My Story P4...Acceptance of the MLC Madness

[Eagle3]

Link to my previous thread:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?bb=showflat&Number=2928890&page=1

Short summary:

BD April 2019 with the famous ILYBNILWY.
Started an affair a few weeks before that timing. Immediately found out. Lying, spewing, rewriting of history, wanting both of us, etc. until I kicked him out 09/2019. Came back 2 months later, totally broken. (way too soon)
Final break-up with OW 02/2020.

COVID so home from 02/2020 until 08/2020. Deep outward depression, first signs of aknowledgement that something is really wrong with him. Still shows a lot of running behavior such as drinking heavily.

Accepts new job abroad since 04/2020, working from home since COVID, asked him to leave for the other country in 08/2020 since behavior is extremely bad for myself and my 3 boys, all teenagers.

From 09/2020 until 12/2020 slightly showing improvement whilst abroad, new running behavior...working out (sports) to an extreme level. As from 12/2020 clear set-back into tunnel, start of OW2 but denies it.

01/2021 - 11/2021: In January he informs me that OW1 passed away (suicide), also asked for divorce, I agree. Still lives abroad and has R with OW2, denies the R until 09/2021.
Clinging towards me and the boys remains present at all times.

10/2021 until today: Break-up with OW2, divorce final, returns home, starts doing some work on himself but still very difficult at times. Presumably in last 3 stages but who will tell...

[LH19]

I am not saying you have to give-up if you see something worth holding onto but I think time and space is the only way here. I would encourage him to get his own place.

So my question to you is that if you knew 100% he wasn't coming back would you tolerate his behavior?

[Eagle3]

Hi LH,

I can only relate to what you state here. I truly believe as well that he still needs his own space to sort everything out for himself. He only doesn't see it that way. He feels more secure at home. He doesn't trust himself for the moment.

He does mention to do a retreat of some sort and that is what I weekly promote now, in the hope he will go forward with that.

I think he is waiting until he's back from a ski-trip with his best friend which is planned the end of this week. His friend asked to go with him about 2 months ago, since 4 weeks he is working on himself but didn't want to dissapoint his friend into cancelling the trip. I hope he will go through with it after the trip but with people in crisis you'll never know of course.

So my question to you is that if you knew 100% he wasn't coming back would you tolerate his behavior?

I love this question. Thanks for asking. I cannot tolerate this behavior in any way, not if he is or is not coming back. I told him he could stay with us since he wanted to be with the people he loved but under certain conditions. He failed last Friday.
That is why I made a new agreement with him.
We will see in the near future if he can meet this new agreement.

[LH19]

He failed last Friday.

Were there any consequences?

That is why I made a new agreement with him.

So he won't fail this time? Is this new agreement easier for him?

We will see in the near future if he can meet this new agreement.

What if he doesn't? A new and even easier agreement?

[Eagle3]

He failed once in almost 8 weeks. That’s huge progress compared to the past years, so yes, I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Definitely a possible risk, one I’m willing to take for now, since he has done huge efforts as well.

[DnJ]

Good Morning Eagle

He failed once in almost 8 weeks.

Be careful. Pass/fail is a difficult metric. As in, how many times did he pass? A couple of thousand?

We tend to accumulate negative or failure data, while the positive or pass data is somewhat not accurately tallied. And we tend to weight negative much more than the overlooked positive events.

Look to the overall journey. Do not focus upon data points; it’s more the overarching trend.

Follow your slow to change beliefs. These are your values and guides in your life. They keep you stable and centered, even when events around you are not. (Ha, my life at this very moment.)

Boundaries are also for you (and kids). Predetermined, and usually stated, actions you will take if G does <specific action>. Boundaries are not a behaviour modification tool; that must come from within the person themselves. Boundaries are clear accountability for someone’s actions.

G’s willingness to an agreed upon word to signify he is about to (or has) stepped over the line - I’m impressed. If he is sincere, and from my view he is, that shows trust and respect of you. For he is listening to your assessment of his behaviour, and working to modify it based upon that feedback. That is pretty cool.

Back slides are common. All forward progress has components of backwards motion. In that viewpoint, backslides are necessary, and therefore not backwards at all. Hence, why pass/fail is so difficult to grade in such situations. G unmet his obligation. G has consequences. G is accepting of that and pledging to do better.

You are on a rare path. I truly do hope the best for you. Continue to, and always do, stand for you.

D

[Eagle3]

Just venting:

MLC H is full time back now. Not a lot of G noticeable anymore.

Well, I always knew this could happen although I do look differently at it now.
(much less pain and much more rational thinking)
He has made a lot of progress but I know he is preparing himself to leave again.
Leaving again for OW2 almost for sure.
He is still not strong enough, so it will be better for everybody that he leaves to whatever his destination might be.

Will he actually go through with it, I'll never know for sure but will be clear in the coming weeks I suspect.

It is actually strange.

I came to realize that MLC H doesn't want me but can't let me go. I on the other hand can let go of him, I do not need him anymore but I still want him. So we have kind of different expectations. LOL

He is leaving for his week skiing this evening, and came in my room last night to cuddle, to sleep by my side, to tell me he will leave again afterwards to be with OW2 but he is not sure she still wants him. A bit later that he will leave because he will travel around the world to work on himself etc. Mixed emotions like crazy.
But one thing is clear, he wants a way out again.
I told him that I will not be there for him when he is going back to OW2. That much is clear.

