Complaints about things I didn't do properly while looking after the kids last night.
Is this a new dynamic?
Originally Posted by tt180
This is something I can't get my head around. Some of the complaints are valid, some are not relaistic, others I would never think of, and could never consider. I validate, but always have struggled with what is reasonable and what is not. My approach is to improve on what I'm capable of, validate all her concerns, and not be bothered by the rest.
You can validate any emotion, you can actively listen to any concern, but don't forget it's totally okay to also AGREE when her point makes sense and APOLOGIZE once when you goof. You don't want to be Mr. SorryForEverything, but there's strength in being reasonable and recognizing mistakes.
You can share here if you're not sure if her complaint's reasonable. It sounds like with the complaints you have a good approach and head on your shoulders.
Thanks. It's a work in progress. Not that I'm trying to impress to win her back, or to be sorry for everything (which is the old MNG dynamic). It's about how I can be a better partner/room-mate.
She wants to have a chat tomorrow. I said yes, so long as we agree on the topics. I suggested let's talk parenting plan. She immediately replied, "maybe it's best to navigate this alone, so let's just communicate with experts, like mediation."
This is the dynamic we have, I assert a boundary that she doesn't like, and then reacts strongly. It's how I fell into the MNG for so long. Actually, in couples therapy, it came out we hardly communicated about any major life decision, let alone the small stuff. So basically we are forced to make up for 10+ years of lack of communication.
I suggest this is my response:
I understand you feel that you can't trust me, we're still trying to sort out the best communication path forward. I'm still open to any offer to chat.
Thanks. It's a work in progress. Not that I'm trying to impress to win her back, or to be sorry for everything (which is the old MNG dynamic). It's about how I can be a better partner/room-mate.
She wants to have a chat tomorrow. I said yes, so long as we agree on the topics. I suggested let's talk parenting plan. She immediately replied, "maybe it's best to navigate this alone, so let's just communicate with experts, like mediation."
This is the dynamic we have, I assert a boundary that she doesn't like, and then reacts strongly. It's how I fell into the MNG for so long. Actually, in couples therapy, it came out we hardly communicated about any major life decision, let alone the small stuff. So basically we are forced to make up for 10+ years of lack of communication.
I suggest this is my response:
I understand you feel that you can't trust me, we're still trying to sort out the best communication path forward. I'm still open to any offer to chat.
How about:
"Ok. Sounds good. I'll have my lawyer contact you."
But then ALSO don't have any chat at all. Keep it all through lawyers.
M(f): 40 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
She wants to have a chat tomorrow. I said yes, so long as we agree on the topics. I suggested let's talk parenting plan.
She immediately replied, "maybe it's best to navigate this alone, so let's just communicate with experts, like mediation."
I assert a boundary that she doesn't like, and then reacts strongly.
Josh, persuading her to have a divorce logistics conversation isn't a boundary--boundaries control you! She referred you to a mediator or attorney. That's the same path we've been recommending to you.
I wonder what she originally wanted to talk about? I'd say, "What's up?" If the matter had anything to do with legalities I'd be following Valeska's lead and referring them to my attorney.
I vote no response. Toss it in the trash bin. Perhaps she'll see it lying there and wonder.
I did exactly that. It's in the outside paper recycle bin with the lid accidentally open.
I agree with R2C. This is passive-aggressive, manipulative behavior. Why did you do this? What were you hoping to gain?
And BL-- due respect, but you should know better than to recommend this kind of action to a newbie. Throw it out if you don't want it-- fine. Engineering so that she sees it lying in the garbage-- this is not DBing.
may22 is right. I should've left out that third sentence. I meant it in a flippant "who knows..." sense as opposed to an "engineered scheme" to get a reaction, but point taken...manipulation is not DB'ing.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
It's interesting. I had a 12-hour GAL with my S. His first ice hockey game (yup, it exists down under). Awesome time. And all through the event, frosty messages with STBXW with a final request for the value of my IT equipment (really? Its so insignificant). I get home and complete snub. She's even talking to S right next to me, turning her back to me. I'm not reacting, even tell her good night, and she walks out of S room.
My immediate reaction is to think what did I do? But I reviewed my messages, and they were reasonable and polite. But I see why. She wanted to talk about a parenting plan, and realised that her proposal of fixed days would pose a logistical problem for her, she wouldn't be able to do after school activities while looking after D1. She also knows my position on partitioning the day. She mentioned she wanted flexibility to handle kids things on non-custodial days, and I said I'm not adverse to exploring flexibility, but had concerns about what does flexible mean. Let's explore schedules and agree how the next school term looks like.
