SSRI's and divorce - WAS (2)

[costanza]

Previous Thread:

SSRI's and divorce - Wife doesn't love me anymore


I've been offline for a while. Started to focus hard on GALing. Lots of new developments, but honestly nothing really positive.

I asked my WAS to move out of the house last Tuesday, the lack of respect, her alcoholism and her "moving on" while under the same roof, just threw me over the edge. She moved to her parents home 10 minutes away. We've been swapping the kids every two days. Not having them fulltime is killing me, I miss my family soo much it hurts. I've been seeing a lot of friends and family, but it's just not the same. I never envisioned this lifestyle for myself. I loved having a family and full house.

I still find it shocking that my WAS wouldn't consider therapy and is ready and more than willing to walk away from everything we built. I keep expecting to wake up from this horrible dream. I really need to come to terms with this fast. I struggle with "the new her" she's become the past year, she's a completely different person. She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials. I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.

She agreed to move out for 2 weeks, however she expects to come back and we start swapping the family home until official separation. A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control. I can't legally kick her out of the house, I also can't expect her to respect "house rules", so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.

I haven't resumed contact with the friend/x-GF or any others based on everyone's suggestion. I'm still a little perplexed by this one though. Is it in the goal of focusing on just me and not confusing my thoughts? Is it to focus on reconciling if that is in fact what the LBS wants? Is it to avoid hurting someone else? I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate? Any info on this one is also appreciated.

[Traveler]

I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate?

You're not expected to do anything. It's up to you whether to stand for keeping your family together or to throw your hands up and move on. Another poster here points out, at one point she wasn't determined to marry you, and then she was. She's determined to move on now, but that's not necessarily a permanent state. There are several success stories here.

Have you decided not to stand? That would affect our advice.

A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control.

100% of us recommended against nesting if you want to save your marriage, including May22.

It is under your control to say, "No, I am not leaving." and then not leave.

I also can't expect her to respect "house rules"

If you mean "Constanza's Rules", of course not, why would she? Wayfarer put it nicely, "Do you tell a roommate when they can come and go? Do you tell them who they can and can't spend time with? Do you worry about what your roommate ate for dinner? Or who they ate it with? No you don't. Because you're not their keeper, or their parent. "

[JosephS]

My advise was to stop contact with your old flame because you wanted to fix your marriage. I don’t see how you can fix your marriage if you are dating other woman.

You can’t control anyone except yourself. If you want to set boundaries that’s fine, but you can’t force her to not cross them. And what’s the plan when she does? You could ask her to leave, but again since you can’t control her she doesn’t have too.

[BL42]

costanza,

Sorry you're struggling going through this. I know exactly how you feel. This is one of the hardest things you'll ever have to deal with, but you can and will get through it.

I asked my WAS to move out of the house last Tuesday, the lack of respect, her alcoholism and her "moving on" while under the same roof, just threw me over the edge. She moved to her parents home 10 minutes away.

IHS was very difficult for me and most others here. Hopefully separation will give you some relief over time. Notice you can't "force" her to move out, but she complied with your request. It's likely a combination of her wanting to leave and you having more power than you currently realize.

We've been swapping the kids every two days.

How are your kids handling all this? It's certainly tough on you, but make sure you're stepping up for them. Every two days is a lot of transitions. Your girls are young (2&4?), but you may want to adjust to less frequent exchanges over time? Read up on that - there are a lot of options.

Not having them fulltime is killing me, I miss my family soo much it hurts. I've been seeing a lot of friends and family, but it's just not the same. I never envisioned this lifestyle for myself. I loved having a family and full house.

I know exactly how you feel. Sorry man. It's tough. Unfortunately you can't make her stay married and committed if she doesn't want to. All you can do is do is play the hand you're being dealt to the best of your ability. Make your life and your children's lives the best they can be given the situation.

I still find it shocking that my WAS wouldn't consider therapy and is ready and more than willing to walk away from everything we built. I keep expecting to wake up from this horrible dream. I really need to come to terms with this fast. I struggle with "the new her" she's become the past year, she's a completely different person.

That's natural. A lot of us here wondered the same thing.

She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials. I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.

I don't recall you bringing up alcoholism or a car crash before? The focus seemed to be SSRIs, though you mentioned drinking with them. Is there a long history of alcoholism with her? Was the crash related to drinking?

