BL42, bttrfly, SteveLW—thanks so much for your feedback.
A D doesn't make a huge difference for me financially.
I definitely don't want to do anything that pushes a D forward. Maybe I am being thick, but I am not sure how I can avoid moving the D along without being passive aggressive or manipulative—and pushing H further away in the process.
H has asked me about starting the paperwork twice and backed off both times after I explained that I have more immediate things to sort out. The most recent time, he said that he would wait for me to reach out first and would not ask me about it again. (But who knows, maybe he will start pressuring me. Again.)
That's why I feel like he's given me the reins on this D. If I simply *never* follow up about starting the legal process, then I come off as standing in his way. Hence my admittedly manipulative fantasy of hiring a mediator who is secretly a MC. SteveLW, I take your point about not using other DBer's experiences as a map for my own. No expectations, no expectations...
I am mentally kicking myself for sort of agreeing to the divorce two months ago—during a text conversation, he was worried that I said that I wouldn't give him the divorce, and I said "That's not what I'm saying, I saying I need more time to process everything." So, I didn't explicitly disagree, but I didn't definitively agree, either. [For context: H referred to the ending of our marriage as a "break up." I said a divorce is a whole different order of magnitude than a break up. And then H freaked out.]
SOrry, just noticed this response. So my question is what is more important to you? Not being the one to drive the divorce forward? Or not coming across as manipulative or passive-aggressive?
It sounds to me at its core you are trying to walk a very fine line: not look like you are stalling the D, but at the same time stalling the D by not stalling the D. It is very confusing.
Being crystal clear on what you want, what you will do and what you will not do is not passive-aggressive in my book. It isn't even close to being manipulative. Trying to steer things to a mediator IS manipulative. So if you are really concerned about not being manipulative then certainly don't do that.
I assume at some point you've made it clear to him that you do not want the D? Most of us had that moment (maybe a few times) where we said something to the effect of "I do not want a D. However, I will not stand in your way if you decide that is what you want." It sounds like he is trying to accomplish a couple of things. First he's trying to get you to agree to the D so that it eases his own guilt. Second he is trying to get you to agree to lead the D so again it eases his own guilt. ANd third, he really wants to get a D so anything that isn't that is going to end up with getting a D he will resist.
I really don't think it is fair for him to expect you to start the legal process, and asking you to start the paperwork, for a D you do not want! So if/when it comes back up I have no problem with you stating, since it seems maybe you haven't been clear to this point, "I do not want a D. However, I will not stand in your way if you decide that is what you want." That means HE takes the reins of the D. HE starts the paperwork. He does all of the legwork necessary to get a D. You do not actively try to prevent the D, but you don't actually lift a finger to move it forward.
See the difference? marching what I think I really see at the root of this is that you are trying to nice him back to the marriage. You cannot nice him back. Many LBSs have tried that approach and it never ends the way they hoped it would. Make him D you, don't D yourself for him.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
DnJ, BL42, and Kind18, I really appreciate your advice. I've filed away the suggested for responses should H bring up D paperwork again. Thankfully (well, if H sticks to his word), I won't need to use them, at least for a while.
It's funny, after BD, I naturally went dark and have been really good about following the 24-48 hr rule. I was (still am) so hurt that I just didn't want to initiate contact and invite more rejection. And I take my time responding to texts because they are so few and far between, each exchange feels very high-stakes.
That is good that you pulled back. Most LBSs do the opposite. Pressure and pursuit are the way to push a WAS away faster than anything. Keep up sitting on responses and NOT initiating contact. Remember, texts that are not a question do not need a response. Texts that ask direct questions should be answered in your own time (you are already doing that) and should answer the questions in as few words as possible. Yes or no questions get yes or no answers!
Also, yes, especially early on, all communications feel way heavier and meaningful than they probably are. Remember, the WAS is also having feelings that are up and down. So you never know what emotional state they are in at any given moment themselves.
Originally Posted by marching
I am starting to plan my move. I'm staying with my parents through the holidays. After that, I'm heading to a city on the other side of the country, where my work is based and my friends live. Don't know when I will ever go back to Country B, where H lives.
I agree with my friends, therapist, and the DBers here that NOT going back to Country B is the best choice for my mental health. Still, I feel sad about it. I am accepting the feeling and letting it pass...
Where you live, in my opinion, is completely up to you and where you want to live! Don't stay in Country B because he is there. But if you truly want to live in Country B then by all means make that happen! If you would prefer to move back to where your work and friends are, and that is your preference, then do that. Please do not make all of your decisions about him.
ALso, meant to say I like how you seem to have a handle on how to control expectations. Expectations will set you back almost every time. So well done on understanding that!
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
SteveLW, wow, thanks so much for thinking about my sitch. Lots of stuff for me to reflect on.
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since it seems maybe you haven't been clear to this point
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marching what I think I really see at the root of this is that you are trying to nice him back to the marriage.
