Think about the whole dating process, the main objective of dating (even lifelong relationships) is to win the desire of the other person. We don't date to win the love of the other person, we date to win the DESIRE of the other person. If you know the person you are with does not desire you, then you STOP dating them. THIS DOES NOT CHANGE ONCE YOU MARRY. From a man' point of view, most everything we do is done to win the desire and respect of our wives. Desire is expressed by the women WANTING us, by sexual desire. So, in effect, men marry for sex. When we DON'T get this, eventually we must shut down, because it becomes unbearable to be the one and ONLY one in a relationship that actually desires.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
If you feel one way and act another, it doesn't necessarily mean you are being inauthentic or "not true to yourself" ... as long as your actions agree with what you, as a rational being, truly believe and want for yourself and your marriage. Regardless of what your emotions may be telling you in any particular moment.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Do you know why I had an EA? I don't think it had anything to do with the lack of sex in my M at all! It was the lack of emotional fulfillment and emotional connection with my H. The OM "appeared" to be compassionate. Of course, I know now that all he was wanting was to get in my panties, but that was what I was willing to do at the time the EA was going on. The OM was just "building up" to the time we could have the PA. That was the "courting" part of the R.
One of the many hard things for me as I go through the withdrawal stages from the EA is that my H still doesn't seem to "get it". I wonder if he ever will.....But, where I would talk it out and feel better, my H keeps it bottled up inside of him. So, we don't come together and "connect" on anything.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Yes, I am resentful. Yes, I am having a hard time forgiving and forgetting almost 42 years of neglect. As I have said, I was always the one trying to add "spice" to the MR......not "Mr. Bump on a Log"! I needed that emotional intimacy so badly that first year of M! I practically begged him for it....but he couldn't do it and as a result, my body shut down to him and I couldn't respond to him sexually. But, then I was the bad one! When I tried to talk.....he wouldn't even acknowledge me by looking at me when I talked. He wouldn't answer me when I asked him a question. He just stared at the TV. But, his answer was always the same.....just have more sex and that would solve the problems of the world!
Sorry, I just get so tired of it all. I think he needs to take his share of the responsibility of the breakdown of the M and he doesn't. He doesn't think he has done one thing wrong. Well, I just don't know if I can get the grit and grace to overcome all of that and respond to him sexually or not. We are talking about a lot of years of neglect to meet emotional needs. Yes, I did not meet his needs sexually.....but neither were mine met either. I tried over and over to tell him that if he would only meet me half-way and compromise and come to bed with me and hold me and talk to me that I could respond to him sexually. One time.........one time....he tried it and it was the best night of our entire M. I'll never forget it as long as I live. And all he had to do was talk to me. I was on cloud nine. You would think that he could see what a difference a small jester like that would make, wouldn't you? He never did it again.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
I am so glad that you contacted me. I don't know that I will be that much of a help, but I will certainly talk with you and listen to you. I can tell you what went on with me.
I read a few of your posts to get an idea of your stitch. I see where you keep talking about how angry your XW is.....still. That tells me she had allowed that to build for a long time before she finally left. Do you know what you did that would cause her to be that angry with you? Is it more in the form of resentment or just coming out as "hate" toward you? I don't believe that women keep feeling that way after the D for no reason. It sounds like she is in MLC from what you said in another post and it will just take time for her to come out of that. But my main concern is why she is holding on to this anger toward you. She has her freedom and she is openly seeing OM, so she should have what she wanted. Right? But.....she is apparently not happy! The clue here is that she is still talking about YOU to her brother! That means you are still on her mind. She is venting, etc., but you are still on her mind. You are on her mind in a negative way, but you are there none the less.
I truly believe that in time she will realize the grass is not greener on the other side and she will begin to come out of the fantasy. If she sees you a changed man......and she likes what she sees.....then there is much hope for you. So, that means that you need to work real hard in making life long changes in yourself.
A flag went up to me when I read where you held your little D when she was in a bad mood where before you would have yelled at her. That is a very positive step. I am wondering if you took your frustrations out on your family when you would go home from work. You said you drank too much. That also was a clue. So, I have to ask.......do you think you had abusive behavior toward your family? By that, I mean verbal, mental, or even physical. If you weren't abusive, then there must have been something to make your W this angry.
