I was having problems with my wife over the past couple of months and it was a godsend that i stumbled on this forum. I've read many posts in the forum that is somewhat similar to my sitch but like the comments that everyone else made; every sitch is different.
Some brief info: M: 7 years T: 9 years D4 and D6 No BD yet because we are still living together due to financial reasons (she doesn't have the means to move out with her spending habit)
Here's a brief timeline of events and I'm not even sure if my W falls into the WW or the MLC category:
- Had an argument on how my parenting styles differed from her (I'm a typical asian dad that disciplines by rule of the cane while she's more of a parent where they reason things with kids) after I disciplined my kids about pleading with my father to give them sweets while they were still recovering from a cough. I snapped and scolded my Ds and my dad for caving in - Apologized immediately after the incident and agreed to change my parenting style (which I did till this day; no caning, not shouting anymore) - cold war starts - i started to snoop on her messages because i felt uneasy and i uncovered a OM that she is communicating more frequently with one particular co-worker that is always constantly complaining about how his W is treating like dirt (looks like she found some common ground) - found out she deleted the messages between them too - confronted and she said trust is broken (it's my fault; shouldn't be snooping on her phone) - suddenly gotten 2 tattoos a few weeks later - started to hang out more with colleagues - started to splurge on tonnes of stuff (heels, hairdo, clothes shopping, drinking, dinner with colleagues and friends, organizing stayovers, etc) - complaint about why the kids are getting closer to me instead of her and her reason was that I'm treating my Ds better now because of guilt - tried to LRT to a certain extent but had a few misses now and then but still trying to go on ahead - stopped my routine of sending her to work and fetching her as well; she said public transport is easier - attended one MC but told me she will not go back again because she hated it. I'm still going alone for the next one though
One major event happened over the weekend. The OM's sister contacted me to tell me that the OM's wife is uneasy about the constant communication between the both of them on non-work related matters and asked me to stop my wife
I confronted her but was calm and steady. Did not accuse her of cheating and i was trying to understand why things have happened this way. She was maintaining her innocence throughout and her explanation was that she felt connected to him because she felt that she's in the same boat as that OM. Told her that in order to move forward we have to create new memories and new future instead of harping on the past. She kinda agreed but reemphasized that the trust is broken, she doesn't love me any more and she is torn between giving up or working together. She also said that she's an independent woman and if things go south she will just focus on her career on the kids.
Past couple of days i saw improvements because she's starting to open up to me because of that particular topic and was always trying to say that she's the victim in this because she just wanted to help out the OM and there's no one else he can turn to at work (she claimed the OM's wife is a control freak and caused him to go see a shrink).
This morning she was asking me if i could send the the screenshot of the message that the OM's sister sent me. I struggled but i sent it to her. In it i was asking if we could discuss the situation further. Now she claimed that because I wanted to find out it seems like i don't trust her anymore. I told her my viewpoint about not the need to find out more and not listening to the story from another angle but she's not taking any of it. Her replies were cold and sarcastic.
At this point I have absolutely what to do next and I'm starting to feel suicidal because she might have convinced me i'm the villain in all of this.
One more thing; her dissatisfaction about me was that during the initial years i wasn't helping the home that much and was on my phone. She felt like a maid because she had to do everything herself (not entirely true; she's got minor OCD and will re-do whatever i've do if i don't do it her way). Other stuff like broken promises and stuffs too.
Sorry for the long post but I hope i can get some pointers on how to proceed from here. I'm super depressed now and can't even GAL as much as i want to. Help me.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
- confronted and she said trust is broken (it's my fault; shouldn't be snooping on her phone
This one always chaps my behind. So snooping on her phone (which should be completely open and unlocked to you BTW) is worse than having intimate discussions with an OM. DO NOT LET HER GET AWAY WITH THIS.
I told my WW in the thick of my sitch: "Nope, you aren't turning this around. Snooping on your device is no where near as bad as there being something for me to find."
Stand your ground. Command respect.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
In it i was asking if we could discuss the situation further. Now she claimed that because I wanted to find out it seems like i don't trust her anymore.
WHY in the the world would you trust her??? Those worthy of trust show themselves to be trustworthy.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Now it took a turn for the worse. She found out that I wanted to approach the OM by getting his number. My intention is to talk to him about her sister contacting me about the excessive communication; and my W flared up and said I'm making the situation worse. And then BD. She mentioned divorce. Later when she came home I asked her if she's serious about the D and she said she dropped it out of anger but the intention is there now.
I told her I'm not going to force her for a closure and I left the house. Looks like whatever I've achieved so far is down the drain and I have to start the LRT all over again. It's until she wants to have the R talk or I die; whichever comes first.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I would suggest that you not contact the OM about anything at this time. I would suggest that you block the person that you are getting excessive communications from. The best thing to do is just leave things be. The more you attempt to rationalize w/your w, the more frustrated you are going to get. You don't want to push them together by attempting to contact the OM or telling your w that you want to do so. She will feel the need to protect him at all costs. The less you say about the situation, the better. If the affair is ongoing, it needs to die a natural, slow death on its own.
Now, pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and continue moving forward. No more relationship talks, no more talks about contacting the OM. Block the woman today.
Focus on you!
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I would suggest that you not contact the OM about anything at this time. I would suggest that you block the person that you are getting excessive communications from. The best thing to do is just leave things be. The more you attempt to rationalize w/your w, the more frustrated you are going to get. You don't want to push them together by attempting to contact the OM or telling your w that you want to do so. She will feel the need to protect him at all costs. The less you say about the situation, the better. If the affair is ongoing, it needs to die a natural, slow death on its own.
Now, pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and continue moving forward. No more relationship talks, no more talks about contacting the OM. Block the woman today.
Focus on you!
THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh and what Cadet said to! Avoid R talks at all costs. If she corners you and starts one, listen and validate.
You've got this.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Even if she's starts it? Should I just act like a friendly neighbour and try to validate whatever she says?
And yes, I believe actions are better than words. In fact for the past couple of weeks when I was GAL-ing and focusing on the kids I felt better and my kids were so close to me that I felt everything was right in the world. My D6 even randomly gave me hugs and kisses as if she knew I needed it badly...
Its just so unfair to not give my kids the best childhood without either of the parents around. It felt like I failed them because I couldn't control myself better to become the husband that my W wants.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I would suggest that you not contact the OM about anything at this time. I would suggest that you block the person that you are getting excessive communications from. The best thing to do is just leave things be. The more you attempt to rationalize w/your w, the more frustrated you are going to get. You don't want to push them together by attempting to contact the OM or telling your w that you want to do so. She will feel the need to protect him at all costs. The less you say about the situation, the better. If the affair is ongoing, it needs to die a natural, slow death on its own.
Now, pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and continue moving forward. No more relationship talks, no more talks about contacting the OM. Block the woman today.
Focus on you!
Thank you for the great advice Job. This is exactly what I should do not even though I have a strong desire to have a closure of some sorts. Guess forcing her will only make her come a conclusion that I'm a begging, pleading slob.
I'm still wrapping my head whether my W is a WW or MLC... Or does it really matter anyway now?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Its just so unfair to not give my kids the best childhood without either of the parents around. It felt like I failed them because I couldn't control myself better to become the husband that my W wants.
