My point is that right now you need to be detoxing from H. You are addicted and addicts have to go cold turkey in order to recover. There is no such thing as a drinking recovering alcoholic.
Maybe in the future, when meeting with SS20 and SD20, setting the boundary up front that you do not want to talk about or discuss their father would be beneficial. This does two things:
1) It lessens the likelihood that he will come up 2) It keeps your intentions pure. It shows YOU and them that it isn't an effort to intel gather on him. And it will take that accusation away from him to use later
So I do have to ask.....are your intentions with these lunches pure?
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
My point is that right now you need to be detoxing from H. You are addicted and addicts have to go cold turkey in order to recover. There is no such thing as a drinking recovering alcoholic.
Maybe in the future, when meeting with SS20 and SD20, setting the boundary up front that you do not want to talk about or discuss their father would be beneficial. This does two things:
1) It lessens the likelihood that he will come up 2) It keeps your intentions pure. It shows YOU and them that it isn't an effort to intel gather on him. And it will take that accusation away from him to use later
So I do have to ask.....are your intentions with these lunches pure?
^^^ YES
I would not have breathed a word of H... but it seemed like what SS20 said he needed to get off his chest. If that's the case it would be wrong to tell him he cannot. AND, I did say quickly... well none of that really matters (about H) and moved on to other things. Again... SS20 JUST found out he is expecting, got engaged, and literally just bought a house the day before. He is overwhelmed and tired.
I'm 100% positive that SS20 does not say a word to H that he chats occasionally with me or that he met up with me.
And, there WAS NO gathering of intel for sure. I didn't ask one word about H... I just listened and validated SS20 feelings in that moment.
PS - I made his favorite pie and when loading up his car and saw I had a pie for him his eyes lit up and he said he was really hoping to get one of these while he was home and was excited and told me he wasn't sharing it with anyone!!!
^^^ That made me feel so good.
As I've said before I miss my family of 5 (now expanding!!!). I won't be a strong presence because it would make my H feel I'm not moving on in his eyes but I'm letting both stepkids know they know how to reach me and if they ever need anything.... What I hope for most is for them to have a relationship with S19. Up until 9 months ago S19 and SD10 were extremely close to one another and I know that S19 misses that too.
So you regularly met SS20 and SD20 for lunches prior to all this happening? Just looking for context.
SS20 is military and has been deployed longer than he should have due to Covid. I have not seen him in just over year (last time he was home). I regularly sent letters and care packages during the last 2yr of his military service - like at least once a month.
We are not in constant contact but will occasional communicate via messenger or he might like a FB post or I would comment on one of his.
SD19 is a bit of a recluse dealing with a lot of her own issues in life. She cut communication with her father last December - H bears 70% responsibility and SD19 bears 30%. I have texted her at the holidays and sent her a package in the last 6 months - no response but its extremely common that she doesn't respond to people's text, her grandmother, her brother, etc.
S19 has texted her a couple of times with no response but yesterday she responded to him via twitter. S19 is hopeful to see her in person soon.
SO - short answer is no. Because up until 6months ago I just saw them as part of daily life. SD19 and I used to go for facials once a month together. I helped raise these kids for 10yr.
We are as a family have been transitioning kids to adults so relationships change and dynamics change as they no longer live with you. Have I done lunches and dinners with SS20? Yes, of course but H was always part of the mix.
You don't have to explain it to me. I am just looking at the optics, and how your H will react. Likely reaching out. Which based on your history I have to question whether or not that was the intent.
Again, you owe me no answers! You do you. But as an outside observer I have to question the motive.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
You don't have to explain it to me. I am just looking at the optics, and how your H will react. Likely reaching out. Which based on your history I have to question whether or not that was the intent.
Again, you owe me no answers! You do you. But as an outside observer I have to question the motive.
So if I am understanding you correctly - you looking at my situation are questioning my motives for seeing my stepchildren?
I raised these kids.
My SS20 tells everyone I was the first letter he got when he was in basic training.
I have not said a word to H about seeing SS20 and I'm nearly 100% positive SS20 has said nothing to him about meeting up with me.
Would you walk away from kids you raised for 10yr???
I will never expect to see them in the same setting where H would be there unless he expressly stated he was okay with it. My relationship with them will be private and most likely keeping in touch through text. As I stated before S19 and SD19 were super duper close with one another for years. I'm more interested that S19 doesn't have to cut those connections.
The minute SS20 stated that SD19 had stated she wanted to be there and planned to come S19 lit up like a Christmas Tree! S19 really misses SD19.
I know you are just trying to get me to think. AND, I have been. I need more time to delve into another topic that is stirring some anger and resentment. Once I process it a bit more I will write it out here just to burn through it better.
What I am trying to get you to do is to think about things in terms of DBing. You continue to do things that set you back. Whether it is contacting about his mail, or engaging about the agreement. Many people have told you to go to email only communication. If it is important he will email. Etc. But you keep engaging and then lamenting the fact that you are still overly attached to him. And then meeting with your stepkids for lunch. Maybe it is innocent, but I think you can see where I would question the motive.
You cannot continue to make mistakes that set you back and then wonder why you aren't moving forward. Your H lied to you, cheated on you, left you for another woman. You shouldn't be engaging in things that make him reach out or contact you, you should be preparing yourself mentally, emotionally, and spiritually for the next phase of your life without him.
And then there is this: "1) SS20 considers me an important person. smile and shared personal news rather than having me find out later when they post on FB." And I have to wonder.....what if he didn't consider you an important person and you got the news through FB later? Would you be ok with that? I still see you defining a lot of who you are based on how the people around you "feel" about you. That your self-esteem is wrapped up in whether this person is nice to me or not, and that this person finds me important. And that is really no way to live. I still see your spirits rise and fall in interactions with your STBXH based on whether or not he is nice. "He was nice!" And even whether or not he asks about you. "He was pleasant but never asked about me."