Ok, to kind of change the subject from that.......let's talk about what you are doing now. No contact to the W is most important. You said that you had "controlling" ways. You can't do that any more. You must let go. You must live and let live or it will drive you crazy. She is a free agent to do whatever she wants with whomever she wishes. The more you try to contact her, the more you are pushing her away. When there are children, it is very difficult not to have some sort of contact....but it can be very limited and kept on a business level. The best thing you can do at the moment is to keep away and out of her sight. She has to get over this anger and every time you make contact, regardless of what type of contact, the anger is going to be stirred up all over again.
For your own peace of mind, you must let go. I don't mean let go of the "hope" that some day the two of you can be together again, but I think it is going to take a lot of time. You must decide if it is worth it or not. If you know in your heart that you do have some abusive traits, I would like to encourage you to see a C to work through this for your sake. Then, when the time is right, you can either write a letter or talk in person to your XW. I'm not saying that you did abuse her or anyone else, please know that, ok? I am just trying to figure out why she has so much anger toward you. There has to be a big reason.
I know for myself that WAW usually have a lot of resentment that has built for years and years. Freedom becomes more important than just about anything else in life. They want to get away from the "problem". If she is in MLC then she is also trying to live in a fantasy world. It will finally come crashing down on her and she will start to get out of the "fog" that she is in. But, how much time it will take depends on the individual person and their stitch.
Have you read Michelle's book on DR? Even though you have gotten D, you can use valuable information from her book. GAL is most important. Taking care of yourself and making positive changes in your lifestyle.
I encourage you to keep coming here and reading and posting. It is what kept me from walking away from almost 42 years of M. People here are great! They will come to your rescue.
Let us hear from you b/c we care.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
I was almost a WAW from 41+ years of M. I went through something like a MLC.....very late in life I might add, but thankfully it did not last as long as most I hear about. I give credit to this board and the great advice I was given when I first came here. If it had not been for that, I probably would have a very screwed up life right now.
I can identify with how your W wants the space from you. I can identify with her resentment of you trying to do all the things she had wanted you to do for years.....but now she feels it is too late and it is smothering her to death. To be very plain, she wants away from you! However, I don't think her leaving the house is a good idea. As long as the two of you can stay under the same roof.....I think the better chance you may have in working the M out. But, that C is poison to your R and you need to get rid of her immediately. I went to one and told her up front that I was into internet sex, etc. and she did not see anything wrong with that! She blamed everything on my H. That was a big clue for me to stay away from her.....and she is the most highly qualified C around here! Scary!
Anyway, my H told me if I left.....there would be no coming back...and I knew he meant every word of it. I could not support myself and I knew he would not help me, so I was pretty much forced to stay home or else move in with my mother, which I did not want to do. But, I did tell him to back off immediately or I would leave. He was doing all the things you have done and it was driving me crazy! The more he pressed me, the further away I wanted to get from him. He also snooped into my email, phone bills, dresser drawers, everything in the house that would give him clues as to what I was up to. I was so furious at him I almost hated him. Even though I was the one that was having an EA with a man over the internet, I felt as though my H had violated me by snooping! Crazy, I know, but that is how WAW's think. The thing is, it pushed me closer to the OM.
My H did give me space and we live in a very, very small house. But, this is what he did. He mostly watches TV at night and I would come to the back room where our computer is and I would stay on this board.....reading and posting until bedtime. This was my therapy. I ordered every book anyone suggested and I'm still reading when I go to bed. My H and I do not share the same bedroom.
At first, things were very strained between us but in time we began to lighten up and become more relaxed around each other. Of course, the first thing I had to do was make my decision to cut the OM out of my life and stay with my H. However, even after doing that, things were not automatically fixed. Not by a long shot! And I told my H that I would have to go through a grieving period to get over the OM, and believe it or not, he understood and has been very patient about it.
So now I am approaching my 3 month anniversary of no contact with OM. I can tell all the difference in the world in my emotional feelings about that. B/c it was only an EA where he was feeding my ego. But, it was like a drug that I had become addicted to and it was hard to let go of it.
I don't know your ages.....I think I missed that in the post. But it sounds like she may be going into MLC. She is missing the single life and wants to replay that. I only pray that it does not lead to meeting OM and leading to an A. All this social activites without you with her is like sending out signals that she is looking for something and is vulnerable to an EA if not a PA. I know you don't want to hear that, but you surely know in your heart that it is just a matter of time if she keeps this up.
