Living with a WAW

[DW17]

Apologies to Kind18, I know I'm supposed to be posting about my GAL, but it's been a rough day and I guess I just found the need to vent here. It's 430 on Sunday here, and I probably only got 2 hours of sleep. Yesterday was D18's birthday party. It was a pretty emotional day having my "baby" turn 18. The past few days I've been having a hard time shaking wanting to know what's going on with W, like where she is, is she actually staying late at work, is she with AP, etc. I did well for a week, but I feel that need-to-know creeping back.

Things were fine at the bday party, family from both sides there with 4 of W's close friends. None of our families know what's going on with us, all of W's friends do. If there is an A going on, I know at least 2 of her friends would know about it based on them being around AP with W at their favorite watering hole. I've known these friends for a long time and can't imagine coming into someone's house knowing about a possible A and just acting like nothing is wrong. If there is an A, it's like being cheated on by W in addition to people who I consider my friends. Have others dealt with situations where W's friends knew what was going on and kept you in the dark still? I'm sure most do, so how did you handle that?

Toward the end of the party, W was texting AP and the friend she goes drinking with every weekend for about an hour straight and basically ignoring the remaining people at the party. D18's BF even commented to D18 about it. The minute W's last friend left the house, she went to the bedroom and said she was getting ready to go out. I knew she was going to, despite the fact that it was her daughter's 18th bday but it still shocked me. D18 ended up guilting her into staying because she didn't get to spend much time with her on her bday or at her party. W reluctantly stayed home, sat on the couch texting for 2 hours, then went to sleep. Watching her relationship with her kids slowly deteriorate is heartbreaking.

And with the need-to-know, W still texts AP non-stop in front of me, still sleeps with her phone, still wanders outside to have phone calls with a girl friend, etc. I got good at laughing it off, but it's getting harder each day. This week was hard for GAL just based on how much stuff is going on. Today I have to help D18 with school stuff and college applications on 2 hours sleep, so today is probably shot too. Next weekend I know I'll be doing stuff so maybe that will help clear my head, but it's been a rough few days. Feeling like a doormat is no fun and I hate that I'm starting to debate whether any of this is worth it. I know there's peaks and valleys to this stuff so hopefully I can shake it off this week. Posting here seems to help.

[DW17]

One more thing I've been thinking about. Neither of our families know what's going on except for my sister. With more birthdays and holidays coming up, it will be impossible to keep them in the dark much longer. I know W will not be at any of my family's events and the family BBQ she missed last month led to awkward questions the whole day. I haven't told my family because I don't want my mom to know. She won't be able to resist reaching out to W, and it will likely be in a negative way. W has had a rocky relationship with my family, especially my mom, and I don't want her ruining any of the work I've been doing with avoiding negative situations. I'll let W figure out when to let her family know. She will avoid it as long as possible, since they all love me and will likely try and talk sense into her, which is the last thing she wants. Is there an appropriate time/way to basically announce to the world that you are separated but living together? And do I just avoid specifics with my family and just say "We are working through some issues" or something along those lines?

[Rockon]

DW: sorry I don’t have any answers for you. In a similar situation.WW has moved out . Don’t know who to tell and what specifics to say. So learning along with you. Both W and I don’t want to be subject to gossiping unnecessarily and value privacy.

[BL42]

DW17,

Apologies to Kind18, I know I'm supposed be posting about my GAL, but it's been a rough day and I guess I just found the need to vent here.

No need to apologize. It's perfectly normal to spin in these situations, wonder about W, and come here to vent or ask for advice about W. Our point is the more you can focus on yourself and GAL, the better for your own progress. But don't feel like you can't post about W when you need to.

It's 430 on Sunday here, and I probably only got 2 hours of sleep.

This is normal. I wasn't getting much sleep after BD and during IHS either. Working out helps. Also talking to a doctor about temporary medicine if needed. It'll pass over time and you'll sleep better in the future.

The past few days I've been having a hard time shaking wanting to know what's going on with W, like where she is, is she actually staying late at work, is she with AP, etc. I did well for a week, but I feel that need-to-know creeping back.