Yet again he can't understand why I still want him, he said I have not been honest with him, that he sees I still have expectations, and that we had an agreement when he returned home about the fact that he would never choose me anymore and he thought I was on the same level. I thought I was but he is actually not completely wrong. The past 8 weeks we have done everything together and yes, this has drawn me back to him emotionally more than I suspected.

I have the impression that he will work on himself now, with or without OW2.
Should I put boundaries on anything or simply let him go and see where it goes?

I'm still fine and dealing well with it. Will miss him but will also fade when he is gone.

Living with an MLC'er definitely is a soap...better when they are not around.

[LH19]

MLC H is full time back now. Not a lot of G noticeable anymore.

I am not so sure this alter ego G ever existed.

He is still not strong enough, so it will be better for everybody that he leaves to whatever his destination might be.

Agree 100%

I came to realize that MLC H doesn't want me but can't let me go.

This is typical of all WW spouses. They want a safe landing spot if everything goes south on them.

I on the other hand can let go of him, I do not need him anymore but I still want him. So we have kind of different expectations. LOL

Being unattached is a beautiful thing.

He is leaving for his week skiing this evening, and came in my room last night to cuddle, to sleep by my side, to tell me he will leave again afterwards to be with OW2 but he is not sure she still wants him.

I am really sorry you had to hear that from him.

A bit later that he will leave because he will travel around the world to work on himself etc. Mixed emotions like crazy.

Don't hold your breath.

But one thing is clear, he wants a way out again.

I think he's been clear with his ACTIONs he always wanted out.

I told him that I will not be there for him when he is going back to OW2. That much is clear.

Good for you!

Yet again he can't understand why I still want him, he said I have not been honest with him, that he sees I still have expectations, and that we had an agreement when he returned home about the fact that he would never choose me anymore and he thought I was on the same level.

He's right. That's why I asked the question about what you would do if you knew he wasn't coming back.

I thought I was but he is actually not completely wrong. The past 8 weeks we have done everything together and yes, this has drawn me back to him emotionally more than I suspected.

Expectations are the enemy in these situations. WWs love to cake eat.

I have the impression that he will work on himself now, with or without OW2.

Don't hold your breath.

Should I put boundaries on anything or simply let him go and see where it goes?

Boundaries are only good when you have consequences.

I'm still fine and dealing well with it. Will miss him but will also fade when he is gone.

With time and space you will continue to see things more clearly. You seem like an awesome woman and deserve so much more. Be kind and patient with yourself.

[BL42]

came in my room last night to cuddle, to sleep by my side, to tell me he will leave again afterwards to be with OW2 but he is not sure she still wants him.

He came into your bedroom to cuddle and tell you he's leaving to be with OW2? That's seems extremely unhealthy.

I told him that I will not be there for him when he is going back to OW2. That much is clear.

Sounds likely he will go back to OW2. What action you willing to / planning to take in response?

[Eagle3]

I am not so sure this alter ego G ever existed.

Believe me LH19, if there are two things that I'm 100% sure of it is:
1/ MLC exists, never thought 3 years ago I would say this but when you have somebody that close going through it, you know it is for real
2/ Alter ego G has been present in recent weeks

This is typical of all WW spouses. They want a safe landing spot if everything goes south on them.

That's the truth. And once they see they gain the power again they push you away.

Boundaries are only good when you have consequences.

Can you please clarify this?

With time and space you will continue to see things more clearly. You seem like an awesome woman and deserve so much more. Be kind and patient with yourself.

Thank you. Being patient is something I learned the hard way over the past 3 years.
And luckily I have always been kind to myself.

What action you willing to / planning to take in response?

As I said, going back to her means no help or friendship from my side.
He is on his own again then.

And venting again:

Today, before he left, MLC H and I had a walk. Talking is extremely difficult again. Everything I say is used against me.

He has been very clear, he thinks he has been working on himself for the past 3 to 4 weeks (he truly thinks this is the time it took him to heal), he is ready and can be happy again and start his new life. I however have drawn him back in 9 weeks ago, he thought because it was to help him but in fact I only did this for myself, because I wanted him back. Trying to explain my side of the story brings monster out.

The truth: I let him come back 9 weeks ago because he was completely rock bottom, my wall was high enough to deal with it although I always have been honest about the fact I'm still standing; we had 7 great weeks together whereby we reconnected big time (no reconcilliation).
About 1.5 week ago unresolved issues from his past arised again which led to his return in the tunnel. He of course doesn't see it that way.

It's me who changed he says. Because he was starting to talk again about OW2 and him wanting her back made me angry because I'm not over him.
I told him honestly that if he misses her he can always go back but then I'm not willing to be his friend. Therefore he finds me egocentric.
I'm only prepared to be there for him when he is not with somebody else.
I told him that if you have her, you don't need me to be there for you. He disagrees because I'm the only one who knows him that well and he needs me to be his friend. I told him again, sorry, I won't do that. I don't want anything to do with you and OW2, this is your life, not mine.

He then immedately said he wanted to sell the house, he never wants me back, blabla, so I said, sure, we will do this immediately. Luckily I'm prepared so will get the contract next week.
Upon his return from his trip he can sign the contract and we can move forward.

LH, You said time and space is needed to see things more clearly.
The past 3 years I have had already lots of time and space, and luckily I do know what I want, I don't have to think about that anymore.
I simply want a happy, fulfilling life, this with or without him.
If he gives up again, I simply move forward on my own as I did the past year, together with the children.

One week of peace and quiet now. Will be good for the both of us. I truly need this. Although I feel I'm strong I cried last night and this evening after he left. The words he said last week are still a burden and processing is needed.

Gaining some strength again to deal whatever comes on my path when he returns.