So start to become the BEST DAD you can be.
If you do that you can not lose and your children will benefit.
If i was giving your wife advice I would tell her to trust YOUR ACTIONS not your words.
I am sorry you find yourself in this common sitch. I am glad you found this support group. It is full of great people with many different perspectives. The hard part for most is grasping the appropriate changes needed and applying them at the appropriate times. You will get conflicting advise. The key is to identify when to use specific advise.
For example, you will be told to act happy. There are times whens you should absolutely do this. There are other times when you should control all of your emotions and not react emotionally.
A couple of my mantras: "I am the emotional rock" and "The first one to react emotionally looses"
Obviously you are angry about your wife's behavior. It is your job to control this anger. You channel this anger into positive changes. Maybe in the past you yelled at her. Now you just listen. You can release this anger at a later time. Some guys lift weights. Releasing emotions is healthy. Best to do this in a safe private place. Some people cry in the shower, some will park in a remote parking lot and scream and yell. Find ways to let it out.
Now that the affair is out in the open, it will not be as much fun for them.
The best way to get her back is the set her free. Focus on your behavior. Learn new ways to interact.
I have seen many relationships turn around. The sooner you let go trying to control this, the sooner things will turn around.
My D6 even randomly gave me hugs and kisses as if she knew I needed it badly...
She knows.
Originally Posted by Ahkuei
Its just so unfair to not give my kids the best childhood without either of the parents around. It felt like I failed them because I couldn't control myself better to become the husband that my W wants.
Life isn't fair. Maybe you failed. So what. All successful people have a graveyard of failure behind them, that's how they learned. Are you learning or hanging out in the graveyard?
R2C's advice about channeling that anger is beautiful. The bright side of your sitch is that you can totally change and become a better person here.
Your W is wayward. Did this happen out of the blue or did she find this OM to get certain needs met? What needs were you not fulfilling? None of this excuses her behavior. She was and is a willing participant in an abhorrent act. Don't let this slide, but don't focus on this either.
I notice you mentioned a phone addiction. I was addicted to my phone for a while. It's unattractive, wasteful, antisocial, etc.. Has this changed?
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Your W is wayward. Did this happen out of the blue or did she find this OM to get certain needs met? What needs were you not fulfilling? None of this excuses her behavior. She was and is a willing participant in an abhorrent act. Don't let this slide, but don't focus on this either.
I notice you mentioned a phone addiction. I was addicted to my phone for a while. It's unattractive, wasteful, antisocial, etc.. Has this changed?
We were living the normal life when last October we had a big event where i snapped about my dad caving in to give candies to Ds and my W was nagging me behind me about my dad is spoiling the Ds. After that a bunch of things started to happened. One detail i left out was that she offered her friend and her son to stay with us in a spare room because her friend was also undergoing a D.
Then things started to go downhill. I've noticed that my W was emulating her friend too. From wearing an anklet, to getting ear studs and suddenly wanting to use a Macbook (her friend has all these). She was basically trying to emulate her friend.
I've been sharing nuggets of info with her friend because she could see the hostility between us and her comments were "I think your W isn't thinking straight. I don't even like my current situation and she's trying to copy me. She doesn't know what she's missing."
On the phone addiction issue. I don't think it's an addiction. I was on my phone because i was working out of it. Clearing emails daily was my daily chore because i hate seeing the bloody red dot on my apps. My W mentioned that she was pissed off when i promised to take care of the kids while she clears hers and then i was on my phone. She ended up taking care of the kids. That was my fault i admit. I have broken the promise that I would take care of the kids. I've cleaned up my act so far but there's still room for improvement.
This morning she just got out of the house to work without even waking the kids up (she usually does this because we have to send them to school). A couple of hours later she sent me a screenshot of her work email sending to the OM that they have to stop communication because she received unnecessary confrontation due to misunderstanding from his family issue.
And she just posted a text; "there"
What is she trying to prove here? She is putting an end to this to spite me or she's telling me that she can resolve her own issues?
I replied "thank you for doing this to remove yourself from the situation". No response from her so far. Seems like she's really hell bent on moving away from me.
Went to a therapist earlier on and spilled out everything to her. She advised me to take care of myself but at the same time find a common connection point to work on it. Example, parenting issues, house issues. NO R talks for now. Seems very in line with DB too. Her only concern for me is that I'm displaying suicidal tendencies and also if I have what it takes to stand even if the results are still divorce or separation.
Sorry for the long post. These few days were just too overwhelming for me... And I really want to thank everyone here that read my post and giving me advice. This is very important to me that I'm not alone in this...
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Your W is wayward. Did this happen out of the blue or did she find this OM to get certain needs met? What needs were you not fulfilling? None of this excuses her behavior. She was and is a willing participant in an abhorrent act. Don't let this slide, but don't focus on this either.
I notice you mentioned a phone addiction. I was addicted to my phone for a while. It's unattractive, wasteful, antisocial, etc.. Has this changed?
We were living the normal life when last October we had a big event where i snapped about my dad caving in to give candies to Ds and my W was nagging me behind me about my dad is spoiling the Ds. After that a bunch of things started to happened. One detail i left out was that she offered her friend and her son to stay with us in a spare room because her friend was also undergoing a D.
Then things started to go downhill. I've noticed that my W was emulating her friend too. From wearing an anklet, to getting ear studs and suddenly wanting to use a Macbook (her friend has all these). She was basically trying to emulate her friend.
I've been sharing nuggets of info with her friend because she could see the hostility between us and her comments were "I think your W isn't thinking straight. I don't even like my current situation and she's trying to copy me. She doesn't know what she's missing."
On the phone addiction issue. I don't think it's an addiction. I was on my phone because i was working out of it. Clearing emails daily was my daily chore because i hate seeing the bloody red dot on my apps. My W mentioned that she was pissed off when i promised to take care of the kids while she clears hers and then i was on my phone. She ended up taking care of the kids. That was my fault i admit. I have broken the promise that I would take care of the kids. I've cleaned up my act so far but there's still room for improvement.
This morning she just got out of the house to work without even waking the kids up (she usually does this because we have to send them to school). A couple of hours later she sent me a screenshot of her work email sending to the OM that they have to stop communication because she received unnecessary confrontation due to misunderstanding from his family issue.
And she just posted a text; "there"
What is she trying to prove here? She is putting an end to this to spite me or she's telling me that she can resolve her own issues?
I replied "thank you for doing this to remove yourself from the situation". No response from her so far. Seems like she's really hell bent on moving away from me.
Went to a therapist earlier on and spilled out everything to her. She advised me to take care of myself but at the same time find a common connection point to work on it. Example, parenting issues, house issues. NO R talks for now. Seems very in line with DB too. Her only concern for me is that I'm displaying suicidal tendencies and also if I have what it takes to stand even if the results are still divorce or separation.
Sorry for the long post. These few days were just too overwhelming for me... And I really want to thank everyone here that read my post and giving me advice. This is very important to me that I'm not alone in this...
