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Originally Posted by Steve_
I wanted to talk to her today like an adult about potentially just taking the kids 3 days a week. (its what I do now anyhow) but I would pick them up friday after school and return them sunday night. This means I would not be interfering with the kids school and I will have them fri night-sun night Every week. (yeah not gonna happen now, she has gone ballistic).

Right now I have them saturday late at night until tuesday evening. Well, my kids went back to her today and my son is having some ill will toward her. He is unhappy about the fighting, he has heard they way she talks (we been in the car when i've answered phone calls) and he is aware she has moved back in with OM. He has over heard her and I arguing about her taking the custody away from me and me responding to her threats. I do this outside with my patio door shut but he has overheard and last week when she was physically there he heard her yelling at me in the parking lot.

I am admit that I need to stop engaging with her, I have to just let it slide and not let the threats get my goat, but these things regarding custody have really bothered me. My kids got involved in the back and forth and I know that is not good. I asked her if she would be willing to go to coparenting classes and sit down with the kids or the family and even the L and work this out, things are getting out of hand.

She decided to tell me she is at the L's office and is demanding that I pay her $800 that I havent paid the last 2 months since we agreed to cut the support back a little. (I dont legally have to pay anything until the order is completed and Ive paid over $13,000 just to be supportive). So that is not really cool, the next thing is her saying I am filing a restraining order on you because you threatened me and my kids and I will message your *&%(^ girlfriend and tell her to stay the F away from my kids enjoy your life good bye.

I asked to her calm down, once again ask if her and I can talk to the children, work this out and not do all this. She said I will tell them you have PTSD and abused me and you were an alcoholic. Etc etc... she has really gone for the gold here. Fortunately this is all via text message. I called the L's office, she was not there. I asked her not to contact me unless it is productive and to please calm down and work with me for the sake of the children. She continues to threaten to use alleged events from years prior to gain custody, file restraining orders, and threaten my time with the kids.

I know I need to keep the kids out of our arguing, I should have done a better job. She has become enraged at how my son is acting toward her because of the threats she is making. He is scared she is going to take my custody away. I told him that is not going to happen.

Something needs to give before this mess becomes a permanent effect on the kids more so than it has. I feel like I want to really push for this coparenting class and get the L to mediate the custody issue. My deciding to move has not occured yet, and wont occur for like 7 months, yet she is making these threats now. Telling the children and her family I am abandoning them and etc.. the petty fighting and threats are really the issue. I gotta stop this before it gets worse. Later she sends me a picture of the attorney's office door telling me to "call her bluff" I was hoping this would not come to this but clearly it has. I see myself in court a lot in the future, and my R with the girlfriend dissapearing as well because of this.

Steve_ I feel for your kids. No way should they in anyway be involved in all of this drama. Please do a better job at shielding them on your end. You have no control over hers.

Steve_, this is pretty common WW stuff here. You had the privilege of having mb post in your threads. The dude had a pretty epic WW. She made all kinds of similar threats to him. Even though she was the one that walked away, cheated, and made the choice to destroy the family.

Steve_ I do not mean to beat a dead horse, but this is another reason dating prior to the D being finalized is a bad idea. She is going to use your GF against you in anyway that she can! The judge will see two people that despite having kids have moved on with other people. The judge cannot believe anything either of you say. Her accusations will sound as true or false as yours will. When she claims abuse, and cheating, you will turn around and accuse the same thing. The judge will not be able to believe that you were faithful, after all you have a GF! At a minimum, the judge will now question just how important your kids are in your life.

Water under the bridge. I wish mb would come back to help you. He instituted some pretty good measures. He limited the communication she had with him so that there was a written record. One of the general rules is to limit all communication to between your lawyers, and through email. IF she approaches you at kid hand offs you record the interaction. Make sure she is aware you are recording because in many places secretly recording someone is illegal. Keep kids hand offs as clean and simple as possible. Meeting at a public place, where you do not have to interact at all if possible is the best thing. Instituting hand offs like this will limit your liability of claims she might make in more private settings (like your inlaws house!). Protect yourself.

And make sure you have a really good lawyer!


M(52), W(53),D(17)
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Originally Posted by SteveLW
He limited the communication she had with him so that there was a written record. One of the general rules is to limit all communication to between your lawyers, and through email.
Working out logistics through email as opposed to via phone will help in a several ways: 1) it will create a documented record of what you two agreed upon as opposed to he said / she said, 2) it will probably lead to less escalation of emotions than a verbal conversation would and even if it doesn't it's easier to target your response to the "business" items and ignore the emotional portion, and 3) it will eliminate the possibility of your kids overhearing the arguments you're having via phone and keep them more insulated from the arguments.