She agreed to move out for 2 weeks, however she expects to come back and we start swapping the family home until official separation. A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control. I can't legally kick her out of the house, I also can't expect her to respect "house rules", so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.

My suggestion, as everyone else has said, is...do. not. nest. Simply tell her you've decided not to move out. You're acting out of fear right now, but it's unlikely she'll move back into the house because of your decision...it's more likely she'll continue to stay at her parents or find some other arrangement. Stand up and be strong for yourself.

I haven't resumed contact with the friend/x-GF or any others based on everyone's suggestion. I'm still a little perplexed by this one though. Is it in the goal of focusing on just me and not confusing my thoughts? Is it to focus on reconciling if that is in fact what the LBS wants? Is it to avoid hurting someone else? I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate? Any info on this one is also appreciated.

You're married. Emotionally you want to connect because your W is leaving and you're scared you won't meet someone else, or want revenge on your W, or have a need to feel validated by another woman, but...if you want to have any chance of staying married, don't have an emotional and/or physical affair with your x-GF.

[LH19]

I've been offline for a while. Started to focus hard on GALing. Lots of new developments, but honestly nothing really positive.

Unfortunately you will not see positive results for a long time. Things have to get worse before they get better.

I asked my WAS to move out of the house last Tuesday, the lack of respect, her alcoholism and her "moving on" while under the same roof, just threw me over the edge.

Ok Costanza this sounds like a control issue. She has to move out because she is moving on from you? Remember you have try to keep your emotions in check. Please explain in more detail what happened?

She moved to her parents home 10 minutes away. We've been swapping the kids every two days.

The kids are staying at your grandparents?

Not having them fulltime is killing me, I miss my family soo much it hurts.

It $ucks. I can tell you the feeling will lessen in time. You will even start to feel guilty because you will look forward to alone time.

I've been seeing a lot of friends and family, but it's just not the same.

It's good you are getting out.

I never envisioned this lifestyle for myself. I loved having a family and full house.

This is why so many people here struggle. It's not about the spouse its about the loss of the future of the family. There is a poster on here Scotty B who really struggles with this part. You should read his thread.

I still find it shocking that my WAS wouldn't consider therapy and is ready and more than willing to walk away from everything we built.

Right now she can not see a happy future with you. They may change down the road.

I keep expecting to wake up from this horrible dream. I really need to come to terms with this fast.

This is going to take a really long time so you need to be patient with yourself.

I struggle with "the new her" she's become the past year, she's a completely different person.

How has she changed?

She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials.

It's good that she is acknowledging it.

I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.[quote=costanza]
Well when it comes to the safety of the kids it is your problem.

[quote=costanza] She agreed to move out for 2 weeks, however she expects to come back and we start swapping the family home until official separation.

Actually I don't think this is a bad idea as long as its temporary. Meaning she is looking for a house come the new year.

A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control.

I think May meant you can't force her to move out. You certainly don't need to nest if you don't want to.

I can't legally kick her out of the house, I also can't expect her to respect "house rules", so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.

What are these house rules? When I was in house separated there was one rule, you watch the kids when it was your night to watch them.

I haven't resumed contact with the friend/x-GF or any others based on everyone's suggestion.

Uuum congratulations on staying celibate for two weeks while being married.

I'm still a little perplexed by this one though.

Seriously?

Is it in the goal of focusing on just me and not confusing my thoughts?

You can't do that without sticking your penis in another women's vagina?

Is it to focus on reconciling if that is in fact what the LBS wants?

It's to focus on yourself and your kids.

Is it to avoid hurting someone else?

Seriously? You better hope Ginger does come to your thread.

I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate?

LOL. Yeah I think you can keep your dick in your pants until after Christmas.

Any info on this one is also appreciated.

See above.

[Traveler]

She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials. I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.

It sounds like, similar to her earlier depression, she's taking steps to address her shortcomings and become a stronger woman. What self-improvement projects have you been undertaking?

[Traveler]

Seems.. the car accident.. finally broke through her alcoholism denials. I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.

If you're a parent, then a DWI is your concern. Was it a DWI? Was there a child in the car? How long ago was this? These are typically public records and I know people who regularly scan for updates to their ex's criminal records. The courts weigh such factors. The court's goal would be to protect the kids by avoiding future incidents of drinking and driving. If it was a DWI, the court may give her options, e.g., recovery programs OR ignition devices that measure alcohol levels. You say she plans to seek treatment, so this may be a non-issue, just a reminder that the way she parents is a concern if it rises to the level of criminal abuse or negligence.

