It's progress, not perfection...

[Elbereth]

Last thread here: Create the life...

Summary so far: H asked for a D and after I kicked him out I discovered he was having an affair with an ex-GF. For a while, I wanted to reconcile but after he made no effort to end his AF, I accepted the D but made him the one to file. He's off living his new life with his new partner in another state. I am still acting as step-mom to the boys I helped raise. I have moved into an apartment and I'm in the process of getting settled now that I am able to begin this new life I've been given.

Friends and Family: My SSs are staying somewhat in touch and are off living their young lives. My mom is very supportive, although she is not happy in her marriage so sometimes talking to her can be emotionally exhausting, but I learned to set some boundaries and that is helping. I have other family that feel that I should be happy that I am not in a relationship with this person they now hate, and they don't understand why I am still unhappy, struggling, stressed etc. If you look at the list of all the things not to say to someone going through trauma, they pretty much have said all those things to me. I try to not judge them too much, as they are helping me in other ways (financially) but it is still very hard to not be able to turn to your family members with the truth of the feelings you are struggling with. Most friends have been supportive and that has helped.

My emotional state: I'm starting to feel again and I've been doing IC. After years of stress and trauma, I've been suffering from emotional numbness and/or detachment. In many ways I have been doing better (my health has improved and I am functioning) but the emotional issues are dragging on. My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues. So I'm considering looking at that in the coming months. I have accepted the D, I've come to terms with what I've learned about my XH and how he treated me, but I still do not really feel "alive" or excited about life yet. So this journey for me is ongoing.

So this is where I begin this thread...

El

[Elbereth]

Now that my D is finalized, there is a part of me that wants to reach out to my XH's OW's husband. I am curious about what he went through. They were M a very long time. And I am sure he knew about my XH as OW had a relationship with him before she met her H. Is this a terrible idea?

[DnJ]

Hello El

I’ve a couple of thoughts from reading your update/summary.

I’d not reach out to XH’s OW’s H (or is he XH yet?). I do not see much benefit coming from ripping open that scar, for you or him.

I'm starting to feel again and I've been doing IC.

Yes, our emotions and feelings do return.

After years of stress and trauma, I've been suffering from emotional numbness and/or detachment.

In no way to belittle anything. However…

After years of stress and trauma, I've been suffering from experiencing emotional numbness and/or detachment.

Detachment and indifference, and the numbness it brings, are not an affliction. It is a perfectly normal part of grief. It is temporary, as you know, as your feelings are returning.

…the emotional issues are dragging on. My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues.

My dear friend. I’d not do that. Dating will detract from your healing, not help it.

One should, needs to, get their emotions, mind, head and heart, and values and convictions in order before entangling someone else into the mix. I do not agree with the advice of using a date to help you through your journey. Deal with your issues, then date if you want too.

I have accepted the D, I've come to terms with what I've learned about my XH and how he treated me, but I still do not really feel "alive" or excited about life yet. So this journey for me is ongoing.

Have faith. It is coming. Act as if. Do. Go on a trip or to an amusement park or whatever.

I do feel alive - now. Excited about my life and future - now. Let’s see, I’m coming up on five years post BD, and the first three or so years were rather dim. The beginning was damn dark, truth be told. The next chunk was all that numbness and kind of not feeling “alive”.

The transition from depression to acceptance is not a well defined point in time, it is rather nebulous. Just one day you realize you accept this. Or most of it. It is not a sudden back to normal feelings by the way either.

Slowly feelings return. And other feelings do not. And still other feelings return and are unwanted. It’s a journey. Worry and focus less on your feelings, and more focus and consider your values and life’s headings.

Feelings are fleeting, and they will eventually align with your beliefs. And those beliefs were strengthened and such with intellect and goals and headings. Peace and contentment comes when one’s heart, mind, and soul are all in step. We then can act upon that with ease - the living a great life, and feeling alive and excited about it.

It’s a journey. Everyone’s path is of different duration. Thing is, it’s not about the destination, it’s about the journey.

I get it. It seems so long right now. I look back, and my divorce journey looks like a blip. Just a wee dip in the road. Yet at the time, it was such a chasm. From me to you, take your time and do it well. The dividends are very much worth it.

D

[BL42]

Elbereth,

In many ways I have been doing better (my health has improved and I am functioning) but the emotional issues are dragging on. My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues. So I'm considering looking at that in the coming months.

I'm with DnJ on this one. If you're ready to date, go for it, but don't do it as a means to process through your emotional issues. That's not a good idea.

Now that my D is finalized, there is a part of me that wants to reach out to my XH's OW's husband. I am curious about what he went through. They were M a very long time. And I am sure he knew about my XH as OW had a relationship with him before she met her H. Is this a terrible idea?

I'd be careful with this one. He's likely hurting as well. You two might open up old wounds or get attached to each other as a way to heal which wouldn't serve either of you.

[Mach1]

My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues. So I'm considering looking at that in the coming months.

Hey E....

I'm not sure that I agree with this just yet...