Working 100% through a L would be even better in that regard, but it does have the downside of being quite expensive and can also take much longer (there are now two intermediaries involve with varying schedules and responsiveness).

Originally Posted by SteveLW
IF she approaches you at kid hand offs you record the interaction. Make sure she is aware you are recording because in many places secretly recording someone is illegal.
Look up the laws in your state about recording communications. My state is a one-party consent state meaning In mine it's perfectly legal to record without telling the other person assuming you're a party to the conversation. In other states notification of both parties is required.

Originally Posted by SteveLW
And make sure you have a really good lawyer!
^Yep


Me:39 Ex-W:37
M:7 T: 9
S:6 D:3
BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20
OM1 affair ends: May '20
W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20
W files for D: Jul20
OM2 confirmed: 9/2020
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Yep, I am aware of the laws here in the state, I looked them up for a refresher to be sure.

I cannot record her its a 2 party state. Its not admissible and actually is punishable to do so. I asked her to communicate only via text message, which are admissable here in CA. That way there is no verbal arguing. The fact that we have both moved on in R's hers right away and mine much later is irrelevant here in CA. The judge doesnt care nor wants to hear it unless there is abuse or crime going on where the children are living. And since they live with me/the grandparents there is no issue for the court to intervene on.

The EW backed off and has been neutral once the L shot her list of threats/demands down. The L knows me, her, the family and even her affair partner (OM). So he was able to talk some sense into her. She has not communicated with me sense. She did offer to work with me on the scheduling if I still do plan on moving, but I told her simply (thats in around 6-7 months, who knows by then what could change, lets just focus on getting past this) she agreed and the issue was squashed for now. I feel like keeping minimal contact as I have been will be the best bet. I dont even see her much when I get the kids its from her parents, I have only been around her about twice in the last 2 months and that was for like 1-2 minutes. Usually its a "hows it goin, how you doin, sounds good, see ya" type of thing. The real issue here was my S being mad that she went back to OM and her guilt about it with him, she expects me to control his emotions toward OM. I only offered to talk to him and help him through this, she thanked me and that was it.

We have him in soccer now, we split the cost of his equipment, his first game is saturday, I took him to practice this past tuesday he is getting really good at it and enjoys it quite a bit. And my little boy loves sunday school. Things were actually really getting bright up until the OM issue. I feel like with some time and going the way I was going and just praying about it, things will get better. I havent had an issue with EW for like 3 months and I will keep texts/emails, I also admonished her that I will keep all those for court purposes, but I feel like this was a temporary emotion blast from her. One I shouldnt have reacted to so angrily and should have seen coming, but is what it is, I learned a lot on this one.

I really appreciate the advice and following the sitch everyone.

And may, I am not sure about moving anymore, if the EW isnt willing I dont think it will be possible.


T:11
M:10
K: D5, S7
BD: 9/1/20
WW continues to break up and recon with OM.
I paid last fees and pushed the D 5/3/2021
Default Dissolution granted 8/5/21.
Glad my D was not busted.
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Steve, I believe you can still record as long as you tell you that you are. She can decide not to consent to it by leaving.


M(52), W(53),D(17)
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Steve is on the money. CA is focused on preventing sneaky recordings in private settings. In public settings, recording is fair game. In private settings, think "This call may be recorded for quality assurance purposes." or a voicemail's "<beep>".



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Originally Posted by Steve_
My big mistake here is riding the emotional rollercoaster. I thought I was doing good, but I’m still on it. I gave up recon and saving my M but I give her too much power. I react to all this stuff I shouldn’t. That I see I still need to work on.
Steve_, I don't think that is the take-away. A key act in this "drama" was when you made an unreasonable request, she said no, and you wouldn't accept her no. Accept what she controls, and drop any scheming to undermine that (e.g., "Maybe we can sit down with the kids and decide") or manipulate her ("OM she’s with lost his kids due to a domestic violence charge a couple months ago", "the children missed 80% of class on her days."). If these allegations are true, raise them now. I get you may be afraid to because she could raise your issues. Don't be afraid. If the issues she's raising are valid, address them. If you don't have PTSD she won't have much luck proving you do. Her choices are as valid as yours.