Beyond that, YES, let go and stop trying to control what she does. That sounds like it would be a big 180 in your situation.

[wayfarer]

Costanza,

Your W is staying at her parents. In 2 weeks you don't need to rotate who's in the home and you shouldn't. No you can't legally kick her out but she left. She wants to leave so now she needs to deal with it. And if that means setting up camp at her parents semi-permanently so be it. You don't have to nest #1 and #2 if you start leaving the house every other week what do you think is going to happen? You think she's just going to sit there and pine for her old life while you bang your way through a f**k it list? She will not and unless you want people you're unfamiliar with around your kids or guys playing a little game of slap and tickle with your W in your marital bed I strongly suggest you tell you're wife nesting isn't happening. She's at her parents now she better settle in.

Next, you don't get to chase tail because your W said it's over. Let me rephrase that....You're welcome to chase all the tail you'd like since your W said it's over but don't anticipate that it won't come back to bite you in the a$$ multiple times in all kinds of fun ways:

- You are not in healthy mental or emotional place to be playing with other people's emotions and hearts. It is cruel to play with people like that.

- Sex and dating is a distraction from the real work you need to do heal from this. While I understand the allure it's no different than your W self medicating with booze. If you need me to elaborate on that I can, but it should be pretty straight forward.

- Right now you have an immense amount on your plate divorcing and getting your kids into a new routine that is a second full time job. For a good chunk of time in the near future. If you aren't focusing all your energy on self care and your children that means you are robbing your children of time, and yourself.

- I doubt anyone would believe you that you really wanted this marriage to work if you pursue other women before the ink is dry on your decree. If you couldn't care less about other's opinions including that of your family, friends and co-workers by all means go ahead.

That's just to name a few.

Seriously though, have you guys even filed yet? Because if you haven't even filed yet the fact that we're even having this conversation is absurd. You are still married in every sense. This isn't Michael Scott declaring 'bankruptcy' in The Office. You don't just say it and it happens. Actual steps need to be taken to create a dissolution of your marriage including separating your finances, your things, creating placement schedules, FILING, recalibrating your entire life to the new normal.

Costanza, if you truly believe you find yourself, you heal yourself, and move on to the next phase in your life between the thighs of a woman you have so, so, so much work to do before you should be allowed anywhere near the dating pool. You need a new therapist. Desperately. You need to do a brutally honest inventory of yourself, and you need to find a therapist who isn't just a validation bot, who can help guide you with that. You need to realize you are just as broken as that W of yours, and you will only attract other broken people or worse be the one who breaks them.

[LH19]

I must say I do love a good game of slap and tickle lol.

[SteveLW]

Costanza, sorry, I know that this not what you wanted. Maybe the physical separation will be better than the IHS. Maybe it won't. Everyone is different, what works for one doesn't work for everyone. Just be aware that sometimes people think physical separation will be better and are shocked when they struggle just as much.

I'm not a fan of nesting but if you're sure it will be only for a short time then maybe it can work. Most people find that the WAS/WS will milk the nesting arrangement and then 2 years goes by and they're still doing it. So I'd only agree to it for as short of a period of time as possible.

On the dating, yes you do not date for all those reasons and more. You can't possibly be ready to be in an R with someone new. It is possible to be celibate until you are in another relationship. It won't kill you. Use this time to deal with the emotional baggage from the end of your marriage, become the best version of yourself you can be. When the time is right you'll find someone new. Lots of LBSs have shortcut this by dating right away only to wind up back in the same spot with someone new shortly down line.

[Sage4]

Just another voice against nesting here.

I agreed to nest at the beginning of our separation because H sold it as a trial separation and I was desperate to not believe that he really wanted to leave.

It was brutal and I wholeheartedly do not recommend it. H used it as an opportunity to point out all my flaws and justify his departure 'the house was messy when you left' (it wasn't), 'you left me with no food' (I didn't) 'you purposely left my dirty laundry and didn't do it with the rest of the kids' clothes' (not true, I just didn't get to laundry those two days). Transitions were awful, and the fact that I had to see him and his shark eyes every few days nearly killed me. Peace became more attainable when he actually moved out for real and I was able to claim my space, get into more of a rhythm and start to heal.

