I've been thinking a lot about folks going through post-BD limbo and continue to empathize with their plight. I'd love to see activity on the forum pick up. I really enjoy sharing my experience with others, and hopefully helping them in the process. So I miss the forum having more active posters with active sitches to help. Have had a couple of friends go through it in the last couple of years so I've been trying to help them as well. Of all of the "experts" I studied so thoroughly over the years, MWD has the best formula for dealing with and moving forward from BD and the aftermath!
Congrats on the Graduation of your D... huge milestone.
As for the activity on this board... I feel the decline is really due to the amount of negativity in general. I'm not pointing any fingers to anyone... its a very broad generalization.
More than once someone has felt personally attacked and decided to leave.
I think its important to realize that there is more than one way to slice an apple. Negative thoughts beget negative actions... I think that if you feel to focus on more positives... things tend to positively improve. Mindset is soooo important when going through a major trauma.
I think there needs to be more focus on inclusivity... because frankly there are things touted on this board that are not in line with MWD principles. MWD tends to focus on small steps and small goals and positives where sometimes on this board you are being cut down by someone else's personal opinion.
There are other boards out there - some better... some worse... but I think the ones with most success tend to help someone focus on positives... and taking small wins.
I've been thinking a lot about folks going through post-BD limbo and continue to empathize with their plight. I'd love to see activity on the forum pick up. I really enjoy sharing my experience with others, and hopefully helping them in the process. So I miss the forum having more active posters with active sitches to help. Have had a couple of friends go through it in the last couple of years so I've been trying to help them as well. Of all of the "experts" I studied so thoroughly over the years, MWD has the best formula for dealing with and moving forward from BD and the aftermath!
Congrats on the Graduation of your D... huge milestone.
As for the activity on this board... I feel the decline is really due to the amount of negativity in general. I'm not pointing any fingers to anyone... its a very broad generalization.
More than once someone has felt personally attacked and decided to leave.
I think its important to realize that there is more than one way to slice an apple. Negative thoughts beget negative actions... I think that if you feel to focus on more positives... things tend to positively improve. Mindset is soooo important when going through a major trauma.
I think there needs to be more focus on inclusivity... because frankly there are things touted on this board that are not in line with MWD principles. MWD tends to focus on small steps and small goals and positives where sometimes on this board you are being cut down by someone else's personal opinion.
There are other boards out there - some better... some worse... but I think the ones with most success tend to help someone focus on positives... and taking small wins.
Again - this is just my opinion.
Well KK I am sorry you feel that way. It's interesting you would mention MWDs principles when you never took them anyway. Steve, AS, myself, Ginger and Thornton took our time and posted trying to help you through the entire process. Everyone told you that you need therapy and you refused. Everyone told you that you can't nice him back and you ignored and actually still ignore. Everyone told you not to date and you did. There are no shortcuts in this process. That is why you are still suffering and will continue to suffer. Manipulation does not work in this process. Time and space are the only thing that works and you still refuse to believe it. We never had a chance to help you because you were never going to listen.
I've been thinking a lot about folks going through post-BD limbo and continue to empathize with their plight. I'd love to see activity on the forum pick up. I really enjoy sharing my experience with others, and hopefully helping them in the process. So I miss the forum having more active posters with active sitches to help. Have had a couple of friends go through it in the last couple of years so I've been trying to help them as well. Of all of the "experts" I studied so thoroughly over the years, MWD has the best formula for dealing with and moving forward from BD and the aftermath!
Congrats on the Graduation of your D... huge milestone.
As for the activity on this board... I feel the decline is really due to the amount of negativity in general. I'm not pointing any fingers to anyone... its a very broad generalization.
More than once someone has felt personally attacked and decided to leave.
I think its important to realize that there is more than one way to slice an apple. Negative thoughts beget negative actions... I think that if you feel to focus on more positives... things tend to positively improve. Mindset is soooo important when going through a major trauma.
I think there needs to be more focus on inclusivity... because frankly there are things touted on this board that are not in line with MWD principles. MWD tends to focus on small steps and small goals and positives where sometimes on this board you are being cut down by someone else's personal opinion.
There are other boards out there - some better... some worse... but I think the ones with most success tend to help someone focus on positives... and taking small wins.
Again - this is just my opinion.
KC, thank you! Yes, she's a very intelligent woman, but that doesn't reflect in her being a student. She inherited my procrastination. She had 4.0+ potential, but ended up in the 3.2 range. Just like her old man! But I have hope, that like me, she'll turn it around in college. I graduated with my degree with honors after being an average 3.0 HS student.
KC, hear you. However, if I could give you some advice in my own thread, I'd suggest you always look for the positive even in what originally seems negative. For instance, I left your thread because you took something I meant as a metaphor as a literal. When I compared your enablement of your STBXH through the puppy, to someone that enables another through drug use it wasn't an apple to apples comparison. In fact, the point was that your excuses for enabling him were similar to the excuses you hear from enablers of an addict. Yet you took it as me saying that your willingness to enable him through puppy sitting was the same as giving him heroin. That wasn't what I meant at all.