Let me tell you a little story:
In my first sitch, in 2005, I installed spyware on our home computer and caught my W IMing with another guy, intimate chats. Prior to that I had started to get suspicious. She was working on a project and liked to work after our D went to bed. Since I had to get up for work I would go to bed fairly early. She was staying up until 2-3am working on this project. Oh....and IMing with her OM. I got out of bed one night to share something with her and when I came into the home office, I saw her quickly switch her screen on the computer. That got me even more suspicious. So one day I snooped, saw a strange name on her IM client, and asked her about him. She was evasive, said he was an old friend from school (true), and that she didn't chat with him much or often (lie). When I installed the spyware the first conversation I captured was her telling OM about me asking about him. And she suggested that some evening, when I was around, that they could IM innocently to show me that there was no concern. The very next night is when I found a lengthy email where he spent 60% of the time trying to convince her to meet him so they could do what they had so often IM'd about sexually.
BELIEVE NOTHING SHE SAYS OR SHOWS YOU. She is an lying cheater. Never trust a lying cheater.
A better response would have been: "Interesting." Keep it vague. Make her wonder. The more she questions what you are thinking, feeling, planning, doing the better for you.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I will heed your advice Steve85... As much as it hurts I will have to keep standing for myself.
Last night she started to talk her work stuff as if nothing happened the day before. I had a hard time because i thought my emotions are still running high and she's treating like nothing happened. Sometime I wonder how can she pull that off.
And I like your "interesting." response. I'll be sure to apply it if the need arise next time!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Nothing much happened these couple of days except that she went out celebrating her colleagues’s birthday and I supposed there was drinking because she came home around 3am.
I was on full on LRT mode and even though that night where she went drinking I was miserable I lived thru it.
Fast forward to today. There were some slight changes in her but I was wary that it might be a false start.
She changed her mind about staying over at her friends place next week and replaced it with just dinner and drinks. She was more comfortable with me standing close together, and she seemed to want to hang out with me and the kids. She also talked more about her new hairstyle and things she needs to buy. And before we go to bed she was complaining to me about her work and how she is going to look for another job. Interestingly this conversation lasted a good 30 mins.
This is all very new to me and I’m not sure if I’m reading it correctly. Is this a false start or is this a sign of things improving? I’m not going to stop DBing that’s for sure...
Anyone out there with similar situations can give me some pointers?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I'm not a longterm member here Ahkuei but in my sitch my W sent me a screenshot of her messages with OM telling him it's over but wouldn't share her phone with me and quickly dismissed me asking saying "I've deleted it anyway". I'm sure she has still contacted him since. Don't fall for it, don't believe it. I think it often takes several attempts to remove the affair partner. What I feel I've slipped up on though was being quite demanding about her ending things as I think it led to W lying further and taking it underground.
Thanks for the kind advice os2. To be frank i don't know if there's an OM involved but I'm treating as it exists.
She did offer to show me her phone contents but back then I didn't want to call her bluff so I didn't ask for it.
It's going to be hard for her NOT to interact to the OM because the OM i suspect is her coworker.
And now she's expressing her feelings on Facebook for everyone to see by posting those "inspirational quotes" on her page. Most of them were quotes about "Trust being broken and hard to mend it" or "Leave, don't continue watering a dead flower"
And the most recent ones were "Loneliness is dangerous. It's addictive. Once you see how peaceful it is, you don't want to deal with people."
This is not the first that she's voicing her discontent on FB for our friends and relatives to see. We've had a fight before about this and now she's starting it again. I'm not going to fall into that again and undo what I've done so far. I just can't understand what's the point of her doing that; is it for me? Or is it to show to someone else that she's all alone in her quest?
And her mood swings are getting unpredictable these few days. One day she will be cordial and just tonight, she had a face so black that it seems like someone tripped her wires. I kinda broke the LRT by asking what's wrong (yeah, i regret it a little) and she just said nothing happened.
By the way, finally received the DR book via amazon today; it's gonna be a long night for me!
Oh one more thing; she has a last drinking with her girlfriends this sat and she's not setting any new events from then on. But I'm wary because she will do things randomly now. I hope she doesn't go out that much so she can spend more time with the kids to be honest. But it's not for me to control.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Forget about her social media. It means nothing. It's not helping you. She's doing it to justify her affair and her horrible, but typical WW actions. Delete your Facebook. Be mysterious. GAL. Stop worrying about her. Stop thinking about her. Stop trying to analyze her moves. Your story is so similar to the thousands of situations that have come through here. You need to absorb a lot of information quickly.
Originally Posted by Ahkuei
To be frank i don't know if there's an OM involved but I'm treating as it exists.
Maybe your forgot your first post where you mention she is staying out all night, drinking, spending, getting tattoos and texting another man whose family is trying to get your W to back off?
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Forget about her social media. It means nothing. It's not helping you. She's doing it to justify her affair and her horrible, but typical WW actions. Delete your Facebook. Be mysterious. GAL. Stop worrying about her. Stop thinking about her. Stop trying to analyze her moves. Your story is so similar to the thousands of situations that have come through here. You need to absorb a lot of information quickly.
Originally Posted by Ahkuei
To be frank i don't know if there's an OM involved but I'm treating as it exists.
Maybe your forgot your first post where you mention she is staying out all night, drinking, spending, getting tattoos and texting another man whose family is trying to get your W to back off?
I echo the comments on SM. Get rid of it. More LBSs get tripped up by SM than any other thing.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Forget about her social media. It means nothing. It's not helping you. She's doing it to justify her affair and her horrible, but typical WW actions. Delete your Facebook. Be mysterious. GAL. Stop worrying about her. Stop thinking about her. Stop trying to analyze her moves. Your story is so similar to the thousands of situations that have come through here. You need to absorb a lot of information quickly.
I'm reading the forums more than i'm reading the bible now. And i'm starting on the DR as I just received it a couple of hours ago... And yes, I need to stop my nonsense in trying to figure her out. Thanks for pulling me back ovrrnbw...
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Maybe your forgot your first post where you mention she is staying out all night, drinking, spending, getting tattoos and texting another man whose family is trying to get your W to back off?
Yes that's the coworker but I do not have hard evidence that they are having EA or PA, the only source of info i got was from the family members of the coworker reaching out to me. That's actually incriminating enough but I don't know why I am still giving her the benefit of doubt. Maybe I'm still trying to grasp whatever little hope I have that she's no longer the same person i married.
And again, really thank you all for the support. Even though we are thousand of miles apart I can feel you guys rooting me on!
Last edited by Ahkuei; 03/10/2003:27 PM.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Journaling after a long 6 months break. Nothing much has changed during these 6 months; hot and cold rollercoaster ride, sudden anxiety attacks, etc.
The funny thing is, the more time passes, the easier it gets. My anxiety attacks became less frequent and shorter in duration, I stopped thinking about the future so much about having a life together with my W (not saying totally, there were moments of weakness i must admit...), and generally I became someone that I would personally prefer if I compared against my last year self.
I've been spending a hell lot of time with the kids. W has been frequently hanging out with friends over dinner and such. At first I was resenting that how could she do these to the kids. But eventually, I sort of started to enjoy the fact that I have more time with my kids alone! I even brought them out to zoos and parks when she wasn't around! Loved it!