And the kids were mightily confused. It was like pulling an old, stuck bandaid off reeeeaalllly slowly. Because H wasn't willing to tell the kids or me the truth (he wanted out and wanted a D), they didn't know up from down. Nor did I.

Nesting is for people who either are amicably separating and have a clear, defined direction (and are both on the same page with themselves and the kids) or it is for cake-eating walkaways and waywards who are confused about what they really want. H had 2 or 3 reconciliation attempts during our nesting phase when he told the children we were never going to get divorced, he loved me more than the earth and sky etc, etc (vomit) etc.

Don't do it.

[Ready2Change]

I did not want the house, but I stayed until I had a 50/50 parenting plan. I then rented a place, set it up for me and my three kids and moved out of the marital home.

so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.

It is really easy. Don't agree to it. Do not try to control her, do not let her control you. Be the best dad ever.

Let her be as angry as she wants, those are her emotions. You are strong enough to not let her emotional state effect yours.

If she wants out of the marriage bad enough, she will move out.

[may22]

Costanza,

to clarify-- I do not think you should nest either (or at least, if it was me, I would not nest). When I said you can't control her, I meant you can't force her to do anything-- stay, go, be a happy wife, etc. Just like she can't force YOU to go or to nest.

If I were you, I'd spend some time really, really thinking about what YOU want.

Do you want to stay married/stand for your marriage under the current circumstances? No one here will judge you if you decide you can't. But this is critical information for you to know yourself and for folks here to give you advice based on your goals.

She can't force you to nest if you don't want to. If she wants to leave, she can leave. If she doesn't want to go permanently and you decide it is too painful/hard to live under the same roof as her when you are separated (remembering that you can't control her behavior), then you can choose to move out yourself or to nest. It is up to you. Your primary responsibility is to be the best dad you can be for your kids. If you think that nesting is the best way to do that, then by all means, but I would read the experiences of others really carefully. Be very very sure you're only doing it for your children and not out of a secret hope that it will result in an R. Like Sage says, it can be really difficult for the children-- and for me, I really felt like if we split, I was going to need to really focus on my own mental health and healing in order to be the best mom I could be. Nesting (or really any contact besides the bare minimum) wasn't going to help me heal and move on.

If you decide you don't want to nest and you don't want to move out yourself, then you just tell her-- hey, I've thought about this some more, and I'm not interested in nesting. I don't want to divorce or separate. I understand this is what you want, but I don't think nesting will be good for me or our kids.

[costanza]

I asked my WAS to move out of the house last Tuesday, the lack of respect, her alcoholism and her "moving on" while under the same roof, just threw me over the edge.

Ok Costanza this sounds like a control issue. She has to move out because she is moving on from you? Remember you have try to keep your emotions in check. Please explain in more detail what happened?

I dunno, it just seems like common sense and decency to me. Obviously moving on in front of the others face 2 months after the separation announcement is just childish and mean. Under normal circumstances where x-spouses don't hate each other and there was no abuse, etc... i don't see how one can just expect it to be normal to start flirting in front of the recently ended 12 year relationship. Once again, the person I knew would not have done this.

She moved to her parents home 10 minutes away. We've been swapping the kids every two days.

The kids are staying at your grandparents?

No, the kids stay 2 days with me, then 2 days with their mom at the g-parents, and back with me for two days, and so on....

Not having them fulltime is killing me, I miss my family soo much it hurts.

It $ucks. I can tell you the feeling will lessen in time. You will even start to feel guilty because you will look forward to alone time.

Yes, The time alone does help, it gives me time for this board and GAL.

I've been seeing a lot of friends and family, but it's just not the same.

It's good you are getting out.

I never envisioned this lifestyle for myself. I loved having a family and full house.

This is why so many people here struggle. It's not about the spouse its about the loss of the future of the family. There is a poster on here Scotty B who really struggles with this part. You should read his thread.

You nailed it, its all the future plans that went down the drain that hurt so much. We had a sabbatical planned in 2 years. 8 months in Costa Rica and 4 months in Europe. Our house would've been paid off, things were looking great.

I still find it shocking that my WAS wouldn't consider therapy and is ready and more than willing to walk away from everything we built.

Right now she can not see a happy future with you. They may change down the road.