I said this before, and I will say it again. I dream of a day when I open up your thread, some time in the future, and see a KC that couldn't give two shakes what STBXH thinks or feels. And not just him, but everyone around you. That you know your own importance and self-worth whether or not anyone else acknowledges it. You have proven yourself to be an intelligent, wise, caring, kind person. That alone makes you amazing, worthy and important!! Whether other people see it or say it is immaterial. You should know it, and not only know it, celebrate it!
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
What I am trying to get you to do is to think about things in terms of DBing. You continue to do things that set you back. Whether it is contacting about his mail, or engaging about the agreement. Many people have told you to go to email only communication. If it is important he will email. Etc. But you keep engaging and then lamenting the fact that you are still overly attached to him. And then meeting with your stepkids for lunch. Maybe it is innocent, but I think you can see where I would question the motive.
You cannot continue to make mistakes that set you back and then wonder why you aren't moving forward. Your H lied to you, cheated on you, left you for another woman. You shouldn't be engaging in things that make him reach out or contact you, you should be preparing yourself mentally, emotionally, and spiritually for the next phase of your life without him.
And then there is this: "1) SS20 considers me an important person. smile and shared personal news rather than having me find out later when they post on FB." And I have to wonder.....what if he didn't consider you an important person and you got the news through FB later? Would you be ok with that? I still see you defining a lot of who you are based on how the people around you "feel" about you. That your self-esteem is wrapped up in whether this person is nice to me or not, and that this person finds me important. And that is really no way to live. I still see your spirits rise and fall in interactions with your STBXH based on whether or not he is nice. "He was nice!" And even whether or not he asks about you. "He was pleasant but never asked about me."
I said this before, and I will say it again. I dream of a day when I open up your thread, some time in the future, and see a KC that couldn't give two shakes what STBXH thinks or feels. And not just him, but everyone around you. That you know your own importance and self-worth whether or not anyone else acknowledges it. You have proven yourself to be an intelligent, wise, caring, kind person. That alone makes you amazing, worthy and important!! Whether other people see it or say it is immaterial. You should know it, and not only know it, celebrate it!
YES... so okay I see where you are coming from.
Relationship with SS20 certainly was strained over the years as he was quite the rebellious teen of two parents who did not get along at all or co-parent well together. Now his relationship with H improved after he went into the military and did my relationship with him.
I did my best. I loved my stepkids from day one because I loved my H.
BUT, unlike his parents my bond with him is not as strong being just a step-parent. He still has both parents. I parented the best I could with 3 teens... nobody's perfect. I will not be part of family dinners, etc. Any involvement I get from now on will be at the choosing of my stepkids.
The fact that despite everything at 20 he recognizes what I've tried to do for him and his sister and that he considers me important melts my heart because he could have easily walked away feeling he no longer had to have contact with me. If he had chose to do that I would have accepted that as his choice. ---- so I celebrated this by being excited about it!!!
You don't have stepkids. This is not something you have ever had to navigate.
I understand you are just wanting wants best for my healing but I'm 100% positive if you had D'd you would not have walked away from your daughter because it was best for your healing.
I know I walk a very fine line. I respect that and my stepkids.
Believe me after what SS20 had to say about H in 60sec grossed me out and I don't want to contact him. I will email him because he hasn't provided the documents I asked for earlier this week but I will probably wait until next week.
Is it the least bit possible you needed to seek from validation from your step kids?
I think what Steve is getting at is that the meeting seemed more to be about how your kids viewed your H and how they viewed you. That it almost seems like a tie to him and you wanted to know a part of that still recognizes all you did and you weren’t tossed aside by them as well.
I don’t have stepkids. I dated 2 guys who kids I fell in love with and them me. And it was heart breaking when they were gone without me getting to say goodbye. I am sure you cared for his kids very much and didn’t want to lose them as well as your H.
It seems like the biggest thing you took out this meeting is validation.
My daughters stepmother is the OW who has been in her life since she was a baby. If they were ever to divorce, I would fully support and help my D have a relationship with her. So I get that part.
Just be mindful of your deeper seated hopes form these interactions you might not be aware of
Is it the least bit possible you needed to seek from validation from your step kids?
I think what Steve is getting at is that the meeting seemed more to be about how your kids viewed your H and how they viewed you. That it almost seems like a tie to him and you wanted to know a part of that still recognizes all you did and you weren’t tossed aside by them as well.
I don’t have stepkids. I dated 2 guys who kids I fell in love with and them me. And it was heart breaking when they were gone without me getting to say goodbye. I am sure you cared for his kids very much and didn’t want to lose them as well as your H.
It seems like the biggest thing you took out this meeting is validation.
My daughters stepmother is the OW who has been in her life since she was a baby. If they were ever to divorce, I would fully support and help my D have a relationship with her. So I get that part.
Just be mindful of your deeper seated hopes form these interactions you might not be aware of
Oh, I'm 100% aware that yes I was validated.
I was not expecting that at all. Sure, it felt good. But I was just happy having lunch with him.
In my defense's I did not ask SS20 for his opinion about H. Frankly I had accepted the fact that SS20 would not want to have lunch with me as perhaps H was seeking validation for himself getting SS20 to commiserate what a B*pitch I am. And, if that had been the case I would never have made SS20 feel bad about not wanting to meet... and let it go.
Honestly my head had been processing that this kid told me he is engaged, expecting and just bought a house all in a matter of 5 days. I'm worried about his stress because he still has over a yr of service many states away. He shared with me that he has been diagnosed with PTSD. I just listened and wasn't prying for anything he didn't want to share.
I love this kid. He has grown and matured so much in the last 2yr. I have told him more than once I'm proud of him.
