Stuck in limbo III

[Doug54]

The only nagging thought (at times) is not knowing if she's still dicking around in EA territory on her phone.

So what changes if she is and what changes if she isn't?

That's a good question. I don't imagine I'll actually find out the answer, but I guess the easy response is that I'd feel more hopeful if it were the latter scenario you mention above.

LH, I believe you said you had an EA yourself and that it was "intoxicating" while going on. That definitely lines up with research about brain scans showing the euphoria of being in love, or as your ex-wife would say, feeling the butterflies.

In theory, definitely something tough for a LBS to compete with.

[Doug54]

If you read the situations that got to R--where the WAS ceased any affairs and got on-board trying to save the marriage--most neither turned on a dime weeks after joining nor took many years. The sweet seems to be 6 months (early) to 2 years (late). I'm impressed you're finding the strength to validate, not cave on moving out of the bedroom/home, and not act cold or mean. It's a marathon, keep at those GAL/180s! If you need to vent, find safe places like here or the gym.

Thanks, Traveler. You definitely seem like a glass-is-half-full kinda guy. I would give my left nut for a crystal ball view of what my life would look like after next summer, but absent that, I can only work on the GAL/180s and living life as best I can.

[Doug54]

I'm glad that you did, and there is a reason I asked you to. And it isn't for anything anyone else is saying, just be patient and I will get to that. Just don't donate it to a homeless shelter or anything, tuck it away all nice and safe for now.

What kind of "sting' did you feel ?

In what areas ??

Mainly just things that would have been so easy to keep going, or pitfalls I could have avoided. I think W is having a MLC and I could easily still be here dealing with waywardness if I'd batted 1.000 as a husband, but that said, I did not. There's a quote I like from a book written by a divorce lawyer, about trying to avoid D. It goes:

How hard is it to be nice to your spouse? To show them some small kindness. [...] You can't tell me that's challenging. Or buying flowers. Or leaving a little Post-it note with some word of affection. There's no risk, either. If it's ignored or not reciprocated, are you really that much poorer for the gesture? You haven't changed some fundamental aspect of yourself. And your conscience is clean for having tried.

I think about that often.

MC is always a tough time during this. Most MLCers will avoid it, so kudos to her for at least showing up...

MC is also a "safe" room, where relationship talks happen, things get said, and anger and frustration, years of resentment is supposed to happen.

Yet, also, the Doug that has been the husband for several years isn't the Doug that has shown up at these lately. He looks like him ....just not that same guy...

I'm glad that you stated your position once again in the safe room, it's not "new" information to her, yet I think that maybe your sessions have changed a bit recently, and just listening to her and validating her will allow her to come to you a little more, feel a little safer little by little.

So, about this MC. My well-meaning IC suggested I try MC with W for "clarity" because I seemed to be struggling a little bit with limbo in the relationship. Needless to say, neither he nor I (at the time) knew anything about DBing. W agreed to go. I tried to set it up with the MC at my IC's practice but she was booked, so W found a MC. However, W clearly wanted to angle the MC sessions towards a transition. You're right though, Mach - it was a "safe space" where several things were discussed, but W did not have intentions of using it to restore the marriage. That said, I don't think it was fruitless.

You aren't LH, and your situation isn't his. And his advice will lead you to his result if you allow it.

Your situation will always be 100% yours, UNLESS you work toward a goal that you do not want....

I was always 100% confident that my situation would work out, right up to the minute that I chose for it not to....

Be confident with the goal that you are working toward....

And THAT is the reason I was pushing you to choose what you wanted....

That's a fair point. I just think without this site and reading about similar situations and making comparisons, I'd probably be tempted to draw conclusions from slight blips on the radar. Like currently, things are going fairly well between W and I. I'd describe it as, she doesn't seem like someone who wants a D, next summer or whenever. But who knows? And to answer your question, yes I hope it works out and we stay together.

It's called the MLC bounce....

Up one minute, down the next, all over the F'ing place...

Trick is, to stay far enough away to not get hit with any collateral damage...

Her confusion is a good sign, she is convinced that she is moving one way, then not so convinced the next.

Be the consistent with YOUR goals in what you want...

No more words now, it's all about your actions and who you are becoming...

Stay true to you and your goals, and let her fly around all over the place....

No sense in you both doing that.

Keep being confident Doug.....

NOT arrogant Doug....

Confident...

I'm trying, dude. As always, I appreciate all the introspective thoughts.

[Traveler]

Traveler. You definitely seem like a glass-is-half-full kinda guy.

In a way, it's easy for me because I got a chance to R with both my XGF and XW. While you can't control the outcome--that involves another human--you definitely see LBS who learn from their mistakes and become a more attractive partner. It can help! Especially if one of the factors causing your spouse to leave was dissatisfaction with the relationship--assuming you weren't doing something that could fall into her "unforgivable zone" like cheating or abuse.

Good job reading Love Languages! Remember Sandi's rules come first. E.g., if Words of Affirmation are her thing, expressing gratitude she cooked a great meatloaf is fine, but beware of laying on excess flattery. Books on other skills (e.g., Listening) are easier to apply at this phase.

