Need advice: wife of 10 years wants out (2)

[Josh71]

Strength and clarity heals your mind.

[PeterB]

Update: I was on a weeklong solo trip, and now I am back. It was awesome. Things at home - well she has been okay. Extremely sensitive overall and easy to get triggered and straight aways gets nasty if triggered. Other times she is nice. Few days ago, she told me that she has 'come back a bit'. I did not react.

However today she was being over-the-top nasty again. I was doing something with my son, and he went into a wild tantrum. She inserted herself into it and basically took it to a (one-sided) fight while my son was watching. Her tactics are crazy effective, and it did work me up, so I immediately told her that the conversation is over. She left after she realized I was not giving attention. An hour later while I was doing something personal, she came back at me again (this is a very predictable pattern - where she comes back to an argument after it is seemingly over and then makes wild accusations about the previous episode which I thought had ended the conversation). She angrily told me that I treated her like [censored], shouted at her and I was the same as before. Then she started piling on insults, so I got up and left. Her parting shot was to ask me to get out of her space (I was already in a different floor). The truth of the first encounter was that I had told her 'Conversation is over" in a firm tone, twice, after I realized that she was getting into insults and judgements. I have conditioned myself to recognize her provocations with time to spare and not to respond. I did just that, so her accusations are shocking. I know that while the accusations are not real, her feelings are. If she has constructed something in her mind, then that structure is real (to her).

Apologies for writing this out here - it has helped me calm down. I do wonder why I should live with this woman.

[BL42]

Update: I was on a weeklong solo trip, and now I am back. It was awesome.

Glad you had a good trip.

Then she started piling on insults, so I got up and left.

The truth of the first encounter was that I had told her 'Conversation is over" in a firm tone, twice, after I realized that she was getting into insults and judgements. I have conditioned myself to recognize her provocations with time to spare and not to respond.

Good job keeping your composure and not responding emotionally. Sounds like you set a boundary about her insulting you (a good one, imo) and enforced it by telling her the conversation is over and walking away. Nicely done.

Apologies for writing this out here - it has helped me calm down.

No need to apologize...that's exactly what this forum is here for.

I do wonder why I should live with this woman.

IHS is very difficult. My guess is physical separation is going bring you peace.

[LH19]

I do wonder why I should live with this woman.

Down the road you are going to wonder why you lived that way as long as you did.

[PeterB]

Hope everyone is doing well. Last 10 days were relatively peaceful.

As far as day to day problems go: Her sleep has been poor because son keeps waking her up earlier than she desires. So she gets into a surly mood and finds a way to blame it on me (I'm not giving her a break). I had already given a solution to the logistics issue (we have a spare room where she can sleep whenever she wants) which she refused to take. I do not react, so these interactions don't escalate.

Yesterday she was in a good mood and wanted to discuss something about R at night. She suddenly showed up to my room.

- She started asking me in interview style to tell her how I have changed relative to the weeks post BD date and relative to my entire life pre-BD. and if those changes are going to be permanent. I'm not inclined to answering these because I don't want to present the answers as if to make a case that she should stay with me.

- She asked me what would I do if she decides to give this marriage a chance. I told her I will figure that out if and when it comes to that. Is that an okay answer?

- She also gave her own interpretation as to why I'm doing these changes - apparently to keep family intact for my son and encouraged me to look at the situation as if our son didn't exist ("what would you do then?"). That I'm manipulating her to stay and so on. I told her I don't need such analysis at this time as I'm happy as I am and I'm not interested in influencing her to stay.

- She also went into the usual soliloquy on why she had to leave me, sending subtle insults my way. I was also working on my computer at this time so intermittently I would press a few keys or scroll. At one point I thought the discussion ended so I started working again. Apparently it had not - I found out when she suddenly jumped out of her lying down position and shouted profanities at me, saying that I'm being dismissive, answering in short phrases and not making eye contact. It was accompanied by "we need to get divorce now", "you are wasting my time" and other caustic sentences. I told her that I do not mean disrespect but at the same time I do not have answers to all her questions and I don't want to answer others; However I'm sensitive to her concerns. To me, this sudden blowout is proof that she is far away from the mentality required for piecing. What do the veterens think about this interaction?

