Cross countries separation EU

[Pack_19]

hi Sandi! First of all, thanks for knocking at the door, you are my float these days as I am sure you know. Yes it has been all in one go! I have been busy with the house, I still have some problems to close in Germany and the covid has started in parallel with my first project in the new role (I can work remotely).

Now that I have more time I am back reading the board, to be honest I do not comment on other threads because I still see myself as a very poor DBer, probably one of the worst. As I said last time I got a chance to see my W things were horrible. She only talks to me about money, complains that our S6 is misbehaving and even if I seat to talk to her she still makes moves away from me as if I wanted to hug her or similar... this is destroying me inside. I cannot believe this transformation. The last pearl I had to hear was that because I am focused on something I can never fix I am also going to destroy the lives of my children. I dont know if I can add this one to the list of things I have to let go or take it seriously.

It has been 8 months and there has not been a single change in her cold and resentful position. I feel lonely, more than anyone can imagine. On the one hand you are holding on to a R with a person who seems to only want to hurt you and on the other hand you dont want to go out and just hang out with the first one that shows interest. I guess the only people who will understand that are here.

I need to go to bed now but I will come back, read other threads, be more active and post about my situation! Thank you all!

[BenB]

Paco, hang in there. 8 months is not a long time when it comes to this.

I rarely comment on other people´s threads as well. Sometimes only when I can offer words of encouragement or give advice for something that has worked for me.

The one thing I can say is that I have changed my perception when it comes to difficult things happening to me. For example, first time I saw my W on the street with another man. That had been my biggest fear and I was hoping I never got to see that. But I did, and you know what? I survived and as a result, it made me stronger mentally.

So anything bad that happens, I welcome it these days as I see them as opportunities to grow. But don´t get me wrong, I feel anxiety and pain when it happens. That can not be avoided. But when you manage to calm yourself, focus and be strong, push through it, it doesn´t just help you at that moment, you gain something that you will never lose.

And a bit of a cliche maybe but try to think of things you can be grateful for. You can work remotely for example. So many people right now have no idea how to pay their rent this month because of this virus.

[Pack_19]

Hi Ben!

Thanks a lot for the comment! I was sure to find people here who understand me and with that story you just left me breathless. I would probably hold composure but my chest would feel like a tornado of pain if that happened. Worst thing is that I know I have to be prepared for that if it is what it all comes to.

I wanted my post today to start with a touch of humor for those who are home because of the virus. Remember when I first came here? no? see my first post, I literally asked everyone if I should send the DR book to my W! Epic first move!

My biggest question today was going to be about time. Everyone who loves is like come on man! it has been 8 year! dont you see she had made a decision? The other day, I talked to my W and of course she was on fire and she mocked me saying "how long has it been? dont you get it?" I calmly answered "8 months", and changed the subject. It hurt double because dates that are recorded with ink in my head like the day she moved out she seems to have forgotten and she seems to be sending the same message as at the beginning, "oh you poor hurting thing, all you need is time."

This freaking virus, aside of how lucky I am to be able to continue working, is not good for DB. I keep my exercise routine, I started watching my fav tv show over again (in short sessions, not too much tv), I am studying for the certifications I need at work and I have taken down the keyboard to become a rookie musician. But when my children are not here I wake up crying, then I pull myself up from the pity party or I go to sleep crying, missing her and the possibility to hug her to sleep. People out there are dying without being able to say goodbye to the ones they love, is heartbreaking. If I did not have enough with my guilt and desire to undo all the pain I put her through, this virus is reminding us all of everything that really matters, and you guys know for me is my family and her. My W thinks differently apparently, she told me she does not even remember when our R was good. She is really trying to break me, or to make me lose it so that she proves herself right, but not today, today is a lesson on true love and humbleness.

I dont know if you remember at the beginning of this I said here my W built a kind of support circle with her cousin who stood up a cheating boyfriend weeks before their wedding was planned and probably talked long about the incomplete and unfulfilling relationships they both had. Well she has moved in with my W until this is over. The last time I offered my W dinner, and I swear this was 2 weeks ago, she replied no, also my cousin is here and she said she was never coming back although I could keep hope if I wanted (she said this in a mocking tone).