So while agree that negativity breeds negativity, what I think you should do is step back from something you initially take as negative and see if their are positives. I've used the example of a true friend before. A true friend will tell you what you need to hear, not what you want to hear. And there is nothing negative about that! When we are doing something immortal, unethical, or self-destructive, and a friend is brave enough and cares enough to point it out, that's a positive, even if the message sounds negative.
Think about your son. If he were doing something he shouldn't do, wouldn't you tell him that?
Okay, this is getting long-winded, but the point is that the posters here want to help. When they all respond negatively to what you're doing, is it possible that they are all wrong and you are right? Or is it more logical that everyone else is right and you're wrong? Something to think about.
Thanks for posting! I hope you're doing well and continuing to move forward.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I think there needs to be more focus on inclusivity... because frankly there are things touted on this board that are not in line with MWD principles. MWD tends to focus on small steps and small goals and positives where sometimes on this board you are being cut down by someone else's personal opinion.
I did want to address this. I think the problem you felt in your thread was you saw small steps and small goals when maybe there weren't any? For instance, you would hyper-focus on "He was nice to me on the phone!" and ignore that he had moved in with OW. Or "he came over to work on X" but ignore that after he fixed X he left to go home to be with OW. So maybe, and I am not saying I am right and you are wrong, that you were thinking something was a small step, goal or positive, when in reality it wasn't. Being disconnected from truth is a defense mechanism that we all have. Some more than others.
Last edited by SteveLW; 06/15/2106:42 PM.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I think there needs to be more focus on inclusivity... because frankly there are things touted on this board that are not in line with MWD principles. MWD tends to focus on small steps and small goals and positives where sometimes on this board you are being cut down by someone else's personal opinion.
I did want to address this. I think the problem you felt in your thread was you saw small steps and small goals when maybe there weren't any? For instance, you would hyper-focus on "He was nice to me on the phone!" and ignore that he had moved in with OW. Or "he came over to work on X" but ignore that after he fixed X he left to go home to be with OW. So maybe, and I am not saying I am right and you are wrong, that you were thinking something was a small step, goal or positive, when in reality it wasn't. Being disconnected from truth is a defense mechanism that we all have. Some more than others.
I was NOT referring to myself OR my thread.
I was referring to the board overall over the last several months. And, I think pouring more personal opinion/convictions over the basic principles of the board poured over too many... and caused people to leave or just overall post less.
There was sooo much put out there about never taking a cheater back and then fine lines drawn over a cheater being PA not so much EA.
^^^^ That is NOT MWD principle and is not even remotely in the book...
Affairs are a symptom of the issues at hand and not so much the primary problem. So digging deeper... what makes a person leave their relationship? Not feeling liked, not feeling loved or not feeling respected... perhaps all 3.
Most people here on this board are dealing with a M crisis is dealing with EA/PA. Those M's are recoverable. They are not a lost cause and the WS does not need thrown under the bus ---- no one here outside the poster KNOWS the WS. You cannot diagnosis my WS as narcissistic no more than any other condition because again... you are only being given a small picture from a hurting person.
Guiding someone to GAL is fine and fantastic!!! IT is MWD principle. It can be alternatively said that the focus must come off the WS and the M... that in itself is a very difficult process to go through but can be done.
MWD states specifically look at cheeseless tunnels... and stop doing those behaviors. To set goals.. small obtainable ones and to mark your positive progress. If you are not making progress go back to cheeselss tunnels and start again. NOTHING states never taking back a cheater...
I think LESS WS bashing might bring this board back to life. Helping to understand what causes marital strife and the responsibilities of each party might be more therapeutic than trashing the WS constantly.
This is just my opinon. But, you can literally see this board is nearly dead. Unless some changes are made it may not come back to life. Which is unfortunate because there are a lot of great things here!
KC, I have never told another poster that they shouldn't be willing to take a spouse who cheated back UNLESS that poster said that a PA was a deal-breaker for them. We have had posters here that have said "PAs were always a deal-breaker for me. My WAS/WS knew that."
This is a different situation than a LBS that never espoused such a boundary.
I think every situation is different. And I've tried to approach every situation that way. I am one of the first here to encourage a LBS to be open to R when a WAS starts to show signs of wanting to come back. If it feels like those signs are real or genuine, then I start advising that LBS differently than I would when their spouse is showing no signs of wanting to come back. Or if the signs are more manipulation and smoke-screen.
So, for me, and I can only speak for myself, I try hard NOT to put my line in the sand on PAs on others, unless the other has stated the same. Because often times what happens is that LBSs are willing to give up their deal-breakers and roll over and take whatever the WAS/WS is willing to dish out all in the name of trying to "save" the MR. Nothing in MWD's writings suggests that the LBS should become a doormat. In fact, she has specifically stated in writing and in her videos NOT to be a doormat.
