No changes on WAW - Pack_19 Part II

[Pack_19]

hi all,

I needed to write today before going to sleep. I heard yesterday from a very good friend that W made out with a friend of a friend last winter. Apparently she wanted something more but he freaked out by the idea of her having two children. This has been confirmed by someone I really trust.

I have tried to face W today via telephone. I wanted to give her an ultimatum and say if I do not hear in two weeks about our M and her stand, I will start the D process and before I could finish she answered "I am not getting back with you" and she hanged up. I tried to call a couple of times without an answer and finally I sent her a message telling her I will not have an open M and I will file if I do not hear from her.

I love my children and want to fight for this but I still have some pride. You might say as many friends oh she is free as you are separated and you need to accept it. Sorry but I cannot be married to a person who does not share basic principles as these ones with me. I would never do that, even if we had problems heavy enough. I feel like filling, now what? I tell my W I will file for D in 15 days and obviously she is not going to say anything in that time.

I am very lost today, this hurts beyond all the cr@p she has told me before. I dont want my children to know I filed but I feel this is too much. We had two days when she talked to me about money only, now she is back to I hate you and do not even talk to me if it is not about the kids. I cannot take this anymore, she is out there doing the hell she wants and I am supposed to have zero love for myself and sacrifice my happiness for our family. I wanted my ultimatum to be serious and once again she disrespects me at my face, not even that she could hear in person.

[LH19]

P,

You are being driven by emotion and are making major mistakes.

[Pack_19]

hi LH19,

What am I supposed to do?

At any point I see her is all about I am never getting back with you and then I hear about these things. I talked to my L today and she told me she would not file because she would leave the door open for the future as we got married very young and we have little children.

You know when someone wrote here that hell and high water will both come and will come sometimes together. Well it has caught me without air in my lungs. I hate this situation and the things that are happening, I truly wish I had never got married so young and stupid.

Should I ignore what happened and continue my GAL and building an amazing life as the man I want to be?

thank you all

[LH19]

P,

Ultimatums are about control and you are trying to control her. You don't issue an ultimatum and then when she hangs up on you then you call her back. You can't control the outcome.

I want you to take some time and figure out what you want before you file. You still have a lot of work to do on you. Accept that right now there is nothing you can do to change your situation.

[greenman]

Hey Pack,

My situation is somewhat different, but its been a year since S also. Its taken me a year to start really accepting where I am at and not feeling sorry for myself and the kids. And not being angry or resentful at my W. It flares up on occasion and almost always sets me back. I also have a firm stance on no infidelity, which we both seem to agree on thus far. I would rather move on than deal with that.

I want to be with W and our family, but you cannot force that nor do you want to. I could also be happy coparenting fully if I had to.

Don't stay in it for the kids. You need to figure out who your W is, how you got here and if you want her long term.

Granted my W has not given up and not treating me like crap, but you need to remove yourself from her equation. Get to a point where you are OK and excited about a future without her if need be. Its taken me a year, but I am getting there. I want R, but I also know I will be fine either way.

You have a lot going for you. You are young and haven't been married a long time. The best thing you can do to get her attention is kick ass and ignore her behavior.

If you have an issue with something she did, you need to ask her about it. Not give an ultimatum. If it is confirmed, convey that you will not be in an open marriage. That is it. Figure out what you want to do. Keep the M for now if its not hurting you financially, but think about Pack and a future without her.

Emotion is a killer.

[sandi2]

Should I ignore what happened and continue my GAL and building an amazing life as the man I want to be?

Think about the words you've said here ^^^^^^^^^.

What are your options? Should you crawl into a shell and die emotionally, b/c your W pretended that everything was your fault......while she pursued another guy?

I have tried to face W today via telephone. I wanted to give her an ultimatum and say if I do not hear in two weeks about our M and her stand, I will start the D process and before I could finish she answered "I am not getting back with you" and she hanged up. I tried to call a couple of times without an answer and finally I sent her a message telling her I will not have an open M and I will file if I do not hear from her.

Well, you've backed yourself into a corner. You've told her what you will do. Don't expect her to bend to your wishes. I think you will hear from her, if you go silent. I think she will follow her old behavior pattern and verbally chew you up and spit you out of her mouth.......again. I don't think your threat will have any positive results. The question you have now, is what do you do after giving her an ultimatum. It is your decision if you follow through with the ultimatum or not. I want you to think very carefully about the results if you follow through, and the results if you don't.

I dont want my children to know I filed but I feel this is too much.

Why, b/c you are afraid they will see you as the bad guy? As long as you are honest with them, and you are involved in their lives as a loving father......I don't believe they are going to resent you for being the one who filed for D. You have been the parent who did everything you could to restore the marriage/family. That's the important part, when you discuss it with your children. Divorce wasn't what you preferred, but there came a time you felt you had to stand on your principles. (Many people file for D based on their principles.) I'm not saying the children will never wish their parents had not remained together. I'm saying they will not see you as being a bad guy for filing for a D.