Another item that I've noticed is that I no longer care that much if my W has OM or not. Yes I will still be pissed off if i discover it but I've come to terms that her having an OM is a symptom; something that i do not have control of.
I've started a lot of new things for myself, went for gym and thai boxing classes and lost 15KGs till date, started to slowly learn the piano, on my way to fix my clarinet (i used to be a clarinet player when i was young) so I can teach my kids music too.. GAL the S&*( out of it haha!
It might seem generally it is smooth sailing but I do have my downs too. Anxiety attacks (less frequent now) and self-doubts happens and I felt as if a truck hit me and my heart was up on my throat. Had to distract myself for a few hours before the feeling subsides... that feeling [censored] but I guess given enough time I will grow out of it.
I've also been seeing a therapist ever since DDAY back in November last year. She's been trying to nudge me to open up communication with my W but I told her I'm not initiating and R talks unless she does because if I do it, it's a push. My W wants space and time and I'm giving a truckload of it to her.
I've been mostly cordial and friendly towards my W all the way. Chirpy tone and being a friend to her. She was sometimes joking or laughing at my jokes but most of the time she was just doing her own things and living her own life. I made it a point to steer clear of her life unless she asks me for help.
And now.. today is our 7th wedding anniversary. So i just went ahead and delivered a small bouquet of flowers(not roses), and only mentioned happy anniversary on the card. I'm not expecting her to thank me for it because I didn't want to break the tradition (I guess it's a wrong move) but she did respond:
Coldly.
"Thanks for the flowers but don't need to send me in the future."
Took me a few mins to collect myself and I responded "Have a great day ahead."
And then she started her usual antics of staying late for work and settling dinner herself, leaving me and the kids at home (I'm working from home because of COVID). Nowadays I feel that whenever she does that she's trying to draw the old me to start an argument; so that she can justify to herself that what she's doing to me and the kids is right because I was a jerk back then (to be honest, I was just a clueless H whom couldn't keep up with her, and my rare anger outbursts (twice) at the kids which I've totally gotten rid of)
"No worries." I replied. And then i quickly pivot my thoughts on what's for dinner with my kids tonight! I think i want to have steak to celebrate a little i guess...
Guess at the end of it I'm still not 100% there yet because it hurt a little today.
Any sage advice on how I can improve myself further and get rid of that hurt eventually? I still love my wife but I don't want to "nice" her back. I want her back on her own accord and start working on our M2.0. I don't want to go back to the old one anyway (wasn't that enjoyable back then in hindsight).
And lastly, thanks for hearing me out; whoever that's out there reading my long-winded journal!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Sorry about your situation. Mine is very similar so I understand what you're going through. In fact, this past weekend was my 7th wedding anniversary. In the first few months post-BD I tried flowers several times they did not work. Now I don't bother and have gotten to a point where I didn't even acknowledge the anniversary and you know what? The day wasn't as much of a trigger as my family and friends who reached out thought it would be. I went to a lake house with friends instead of my W, and it was fine...life goes on.
Hang in there!
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
When you didn't acknowledge the anniversary, did you W picked a fight purposely or show up with actions that will grind your gears a little?
My W simply threw in work overtime and skipped dinner with the kids and me altogether today which to me felt like she did it on purpose. A little bummed out by this but like you said, life goes on.
I just hope that I have it in me to see this ordeal thru and emerge a better person. Generally I'm fine but then anxiety sets in (which is mostly triggered by my W actions that threw me off-guard) I tend to overthink and when i overthink I panic, and my mental strength just falls like dominos.
But I'm glad to say that I'm fixing back the dominos faster now haha...
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
When you didn't acknowledge the anniversary, did you W picked a fight purposely or show up with actions that will grind your gears a little?
No fighting or grinding of gears. Neither of us said a word about it. I was very aware of the date and assume she was as well. Though, not sure if you've read my sitch but W moved out so had the kids most of the day, only saw her briefly for drop-off, and my W has shown little indecision or regret to date common in other sitches on this board.
Originally Posted by Ahkuei
My W simply threw in work overtime and skipped dinner with the kids and me altogether today which to me felt like she did it on purpose. A little bummed out by this but like you said, life goes on.
A lot of people on here talk about no expectations - assuming the worst from your spouse and being surprised (if not skeptical) at positive signs - it took me awhile to fully understand that, and easier said than done.
Originally Posted by Ahkuei
I just hope that I have it in me to see this ordeal thru and emerge a better person. Generally I'm fine but then anxiety sets in (which is mostly triggered by my W actions that threw me off-guard) I tend to overthink and when i overthink I panic, and my mental strength just falls like dominos.
But I'm glad to say that I'm fixing back the dominos faster now haha...
It'll come - just keep focusing on you and your kids!
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Coldly. "Thanks for the flowers but don't need to send me in the future."
Took me a few mins to collect myself and I responded "Have a great day ahead."
If she's in an EA or a PA things will *not* improve for you. All you can do is really avoid making things worse -- and sometimes making things worse is actually better for you in the long run.
In order for her to notice you in a positive light her affair needs to end, she needs to mourn the loss of it, have some emotional space to reset and figure herself out without any outside emotional pressure (from you) and once her grieving is done she needs to decide not to replace her affair with another one.
For you that means a lot of waiting, more patience than you think you're capable of. It's a marathon not a sprint.
Yeah, I kept telling myself that it's a marathon not a sprint.
I'm trying to be as patient as I can, the inner demons are just sometimes pretty convincing to tell me to F it and drop the ball.
And her birthday is coming up next month. Do i still get her a present? She gifted me a big LEGO set for mine. Was thinking of getting her something nice too to reciprocate. Or is that a push? Or just a card will do?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Went to my IC for a session and told her about the current situation. She was saying that the only thing that me and my wife are still connected are the kids. I told her the past few weeks it felt like I was back the early stages of DDay. The IC agreed that whatever my wife is doing now is purely for her own benefits; kinda like a teenager.
My W is still slightly active in terms of the kids, nothing major, just spending a few minutes with them and off she goes to do her stuff.
I have been trying my best to detach because I'm very tired of analysing her actions and words. At this point in time, I don't even care if she has EA or PA. If she does have, that will be even better because that's my dealbreaker and I will have to start doing things to protect my kids and myself.
She is still spending a lot of money (her own money) for things to make herself feel better. A spanking new Pandora bracelet (back then she was saying it's a waste of money and now look who's talking...), a new phone with a new number (fishy fishy but who am i to judge?), new tattoos, etc, etc. These are things beyond my control so I'm keeping my mouth shut so I'm ranting here.
I don't see her hitting rock bottom anytime soon, it looks and feels like she's enjoying her life to the fullest!
On my side, I'm still spending all the time i have with my kids, bringing them out to play, cooking for them and taking care of them on a daily basis.
Back to the IC, she told me giving an open date to this situation has its pros and cons. Pros is that it will not pressure me to make any decisions out of emotions (doing nothing is something). Cons is that the resentment will keep building because she doesn't think my W is stopping her antics any time soon. Her advice to me is to keep working on myself and focus on the kids. The key thing is that whatever happens, we have to be aligned as co-parents; the marriage doesn't matter for now.