I believe that if she wants to come back she should do it on her own analysis. I do not want to provide her any input or make an explicit case by discussing R issues.

Any insights on the above will be really helpful. Should I talk to her and set some rules on further discussions and that I'm not averse to discussing. If yes, what would these rules be?

[LH19]

Peter,

You are doing fine. She knows reconciling is the right thing to do but she’s not feeling it. Logic and reason says reconcile and emotions say divorce. Unfortunately guess which one usually wins in these cases?

[Valeska19]

I do wonder why I should live with this woman.

IHS is very difficult. My guess is physical separation is going bring you peace.

This is a new development on the boards over the past few years. We didn't always push for physical separation.

Sure it will give you peace.. but it also won't give your W a chance to see your hard earned changes.. nor will give her the experience to see the new you which is why she questions her emotions.

Detach Peter. Who cares what she thinks...You are doing the changes for you right? So don't worry about the outcome. You have no control on whether she believes your change. Only time and consistency are the best chances of that.

Validate her hesitation/frustration/anger especially if when you're actions are 180s for you and how you behaved pre-BD

Walk away from conversations where she spews venom.

Not always easy... but fairly simple.

[OnlyBent]

Not sure BL was pushing for physical separation. He stated his opinion, IHS is very difficult. From my experience I totally agree.

I’m also not sure that DBing is about ensuring that she can see your changes. I was of the understanding that the changes are for you and who cares if the other person sees them or not. but if you are hoping they do, like staying IHS just so they can, it makes the changes seem disingenuous.

I must say I’m a bit over hearing all this talk of the boards aren’t what they used to be. They are what they are, the reminiscing doesn’t help anyone. If you don’t like something, or wish it to be a certain way, then be the one to try and change it rather than sit around and talk about the good ol days.

[Valeska19]

Not sure BL was pushing for physical separation. He stated his opinion, IHS is very difficult. From my experience I totally agree.

Of course it's difficult... but there ARE benefits to being in proximity IF you can stay detached.. Peter didn't ask BL his opinion. Nor did BL ask if Peter was considering leaving. We have no idea what a physical separation will bring Peter.

[quote=OnlyBent]I’m also not sure that DBing is about ensuring that she can see your changes. I was of the understanding that the changes are for you and who cares if the other person sees them or not. but if you are hoping they do, like staying IHS just so they can, it makes the changes seem disingenuous.

That's not what I said at all. I said the same exact thing. All I said was that she won't get to see his changes...which is true. Who cares you ask? People who want to save their marriages! It's not disingenuous to be consistent with your changes and want to show those changes to your spouse as a form of validation. The doing in "for you" is keeping consistent in those changes regardless of her response.

I must say I’m a bit over hearing all this talk of the boards aren’t what they used to be. They are what they are, the reminiscing doesn’t help anyone. If you don’t like something, or wish it to be a certain way, then be the one to try and change it rather than sit around and talk about the good ol days.

Woah OB..that's not what I have said or anyone for that matter. The boards are based on Michelle's teaching... if they stray from that... we should guide it back. That's what the vets are talking about.

[OnlyBent]

V, over on the Surviving, the whole “the boards are not what they used to be” has been thrown around a few times recently, referring to the fact that the people on this forum can’t seem to hear some hard truths. I actually agree with tough love and do think some on here are a bit precious when receiving honest feedback.

What I don’t think is helpful is saying the boards aren’t what they used to be, back in the good ol days, etc. I feel like it alienates newbies and others. Like I said, things are as they are, if you don’t like it, work to change them rather than talk about how great they used to be. Not particularly directed at you V. Peter, apologies, the last of the hijack.