I still thought that there was too much un-organized stuff piled here and there. I saw the pictures again. My word- I'd be thrilled to be back to that level of mess. The dining room was unusable yes - but most of the house was pretty well organized - a mutual accomplishment. Some piles here and there that had accreted for a decade or more, but they were small piles by comparison.
Certainly gives you some perspective on how bad it is now, right? This is not about you being a fussbudget, it's about her hoarding. I think a lot of the other lack of "respect' comes about as a consequence of the hoarding - in that mess, you can't expect to find the right scissors to trim the dog's fur, so you grab the scissors that are available, even if they are the cooking shears. You grab any available mug for the grease because it doesn't occur to you that you could find another more appropriate receptacle.
I hear you secretly hoping she will exit without you having to be the one making that decision. That would be great if that happened but you shouldn't make big life-changing decisions based on hoping the other person will do it for you. If it's what you want, you should be prepared to accomplish it, even if it is difficult.
I find it a bit odd that she's going through her parents' clothes instead of organizing a funeral right now. I mean, going through their clothes is something that will need to be done, but it seems that other things would be a priority first? This may be a hoarding thing, she may be "shopping their closets", beware of her coming home with a bunch more stuff.
It does seem really sad that her son has suffered academically from her neglect. If he's a bright kid as you say, is there not a way for him to test out of high school, such as the GED here in the US? And then go to a community college (or whatever your Canadian equivalent is)?
It's hard for kids of hoarders. It affects their social life, their self-image. My middle son had a friend whose mother was a hoarder. I kind of suspected it as I was never invited in when I dropped him for playdates and there were always a few random items on the front porch - son told me later it was really bad inside, unusable kitchen, trails between stacks of stuff. I've often thought how sad for that kid.
Almost made it to page 4! This thread is about to go poof yet again I think. Sheesh - so much drama.
I was going to post today but thought that I'd wait until today when I would have more information.
Happy Sunday from blustery Upper Lower Middle Kanukistan. We are under both a thunderstorm watch and a snow-squall watch. Welcome to November. A good day to putter around the house.
S said that she'd be home on Saturday morning. To no-one's surprise she got her a bit after 6:00 pm so I had an uninterrupted day to do my historical past routine. S had a big order at the cafe to be picked up but the owner wasn't sure about giving it to me. A bit before 5:00 S texted me and asked me to pick it up. We keep a jar in the kitchen for incidental expenses "the grocery jar" so I raided it for the $50 needed. It's a great innovation suggested a lot of years ago by my ex-wife so that if we needed milk etc that we don't have to dig into our pocket money. We put $20/week into it which was the usual appropriate amount but is a bit high I think in current circumstances. It's usually running a surplus as S and the boys will go for take-out food whenever they have the nibblies and we don't go through a lot of the usual staples like milk and bread that we would normally use this for.
When S got home I'd not made dinner - wasn't really feeling hungry so she and her S18 decided that they wanted McDonalds (which I "don't" eat) so I drove in to pick that up.
It felt really really weird giving her a hug and smooch. Awkward - I think for both of us. There's a definite feeling of a wall there. She had brought little home which was a bit of a surprise. Some of her Dad's shoes for S18 who badly needs a new pair. She did show up with a brand-new carpet shampooer which was a surprise to me. She said she paid for it out of her pocket money and "some money she had". I know she really wants a new machine and that if I'd done something like this that I'd get the hairy eye-ball and a "don't you think you should have talked to me about this first" followed by anger and tears on how horrible I am. DARVO. She said that we'll talk about it. My intention had been - which we had talked about - was to rent a unit and get the rugs clean. S's attitude I think is that she "needs one" - which she certainly did in her apartment with incredibly messy kids who though nothing about food and drink falling all over the floor and pets that constantly soiled the carpets as well.
I may just decide that this isn't an important hill to die on along with questioning where she suddenly found several hundred dollars when she couldn't find money to assist with the grocery and other bills.
Surprisingly S came to bed with me last night around 9:30 and stayed. She read for a while while she and the dog took up a lot of the bed. It was a rather restless sleep for me when I eventually got to sleep. S usually is a restless sleeper and as usual will interact with me throughout the night.
I am sure that S knows that we still have problems and that I'm not addressing them right now. From her commentary she knows that I actually was perfectly fine and somewhat happy when she was gone which can't make her feel good. I think she'd like to have it all out in the open which I can't bring myself to do. I feel horrible about that but just can't seem to suck it up and face it. A sense of duty and obligation are very likely the key barriers here.
When she was gone it was in many ways like being single again albeit with the burden of her annoying cats plus the clutter and the need to be available for S18. It felt good - like I was in control of my own destiny again.
--------
S's daughter and 1 year old grandson were supposed to have driven the hour down and stopped off to pick up candy. That got cancelled when her father-in-law got sick and is being tested for COVID. The grandson is also sick now with a pretty solid fever but he's also teething and kids do get sick. S didn't tell me in advance other than "she needed to explain when she got home". She had gotten the treats with an expectation that all of her kids would be by and that they'd have a cookie decorating party. None showed up. S13 is still with his Dad (I was surprised she didn't pick him up) and her D19 and BF were presumably going to a party according to her Instagram page.
We got 14 kids to the door in about 4 batches. Several of them asked where the boat was. Certainly down from the 80+ that we would have gotten on such a perfect night. I was thinking that we might not get any. I feel pretty blue about the whole thing. Halloween is such a big day for me. I commented to S how hard it was on me this year and mentioned how it had been nice to be able to sit in the enclosed front porch to watch them going down the street and be easier to see them come to the door. The front porch is unusable as she set up her "store" there and then piled in a lot more stuff on top of that so we sat in the kitchen. I was surprised that she sat with me while I waited for the kiddies.