You admittedly are having some troubles with coming through this,. Feelings of being Jaded and still seems to be a lot of anger built up inside.

And maybe going on a few dates would be good, yet somehow I don't feel as if that is the person that you want to put out there.

???

To me, I think you are heading in the right direction. Just finding out who YOU are through all of this....

Yes, you could possibly have some validating interactions, albeit external validation, and that only lasts for so long. It comes down to how you validate yourself that really matters...

Imagine that you are once again that 6 year old girl, imagining her prince rescuing her from the tower..

Except when he finds you, you aren't whole and ready for that ???


Who is the person that you want to show the world everyday ??


THAT is the person that you should be searching for IMHO....

Find her.....

Now that my D is finalized, there is a part of me that wants to reach out to my XH's OW's husband. I am curious about what he went through. They were M a very long time. And I am sure he knew about my XH as OW had a relationship with him before she met her H. Is this a terrible idea?

I wonder what YOU would like to see if that happens ?

What answers would help you ?

Would it be a 'closure' thing ???

Cause it could also be a couple people that get stuck commiserating, and really never move forward, which isn't a healthy place to live in....

[Elbereth]

Hello everyone,

As for dating again...

One should, needs to, get their emotions, mind, head and heart, and values and convictions in order before entangling someone else into the mix. I do not agree with the advice of using a date to help you through your journey. Deal with your issues, then date if you want too.

I'm with DnJ on this one. If you're ready to date, go for it, but don't do it as a means to process through your emotional issues. That's not a good idea.

I'm not sure that I agree with this just yet... You admittedly are having some troubles with coming through this,. Feelings of being Jaded and still seems to be a lot of anger built up inside. And maybe going on a few dates would be good, yet somehow I don't feel as if that is the person that you want to put out there. ???

To me, I think you are heading in the right direction. Just finding out who YOU are through all of this.... Yes, you could possibly have some validating interactions, albeit external validation, and that only lasts for so long. It comes down to how you validate yourself that really matters... Imagine that you are once again that 6 year old girl, imagining her prince rescuing her from the tower..

Except when he finds you, you aren't whole and ready for that ??? Who is the person that you want to show the world everyday ?? THAT is the person that you should be searching for IMHO.... Find her.....

I hear all of you. And I think I need to provide a little more context that my IC discussed with me to really hash this out. I've spent a lot of time coming to terms with what has happened to me. I've read a lot of books, listened to podcasts, and had several months of IC. I do feel that I know who I am, and what I need to work on for myself, and I have an understanding of my role in the collapse of my marriage. I do have a pretty solid view of my mind, head, values and convictions. What I am still struggling with is feeling numb and shut down from exhaustion. My MR was collapsing for 2-3 years before BD, so IC feels that it's the long timeline of stressors that has me numb more than my mindset. I fear trusting a partner again. I fear getting involved with another narcissist again. I am introverted and I like being alone, but I also need others in my life to help me grow, heal and enjoy my life. I'm in the place where I no longer want my H back. I know I want and deserve better. Of course, I'm still angry about it...but not in the sense that I'm angry all of the time. I don't think anyone really gets passed the unfairness of it all. But I'm not stuck on the anger, I'm looking forward. And I am personally not in a rush to lock myself into a new relationship. I don't feel like I have to have someone in my life. But I know I want to eventually. And you can't work relationship fears if you are not dating...at least that is what my IC has discussed with me. For example, I can't work on romantic trust without someone there to romantically trust...

So I don't see it as rushing into another relationship or using people to heal my issues. My goal is to eventually be in a long-term relationship again. So, the goal is still seeking a long-term relationship, it's just I'll need help with the "process" of finding that. I am hoping to go about it with a dating coach as well as coaching from my counselor and I would take things very slow. And, I wouldn't even start this process for another month or so, as I'm still dealing with my move and a training course. I'm fine where I am at the moment and will continue to explore the idea...and I'm fine with only doing it when I am ready.

As for reaching out to the OWs XH...

I’d not reach out to XH’s OW’s H (or is he XH yet?). I do not see much benefit coming from ripping open that scar, for you or him.

I'd be careful with this one. He's likely hurting as well. You two might open up old wounds or get attached to each other as a way to heal which wouldn't serve either of you.

I wonder what YOU would like to see if that happens? What answers would help you? Would it be a 'closure' thing??? Cause it could also be a couple people that get stuck commiserating, and really never move forward, which isn't a healthy place to live in....

I avoided doing this prior to the D for several reasons... I did not want to cause any drama that would make my D more complicated, I did not want to interfere with XH and AP's relationship (I didn't want any collapse to be blamed on me), and I didn't feel I was in a place to deal with anything I might find out.

However, now that I am in a better place, I am still curious about if he knew about the AF, about the history they had, etc. Lots of curiosity questions mostly. I'm analytical. I've found that I need to research and have some understanding of what things occurred. Probably the same reason why I have spent all this time researching MLC and infidelity.