You mentioned how your friends say that your W is free to see other men while separated from you. That is a common belief and practice among many people. They see a separation as being single. I'm not saying it is right or wrong, b/c my principles may not be the same as yours. Your W's viewpoint may not agree with your viewpoint about how she conducts herself while separated. If so, then I don't think your ultimatum is going to prevent her from staying separated or from seeing another man. If that's true, then what do you do? You cannot control her. You only control Paco.

I agree with LH, that you need to calm down your emotions and stop reacting to her actions. People don't make great decisions when they are reacting on their emotions.

I tell my W I will file for D in 15 days and obviously she is not going to say anything in that time.

Now listen, Paco, you wait out those 15 days, and don't reach out to her. Don't contact her. I think your emotions will want you to contact her to apply more pressure.......but don't do it. Don't try to have another discussion. Come here to write about your feelings, but don't contact her. Just work on calming down, so that you can think better, okay? I think she will test you, by giving you a phone call. Be prepared, b/c it's only a test. It will not be her ready to say she wants to save the marriage. If she wants to tell you something, she can send you an email. She doesn't like emails, b/c it doesn't give her the satisfaction of verbally giving you a beating.

Does she have the children during this time?

[Pack_19]

hi all,

thanks for all the comments and support. Things have gone worse, I did send her a message telling her I thought her behaviour was despicable and she was a lousy wife and mother (yes I was freaking inspired there but I let my emotions run wild) and she passed it on to her L. I have been warned by my L because of domestic violence so I am backing off totally. Basically, all the things I thought she would never do, she is doing.

We have been communicating via email and yesterday afternoon I spend some time with the children which was great for me. S6 told me we are separated because I was "bad with mommy" which was very hard to hear but I calmly told her I was never bad, only nervous and it will never happen again.

If I try to talk to her about the information I got on her going out wild she will ignore me, she treats me like a dog again. Yesterday when I dropped the kids we met at her elevator and her words were "It was back by 21 not 21:15 and do not ever come up my elevator" then she tried to take the kids and leave but I stopped her to kiss them goodbye.

I talked to my L. She recommended I dont file because we are very young and have young kids but if the things my friends told me are true I want to file. I would never do this to my spouse, ever, I would divorce first and I cannot understand she does it. I know for sure my S6 wants me to keep fighting.

I have spent the last 3 nights sleeping intermittently, I woke up today thinking about sending her an email to ask for clarifications but is only going to make me look weak. I am so tired of being treated this way. what should I do?

[Pack_19]

@ Sandi,

She has the children until Sunday, then I get them next week and then she gets them the week after and so on. We have been communicating as I said over email the last 2 days.

I never meant to give her the ultimatum to get her back, sadly for me I truly feel our M is somehow there and I refuse to live in an open M where she can go out and pursue whoever she wants while I get up every day thinking about the man I want to be and the R I would like us to have. It is not fair for me, I would never do this and if we are to go down this path I say we do it divorced. The thing is that she hates me so much she couldnt care less about any words I say.

I think a lot about your comments on how things had to get worse before I could see a change if ever, well I dont think things can get any worse than when your W threatens with police. I am a good father and I love my W, that is all, I do not deserve this treatment...

I dont know how I will proceed when the 15 days have passed and she has not said a word. As I am sure it is what will happen. Thank you all.

[LH19]

P,

First and foremost I want to clarify what things typically need to get worse before they get better means typically people need to go through a divorce and the WW needs to hit rock bottom. Then the WW can look at themselves and realize they also had a role in the downfall of the marriage. They realize there were more good times then bad and life was better together. This does not always happens. Sometimes people are better off apart.

THIS DOES NOT MEAN GETTING THE POLICE CALLED ON YOU!

You are going to struggle because you have a tough time controlling your emotions. You also think you can control your Ws actions. If her being with other men is a deal breaker for you then you should probably file for D right now. You painted yourself into a corner with this ultimatum.

Unfortunately Pack it's been a year and you still think you can control the outcome. You are sadly mistaken my friend. You are 29 years old. Almost half my age. Do you want to spend the rest of your life chasing a woman who wants nothing to do with you?

The clock is ticking on your ultimatum.

[Pack_19]

LH, thanks for your words. I am trying to be detached from this situation, I am trying to be happy and leave W aside but I keep coming back to memories and the value of our kids.

My W being with other men IS a deal breaker for me, I cannot be with someone who does not share those values with me. I dont want to control what she does, I want her to be clear. If she is I can then file with peace of mind, if she keeps hiding things and treating me like a criminal I cannot file based on a rumor.

I can only control my happiness, that is very clear. I do not want to spend the rest of my life chasing a woman who treats me like a bad person and disrespects me even in front of my children. Maybe she has changed more than I could ever imagine, or maybe she was always this way and married me because we had a son and it was "the right thing to do".

I am going to stay way and silent for 15 days starting yesterday and if I do not hear anything from her I will ask my L to change the S for a D. I went to Ikea yesterday, I am renewing my entire bedroom, all in. If we are going to sleep with other people I will do it in a new bed and a new house, apart from all the focking memories these pieces of furniture bring to me, apart from anywhere I laid with her, but I will the pictures of my children, they are the best thing that ever happened to me and whoever is going to love me will understand it.