After reading so many posts in the forum, I still think I have a lot to change about myself. The advice here is counterintuitive and I have a hard time getting over it. But I believe this is for the better. As much as I would admit, my W is looking way better than she was previously because of all the makeup and change in fashion sense, I still feel a sense of revulsion whenever i see her getting ready to head out. I just can't shake off the feeling that she's such an ugly person in my world. Not sure if this is the right mindset here.
It's been 10 months since all of these hullabaloo. What a roller coaster ride.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
My situation resembles yours except that my boys are both in college. They were both home for about 5 months however due to COVID and W was basically nonexistent in their lives. W moved out (BD) almost a year ago. She has spent maybe 16 hours total with them in the past year.
The teenager thing definitely rings a bell. They are so self centered and only concerned about themselves. Just keep NC and being an awesome dad. Your children will see this and realize that you are the one they can rely on. Maybe she will see this too.
Stay strong you got this.
HD
M57 (53@BD) XW55 (50@BD) S24 (20@BD) S22 (19@BD) Married 25 (22@BD) Together 28 BD 9/29/19 (moved out unannounced while I was on fishing trip) W filed 10/19/20 (Informed me via text) D final 11/10/22
The teenager thing definitely rings a bell. They are so self centered and only concerned about themselves. Just keep NC and being an awesome dad. Your children will see this and realize that you are the one they can rely on. Maybe she will see this too.
Yeah, it baffles me till this day. The rewriting of history, the hostility, the self-center-ness. I'm pretty sure her justification for her behavior is because I've been treating her like dirt last time (which I beg to differ, but there's no way to win this argument)
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Got blindsided by W yesterday morning. My kids came running to me excited and saying they are going to the aquarium and staying at the hotel. I have no idea this was the plan.
Went to W to confirm if I'm hearing this correctly; she's bringing the kids out and staying OVERNIGHT at a hotel? She responded with a soft "Yeah, you can do do your own things then "
I told her with a poker face, "Look, I have a lunch appointment followed by the kickboxing session, then I'm heading home to prepare for dinner. If you're heading to the hotel, what about me? Can you at least let me know earlier if you are bringing the kids out for overnight stays? They are my kids too."
She responded with another "Yeah" and off she goes with my kids. Told my kids to have fun and listen to mommy and I didn't hear from them till now.
And my tenant (who is friends with my W), gave me a lot information about my W which I never had the intention to ask.
- W is trying to convince the tenant to move out so she can take over the spare room (meaning she wants to move out of our master bedroom) - W is also exploring moving out of the house by the end of the year - W is behaving extremely frustrated when out with the kids, losing her cool when the kids are not in line; and fumbling at the simplest things at times. Not sure what to make of it - W has been spending money like no tomorrow; buying jewellery, a 2nd phone (fishy), new tattoos, tonnes of new clothes, etc - W told her in the face she did not recall mentioning divorce. (when I heard it I nearly burst out laughing) - W asked my D6 and D4 who they like more. D6 said dad, D4 said both (well done). Then she tried to pivot the narrative to my D6 the reason she likes me is because i let her play video games and watch youtube. Tenant stopped her immediately and told my kids you don't take sides; both are equals. This information really pissed me off.
I thanked the tenant about sharing those information and told her I cannot control what my wife thinks, feels and does. I will only control myself and make sure I put my kids and myself as priority now. if she chooses the D eventually, I will not stop her but I will not help her too. And if she wants to contest it, I will do what is best for my kids.
And now, after so many months of roller coaster ride, I'm finally at a place where I'm not thinking about reconciliation. I still love my wife very much but I don't think i can put up with this version of her. My marriage is dead 100%. It's either we start M2.0 where we both put in the effort to change (I'm not completely faultless here and I own it), or I will be a darn good second husband to someone else.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
W has been evasive in joining the family for the routine dinners. Either she's working late or she has dinner appointments with colleagues and friends. She has lined up her programs to stay as far away from the kids and me as much as possible; she's even going to stay over at a friend's house over the weekend knowing fully I have classes on Saturday morning. The worst part of it is that she tend to give last minute notices; where we have already prepared the food and we are stuck with leftovers.
I took it in my stride whenever she drops the ball which I will simply replied "No worries". I shook it off and carry on with my life. I'm at this point where I'm assuming she's not eating with us so I will consciously cook lesser. I hate wasting food.
My buddies were telling me to spring a surprise video call when she stays with her friend; using my kids as a reason to making the video call. I thanked my buddies for the advise but I don't think I will do it because I don't want to use my kids as a tool for these sort of nonsense. If she cheats, she cheats. I will not snoop around to find out about it but if it falls on my lap due to her blunders then there will be consequences.
I still don't think I'm detaching enough because I have this fear that if I let go, she will take it that I'm giving up on the relationship and she's free to do whatever the hell she wants without the consequences. This fear is stopping me in my tracks. I'm not stopping her from doing anything now. It's my negative thoughts that is constantly nagging at me, "When will this madness stop? Do something man!""
"Doing nothing is something", I kept telling myself that. Physically I'm at my healthiest in my life so far; dropped more than 14KGs and stopped smoking and going for kickboxing and gym frequently. Emotionally I'm struggling like a fish out of water, flailing around gasping for breath but I do not show it in front of anyone; not even to my kids.
2020 is really a dark year so far. I really hope I can have an awakening soon so that I can breathe better and carry on with my awesome life. Putting all these nightmares behind me.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
That's an understatement! It's been brutal. I often hear people who don't know my sitch say that at work or in casual conversation in reference to COVID and think to myself "you have no idea...". I'm feeling more confident lately about 2021 every day though.
Originally Posted by AKuei
I really hope I can have an awakening soon so that I can breathe better and carry on with my awesome life. Putting all these nightmares behind me.
Keep focusing on you and your kids. It'll get better. I'm not fully there yet, but I can feel the difference a few months has made. You'll get there. Has to feel good to be in shape! I lost 30lbs in the few few months and was amazed how many people on here said the exact same thing (20-30lbs).
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Thanks for the encouragement BL! I can't describe how grateful I am to have stumbled on this place. My sitch is similar with a few here and by reading and feeling their pain, I can better relate that Im truly not alone in this.
And yes! I'm so looking forward to 2021! I have tonnes of things planned up for myself and the kids! I can also say that it will be even more awesome if W is around to do all things together as a family but Ill be just as fine without her. I have to fake it till I make it. The fear and anxiety will not be completely gone but as time passes and we get better at detaching, we probably won’t die from it!
I feel like I’ve come a Long way and I’m a different person now; I’m sure I’m a better father to my kids because they adore me! I’m getting more positive by the day (but you know some days are just brutal because emotions are a b****). No matter what happens, I WON’T DIE!
But that being said, I still have a lot of work to do. I’m still affected by my W’s action to a certain extent sometimes. Like I assumed she already has a EA/PA even though I do not have hard evidence (I’m stopping myself from snooping) and sometimes my bad thoughts will appear out of nowhere to put me down. It’s tough but I Guess it’s part of my journey?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
She was evasive, said he was an old friend from school (true), and that she didn't chat with him much or often (lie).