I keep expecting to wake up from this horrible dream. I really need to come to terms with this fast.

This is going to take a really long time so you need to be patient with yourself.

I struggle with "the new her" she's become the past year, she's a completely different person.

How has she changed?

I believe I touched on this in the earlier posts. She became almost unrecognizable 1 month after the SSRI's. 2 months into SSRI's she became an alcoholic, when the medication says to not even consume alcohol. Went from someone that wouldn't even get in a car with someone that drank, to drinking and driving herself. She totaled our car a few hours after drinking with coworkers at lunch.
Denied a drinking problem, yet every measure clearly shows it. Always taking on new projects at work, and doing less with/for the kids and home. Became an extreme extrovert, loads of energy. Very functional at work and university even considering the drinking. I can go on if you'd like a better picture.

She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials.

It's good that she is acknowledging it.

I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.

Well when it comes to the safety of the kids it is your problem.

That's been my point from the start. It's terrifying.

[quote=costanza] She agreed to move out for 2 weeks, however she expects to come back and we start swapping the family home until official separation.

Actually I don't think this is a bad idea as long as its temporary. Meaning she is looking for a house come the new year.

A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control.

I think May meant you can't force her to move out. You certainly don't need to nest if you don't want to.

I can't legally kick her out of the house, I also can't expect her to respect "house rules", so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.

What are these house rules? When I was in house separated there was one rule, you watch the kids when it was your night to watch them.

I was aiming for decency, no overt flirting and not crawling in drunk at 2am.

I haven't resumed contact with the friend/x-GF or any others based on everyone's suggestion.

Uuum congratulations on staying celibate for two weeks while being married.

I understand your shot. The way I see it is, I lost my wife last year 3-4 weeks after she started the SSRI's. It's been incredibly lonely even though we lived together. It wasn't the same person, we didn't talk, joke or spend time together in the same way. The memories were swept under the rug. She wasted no time to start flirting with coworkers and anyone else that will give some attention.

I'm still a little perplexed by this one though.

Seriously?

Is it in the goal of focusing on just me and not confusing my thoughts?

You can't do that without sticking your penis in another women's vagina?

Is it to focus on reconciling if that is in fact what the LBS wants?

It's to focus on yourself and your kids.

Is it to avoid hurting someone else?

Seriously? You better hope Ginger does come to your thread.

I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate?

LOL. Yeah I think you can keep your dick in your pants until after Christmas.

Any info on this one is also appreciated.

See above.

[costanza]

Just another voice against nesting here.

I agreed to nest at the beginning of our separation because H sold it as a trial separation and I was desperate to not believe that he really wanted to leave.

It was brutal and I wholeheartedly do not recommend it. H used it as an opportunity to point out all my flaws and justify his departure 'the house was messy when you left' (it wasn't), 'you left me with no food' (I didn't) 'you purposely left my dirty laundry and didn't do it with the rest of the kids' clothes' (not true, I just didn't get to laundry those two days). Transitions were awful, and the fact that I had to see him and his shark eyes every few days nearly killed me. Peace became more attainable when he actually moved out for real and I was able to claim my space, get into more of a rhythm and start to heal.

And the kids were mightily confused. It was like pulling an old, stuck bandaid off reeeeaalllly slowly. Because H wasn't willing to tell the kids or me the truth (he wanted out and wanted a D), they didn't know up from down. Nor did I.

Nesting is for people who either are amicably separating and have a clear, defined direction (and are both on the same page with themselves and the kids) or it is for cake-eating walkaways and waywards who are confused about what they really want. H had 2 or 3 reconciliation attempts during our nesting phase when he told the children we were never going to get divorced, he loved me more than the earth and sky etc, etc (vomit) etc.

Don't do it.

I believe my situation is a little different. There is no doubt my W wants a D, it could not be clearer. She's announced the separation to everyone on her side, friends, family, coworkers, day care, etc.... Seems like she won't miss an opportunity to mention it. She's pushing to start mediation and financial split ASAP. She's already looking and may have found a permanent place for January (if not sooner).

It's sad and pathetic on my part, but i wish she was a little more wishy washy on the subject. In my head I still have no doubt we could've worked things out.

[costanza]

How are your kids handling all this? It's certainly tough on you, but make sure you're stepping up for them. Every two days is a lot of transitions. Your girls are young (2&4?), but you may want to adjust to less frequent exchanges over time? Read up on that - there are a lot of options.