She also said something that destroyed me a bit more. She told me in my family I have been taught I can have all I want and now she is what I want and I cannot accept I cannot have her and control her life. I come from a humble family, I have been the best student since school, got grants, got prizes, promoted and changed jobs. I am everything but spoiled, I have worked for every good thing in my life and this is why I want to work through the DB process. I trust my personal strength and ability to learn, but for her... for my W I am just a child who wants something he has lost, and he does not even truly love. I got in my car, I cried, I got home and cried again. I dont know how much I have changed for her to think something like this. But I know something better, I love her above all and finally my tiny stubborn brain understands now that love means giving the other person what she/he asks for and she is asking me to NOT have a R with her.

The loving comes natural, for example she talked to me about how she wants our children to start eating healthier, so I got a book about that because I want to be able to talk to her about ideas. I want to take care of her, now when people are making jokes about how domestic fights are increasing all I want is a f@%$# night kissing her and in bed with her, but my best and only friends are books and the phone.

I trust with time and effort I will be the perfect husband for someone. I just hope that someone is her and my children can have the family they deserve. I am reading "Manly Separation Survival" and it is really helping me but I miss her. Some days I sink in thoughts about the things she told me at home, when she threatened to go with the first man she would find if I made her stay in Germany, when she said she was glad she only had to survive a few days before she would be away from me or told me I had never satisfied her in the bed...

My family adores me, my friends admire me and my children miss me every single day they are with her. But for my W, the most important person in my life, I am some kind of monster. I am sorry I bring all these sad reflections, I need to talk to someone about this. Please note I dont see myself as a victim, I messed it up and I have put my marriage at risk of death because I ignored her many warnings. I have a lot to change but I could really really really use a hand from her side. Thank you all, tomorrow is my sister's birthday so no crying in 48 hours!

[Pack_19]

I want this in my thread, I need it more than ever:

"If your efforts to save your marriage haven't been paying off, it's logical that you eventually start to question your motives for wanting your marriage to survive. I might do the same thing if I were in your shoes. It helps you to feel some sense of control and makes the hurt lessen somewhat.

However, from my perspective, unless there is physical violence or chronic substance abuse which is intolerable, I would prefer you look at it differently. There are lots of great reasons to try to restore love in a relationship, especially when there are children involved. Even if your marriage was lacking before the threat of divorce, there are good reasons to try to bring love into the marriage. You have been doing the right and honorable thing. You husband hasn't. You have been wise, your husband hasn't been. Rather than give up your morals and values and question why a person would want to save a marriage, I suggest you tell yourself that you've been nobly fighting for something that is worth fighting for. However, for some people, when the fight is unbearable, they decide that it's time to quit. That is an individual decision. If you're at that place, you are entitled to feel that way. You need to follow your heart- not because working on your marriage isn't worth it, but because your husband is currently too self-centered to recognize the benefits of making marriage work. That happens. There wouldn't be a 50% divorce rate if it didn't happen.

So quit if you must, but know that you were doing the right thing. You just weren't married to someone who uderstood this. Keep us posted.

Best to you,
Michele "

[Pack_19]

hi all,

I am having a couple of terrible days. I will explain. The situation being alone at home is not the best, I spend a lot of time thinking about our good memories and I end up feeling like I cannot go on one more single day. Is like you have all the tools and know what to do but then you start missing her as intensively as day 1 and you feel like you need to go and review all those tools, rules and tips you have.

I have been crying around for the last 2-3 days and the worse I feel the stronger I feel the need to read through the material I have on DR and your tips. I remember reading here somewhere leaving the M and help books behind was a potential 180. Well I am not ready for that 180 at all.

Today I was planning to spend some time but I just could get myself focused. I have all these strong vivid memories of the early stages of our R, before kids, bills, work and it feels me with both a deep feel of love for her and pain for the fear that it is gone forever. Yesterday I went to pick up the kids, I was cheerful, listening, I looked into her eyes and did not say a word. This IS a little victory, and for those here who have followed my thread they will understand.

As Sandi once told me, it is probable I have not fully let go of her. I do not know why it is so hard. I do not want to talk her into anything, when our M went down I was in a polluted cloud and I feel like we did not get a chance to talk past, present and future properly as a couple going through cr***y times. I guess that is not happening now and might not ever happen.