My advice to you would be to stay under the same roof as long as possible. Once she is out on her own, she is going to really do things you won't be happy about. Plus, she may decide she really like that freedom and doesn't want to go back home again. I think you need to give her as much freedom from "you" as possible right now, and I know that scares you, but you've got to stay away from her and stop pressing her and trying to control her. My H tried to "force" me to stop contacting OM. He did some really silly things and treated me like a little child! Well, if a woman wants to contact OM, she will find ways of doing it and her H can't stop her. That's exactly what I did. So, don't try to control her.....she will rebell.
Stay busy with the kids and doing jobs around the house....inside or out. Doing things that would help her (like vacuuming the floors, putting on a load of clothes to wash, cleaning the kitchen, etc.) would be good.....but don't draw attention to it as if you want her to notice that you are doing it for her. The more you say, the worse it will cause her to act. She will notice, but at first she will resent it, b/c it is the thought process of the WAW that makes no sense to the LBH. If she asks why you are doing it, just tell her you want to do your share around the house and let it go at that.
She is very unhappy with her life and she is going through some thought process that you cannot understand. She is trying to figure out what she really wants and she thinks she knows but then she gets confused and feels guilty, etc. That is one reason you never know what to expect from her. She thought she had her plan all worked out in her mind. But then, she gets frustrated and her feelings get so messed up and she is angry, etc. Of course, you are too, but as others have warned you....to her, it is all about HER right now. All she can think about is how unhappy she is in this M. She feels trapped and she wants freedom. She can't even think about what is best for her children b/c of the "fog" she is in. She will try to convence herself that the kids will be fine, etc. and that you would be better off without her.......all WAW's think that way.
I think the more you could arrange to be away with the kids while she is home, the better......for right now. She is not going to be interested in family days together etc. for quite some time yet. So, spend time with the kids and plan to be away as much as possible while she is home. When that is not possible, then spend your time in another room in the house. Do as much as you can to help with the kids at night. When you are around her, be polite (not cold), upbeat, everything like the DR book tells you. Use that time alone in your bedroom to read that book over and over.
You must stop analyzing everything she says and does or it will drive you crazy. You never thought about any of that stuff before. That is what is so crazy to us WAW's......the LBH never seem to listen or pay any attention to our needs until they thought they would loose us......then it is like they hang onto every word and move we make and analize it. You have to relax and stay cool. You must GAL and start improving yourself. Take care of yourself. All this other advice people have given you is great and I can't really add anymore to that.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
I started out feeling and saying many of the things your WAW is....
Stop trying to figure out what is going on in her head. She is very confused and hurting, just as much as you. She may be saying that its over but she is giving signs that she still has doubts. Work the DB program. Focus on you. Stop trying to control her and the situation. Let her have space, as much space and time as possible. Do not mention divorce or lawyers that will do nothing but irritate the situation. Plus if you start making these idle threats you may find yourself getting a divorce and not just talking about one. If you do not want a D wait for her to make the advances in that direction and even then make it clear that is not what you want or think would be right in your situation. I guess my main point before I get more info is to not give up. I know this is a sucky time and you are a mess but you need to DB and give your WAW time to see your 180's. Plant the seeds of doubt. See what parts you played in this and do your best to work on them if you want to save the M. Your WAW will have to own up to her parts too but it's got to start somewhere.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Your pride is hurt....that is obvious. But I don't think (speaking as a WAW) that is the intentions.....hurting the H's pride. Your pride is hurt b/c she has turned to OM and talked about your M to somebody else. There is no easy way for a W to leave a M without hurt feelings. I just wished you could see past yourself to understand this is not reality and she is not "winning" here. You must stop saying things along that line. It is not helping yourself but instead, it is keeping the anger stirred up. You won't begin to start doing positive things until you start to cool the anger.
She may want this to be real for her....but what she dreams of and what will really happen are two entirely different worlds. You have to decide if she is worth fighting for and if she is then do it in the right way....which is DR.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
you just keep pressing and pressing and pressing. You don't get it! How can we make you see that she does not want a R with you now? Sorry to be so plain, but you won't listen. She wants to feel free and you are treating her like she is still your W....which she is, but she doesn't want to feel like she is your W....that is the point. She wants to be free and she doesn't want you controlling her life.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
