Lightening My Load

[kml]

So, a discussion on another thread has me thinking more generally - what DOES it signify when grown up adults say “I love you” in a dating situation? And how soon in a relationship do you say it?

I mean - it SHOULDN’T mean “omg my soulmate has arrived!” the way young people in their 20’s mistake infatuation for true love. We are wiser than that now.

It shouldn’t mean you are committed forever to the relationship - you can love someone and still figure out while dating that they are not right for you. (Aren’t most of us here because we truly loved someone who wasn’t really right for us, in that cheaters aren’t right for us?).

Thinking back over my post-divorce dating, I think I only said it to crazy ex-bf and CMM.

I loved my first post-D boyfriend but he was clearly an avoidant and it didn’t seem appropriate to say. I still love him in an agape sort of way. He’ll always be my friend, I’ll always be grateful to him for the role he played in my recovery from my divorce, and I would always help him if he needed it.

Crazy ex-bf and I said it to each other, I don’t have any memory of when we started. I don’t remember any awkwardness. Of course now we know he was duplicitous. But we were in a loving relationship where it seemed appropriate to say.

CMM started saying it to me way too early, maybe 3-4 weeks into dating. I told him he didn’t even know me yet. He was clearly infatuated, and I wasn’t sure how I felt about him. I did say it to him a couple months later as he was going into surgery that would diagnose his lung cancer. Why did I say it to him then? I cared enough for him that I knew I would stand by him through his cancer treatment if it was cancer. And I knew if I waited until after the diagnosis was confirmed that he would always think I was only saying it because of his diagnosis.

I didn’t think he was the love of my life, although I was enjoying the relationship. I certainly cared for him, although he turned out to be difficult to live with at times. I committed to traveling his cancer journey with him, and our relationship deepened through that. He loved and cared for me, and I chose to love and care for him.

Adult love post-divorce isn’t always fairytale, but that doesn’t make it invalid.

Would I be pissed the way some people suggest they would be if someone said ILU to me while we were dating and later broke up with me over some incompatibility? Nope. Would I feel I had been abused or misled? No. Dating is a process by which you learn whether someone is right for you, and someone can feel love for you but still decide - for whatever reason - that a longer term relationship with you isn’t a fit, for whatever reason. We need to be careful not to drag our sense of rejection from our marriages into our dating life. Saying ILU isn’t a marriage proposal.

So, my question for you all is, when do YOU think is the right time to say ILU in a dating relationship? When you’re feeling infatuated? When you decide you’re really really enjoying your time with a person? When you decide you really really like who they are as a person? When you decide to be exclusive? When you decide you want to live with them? When you decide you want to marry them?

I’d say waiting until a marriage proposal is too long, and saying it in the first flush of infatuation when you don’t know the person that well is too soon, but there’s an awfully wide swath in between.

[Traveler]

I enjoyed the perspective of this article--

I was out to dinner with one of my partners when we started talking about love. We recognized that we loved each other but that it didn’t have to mean anything grand. We weren’t in a super commitment kind of place and that was perfectly okay. Our love for each other felt comfortable and at that moment, it worked for us. Neither of us was offended; we were actually very content.

A lot of the time, saying I love you to a partner seems to come with expectations. You love me so now we have to take things to the next level. You love me so this is definitely going to a “marriage, kids, lifetime commitment” kind of place. That stuff is all beautiful, of course, and if that’s where saying I love you takes you, then I’m so happy for you. It doesn’t always have to be that way, though. Sometimes love can just be love.

Sometimes we say I love you because we just can’t hold it in anymore. We don’t know exactly where it’s going but we know that love is here, now, and not saying it is just too much effort to keep up with.

I love you is always a gift, but it means different things to different people at different times. I'm sure CMM's meaning was different 2-3 years in than it was 2-3 weeks in. I like that K told me explicitly what she meant--I was her joy, her happy place after a tough week. I wouldn't assume ILU entails a commitment anymore than that sex implies exclusivity. These are situations where a simple talk with you partner can ensure you're both on the same page which is what truly matters.

[AndrewP]

I've been mulling this over as well and have no good answers. I know that for me that once the ILU had been dropped on me that I certainly felt a lot of pressure to return it. And we all know how good I am at coping with pressure

When I was young I "wanted" to be in love and also when I was dating post-divorce. Now? I dunno. Despite me being the classic "small town handsome bachelor" that is always featured in Hallmark movies - I can't say that it's something that I can find in me to feel in the way that I did so many years ago.

Did the women I dated drop the ILU on me out of actual true feelings of love? Or was it something that was used to "nail down" a good prospect? Cynicism would certainly say the latter.