I didn't think that was unreasonable, but apparently she did, and said this is why I want mediation so "the kids needs aren't overlooked."
Rather than dwell on her motives, as I so fruitlessly do, I'm going to just say (to myself), that's great, mediation involves compromise. Leave it with her to set up (which she is doing).
I'm going to lower my expectations on any sort of reasonableness from her. At this point, I can't expect anything from her.
But my fear on all this, is that for me to break free, and move on, I cannot have flexibility, be at her beckon call. I strongly feel "whats in kids interest" will be the justification for requesting anything, like to visit on my custody days, or for me to drop a kid to music lessons on her day.
Please tell me, am I unreasonable to refuse this? Because really, what is best for the kids is a nuclear family. And that's finished. I can see it from her pov, it's an effed up sitch. She assumed I'd be the cooperative co-parent, life goes on. I just know I'll never move on if we act like a happy co-parenting couple, having her in my life everyday. I'm happy to hear someone tell me she has a point, get over it, and do it for the sake of the kids. But I don't think that I have the mental resolve to be that. Am I just making matters worse by resisting?
I had a 12-hour GAL with my S. His first ice hockey game (yup, it exists down under). Awesome time.
That's great. Enjoy the bonding with your son. Chat up the other parents and make friends.
Originally Posted by toughtimes180
And all through the event, frosty messages with STBXW with a final request for the value of my IT equipment (really? Its so insignificant).
Why go back and forth on the value of IT equipment during S's event putting a damper on it for you? That's certainly is not an urgent issue. Deal via email waiting until you have time to consider and focus on it...or through a L. Lots of posters have made that suggestion, but you don't seem to follow that advice?
Originally Posted by toughtimes180
Please tell me, am I unreasonable to refuse this? Because really, what is best for the kids is a nuclear family. And that's finished. I can see it from her pov, it's an effed up sitch. She assumed I'd be the cooperative co-parent, life goes on. I just know I'll never move on if we act like a happy co-parenting couple, having her in my life everyday. I'm happy to hear someone tell me she has a point, get over it, and do it for the sake of the kids. But I don't think that I have the mental resolve to be that. Am I just making matters worse by resisting?
In terms of the parenting plan/custody/co-parenting...
My opinion is you want to define clear days on who the kids are staying with (E.g., every other week, 3-4-4-3, 2-2-3...etc.). I would not bake hours into those defined days where she come over to your place and play with the kids on your days. That's too granular. At least for me. Others may differ.
However, with little kids you'll have lots of activities and logistics. S has hockey; D has music. It's reasonable to work on reasonable coordinated within the define days to work out those activities. For example, I work remotely from home and flexible hours, which allows me to coach S7's sports teams, where as W works defined hours in the office. So even on "her weeks" I care for S after school and take him to those events and see him as much as she does even on her days. It's easier for her and it gives me more days/time with my kids. I could push back and tell her "it's your day; figure it out" but I want the extra time with my kids so I'm happy to help, not for her but for my kids and me. With your kids' ages, being able to collaborate on S's hockey and D's music practice with STBXW is going to make things easier for everyone in the long run. But get the defined days/weeks in print first, then worry about activity logistics. Be first up front to set expectations/boundaries and then relax and become more flexible. It'll get easier over time. And if you need your own time and don't want her leaning on you all the time, it's ok to state that as well.
Last edited by BL42; 05/14/2201:45 PM.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Yeah, thanks. I feel I'm just overwhelmed with the idea of not having control, that she is calling all shots. My work is very flexible, so I'm prepared to take care of D2 many times a week. Reframed as kid time, and we discussed this in earlier threads, who cares about her motivations. I don't mind, so long as it's in writing, to do pick-ups and events on non-custodial days. In writing is key, otherwise I see wriggle room.
It's the "oh weather is good, let's all go to the beach" or "I'll pick up the kids from school for some afternoon fun, then return them go you", or "the cousins are at grandmas, come over". That is what I object to. These are things she actually said to me two weeks ago. Of course there is value in shared family time, but it feels to me she wants life as it is now, but just that I live somewhere down the road.
And all through the event, frosty messages with STBXW with a final request for the value of my IT equipment (really? Its so insignificant).
Why go back and forth on the value of IT equipment during S's event putting a damper on it for you? That's certainly is not an urgent issue. Deal via email waiting until you have time to consider and focus on it...or through a L. Lots of posters have made that suggestion, but you don't seem to follow that advice?
I didn't engage, nor go back and forth. I'm just pointing out the current mood.