Exercise is starting to pay back, I feel and look better but I chose to shave my hair due to covid quarantine and I look like a young military recruit! Like I said on a previous post, you see people who are dying without the chance to say goodbye to their loved ones and it just lights up this impulse to reach out to my W. the feeling of loneliness is dreadful in the sense that alone you are miserable and your family only pushes you to move on because, you know, its been 8 months and what the heck are you doing with your life.

The other day I did some clean up in the house to keep my mind distracted but nights are terrible. Sometimes I feel pitty for myself in the sense that I have been single and happy, independent, attractive, a man focused on his clear goals, but under the pressure of a failed marriage and a broken family that seems a selfish and irresponsible place to be. Do you understand what I mean? Whats wring with me?

That you all! stay safe and healthy!
Packs

[Pack_19]

hi all,

I have collected a number of golden quotes from my thread and when the desire to write to my W of think about our memories attacks me I go and read them. It gives me strength to know there are people behind those statements that understand the situation.

My two children have been with me for the last 6 days and today after my S6 video called my W and wanted to hang up early (something I always tell him off for because I am educating her in the love to both of us) I got a phone call from my W. Shouting, it went something like this:

W: " I dont know what you and your family tell your son because he has told me he only wants to be there with you, he has more toys and he does not want to be with me. You are hurting your son. And now go on and write to me one of your love paragraphs"

Then she hung up. I was calmed, left the phone aside. Fisnished dinner, read a story to both S1 and S6 and put them to sleep. When I got the phone I had 4 missed calls and a message reading "call me". I wrote to W:

My TM: "I am sorry I was putting the kids to sleep. I am going to bed now, tomorrow I work earlier. If you want tomorrow give me a call to speak about whatever happened with S6. There will be no more paragraphs. Good night"

I am trying to change every defect on me and being the man and the father I want to be. I am loving on my son more than ever, I read to him, I build legos, play football, practice reading with him and we just started playing Spyro on ps4. I have made mistakes but I am not a bad father and I try to show my son how my W is wonderful in mentioning her as much as I can for good references. I know I cannot control my W, I dont want to read between the lines, I dont want a freaking date with her, I dont want a R now, I just want her despise and hatred to go away. Nothing seems to work, I have been NC for 4 days now, and I plan to go on like this for months. My actions so far have only pushed her away and she mocks my attempts to express love and empathy. What can I do more or new? thanks!

[sandi2]

It's great to hear from you, Pack! You continue to sound much better, so you are doing something right.

My two children have been with me for the last 6 days and today after my S6 video called my W and wanted to hang up early (something I always tell him off for because I am educating her in the love to both of us)

You've lost me. Could you clarify the words in parenthesis?

W: " I dont know what you and your family tell your son because he has told me he only wants to be there with you, he has more toys and he does not want to be with me.

I think it's fairly common for the kids to say something on this level, when they first experience a flood of new toys and a parent's undivided attention. He's missed his father, so he's talking like a six year old little boy.

And now go on and write to me one of your love paragraphs"

P...a...c...k, have you been sending her love paragraphs???

I am trying to change every defect on me and being the man and the father I want to be.

As long as you are making the changes for yourself and your children, then bravo. I think it's only human to want to make changes to draw back the WAW/WW, too. Just a word of caution so you won't get depressed.......should you not see her responding positively. She is so full of rage, that even if you were to become a perfected version of Pack, it's possible she still wouldn't want to reconcile. Know why? B/c the biggest problem currently abides within her own heart. In other words, she has to find her own path out of the anger she feels. Currently, she's still blaming you for her unhappiness and her anger. Eventually, she will have to find a way to heal, or she'll remain a bitter person.

The only other advice I have for now, is that you might need to cut back a little bit on talking about S6's mother. I respect and admire what I think you are trying to do. But you might be saying too much in his little ears, too soon. When he's talking to his mother, he might unintentionally convey the wrong message. Considering how touchy she is while he's there with you, she will likely find fault and her anger will blaze higher. I know you wouldn't try to influence her through something S6 says......would you? Like, try to impress something?

I'm very proud of you and how you were finally able to detach.......at least a little. You've gone four whole days of NC. Isn't that a record breaking number for you? Hey, it's a good beginning. We'll take it.

((hugs))

[Vergo]

Sorry to read your story. For sure it's not an easy situation to be in especially when you have kids who are effected with this situation. Well I am from Germany too but my soon to be ex wife lives here too. Luckily we don't have kids but after we filed for divorce I had to put property for sale in Germany as half of it belongs to her. This year is not a good one for me fore sure. So I can understand what you are going through and everything will be fine sooner or later, we just have to wait.