Instead of: "I give her too much power." => "Recognize where she has power and where I have power." Divorce separates out your respective powers. Less needs to be agreed upon.



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Originally Posted by CWarrior
While a tangent, I urge you to banish "calm down" from your list of replies to women. Although not the big issue, I suspect I'm not the only one cringing when they read that. It tends to be dismissive, belittling (instead of validating) her emotional reaction and ignoring the substance of her speech.

Originally Posted by Steve_
I also admonished her that I will keep all those for court purposes, but I feel like this was a temporary emotion blast from her.

Can you see the similarity between my description of "calm down", and calling her communication a "temporary emotion blast"? I am glad you two have stopped arguing and you've indicated you're rethinking moving. Props--staying, instead of plotting how to best move, would be huge for the kids. Hopefully, your GF will consider moving for you, and if not, women (or men) aren't in short supply.



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Well things have settled down,

Just had my son's birthday this week. He is now 8. He is a great kid, I went over to EW/IL's house and brought them Ice cream. The EW was decent, her and I discussed being good to one another and taking care of each other with the kids at the table together. We each apologized to one another for arguing and told the kids we would do our best to be friendly and support one another. (I dont believe it but the kids needed to hear that, just stop the tension and keep it away from them from now on if and when it flares up).

As I was leaving OM pulled up, I havent seen him since we went camping together in august of last year, just before EW took off with him at nights for a month then BD and moved out. It was interesting to say the least. He had a look on his face of confusion/scared/uneasiness. I just strolled up to him and shook his hand. He looked surprised and smiled. I said "Good to see you again, its been a long time" he said yea, its good to see you Steve, you look great man. Kept the weight down even got a little bigger muscularly. I joked and said "well Divorce is great for weight loss" he replied with a laugh. I told him and EW as we stood out in the driveway "I guess none of this went down the way we planned did it? I know its been hard for us all" OM agreed, he had this residual look of being tired and looking defeated on his face. He mentioned he has to pay $4,000/mo in support and alimony and his EW is cleaning him out. I shrugged and said yeah, I bet its tough man. I then said "I just want you guys to be happy and the kids most importantly, I told him You dont have to worry about me, I was pretty upset in the beginning but its been some time and im okay, I wish you guys well" He thanked me and asked if I was doing okay, he asked if my girlfriend is doing well, I told him she is, and shook his hand once more, he said "I still dont know why she left you, you are such a good guy" and he shrugged and said, "see you around bro" (its a foreign thing) and I got in my car and went home.

It was unexpected to meet OM face to face, but I actually left happy, and im glad I did. That man looks exhausted, I hope my EW treats him better than she did me, (doubtful) but I will pray for them. And the man if nothing else is a good father so at least I have that, he isnt on drugs he has a good career, it could be way worse. Otherwise the kids are doing great, work is going great, and I have been doing the keto diet for 3 weeks and lost another 12 pounds. I invited my GF to a birthday party with my coworkers, they adored her. She really is such a sweet gal and really down to earth.

I thank god everyday for things turning out better than I expected them to. But I stay prepared for that to change. And I document everything.


T:11
M:10
K: D5, S7
BD: 9/1/20
WW continues to break up and recon with OM.
I paid last fees and pushed the D 5/3/2021
Default Dissolution granted 8/5/21.
Glad my D was not busted.
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Originally Posted by "Steve_"
OM she’s with lost his kids due to a domestic violence charge a couple months ago
Originally Posted by "Steve_"
the man if nothing else is a good father so at least I have that
Steve_, a week ago you said OM lost his kids due to domestic violence charges only two months ago and you wanted to raise that to the court--a week later he's a good father? I'm glad you're in a good mood, your co-workers approve of your girlfriend, and you've stopped arguing in front of the kids.



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Turns out Cwarrior that his EW had her brother hit her in the face and give her a shiner. She called the cops, he got arrested. But the case was dismissed after he was able to prove he was not anywhere near her. And he has his kids back on weekends now.

He had to file a restraining order on her brothers because they had been following him around threatening him for awhile. His ex is the definition of scorned. His D wont be done for a very long time. He apparently tried to file D a few years back and his W pulled some crazy then and he backed down. Somehow my EW convinced him she was worth it all...lol

Last edited by Steve_; 09/25/21 09:16 PM.

T:11
M:10
K: D5, S7
BD: 9/1/20
WW continues to break up and recon with OM.
I paid last fees and pushed the D 5/3/2021
Default Dissolution granted 8/5/21.
Glad my D was not busted.
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