Understandable. It'll come in waves. The more you can focus on work, kids, your GAl activities the less time you'll have to focus on W.

I've known these friends for a long time and can't imagine coming into someone's house knowing about a possible A and just acting like nothing is wrong. If there is an A, it's like being cheated on by W in addition to people who I consider my friends. Have others dealt with situations where W's friends knew what was going on and kept you in the dark still? I'm sure most do, so how did you handle that?

That's tough. It's a bad feeling to know people who you thought were friends not caring about W's actions. Many people will either not care - just "staying neutral" - or even take her side. The one thing about D is you'll learn who your true friends are. I knew right away about now-ExW's affair, before her/our friends and family, so I never had any of them hiding it from me though.

Toward the end of the party, W was texting AP and the friend she goes drinking with every weekend for about an hour straight and basically ignoring the remaining people at the party.

My ExW would text OM1 in the same room as me, in m y son's room while she "put him to bed"...even left S's 5th birthday party early to talk to him. It's so difficult when you're going through it, but you'll be alright in time and realize how awful her actions are and never want that again.

D18's BF even commented to D18 about it.

Yeah...it's a lot more obvious than the WS realizes.

The minute W's last friend left the house, she went to the bedroom and said she was getting ready to go out. I knew she was going to, despite the fact that it was her daughter's 18th bday but it still shocked me. D18 ended up guilting her into staying because she didn't get to spend much time with her on her bday or at her party. W reluctantly stayed home, sat on the couch texting for 2 hours, then went to sleep.

This is so familiar...texting in front of people, talking in other rooms, being upset or depressed when they're "held back" from meeting up with AP...even if it's their kids' birthday.

Watching her relationship with her kids slowly deteriorate is heartbreaking.

It's not your job to foster her relationship with her kids, but also prep yourself for your kids to still love their mom. As hard as it is, W is betraying you but your kids are still going to have a relationship with their mother - it's not fair to expect otherwise.

W still texts AP non-stop in front of me, still sleeps with her phone, still wanders outside to have phone calls with a girl friend, etc. I got good at laughing it off, but it's getting harder each day.

IHS is extremely difficult.

One more thing I've been thinking about. Neither of our families know what's going on except for my sister. With more birthdays and holidays coming up, it will be impossible to keep them in the dark much longer. I know W will not be at any of my family's events and the family BBQ she missed last month led to awkward questions the whole day. I haven't told my family because I don't want my mom to know. She won't be able to resist reaching out to W, and it will likely be in a negative way. W has had a rocky relationship with my family, especially my mom, and I don't want her ruining any of the work I've been doing with avoiding negative situations. I'll let W figure out when to let her family know. She will avoid it as long as possible, since they all love me and will likely try and talk sense into her, which is the last thing she wants. Is there an appropriate time/way to basically announce to the world that you are separated but living together? And do I just avoid specifics with my family and just say "We are working through some issues" or something along those lines?

Not sure what to advise you here - some will recommend "working through some issues" approach and not sharing details, others will say tell key people to bust the affair. I know what I wish I would've done now in my own sitch knowing what the outcome ended up being...but hindsight is 20/20 and your situation is not mine.

[DW17]

I messed up this morning and could use a bit of advice.

This morning I was getting ready for work and W commented that I looked nice and asked if I was trying to impress a girl. I smirked and did not respond. She then said that I owe it to her to let her know if I’m talking with anyone because I called her out for texting AP in the car with the kids one day about 6 weeks ago and used his name. I asked how those two things were related (first mistake, should have walked away). She said something about him just being a friend and that she can do whatever she wants. I walked away, was about to leave for work, and couldn’t help but respond.

I walked back and said something along the lines of “you can do whatever you want, but texting your “friend” all day long every day, even while lying next to me in bed, is completely disrespectful.” I also said something about how the one thing I asked of her (when I was in the begging stage) was to let me know if there is anyone else because I couldn’t handle going through her cheating on me again. When she said she wasn’t doing anything wrong, I said something about how I knew she would probably lie about it anyway. It was said while she was in the bathroom so couldn’t walk away from it. She got upset and told me to walk away, which I did. I left for work and then had this text message exchange:

W: You have lost your mind, do not ever come at me like that again. You legit triggered a panic attack and I haven’t done anything wrong! It has been clear that we are still here for the kids and you say one thing one day then come at me like this another day! I literally can’t handle the mental abuse anymore. Pinning me into a corner and demanding information out of me is not the way to go.