----
I spent a foolish bit of time these past few days scrolling through old pictures from the 1980s and 1990s. As D might say - we had a good life. Not perhaps a "great" one all the time, but there was Joy, love and affection showing in those old pictures. Unlike where kml could see how uncomfortable her ex was in those situations being documented, the woman that I used to love shone through in the bright smiles, silly actions and the just being "family" that was my life for now nearly 1/2 of it.
I know what I had. I'm pretty sure what happened. I know that while I wasn't a perfect husband, that there wasn't anything specifically to do with me that caused the end of the marriage. One key difference between with her and even with B - I was so very proud of who this person was that I was with. They were clever, capable, bright and loving. My ex and I still held hands up to just before bomb-day whenever we'd go anywhere. We were that "cute" middle-aged couple that still were obviously in love. People regularly told her how lucky she was and I think she knew that.
I've tried to find things about S to be proud of but struggle to pin that down. Undoubtedly one of my key problems as pride is so very important to me. The things that I thought she was, in tune with the universe as a spiritual person, a capable baker, a loving Mom who cared deeply for her children, a keen business person and entrepreneur, are all not the reality. I almost wrote lies but I have to take ownership of my own perceptions.
When I was out I was chatting with my old friend FSL - who unfortunately I unburdened on. One of the things that I always liked about her and that attracted me was what a great empathic listener she is. I felt bad about that - putting my burdens and venting my unhappiness on someone else isn't the right thing to do. I did tell her that I will bring her in some Halloween candy as I always do for her and her son who I think is 7 or 8 now. Where does the time go. We chatted about our normal habits - we're both it seems the "can't sit still" and need to be puttering all the time sorts.
Ah well - time to wrap this up. We have bright sunshine coming by every few minutes - going to be weird weather day. I picked up some fresh cider - might be a good day for a big mug of mulled cider with cinnamon sticks and a good book plus some puttering today. I have to take S18 to work in a few minutes. S is still in bed but was awake when I let the dog back in. Not sure what her plans are but she would probably agree that a "veg" day is a good idea.
A bien tot mes amis.
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Had a long deep conversation with S. She challenged me to come right out and say that I wanted her to move out. I didn't. She challenged me on if the only reason that I wouldn't say that was out of a place of duty and honour. I prevaricated. It's obvious to me that she wants to put the entire onus on that choice on me which admittedly is perhaps where it belongs.
A "lot" of laundry got aired and is the better for it. There are some obvious points where we are mis-understanding each other that we both agree that we need to work on. There were a good number of tears from S as she unearthed things that were bothering her that she perhaps hadn't examined before. We're going to set aside time each week for cuddle and talk time and wait for a couple of weeks before seeing a counselor. We both, especially me, know that we need better tools on how to deal with what is bothering us.
S specifically called me out on my griping to people that she and the boys don't lift a finger around here which understandably makes her feel bad. I tried to explain that just because I didn't need or want help with what I'm doing that there wasn't lots that they could be doing but I don't think that got heard.
We talked about the fact that she went and did a major purchase without talking to me about it and how I felt that we should each be trusted to make those sort of decisions. I talked about how secrecy and lies were a big problem for me and that I was upset that she hid that from me. For her part she said that she was upset that I had shut down the idea of buying a shampooer to consider renting. Personally I think that was a bit of petulance on her part that she just went ahead and did what she wanted even after we talked.
We agreed that the phrase "easy to love - hard to live with" undoubtedly applied to both of us. We also talked about the words Pride, Joy and Respect and how those are important to me. Finding words to hang a concept on is very helpful for me.
We also talked about how I made the decisions to get engaged and for her to move in after us having a fight and how we need to make sure that pattern stops.
S went on to say how much she really really wants this house to be tidy and organized and that she just "needs more time". There is incremental and intermittent progress I admitted.
S was I think prepared for me to toss her out and has been making some plans about the practical parts of that. She said that she was completely blind-sided by my comment a few weeks ago that I didn't think things were going to work out.
Going to keep working on things.
Sigh - this shouldn't be this hard.
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
I’m still also trying to find where she is “easy to love” anytime you express yourself she puts you down, makes you feel bad and berates you. So how exactly is she easy to love?
It's good that the eye of the hurricane finally came to be...but it looks like the merry-go-round is still in operation. Andrew, actions speak louder than words.
I do agree w/the others....what has changed? More tears, is she in a snit and will she act all hurt and pouty for a day or so? Well, that's just the way she deals w/being called out. She'll either get over it or stay in a snit. For what it's worth, a lot of what you discussed needed to be said. Now, let's see if her actions match her words. My money is on her seriously thinking of moving out.
BTW, I would have rented a shampooer because it's cheaper and you don't have to store the equipment. Also, how many times do you actually need to use it? She doesn't sound like she's good at thinking things through and this is where I see a pattern of "splurge" shopping being done. I would have weighed the $$$ amount before I purchased the shampooer with what I owed on my bills and yes, in helping out with grocery purchases, etc.
I sense that the merry-go-round will continue to turn round and round for a while until one day, she will finally move out. BTW, one last thing...if she's so tired of you talking to others about her and the clan, etc., then she needs to go to bed at a reasonable hour, get up at a reasonable hour and get to work on cleaning and tidying up the place...you would have the need to talk to someone if she was pulling her weight around the place. The shampooer can't operate itself...now can it?
Learn to speak up more frequently and when something isn't right...point it out at that time...not later and she should do the same....it's best to clear the air when something rankles either of you.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