So yes, some posters may say "once a cheater, always a cheater". We have had many LBSs here who have been cheated on many many times over and need to hear that message. However, no matter what anyone else types or says, the LBS ALWAYS has the option of separating the wheat from the chaff, take the advice that makes sense in their situation, and ignore the advice that doesn't align with their own personal beliefs. For instance, after it was clear that you like alcohol, I stopped harping on you to not drink alcohol. I am a recovering alcoholics, 27 years sober. So I shouldn't put that on you! (However, DBing is hard enough when you are sober...many a LBS has regretted the drunk call to the STBX.)
I haven't witnessed a lot of WS bashing. I've seen a lot of WS behavior bashing. And I think KC this is another area of self-improvement you can make. Separating the PERSON from the BEHAVIOR. None of us know your STBXH well enough to BASH him. But we certainly could see how he was treating you, the behavior he was choosing to engage in, and bash that behavior. I think our society takes chastisement of behavior way too personally! One of the things that is in our power to do is change our behavior. So harping on behavior doesn't have to mean harping on the individual.
MWD does leave it up to the LBS to decide if they want to take a cheater back or not. But MWD also never faults a LBS that chooses D over taking a cheater back if that is a deal-breaker for that LBS. However, what MWD is unequivocal on is that you CANNOT save a MR when one spouse IS ACTIVELY CHEATING!!! This board has always reflected that. No one on this board is against taking a cheater back that acknowledges their affair, is remorseful of it, is willing to abide by the LBS' requirements for returning to the MR, and is ready to work on that MR. But this board has always maintained, like MWD, that is impossible to work on a MR when the WAS/WS is actively engaging in the affair.
KC, I think your thread title has always been your problem. You do not want a D. Your H was abusive. Emotionally and physically. He not only cheated on you and but left you for the OW and moved in with her, presumably ready to marry her once your D is final. He also treated your son pretty badly. You even started dating and sleeping with other people, one guy that you fell pretty hard for. Yet you still maintain that you do not want a D! You never could get to the point where you were DBing to move forward with your life WITH OR WITHOUT your STBXH. It was always about trying to get him to come back. Maybe we were heavy-handed with you at times. Maybe we were too hard on your STBXH, I am sure he has his reasons for what he did (the abuse ASIDE, I will never excuse that!!). But it was always in effort to try to get you to wake up and face your reality.
I have continued to pray for you KC. I will continue to do so. Sorry for the novel. But your posts have been thought-provoking.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
no one here outside the poster KNOWS the WS. You cannot diagnosis my WS as narcissistic no more than any other condition because again... you are only being given a small picture from a hurting person. I think LESS WS bashing might bring this board back to life. Helping to understand what causes marital strife and the responsibilities of each party might be more therapeutic than trashing the WS constantly.
Originally Posted by LH
Case and point "new Steve's'" W had I think 7 affairs. I can't in good conscious give him advice to take his w back.
Your husband not only cheated on you he physically and emotionally abused you. That changes my advice on things.
I hear you, KitCat. We aren't qualified to diagnose if Steve'x STBXW or your STBXH have mental illnesses. We aren't qualified to assess their value as humans. I'll get personal. My XGF has competed in international sports, taught at Harvard, solo parented, donated to charities, and made scientific advances. The world is better with her in it. However, that she's verbally abusive makes her a terrible partner. Steve's STBXW is a serial cheater and so a terrible partner. Your STBXH is an abusive cheater and so a terrible partner. Whatever faults you, Steve, or I have--each of us have enough to warranty therapy--may have justified leaving us. It doesn't justify abuse or serial cheating. That's on them and speaks to character flaws making them poor choices for partners. Maybe, years from now, your STBXH upon cheating on or abusing his current partner and finding himself single again will tell you he completed an anger management program and deeply regrets cheating on you. Maybe he can articulate what changed beyond losing his Plan A and wanting his Plan B. That may change things, or maybe you'll have moved on or be with a good partner by then.
I wish I could keep everyone's details straight in my head, but I can't. I know LH19 and Steve do a fair job at this.
I believe divorcebusting.com has lost some SEO (Search Engine Optimization) and may not be getting the exposure it used to. I just did a quick search on a few terms that should be hit, but did not see any links to this site. Might explain the lack of newbies.
8 user and 62 Anonymous online right now. (lots of lurkers).
This quote stands out: "This is not a peer-counseling site, it's a brainstorming solutions site."
During brainstorming sessions IRL, one of the main ideas to write down every idea. No ideas are bad. 20 ideas is better than 19.
I do censor some of my personal beliefs when I post because I understand MWD view on exposing affairs ect. and attempt to keep things in line with hers.
I do not believe married people should date people outside the marriage. Even if one spouse is actively cheating. But if some one asks for dating advise, I will give them advise as if they are a single person.
The more each of us can give from our personal experiences and knowledge, the better.
It is up to the reader (Who may not be the thread owner) to process all that they are reading and make a decision on how to apply new behaviors to their life. They then live with the consequences of those choices. Good or Bad. Rinse and repeat for the next choice.
We told DanF that driving past his "old house" was a bad idea. Did he listen and change his behavior? He did what he felt like vs what he knew he should do. Either learn from others or learn lessons for yourself.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