I think you're right, W already mentioned this as well, I guess we'll look into other schedules soon.

I don't recall you bringing up alcoholism or a car crash before? The focus seemed to be SSRIs, though you mentioned drinking with them. Is there a long history of alcoholism with her? Was the crash related to drinking?

No history of alcoholism, she always drank occasionally and pushed it once in a while on the odd night out or special occasion, but never regularly and never this amount. Yes, crash was a couple hours after a liquid lunch with coworkers.

My suggestion, as everyone else has said, is...do. not. nest. Simply tell her you've decided not to move out. You're acting out of fear right now, but it's unlikely she'll move back into the house because of your decision...it's more likely she'll continue to stay at her parents or find some other arrangement. Stand up and be strong for yourself.

I like your stance here, I'm gonna go with this approach. Thank you!

You're married. Emotionally you want to connect because your W is leaving and you're scared you won't meet someone else, or want revenge on your W, or have a need to feel validated by another woman, but...if you want to have any chance of staying married, don't have an emotional and/or physical affair with your x-GF.

I'll be straight up, although the D-bomb was a little over 2 months ago, I've been living with a stranger for the past 12 months, the person I had a past, kids and dreams with is gone, replaced by a hyper and self centered creature. I've been lonely a long time, I feel I've already come to terms with having lost my wife, perhaps and hopefully only until she stops with the medication and alcohol. So ya, I'm lonely, I miss having company, affection, real conversation and plans.

I realize it'll probably take years for anything to change with my W, she isn't going back on her decision any time soon. She's all in, high on life (and medication) and loving it.

[costanza]

It's up to you whether to stand for keeping your family together or to throw your hands up and move on. Another poster here points out, at one point she wasn't determined to marry you, and then she was. She's determined to move on now, but that's not necessarily a permanent state. There are several success stories here.

Have you decided not to stand? That would affect our advice.

It would seem this is where I'm stuck. I need to read up more on the term "Stand". Nothing will change in my situation any time soon (meaning 1-2 years). So although I want nothing more than to reconcile, I realize it won't happen any time soon. At the same time, like I said in a previous post, I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?

100% of us recommended against nesting if you want to save your marriage, including May22.

It is under your control to say, "No, I am not leaving." and then not leave.

This is what I will do. Thanks.

If you mean "Constanza's Rules", of course not, why would she? Wayfarer put it nicely, "Do you tell a roommate when they can come and go? Do you tell them who they can and can't spend time with? Do you worry about what your roommate ate for dinner? Or who they ate it with? No you don't. Because you're not their keeper, or their parent. "

Touché, you got me here. Yes, I just assumed decency would be respecting a partner of 12 years. This would only be normal for me and the previous version of my W as well. It isn't the case anymore.

[costanza]

What self-improvement projects have you been undertaking?

Not as much as i would like. Been working on the house, getting ready for winter, researching mediation options, spending a lot of time with the kids. But mostly, trying to understand and deal with my situation and talking about it way too much with my sister, mom and friends.

[LH19]

I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?

This is an 180 opportunity for you. Meet new friends. The ladies and sex will come in time. You must first be able to live alone. During the pandemic I went without sex for 10 months. Guess what? I didn't shrivel up and die.

Tell me more how she's overly flirting in the family home.

[costanza]

I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?

This is an 180 opportunity for you. Meet new friends. The ladies and sex will come in time. You must first be able to live alone. During the pandemic I went without sex for 10 months. Guess what? I didn't shrivel up and die.

Tell me more how she's overly flirting in the family home.

That's the thing, I'm not afraid of ending up alone, I know I'll find someone and be fine in the long run weather that's with her or someone else.

It's just been a long time since I had a real partner. We had been having sex until July, so its not just about the sex.

Regarding the overt flirting, it's mostly via Teams chats and calls with colleagues and cell phone on the evenings. Extra info: 2 years ago a friend of mine and colleague cheated on his wife with another colleague and ended up leaving his family for her. We had dinner with his x-wife and new wife a few times, back then, my W found his situation pathetic, first to dip your pen in company ink and not end things before realizing the relationship was over. Fast forward and her main site for meeting and frequenting new people is at work.