But I think you all are right...at this stage, in my healing, it probably would not do me any good and it would just throw me back into commiserating and dwelling. I'm not sure what I'd do if he reached out to me first. But so far, he never had. The truth is, I'll never get the truth...right? lol

Anyway, I hope that helps provide some more context. Thanks for taking the time to let me know your thoughts. I appreciate them so much!

El

[bttrfly]

Hi El,

And you can't work relationship fears if you are not dating...at least that is what my IC has discussed with me. For example, I can't work on romantic trust without someone there to romantically trust...

Is that really the only way? I'm not sure I entirely agree. What I've come to understand is that it isn't about me trusting someone else as much as it's about me trusting myself - trusting myself to be a good judge of character, trusting that I can take care of myself and my emotional health.

Once you are solid within yourself, my belief is that the rest will just flow naturally.

as far as reaching out to AP's exh ... I found out about my exh's AP two years ago. I didn't do the typical things like search for her address, or social media or anything like that. At one point though, many many months after finding out I did a search and found that her husband filed 13 months after my BD. I wondered about their relationship. Were they separated when she took up with my husband? Were they still living together? When did he find out about the affair? What prompted him to finally file? Did he know how they met or where?

I allowed these questions to flow across the tv screen in my mind, without judgment or any effort to stop them. Eventually the questions changed: Would it change my present life to know how they met? How he found out about their affair? Would it change my relationship with my exh or have changed the outcome of my marriage to have any of these questions answered? Would my questions make him re-live something painful or stir up possible hostilities? Whatever happened between the three of them, I feel like I'm better off staying out of this, for my own peace of mind and the peace of mind of my son. That's their karma. Not mine. And I certainly don't want to add to another's pain.

My conclusion was that the outcome is what it is, and most likely her husband doesn't have the missing puzzle pieces either. The only two people who could satisfactorily answer my questions are proven liars with something to hide. Some things I'm better off not fretting about. It just becomes a distraction and avoidance of my daily life.

Hope this helps.

[Ginger1]

Take this with a grain of salt. Because we all know my dating track record stinks and it is the consensus here I make poor dating decisions. However….

We all come out of this with scars and issues. It’s how we recognize them, what we learn from them etc. no one has these issues perfectly worked through . And if people didn’t date until they were, we would probably never date. Unless those issues have the capability of hurting a dating partner , then , well, I agree with your IC. She probably sees more of fears , rather than issues you need to work through on the dating front . The 2 can be confused often. And the best thing to do for our fears is work through them .

We are middle aged folk here who have been through the ringer. I would majority of us have done some pretty good self work. None of us will be perfect and completely ready to date. As long as we don’t see ourselves in a place where we will likely hurt someone else or ourselves, it’s a fine time to try it again .

That’s my 2 cents, not the popular opinion here. But another viewpoint to consider

[bttrfly]

Take this with a grain of salt. Because we all know my dating track record stinks and it is the consensus here I make poor dating decisions. However….

We all come out of this with scars and issues. It’s how we recognize them, what we learn from them etc. no one has these issues perfectly worked through . And if people didn’t date until they were, we would probably never date. Unless those issues have the capability of hurting a dating partner , then , well, I agree with your IC. She probably sees more of fears , rather than issues you need to work through on the dating front . The 2 can be confused often. And the best thing to do for our fears is work through them .

We are middle aged folk here who have been through the ringer. I would majority of us have done some pretty good self work. None of us will be perfect and completely ready to date. As long as we don’t see ourselves in a place where we will likely hurt someone else or ourselves, it’s a fine time to try it again .

That’s my 2 cents, not the popular opinion here. But another viewpoint to consider

Sometimes we can only work on relationship issues in a relationship because we don't know they exist until those circumstances trigger something. This is true.

Launching one more person into the dating pool who hasn't yet healed enough is why many of the posters here have something to complain about in online dating/meetups/etc.

[Mach1]

. I've spent a lot of time coming to terms with what has happened to me. I've read a lot of books, listened to podcasts, and had several months of IC. I do feel that I know who I am, and what I need to work on for myself, and I have an understanding of my role in the collapse of my marriage. I do have a pretty solid view of my mind, head, values and convictions. What I am still struggling with is feeling numb and shut down from exhaustion. My MR was collapsing for 2-3 years before BD, so IC feels that it's the long timeline of stressors that has me numb more than my mindset. I fear trusting a partner again. I fear getting involved with another narcissist again.

Ultimately, that decision is yours...

You seemed to vacillate between being ready and not being ready....

Which direction would you like lead to ???

All of that up there.. ^^^^

Knowing it and living it are entirely different.....and FEEL entirely different in the real world....

Hell, I could perform a knee replacement because I watched a video of it...

However, IN THE MOMENT, I'm certain it would be totally different...


When what I thought I knew, is up against what I don't actually know....


Thinking that you know, is the fear of being in those situations again....


Knowing that you know, is what keeps you from them....


So maybe if you decide to date, think about the specific reasons that you are, and what your goals are for the date...

Are you simply trying to validate yourself externally ?

Are you seeking a long term companion ?

A one night companion ?


Whatever choice you make....just be sure to "own" it...