Me: I had no intention of triggering a panic attack and I can understand how upsetting that is. I agree that approach was not acceptable.

W: I’m legit crying now before work, thank you.

Me: We do need to talk about a few things whenever you are comfortable with it (At the time I was thinking we need to talk about her leaving the house)

W: Nope, not it’s time to let everyone know who you really are. I owe you zero explanations of my life other than my kids. This is not your house, it is mine as well…the bed, the couches, everything. If you would like I can make things more difficult for our children and go stay with (girl friend who lives 30 minutes away) if that is easier but as far as owing you any explanations of anything in my life other than my children, do not communicate with me. You have just lost me 100% friend and all. Thank you for making me late for work.

I did not respond to this.

Her staying at her friend’s house was something she was planning on doing early on. I was actually happy she brought it up again. She went there one day and then came back because her friend was “too controlling,” This was also during my “begging” stage, so I didn’t want her to go at the time. But since W brought it up again, I think it is the best situation as long as she doesn’t bring D4. It’s too far from her school and doesn’t really make sense logistically. I am already taking care her all day anyway. The only thing I don’t do is take her to school, which I can make work. That seems like the best solution, having W go there.

I feel stupid for cracking. My mind had been getting more frustrated, but my actions haven’t reflected that until today, but it’s been building as noted in previous post. Any advice would be much appreciated.

[LH19]

DW I am not sure what kind of advice you are looking for right now? It was hard to read the exchange between the two of you. You are being gaslighted by a woman who if I am reading this correctly is cheating now and has cheated in the past. I think at this point for your sanity it is best that she goes to your friend's house to give you some space.

[BL42]

DW17,

"Why do we fall? So we can learn to pick ourselves up."

Sounds like you know what you did wrong - you just have to work on your mental game for the future.

This morning I was getting ready for work and W commented that I looked nice and asked if I was trying to impress a girl. I smirked and did not respond.

The smirk and no response was perfect.

She then said that I owe it to her to let her know if I’m talking with anyone because I called her out for texting AP in the car with the kids one day about 6 weeks ago and used his name.

You don't owe her anything. She is cheating on you and wants to break up your marriage. Unless she ends her affair and recommits to her husband, you don't give her anything - stay strong.

I asked how those two things were related (first mistake, should have walked away).

This is where you started to falter. Don't get into a logical argument about anything. It's not a game you'll win because she's all emotion. It's not an Oxford debate team match.

I walked away, was about to leave for work,

Yes...

and couldn’t help but respond.

No! You could've helped yourself from responding, but you choose not to. Be stronger and more aware next time.

I walked back and said something along the lines of “you can do whatever you want, but texting your “friend” all day long every day, even while lying next to me in bed, is completely disrespectful.”

You're absolutely right - that is disrespectful. But what are you going to do about it? Complaining about disrespect or broken boundaries with no actions is weak.

I also said something about how the one thing I asked of her (when I was in the begging stage) was to let me know if there is anyone else because I couldn’t handle going through her cheating on me again.

You asked her to let you know if she was cheating? This sounds super weak. Stand up for yourself.

W: You have lost your mind, do not ever come at me like that again. You legit triggered a panic attack and I haven’t done anything wrong! It has been clear that we are still here for the kids and you say one thing one day then come at me like this another day! I literally can’t handle the mental abuse anymore. Pinning me into a corner and demanding information out of me is not the way to go.

You better be very careful about these exchanges. She's accusing you in written format about "come at me", "panic attack", "pinning me into a corner"...you wouldn't be the first to get tagged with a BS domestic abuse charge. Don't brush this off. Hopefully it doesn't come to that, but you never know. You should consider starting to audio or video record interactions. Learn the laws in your state about recordings. Some are two party consent, others are one party consent.

I literally can’t handle the mental abuse anymore.