[job]

Vergo,

Please start a thread of your own so that we can proceed support to you. Also, by creating a thread of your own, you can refer back to your threads as you walk the path that you are on.

[Pack_19]

hi all!

Sorry again I have been out for a few days! We have this project at work that has me fully immersed and when the kids are here I do not have a minute to stop.

So the first thing about my S6 hanging up is this bad habit he has developed to suddenly hang up when he is videocalling either me or her from the other's apartment. My W has accused me of not encouraging him to speak to her daily and calmly when he is with me but cannot understand that so I have started making an effort for him to spend at least 30 min when he is here talking to her.

So my S6 loves being around with me, I can set time aside to work with him through his homework, I have all these story and flaps books he loves, we play spyro on the ps4, we play football and I am giving myself to them. I feel so alone and miserable that they have become all the love I get. My W accuses me of trying to win them and I told her the other day the only way I think we four win is if ever we get to be a family again and I am only trying to be the best father I can.

I did send my W some paragraphs, I got pity and mocking comments when I saw her, I have not done it again. I can proudly say I am all NC now, I go to bed and have things to keep me busy or entertained, I wake up in the morning with new goals, plans and to-do lists and I will never ever beg her again for a simple coffee or dinner. The other day for example she told me in a mocking tone that I could keep trying to fix us like I had been doing for the last 10 years without success, these comments make me realize how cold and distant she is right now, better back off.

Yesterday I dropped the kids with her and it was the first time when after enjoying some time with them together I was the first one to want to go, I genuinely wanted to leave so I opened the door to her building and as I was saying goodbye she started crying and told me she could not bear anymore my accusations. She told me she was not happy either but she could not be with me, she had suffered for a long time and now she could not start clean.

I told her I knew she had been banging her head against a wall and that I was sorry and would give her all time and space she needs. To that her reply was that I am stubborn, that I must accept we are separated and it is probable we are never together again. I got strength from inside and told her I had accepted it and she told me she does not understand why we cannot speak like friends and that it feels like I am punishing her. I told her I could happily talk about our children and the only one to shift the blame 100% on the other here was her and walked away (I am sorry but I just felt like I also have to set boundaries for me and her tears did not seem genuine, you cannot just cry and then say do not dare coming close to me in an angry tone)

I have some questions maybe you all can help me with. I can perfectly separate our children from adult relationship, yet I cannot be her friend like all is roses and happiness and oh yes we share two children but do not love each other. I read all this DB stories were Hs say the first step is to be friends again, what on earth is wrong with me? why can't I ignore the fact that we have a broken marriage? it hurts so much to hear her talk about us as nice memories!

Also I dont know what to think about her tears, she has used them in the past to get her way and they come out of nowhere. A minute ago she is ignoring me and when I am going to leave she bursts into tears, what is she playing at? I did not want a separation, I asked for time to work on me and gave her options to build a new life in Spain but her answer is you know the only thing I could not see fitting in my life was you (wtf? could someone hurt you more with a sole sentence?). I feel like I carry 100% of the blame, I carry it all alone and she keeps talking about us never getting back as if I wanted to force her, I have had enough, I deserve someone who values me for the things I have and will achieve.

I read your golden tips almost daily and I specially keep an eye on that sentence, "give her time from talking to you, I mean months,... all of your actions so far have pushed her away". I have finally managed no contact, I no longer count the days, I dont have a deadline to save my M and all I have to do now is be the best me I can ever be. I hate fighting this war alone, I hate the uncertainty of knowing that regardless of your changes the output depends on her entirely and I hate myself for not being able to give my children a full and happy family.

I am better, it has taken me 6 months but I am, only I am still emotionally shattered inside and getting used to living day after day without big fancy future plans as I always had. Some days I feel apathy for this, but I pull myself back to mourn for the loss of my M and move on. The only good thing about all this guilt and pain is that it keeps me invested on being my best me every minute.

@Vergo, I am sorry you are here. Yes it seems I will also be selling a property in Germany by the end of this year. My W and I have not filed yet but as you can read here it seems we are sailing in that direction. I will go to your thread and try to help but see the positive of this, use the time wisely to be the best you for the new stage of your life.

Thank you all, ((hugs))
Pack

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