into the human mind.

Keep your chin up. Remember that you’ve passed the worst of it. Life will only get better from here.

One day, you too will realise that actually deserve someone who values and loves you as much as you do them.

Thanks Kind. Yeah I guess that's how I'm feeling. Life will get better. I can't stand the thought of turning our sons life upside down, and for that reason alone I'll never fully forgive my STBX for that.

Yeah, that 'theme' is interesting. I guess acting 'as if' wasn't the best move, but it wouldn't have mattered anyway in the long run.

She wasn't fazed one bit about me speaking to a L, and she kept saying stuff like 'i'm not going to fight over a TV, couch, etc. She's said she fully expects to end up in a small apartment or something. So, here's a woman in her mid 40s, that is giving up half of her son, her husband, a quarter million dollar home, safety, security, friends, etc, because she's 'not happy'. I've stuck w/ her through a ton of issues (eating disorder, depression, alcoholism, etc). Never cheated on her, never physically abused her. She still swears there's 'nobody else', but who cares.

So what now? I don't want things to be cold and mean around here. I think from now on, it's just all business. I'll be nice and cordial, but that's it.

[SteveLW]

Now? Keep on DBing. your divorce is still in the 'all talk' phase. Many never make it out of that phase.

I just read about Art Carney. The actor. His wife divorced him in 1965. He was devastated. He resorted to drugs and alcohol. He even remarried. In the 70s he finally got on with his life. He won an Oscar. And then in 1980, he and his first wife remarried and were married until his death.

There is ALWAYS hope.

Keep DBing.

[Kind18]

Agree with Steve. DBing doesn’t stop.

DBing is actually about identifying your flaws, it’s about personal development, learning to set boundaries, regaining strength/confidence - and learning to love yourself. You learn to place your happiness in how YOU feel about yourself, not on whether someone else thinks you are worth it.

Stopping self improvement and just meandering along until the next relationship happens is a recipe for disaster - either you’ll settle for someone who isn’t amazing (because you haven’t found self-happiness and need someone else to feel loved), or you’ll find someone … but you’ll make the same mistakes the second time around.

Also, until that piece of paper is in your hand, you aren’t divorced.

Now that you seem to have accepted it - why don’t you do something for you? You don’t have to sink money, time and emotional energy into trying to save it any more. Why not spend that money, time and emotional energy on something amazing?

How about buying something you’ve always wanted? What about a holiday? What about skydiving? Fix up that old car you have in a garage. Buy a motorbike. Buy a mountain bike. Go and do a yoga/meditation course! Join a gym and start a 90 day weight loss program.

We only get 80 laps around the sun. Now that you accept this marriage is probably done, time to start living 💪

[Ready2Change]

So, W and I just had another 'talk'....She again asked why I would even want to stay married. Probably a mistake on my part, but I told her that in addition to believing D should be the last resort, the last few weeks have been nice, and it didn't seem like we had to work that hard at it. She said 'I've been nice and happy because I feel like a huge weight is off my back now. I figured you felt the same'. Then she went on to say some stuff about 'growing apart, not in love anymore, etc'.

It is a loaded question. No matter what your answer is, it is a mistake to have R talks. The bigger mistake is to give your POV.

The good news is, at least initially, W and I seem to agree on most things (selling the house, dividing debts, 50/50 custody). No spousal or child support, and we each take our student loan debts. I told her I'd consider giving her my vehicle in exchange for some household assets.

She asked if I would help pay her lawyer fees, as well as the filing fee. I just laughed.

You can suggest that you both drop the lawyers and fill out the DYI divorce paperwork. Do some online research BEFORE discussing this with her.

I just checked and my state has a $230 filing fee, which can be waved if income is below a certain level.

[Ready2Change]

I can't stand the thought of turning our sons life upside down

That is why you DB. Can't control her, but you can focus on being the best dad on the planet. You will most likely have more quality time with him.

So, here's a woman in her mid 40s, that is giving up half of her son, her husband, a quarter million dollar home, safety, security, friends, etc, because she's 'not happy'. I've stuck w/ her through a ton of issues (eating disorder, depression, alcoholism, etc).

She will find out that she is still 'not happy' when she is away from you. You are the one that will go through life changing personal growth.