Don't buy into the "mental abuse" claim. LH is right...she's gaslighting you! She is cheating on you. Instead of blaming herself and recognizing her poor behaviors she's projecting it all onto you. SHE can't be responsible for her guilt and pain, so you are. Don't let her convince yourself you're a monster.

W: Nope, not it’s time to let everyone know who you really are.

Sounds like a very specific threat - prep yourself for things to get ugly. She'll tell her family and friends what a monster you are to justify her actions. Make sure you don't buy into it.

This is not your house, it is mine as well…the bed, the couches, everything. If you would like I can make things more difficult for our children and go stay with (girl friend who lives 30 minutes away) if that is easier

Honestly? That sounds ideal. DO NOT MOVE OUT. Let her do the moving. That may be in your best interest at this point.

but as far as owing you any explanations of anything in my life other than my children, do not communicate with me.

I agree with her there - honor her wishes and do not engage with her unless it's about the kids. Also, consult with one or more Ls ASAP.

You have just lost me 100% friend and all.

She is your W. You don't want her as a friend.

Thank you for making me late for work.

Obviously you did not "make her" be late for work.

I did not respond to this.

Her staying at her friend’s house was something she was planning on doing early on. I was actually happy she brought it up again.

Yes. If she voluntarily leaves the house on her own, that's ideal. Consult an L ASAP! Make sure you're ready to act if needed around the house and kid.

I think it is the best situation as long as she doesn’t bring D4.

Dpon't let her move anywhere with D4. Consult an L. A judge would likely keep the status quo with kid in the house, temprorarily at least.

That seems like the best solution, having W go there.

Yep.

You are being gaslighted by a woman who if I am reading this correctly is cheating now and has cheated in the past. I think at this point for your sanity it is best that she goes to your friend's house to give you some space.

LH is 100% right. Don't allow her gaslighting to break you mentally. SHE is the one cheating and doing wrong. Time to not engage anymore, and prep yourself for the next round.

[DW17]

LH19 - I'm not really sure what I was looking for either. Maybe a 2x4! I agree about her leaving. Having my nose rubbed in everything on a daily basis because we live together is not healthy for me and it's going to affect my kids if it hasn't already. I have doubts that she will actually go to her friends house as she's failed to take action on anything for the past 4 months, but I'll push for it.

Feeling like a doormat is rough. I've been wanting to stick up for myself and tell W how I feel about everything, but it goes against the DB rules. The status quo doesn't feel like it will work though. Time apart will either help with separation, or help fix it, but either way it should help me ignore things and sleep better.

[BL42]

Feeling like a doormat is rough. I've been wanting to stick up for myself and tell W how I feel about everything, but it goes against the DB rules.

Stick up for yourself through actions, not words. Don't have a long R talk whining about her cheating and how it makes you feel. Plenty of us have gone down that road and it rarely if ever works. Instead, take action! What if you helped pack up her stuff and have it ready for her when she comes home from work?

Time apart will either help with separation, or help fix it, but either way it should help me ignore things and sleep better.

It's a toss up with the former, but 98% chance it'll help the latter.

[LH19]

LH19 - I'm not really sure what I was looking for either. Maybe a 2x4!

I am happy to wack of you over the head with one if you would like?

I agree about her leaving. Having my nose rubbed in everything on a daily basis because we live together is not healthy for me and it's going to affect my kids if it hasn't already.

It isn't healthy. I am not a fan of IHS because it is typically soul suking to the LBS.

I have doubts that she will actually go to her friends house as she's failed to take action on anything for the past 4 months, but I'll push for it.

What do you mean push for it?

Feeling like a doormat is rough.

It is rough. Why do you feel like you're a doormat?

I've been wanting to stick up for myself and tell W how I feel about everything, but it goes against the DB rules.

So first off talk is cheap. Second off your W can give to $hits about how you feel. I only want to see actions from you.

The status quo doesn't feel like it will work though.

I agree. Affairs are not good for a marriage. Something needs to change.

Time apart will either help with separation, or help fix it, but either way it should help me ignore things and sleep better.

How do you think time away will help fix it?