My W had her AP's name in her phone with his job title as if to remember who it was (like someone you met at the bar the night before) and after continually denying and affair when I finally confronted her with the name she said he's been a good friend for 10 years. I knew her 9 of those and never heard about him once. It was complete BS.
Originally Posted by Steve85
When I installed the spyware the first conversation I captured was her telling OM about me asking about him. And she suggested that some evening, when I was around, that they could IM innocently to show me that there was no concern. The very next night is when I found a lengthy email where he spent 60% of the time trying to convince her to meet him so they could do what they had so often IM'd about sexually.
My W and OM had multiple drawn out discussions about how not to get caught and whether or not I would expose them. They would plan for her to invite my parents over for a Sunday family dinner so to act as if nothing was going on and keep suspicions down and keep the peace (she didn't have any idea how much I knew), unfortunately I was still trying to nice her back at the time so I played along. Now she won't even say hello to my mom, who has been NOTHING but welcoming and generous and loving to her for 9 years.
Originally Posted by Steve85
BELIEVE NOTHING SHE SAYS OR SHOWS YOU. She is an lying cheater. Never trust a lying cheater.
^^^THIS!!! They're liars!!! It's hard because you remember them when they weren't wayward and see signs of something and think "no, she couldn't do that" or "no, she wouldn't lie about that"...they ARE!!! Listen to Steve85.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Thanks for the encouragement BL! I can't describe how grateful I am to have stumbled on this place. My sitch is similar with a few here and by reading and feeling their pain, I can better relate that Im truly not alone in this.
No problem! I understand completely about reading others' sitches and not feeling so alone. We could all use some around here and it sounds like your timeline and situation are somewhat similar to mine, so I'm especially interested to follow it.
Originally Posted by AKuei
And yes! I'm so looking forward to 2021! I have tonnes of things planned up for myself and the kids
Awesome!
Originally Posted by AKuei
I can also say that it will be even more awesome if W is around to do all things together as a family but Ill be just as fine without her. I have to fake it till I make it. The fear and anxiety will not be completely gone but as time passes and we get better at detaching, we probably won’t die from it!
I feel like I’ve come a Long way and I’m a different person now; I’m sure I’m a better father to my kids because they adore me! I’m getting more positive by the day (but you know some days are just brutal because emotions are a b****). No matter what happens, I WON’T DIE!
No, you won't die - we'll both make it through. It's not ideal or what we wanted, but it's what we have to deal with and as they say around here there's life after.
Originally Posted by AKuei
But that being said, I still have a lot of work to do. I’m still affected by my W’s action to a certain extent sometimes. Like I assumed she already has a EA/PA even though I do not have hard evidence (I’m stopping myself from snooping) and sometimes my bad thoughts will appear out of nowhere to put me down. It’s tough but I Guess it’s part of my journey?
Yep, me too. I was doing pretty well and had a set back today which I'll post about on my new thread. Certainly ups and downs go along with these situations.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
I was reading your sitch and I had the creeps because we are almost living the same nightmare but in different places and with different people. We have such similarities that like you, I have a vested interest in following you. Not the best place to make new friends but well, we have each other now (and other awesome folks here too)!
I'll keep cheering you on and hope you can do the same for me too!
Now, some journaling to channel the frustrations away...
Last weekend the W stayed over at her friend's house (didn't ask who/where even though i was dying to know). She didn't contact me or the kids for that past few days; a first 30 mins i was getting anxiety attack but on the 31st minute till she returned I was kicking ass enjoying my time with the kids and doing things for myself! Now I fully understand that we can be happy by ourselves and you definitely can't beat that feeling!
Some changes in the W when she got back. She's not offering to pick the kids back home nowadays sporadically (99% of the time i was the one sending and fetching them so it's nice for a change), she brought the kids out to the park for walks (1st time since 4 months ago), she taking on more chores that's related to the kids (packing their school bags, washing their bottles, face masks, etc). Wonder how long she can keep it up? I'm trying to take a step back because my therapist advised my W during our one and only counselling session (she attended it once and then called it quits; saying it's not working at all but I'm still going as IC) that she's ought to spend more time with the kids.
My buddy's wedding coming up this week and he's invited us to a drinking session post that, I asked my W if she's keen to go and she said yes without a heartbeat. Felt nice for a change.
BUT......
Never trust what she says and believe half of what she does. I'm etching that into my brain.
Seems like calm before the storm, no?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
After a few weeks of really detaching from my W, I’ve been more at peace than I ever was. I’ve dropped hope of reconciliation and worked towards being the best single dad I am to my kids and improving myself to the best that I can.
And all of a sudden, my W texted me if it’s time to have a talk. I’ve been standing for close to a year and now she finally initiated a talk. She was asking me if I’m ready for it because she felt that I’m not ready.
I told her I’m not 100% ready but I will try my best; whatever outcome of the talk I will respect her decision.
Any advice on what to do next? I’m more or less prepared for the worst case to happen.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Akuei, prepare for the discussion by studying and truly understanding listening and validating. Practice validation skills.
If she tries to nail you down on details, just be ready to let her know you need more time. Statements like: "I am not sure about that, I need more time to process everything before I can answer that."
Listen and validate. Do not give answers you are not ready to answer. If she gets frustrated at your lack of answers, fall back to listen and validate.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
She texted me asking for a divorce. I told her I don’t agree with it but if she insists I won’t stop her. Then she changed it to separation first by moving out. Again I told her the same thing; don’t agree but I won’t stop her.
Asked her about the timeline of her moving out and her plan to breaks the news to the kids she replied “slowly”.
My last message to her seems kinda like a push though: “ Ok... I not sure if this is going to push you further away but I want to let you know that I still love you with all that I have. I’ve been trying change myself for the better because I can’t change the past. Should you have a change of heart to give this marriage a try I’ll be 1000% ready to commit again. But should you choose to walk away I will totally understand too and I’m sorry that you feel that way and I’m sorry I’ve unknowingly put you thru so much hardship throughout these years. I’ve never meant for things to turn out this way. Our problem is that we don’t communicate; we kept bottling up our feelings and then we explode. And when things explode no matter what we do it’s already too little too late“
She couldn’t face me physically and chose to tell me these over messages.
The surprising thing is, I’ve felt that coming miles away and I didn’t have any anxiety Attack. I’m very calm right now (maybe I’ll feel the effects when I wake up tomorrow though haha) and I’m not thinking about winning her back at all. All I’m thinking about is my kids. They must be protected at all costs.
Guess I didn’t come out of this like a champ because of the last push message but hey, I’m still learning and I’m still standing.
Guess I need to pop sleeping pills tonight to get to bed haha...
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Yep. But she will slow it down too. Don't be surprised when her racing car comes to halt and the D stalls for weeks or months. WASs are notoriously lazy when it comes to moving the D forward. In fact, in a lot of cases, they will try to get the WAS to do the heavy lifting.
Originally Posted by AKuei
She texted me asking for a divorce. I told her I don’t agree with it but if she insists I won’t stop her. Then she changed it to separation first by moving out. Again I told her the same thing; don’t agree but I won’t stop her.
Great, you said it once. No need to repeat it. LBSs make this mistake all the time. Reminding their WAS that they don't want the D. They know that. So don't repeat it.