There's also the whole Eros and Agape division. I love my cat, but not in the same way I could love a woman or in the way I love my children. The English language is poorly designed for these sort of discussions.

[kml]

I’m curious - what’s the longest someone has gone in a relationship with their partner saying ILU before saying it back?

[kml]

(With a partner saying ILU repeatedly, not just once).

[LH19]

So, a discussion on another thread has me thinking more generally - what DOES it signify when grown up adults say “I love you” in a dating situation? And how soon in a relationship do you say it?

When you feel it in your soul. No timetable.

I mean - it SHOULDN’T mean “omg my soulmate has arrived!” the way young people in their 20’s mistake infatuation for true love. We are wiser than that now.

Who says it should?

It shouldn’t mean you are committed forever to the relationship - you can love someone and still figure out while dating that they are not right for you. (Aren’t most of us here because we truly loved someone who wasn’t really right for us, in that cheaters aren’t right for us?).

Not committed forever. But if you are truly in love you will want to work out issues with the other person.

Thinking back over my post-divorce dating, I think I only said it to crazy ex-bf and CMM.

Ok. Did you mean it?

I loved my first post-D boyfriend but he was clearly an avoidant and it didn’t seem appropriate to say. I still love him in an agape sort of way. He’ll always be my friend, I’ll always be grateful to him for the role he played in my recovery from my divorce, and I would always help him if he needed it.

Why not?

Crazy ex-bf and I said it to each other, I don’t have any memory of when we started. I don’t remember any awkwardness. Of course now we know he was duplicitous. But we were in a loving relationship where it seemed appropriate to say.

Sounds like you may have loved him.

CMM started saying it to me way too early, maybe 3-4 weeks into dating. I told him he didn’t even know me yet. He was clearly infatuated, and I wasn’t sure how I felt about him. I did say it to him a couple months later as he was going into surgery that would diagnose his lung cancer. Why did I say it to him then? I cared enough for him that I knew I would stand by him through his cancer treatment if it was cancer. And I knew if I waited until after the diagnosis was confirmed that he would always think I was only saying it because of his diagnosis.

Sounds like you may have loved him.

I didn’t think he was the love of my life, although I was enjoying the relationship. I certainly cared for him, although he turned out to be difficult to live with at times. I committed to traveling his cancer journey with him, and our relationship deepened through that. He loved and cared for me, and I chose to love and care for him.

Sounds like you may have loved him.

Adult love post-divorce isn’t always fairytale, but that doesn’t make it invalid.

Huh?

Would I be pissed the way some people suggest they would be if someone said ILU to me while we were dating and later broke up with me over some incompatibility? Nope. Would I feel I had been abused or misled? No. Dating is a process by which you learn whether someone is right for you, and someone can feel love for you but still decide - for whatever reason - that a longer term relationship with you isn’t a fit, for whatever reason. We need to be careful not to drag our sense of rejection from our marriages into our dating life. Saying ILU isn’t a marriage proposal.

K I think it's clear that ILUs are basically meaningless to you and CW. I think you two are in the minority.

So, my question for you all is, when do YOU think is the right time to say ILU in a dating relationship? When you’re feeling infatuated? When you decide you’re really really enjoying your time with a person? When you decide you really really like who they are as a person? When you decide to be exclusive? When you decide you want to live with them? When you decide you want to marry them?

When you love being with this person and you can't imagine living your life without this person. That's what love is all about. Anything else is likely manipulation.

I’d say waiting until a marriage proposal is too long, and saying it in the first flush of infatuation when you don’t know the person that well is too soon, but there’s an awfully wide swath in between.

How about simply saying it when you mean it.

[kml]

When you love being with this person and you can't imagine living your life without this person

This sounds like you wouldn't say it then until you're ready to propose? That seems far outside the norm.

[LH19]

I wouldn't assume ILU entails a commitment anymore than that sex implies exclusivity.

uuummm sex doesn't imply exclusivity.

These are situations where a simple talk with you partner can ensure you're both on the same page which is what truly matters.

K: So Traveler what does love mean to you?
T: It means you in are my life to make me feel good until you don't live up to my expectations and satisfy my needs anymore because then I am dumping you.

[LH19]

When you love being with this person and you can't imagine living your life without this person

This sounds like you wouldn't say it then until you're ready to propose? That seems far outside the norm.

Uuuum I'll never get married again but am quite sure I will say it again.

[Traveler]

The longest relationship where she said ILU and I did not was 5 years! After a marriage where ILU was an obligation to stay despite abuse, no feelings, and no sex I couldn't feel it for awhile, was hesitant to say it again.