Until a year ago this was someone that walked in the door and left her cell phone on the counter top and would maybe check it for missed calls 2 times in an evening. Her parents and friends always called me if they needed to talk with her because she never bothered to carry her phone around. Now she's a social media junky and I assume obviously flirting on it as well since she's attached to it even while playing with the kids and cooking. You wanna talk complete 180's!? I just don't know this person.

[SteveLW]

Just another voice against nesting here.

I agreed to nest at the beginning of our separation because H sold it as a trial separation and I was desperate to not believe that he really wanted to leave.

It was brutal and I wholeheartedly do not recommend it. H used it as an opportunity to point out all my flaws and justify his departure 'the house was messy when you left' (it wasn't), 'you left me with no food' (I didn't) 'you purposely left my dirty laundry and didn't do it with the rest of the kids' clothes' (not true, I just didn't get to laundry those two days). Transitions were awful, and the fact that I had to see him and his shark eyes every few days nearly killed me. Peace became more attainable when he actually moved out for real and I was able to claim my space, get into more of a rhythm and start to heal.

And the kids were mightily confused. It was like pulling an old, stuck bandaid off reeeeaalllly slowly. Because H wasn't willing to tell the kids or me the truth (he wanted out and wanted a D), they didn't know up from down. Nor did I.

Nesting is for people who either are amicably separating and have a clear, defined direction (and are both on the same page with themselves and the kids) or it is for cake-eating walkaways and waywards who are confused about what they really want. H had 2 or 3 reconciliation attempts during our nesting phase when he told the children we were never going to get divorced, he loved me more than the earth and sky etc, etc (vomit) etc.

Don't do it.

I believe my situation is a little different. There is no doubt my W wants a D, it could not be clearer. She's announced the separation to everyone on her side, friends, family, coworkers, day care, etc.... Seems like she won't miss an opportunity to mention it. She's pushing to start mediation and financial split ASAP. She's already looking and may have found a permanent place for January (if not sooner).

It's sad and pathetic on my part, but i wish she was a little more wishy washy on the subject. In my head I still have no doubt we could've worked things out.

I think you will be surprised at how long she will drag her feet on the actual D. Has she filed? Hired a lawyer?

We have a lot of LBSs here that were shocked by how long their WAS dragged their feet on the actual D. Move out? Get separation arrangement in place? Go public with an OP? Yes, they may rush for that. But the actual D, filing, paperwork, court appearance, lawyer consults/hiring are all put on the back-burner. In fact, most of the time it is the LBS that gets tired of waiting and goes and files and/or pushes the D forward. WASs are notoriously lazy and slow when it comes to D.

This is why nesting is bad and frowned on. It lets the WAS have their cake and eat it to. In so many situations nesting became the new normal. The WAS claimed it was temporary but we had longtime posters here that were still nesting 2-3 years later.

Constanza, you seem to seek advice, but then decide what you are going to do anyway. The advice given here is by people that have been in the trenches. These are not folks that must decided one day to start giving advice to other LBS, but people that lived through situations where their spouse was wanting out of the marriage.

You mention she has no doubts she wants a D....and claim that it makes your situation different. I disagree. 99.9% of the people that come here have spouses that have no doubts they want a D. And in some of those cases a D never happened. Or a D happened and then the WAS wanted to get back together. Remember, action not words..............

[LH19]

Until a year ago this was someone that walked in the door and left her cell phone on the counter top and would maybe check it for missed calls 2 times in an evening. Her parents and friends always called me if they needed to talk with her because she never bothered to carry her phone around. Now she's a social media junky and I assume obviously flirting on it as well since she's attached to it even while playing with the kids and cooking. You wanna talk complete 180's!? I just don't know this person.

This is WAW 101. My exw and I used to share a phone. Then she wanted her own and was constantly on it doing god knows what. This is all part of the script that will eventually run it's course.

Just so you know I lived with my exw for 14 months after she filed for divorce with zero house rules other then making sure someone was watching the kids. I survived so you can suck it up for a month and a half.

[Traveler]

Hey constanza, what's the news? It's great you realize your XW is a new person--e.g., flirtatious, into social media, getting meds to solve her depression, and talking to her doctor about drinking too much. Have you gotten on board yet with saying no to nesting? Are you joining her in making 180s especially with respect to learning to taking full control of you and letting go of others?

[LH19]

What's the latest Costanza?