Originally Posted by AKuei
Asked her about the timeline of her moving out and her plan to breaks the news to the kids she replied “slowly”.
Why? Listen and validate. THis is exactly what I was talking about above. "She came at me like a racecar." "She wants to break it to the kids slowly." Doesn't really match up does it? So stop asking questions. Just listen and validate.
Originally Posted by AKuei
My last message to her seems kinda like a push though: “ Ok... I not sure if this is going to push you further away but I want to let you know that I still love you with all that I have. I’ve been trying change myself for the better because I can’t change the past. Should you have a change of heart to give this marriage a try I’ll be 1000% ready to commit again. But should you choose to walk away I will totally understand too and I’m sorry that you feel that way and I’m sorry I’ve unknowingly put you thru so much hardship throughout these years. I’ve never meant for things to turn out this way. Our problem is that we don’t communicate; we kept bottling up our feelings and then we explode. And when things explode no matter what we do it’s already too little too late“
Stop talking. Act. One of the #1 rules of DBing is to never point out the changes you are making to your WAS. The minute you do you ruin any chance that they might notice them and think they are permanent. When you say "Look at how much better I am than before!" they see it as a manipulation attempt to get them back. This entire message was a huge mistake. Let me ask you, where in DBing did you see "Send her a heartfelt message pointing out that you've changed, that you don't want a D, that you won't stop her from walking away, and once again pointing out and apologizing for your shortcomings and the problems in the MR."? THe answer is that it isn't part of DBing.
Try this, next time you get the urge to send a message like this, come here and tell the forum what you are planning to do. We can stop you from making a mistake.
Originally Posted by AKuei
She couldn’t face me physically and chose to tell me these over messages.
Out of your control. So stop trying to control it. Also, stop responding to her messages. IF it isn't about the kids....and if it isn't a direct question, then do not respond. If it is a question, respond in as few words as possible, in your own time (not right away). Yes or no questions get yes or no answers. Unless it is a question you are not ready to answer, then push it off. "I need more time to consider that." [/quote]
Originally Posted by AKuei
The surprising thing is, I’ve felt that coming miles away and I didn’t have any anxiety Attack. I’m very calm right now (maybe I’ll feel the effects when I wake up tomorrow though haha) and I’m not thinking about winning her back at all. All I’m thinking about is my kids. They must be protected at all costs.
Not sure I believe you. But if true, good. Then let that guide your actions. Because that last message above is not in keeping with "not thinking aobut winning her back".
Focusing on your kids is the right approach.
Originally Posted by AKuei
Guess I didn’t come out of this like a champ because of the last push message but hey, I’m still learning and I’m still standing.
Guess I need to pop sleeping pills tonight to get to bed haha...
If sleeping pills will help you sleep, then take them. What I urge you is to stop reacting to her. When you react rarely will that lead you to the right actions.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Thank you for the brutal advice here and i really appreciate it. Yes, I screwed up by sending her that last message, sort of like a hail mary to me but now after calming down further I've realised what a stupid message that was.
When I woke up this morning, all of my thoughts were, "How will the kids take this? How soon will she move out?". It kept replaying in my head. I supposed that's normal because this is the first time she's talking about divorcing/separation straight in my face.
I'm not sure what is next in store for me. I will try to be as normal as possible and focus my energy on the kids and myself instead.
One more thing she mentioned last night was that she said: "I will let you have the kids though." To me, it seems that not only is she abandoning me, she's going to abandon the kids too. This is not the W that I knew, previously the kids were the world to her. Makes me sad that whatever she's going thru now is making her a totally different person. MLC or WAS, it doesn't matter anymore. She's no longer the same person I've married 7 years ago.
And I would like to seek more advice on this new phase for me. Apart from GAL, focus on the kids and myself, what else can I do to get me thru this excruciating phase?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
One more thing she mentioned last night was that she said: "I will let you have the kids though." To me, it seems that not only is she abandoning me, she's going to abandon the kids too. This is not the W that I knew, previously the kids were the world to her. Makes me sad that whatever she's going thru now is making her a totally different person. MLC or WAS, it doesn't matter anymore. She's no longer the same person I've married 7 years ago.
Get that in writing and signed off with the lawyers ASAP, if you can. I doubt she'll stick to that offer forever. Better to secure your parental rights up front (imo). Also, not sure your financial situation but that would likely result in you receiving (or at least not paying) child support.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Today is rough and I'm on the verge of breaking down. The conversation with the W kept replaying on my head. The NGS in me kept asking myself what went wrong? I guess a few things went wrong especially that push message. Now I just need to dust it off and take it one step at a time.
I still have a lot of fear in me that I'm still trying to get rid of. Mostly it's around the fact that my kids won't have a complete family with her out of the picture.
Laws over here in my country are favoring women. I'm financially stable but my wife isn't as her MLC-type spending habits are quite out of control. If we do the D route I supposed I will be liable to pay quite some alimony. And custody-wise, it's usually favoring the women as well.
I'm thinking of starting to engage a L to discuss my options. It feels like a ticking time bomb now; not sure when the W will announce that she will move out. If may be in a few days, a few weeks or a few months. Who knows?
We are supposed to head to the beach this coming saturday to spend some time with the kids together but now I'm not sure if I want her to be there.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I still have a lot of fear in me that I'm still trying to get rid of. Mostly it's around the fact that my kids won't have a complete family with her out of the picture.
Yes, I'm lamenting that loss for them (and me as well). Unfortunately we don't have any control of it.
Originally Posted by AKuei
Laws over here in my country are favoring women. I'm financially stable but my wife isn't as her MLC-type spending habits are quite out of control. If we do the D route I supposed I will be liable to pay quite some alimony. And custody-wise, it's usually favoring the women as well.
I'm thinking of starting to engage a L to discuss my options.
Yes, you absolutely should do that ASAP. There is no downside - why not at least find out where you stand legally in case the worst happens.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Close to a week since she started the separation messages. We are back to being cordial and friendly and she didn't bring up any R talks at all.
Now my mind is not replaying that scene that frequently but the only nagging inner question remain; "When is she going to make her next move?" I shouldn't even be giving oxygen to this thought but I'm struggling to get it out of my head.
She joined me to visit a post wedding celebration of a buddy of mine which i extended the invite to her before that incident. All went well, had fun with the kids at the beach, she was talking to me on a whole range of topics from covid to her recent outing with her colleagues (she and her colleagues (all males) tried to walk 36 clicks coast to coast in a single day, failed though).
She interacted well with my buddies; talking mostly about her new tattoos. My buddies knew about my situation but kept their cool and did not rip off her face at the spot because they respected me and what I'm doing right now (standing for the marriage).
She also had a minor covid scare as she received a notification from our health ministry that she was in a vicinity of a covid patient while she was out shopping as part of contact tracing efforts. Here's the thing that baffled me; she was advised to stay home and work from both the government ministry and HR but this morning, she left the house with her laptop, which i assumed she is opting to work anywhere else other than at home with me.
I'm working in my study room, door closed and I am not harassing her in any way whatsoever. Am i that repulsive? Or maybe she's off to meet OM to work together, who knows?