You have picked up on my problem, something I want to improve on moving forward (a 180!). I think I have been too passive. I never explicitly said that I didn't want this D because I was scared of making H angrier and pushing him away. I didn't explicitly state that I wanted to work on the marriage because I thought that would be pursuing. I've just been buying time.
I worry that I have really messed things up by not being assertive earlier, when I was in Country B. I especially wish I had put my foot down when he said I wasn't allowed in the apartment. Really, really kicking myself for that. At the time, he was so adamant, I actually thought it was kind of justified. I blamed myself. I didn't defend myself.
We've had fewer than 10 interactions in the 3.5 months since BD (and that's counting very brief business text exchanges). It's been a weird situation because we were apart even before BD; he dropped the bomb right before we were going to live together again.
Now I am not in Country B anymore and who knows when I'll ever see H again.
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Being crystal clear on what you want, what you will do and what you will not do is not passive-aggressive in my book.
I am starting to plan my move. I'm staying with my parents through the holidays. After that, I'm heading to a city on the other side of the country, where my work is based and my friends live.
Family & friends are vital. Enjoy the holiday with your parents, and GAL like crazy with your friends in the city.
Originally Posted by marching
I agree with my friends, therapist, and the DBers here that NOT going back to Country B is the best choice for my mental health. Still, I feel sad about it. I am accepting the feeling and letting it pass...
He knows how to contact you if he wants. In the meantime go enjoy your life and who knows when he reaches out next time you may not even want to hear from him.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
I've been struggling since having the divorce ball thrown in my court and making my move more concrete. I guess it's a necessary, painful step in dropping the rope. It's a very real step towards living life without H.
I have been missing him a lot lately. For the first several months, I was just dealing with shock. Now, so many things remind me of H. There were even so many good times from right before BD. Laughter and passion.
It's hard coming across songs, articles, and videos that I'd normally share and discuss with him, too. It's really hard not having my best friend in my life.
Clearly I am not detached.
I've been figuring out where I'm going to stay while I look for an apartment in the Big City. Having to keep living out of a suitcase is very frustrating. But my friends and family have offered a lot of support, and I'm so grateful for them. Trying to focus the positives in my sitch—like having wonderful people in my life. Including even people at work, who have been very understanding. I'm improving in my running, too.
I have been missing him a lot lately. For the first several months, I was just dealing with shock. Now, so many things remind me of H.
The best thing you can do is stay busy, hence the GAL advice. Pour yourself into work, into exercise, into picking up a hobby and getting out and being social. The more you're focused on other areas the less time you have to dwell on your sitch..and btw the happier and more confident and attractive you'll become.
Originally Posted by marching
Clearly I am not detached.
It's perfectly natural to still have feelings, so don't beat yourself up over it. As my IC would say...it's a process. When you 've been with someone for a decade detaching doesn't happen over night. It's going to take time.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Two things just happened that lifted my mood a lot.
1. I had an appointment with a new C. She gave me some tips on how to be more assertive with H. She thinks H is in a bubble of emotional chaos and his recent behavior is immature, selfish, manipulative, and possibly even delusional. (Which the DBers here all touched on more or less.) I thought it might be a drag to start over with a new C but her perspective and approach are really helpful.
2. A temporary housing solution fell into my lap thanks to a friend. A reminder of just how great my friends are. Really looking forward to hanging out with them in the Big City. We're making lots of fun plans.
Good stuff marching! Glad to hear you found a new counselor. Sounds like you have a good network of caring friends...make sure to GAL like crazy with them!
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
I am very pleased to see a housing solution has presented itself. That’s wonderful. And will certainly alleviate some stress.
Originally Posted by marching
I have been missing him a lot lately. For the first several months, I was just dealing with shock. Now, so many things remind me of H. There were even so many good times from right before BD. Laughter and passion.
It's hard coming across songs, articles, and videos that I'd normally share and discuss with him, too. It's really hard not having my best friend in my life.
Clearly I am not detached.
You are doing very well. What you are experiencing is perfectly normal.
From my view, you are starting the stage of withdrawal, which proceeds indifference. Withdrawal is painful. Our brain no longer having its dopamine rewards from interactions with our spouse, pains for that which once flowed so freely.
What you are feeling is likely to get worse. The best strategy is to limit exposure to those nostalgic memories. Pictures, songs, trips down memory lane are far to easy to get lost in. The boost of relief - dopamine - is temporary, and prolongs getting to the other side of this.
Make no mistake, when you get to the real thick of it - withdrawal is a battle. However, you are not unarmed in this fight. Reason, logic, and control are your’s to utilize. You fight the temptations and the pain. The better you do that, the quicker you find your way.
Once through withdrawal, old pictures, songs, movies, memories, and such, don’t trigger or hurt. The happy memories return and just are.
Be strong and stay the course.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