[Ready2Change]

Like currently, things are going fairly well between W and I.

I am not sure what your measuring stick is that is telling you that things are going well between the two of you.

I'd describe it as, she doesn't seem like someone who wants a D, next summer or whenever.

I would bet she wants some excitement in her life.

Have you had a chance to read The Art of Seduction? That book completely changed the way I interact with my lady.

[LH19]

Doug if I had one piece of advice for LH19 of 8 years ago it would be I can’t change the past but I can change the future. Who gives one fuch what W is doing this is the person/partner I want to be moving forward.

I think the number one challenge for newbies is to understand they have little to zero control and understanding what we mean when we say it’s a marathon and not a sprint.

[Vapo]

LH, exactly. No silver bullet in sight...

[LH19]

LH, I believe you said you had an EA yourself and that it was "intoxicating" while going on. That definitely lines up with research about brain scans showing the euphoria of being in love, or as your ex-wife would say, feeling the butterflies.

It was intoxicating and I went through serious with drawls when I ended it. Luckily I still had my logic and reason sensors still functioning. Most MLC middle age people do not and see it as the only escape from the horrible lives (eyeroll) they have.

I can tell you Doug in the past month my exw has had three major bouts of things she had to handle alone because she is single and none of them were fun. Is the grass greener? Maybe and maybe not.

[Doug54]

Been a little while since I posted. I was given a few more responsibilities at work (fortunately a commensurate pay bump as well) and have been busy AF. A nice measuring stick for me is that work was fairly chill last spring when my home situation was spiraling, but I could barely get stuff done with the wheels turning in my head. Now, I feel much more attuned to job duties...I guess mainly a passage of time thing with my situation.

So...about that. Things have mostly gone well at home since my last post. I'm almost tempted to repeat my sentiments about W softening except that I'm not a mind-reader, and of course it's a marathon and not a sprint. The whole "us sleeping together in the same bed might be the next domino to fall" thing never materialized. We've definitely talked more around the house and I want to say she's texted more as well.

Only chink in the armor are some thoughts I've had about not knowing what's going on and wondering if trust can be rebuilt. LH, I know you wrote "Who gives a fuch what W is up to - live your best life." Should I not be concerned how much cake-eating might be going on while I've dropped the rope? I don't say that from a place of trying to control W, but to not get taken advantage of. I do feel like if W somehow said she'd secured a place to live and was leaving tomorrow, I'd be ok staying in the house with the kids. I certainly wouldn't have typed that 4 months ago.

To that point, I re-read "Carol's" situation in DR a few times, mainly the part about how Carol thought her husband should be the one trying to win her back, not the other way around. I know in my case, W had at a minimum an EA with (I suspect) someone from her past, and I'm not positive if we're talking past or present (ongoing) tense. So, again...I've had some nagging thoughts about "what am I trying to save here"?

Can anyone relate to this in their own situation?

[BL42]

Doug54,

I was given a few more responsibilities at work (fortunately a commensurate pay bump as well) and have been busy AF.

Congrats on the raise!

A nice measuring stick for me is that work was fairly chill last spring when my home situation was spiraling, but I could barely get stuff done with the wheels turning in my head. Now, I feel much more attuned to job duties...I guess mainly a passage of time thing with my situation.

That does show progress. Plus I think it works both ways and feeds on itself really - the more you settle out of the spiral the better you can perform at work, and the more you're able to focus on work the less you're thinking about your sitch and the better and more confident you feel from the validation of your work performance.

So...about that. Things have mostly gone well at home since my last post. I'm almost tempted to repeat my sentiments about W softening except that I'm not a mind-reader, and of course it's a marathon and not a sprint. The whole "us sleeping together in the same bed might be the next domino to fall" thing never materialized. We've definitely talked more around the house and I want to say she's texted more as well.

Softening and positive communicates are a good thing. Just keep focusing on improving yourself. Sounds like work is going well. How about personal? Are you meeting up with other guys, doing any activities, hitting the gym, upgrading the wardrobe, reading relationship/attraction materials?

Only chink in the armor are some thoughts I've had about not knowing what's going on and wondering if trust can be rebuilt.

Totally understandable. It's hard, but do your best to focus on yourself and not worry about what she's doing - you can cross that bridge if you come to it.

LH, I know you wrote "Who gives a fuch what W is up to - live your best life." Should I not be concerned how much cake-eating might be going on while I've dropped the rope? I don't say that from a place of trying to control W, but to not get taken advantage of.

Are you living your best life? What are you doing to live your best life?

Dropping the rope means knowing you'll be fine and have a great life regardless of what she decides. That you're not trying to control her decisions at all and are totally open to her deciding so she doesn't feel pressured.

I do feel like if W somehow said she'd secured a place to live and was leaving tomorrow, I'd be ok staying in the house with the kids. I certainly wouldn't have typed that 4 months ago.

Don't be surprised if you spin if that happens. It can come in waves / be a rollercoaster and is common for someone to feel they're stronger but then take a dip when something hits them.