Just simply cannot understand why she's rebelling so much. Is that her way to portray her regressive teenager expression?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
She's seems very selfish, a common trait in WW's. I wouldn't bother trying to understand her. Good things happen to people who work hard to make their life better, are you GAL? Are you improving as a person?
You need to refocus your train of thought on to yourself. Leave her be. In the simplest terms, she isn't your woman anymore. Act accordingly.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Thank for hammering me back to my senses Ovrr. My train of thoughts had derailed and this was just what I needed.
She's not my women anymore and I have to act accordingly.
And yes I'm GAL-ing more than ever. Heck, I'm doing even more things now than I was younger (i guess i have more disposable income too haha). Muay thai, engaged a personal trainer, going for excursions with the kids, cooking a hell lot more frequently, reading and hanging out with my buddies, etc, etc. Going to sign up for a boat license this month as well...
I'm also seeing a therapist once a month too to work on myself. And most of all, re-reading the plethora of valuable advice in this forum.
I think it has come to a point that my kids are so attached to me that my W felt dejected at time. Thus my assumption that she wants to "let me have the kids if she moves out".
I'm slowly and surely detaching and making myself happy instead of depending on my W. I've been mr nice guy for too long and I've lost myself. In fact, I'm actually leaning towards being grateful to my W for creating this saga that allowed me to understand how lousy as a person I was back then (fat, ignorant, didn't spend enough time with the kids, low self-esteem, etc).
It's a marathon, not a sprint.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Seeking advice here from the vets before i make my next move:
My kids told me today that the W was talking to them about her moving out and coming up with a sort of arrangements of picking them up from school. All without my knowledge. Should I confront her about it? I don’t like the fact that she’s talking to the kids about such serious matters behind my back. It seems like she’s hell bent on moving out.
My D6 told me she agreed to let my W do that because she thought it's only for 1 day. I told her it might not be that case and it kinda hit her like a truck and quickly said no she doesn't want that. My D4 told her vehemently no way she wants that to happen.
I don't agree to this action of hers; trying to gather consensus vote from the kids behind my back. I felt a lot of anger right now but I'm telling myself not to blow my top. I have to be calm and collected in face of this adversity.
Need some enlightenment on this please...
Last edited by AKuei; 10/09/2002:11 PM.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Seeking advice here from the vets before i make my next move:
My kids told me today that the W was talking to them about her moving out and coming up with a sort of arrangements of picking them up from school. All without my knowledge. Should I confront her about it? I don’t like the fact that she’s talking to the kids about such serious matters behind my back. It seems like she’s hell bent on moving out.
My D6 told me she agreed to let my W do that because she thought it's only for 1 day. I told her it might not be that case and it kinda hit her like a truck and quickly said no she doesn't want that. My D4 told her vehemently no way she wants that to happen.
I don't agree to this action of hers; trying to gather consensus vote from the kids behind my back. I felt a lot of anger right now but I'm telling myself not to blow my top. I have to be calm and collected in face of this adversity.
Need some enlightenment on this please...
So what is the outcome you are looking for in confronting her? Do you think she will be remorseful, apologize and agree not to do it again? Or do you think she will be defiant, unapologetic and tell you to go kick rocks? Do you just want to express your dissatisfaction at her actions?
The reasons I ask these questions is that LBSs often think they can get the moral high ground in these exchanges. The problem is that the WAS doesn't care about who is right and who is wrong. They care about how they feel. She felt she needed to talk to the kids about this. You jumping up and down and screaming and yelling about it will not change that. And you have no power to enforce any "I don't like the fact that you are talking to the kids about serious matter behind my back". Her attitude is likely "So what! I can talk to my kids about anything I want!"
So think about outcomes, because you likely aren't going to get the outcome you desire. And confronting her on this may just make things worse.
So, IF she brings anything up about this "plan" you can tell her "Yes, D6 mentioned that you said something about this to her. I'd prefer if you and I discussed these things before involving the kids." Simple. To the point. Let's her know that you disagree with what she did. But it is non-confrontational, and it doesn't seem like you are coming down on her for it.
AK, what I can tell you is that if your sitch ends in D, there will be a lot of things you "don't like" and they you "do not agree with". Introducing your kids to an OM. Etc. If you make a federal case of every one of those then you will come across as weak and petty. Unless the kids are endangered in some way, then pick your battles. Is this discussion with your girls really a hill you want to die on?
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Steve, I can't express enough my gratitude on your support on my sitch.
You are so right in so many things. I guess I'm still in the thick of the fog because if I'm not decisive in this kind of situation it still means I'm still a long way to go from detaching and DBing.
I'm reading from the other thread that we LBSs should come to this board before we want to make any stupid moves and then we have heroes like you to talk us down the ledge. This truly works.
I will follow your advice religiously and carry on with my GAL and 180s. I have a lot of work to do even though I keep feeling time isn't on my side.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Steve, I can't express enough my gratitude on your support on my sitch.
You are so right in so many things. I guess I'm still in the thick of the fog because if I'm not decisive in this kind of situation it still means I'm still a long way to go from detaching and DBing.
I'm reading from the other thread that we LBSs should come to this board before we want to make any stupid moves and then we have heroes like you to talk us down the ledge. This truly works.
I will follow your advice religiously and carry on with my GAL and 180s. I have a lot of work to do even though I keep feeling time isn't on my side.
AK, I applaud you for asking before acting! Always good, something I did poorly in my own sitch.
Hopefully, the vets of the board will weigh in too. In general I think confronting about stuff like this a bad idea. But there are those that are smarter than me that can help too.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Need advice again on how to respond to my W. I feel that she's trying to bait me to react.
It's going to be her birthday tomorrow and all of a sudden she dropped me a message saying that she won't be returning home tonight. She has stayovers previously in the weekends and this is the first time she's blatantly doing it on a work day. Ok, given that the next day is her birthday she might have plan something out with other people in her life.
When i saw that message, my heart hurts and I barely managed to stop myself from spewing all my words onto the phone. I wanted to messaged back "Why are you doing all these? Are you trying to prove a point? What will the kids think about you not being at home? You want to spend your time with your OM? Be my guest... yada yada yada..."
Or should i just replied with a short "OK." Will that do? Will that be considered being aloof?
I was planning to get her a card and a cake chosen by the kids tomorrow. Now i'm having second thoughts about this...
Some help please.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Thanks for the quick response LH. I needed someone to slap my face and wake me up.
I'm trembling as I'm typing this because the urge to respond to her is overwhelming. I've been staring at my phone for the past 20 mins and thank god i didn't type in anything.
I have D6 and D4. I'm sure they will have a lot of questions why mommy isn't home tonight later.
To be honest, I've been trying to detach and it's tough AF. I have so many instances where I'm second-guessing myself; the fear is crippling because I have the constant thought that if i do detach, my W will leave. I understand that the advice i was given is that I have to live the best version of myself and there's no magic bullet, I'm just having a hard time getting rid of that fear. Even though it's close to a year and when i started to truly detach from my W a few weeks earlier, she started doubling down with hints of separation and now this staying overnight elsewhere on her bday.
I kept telling myself she's testing me or she's trying to break me and get me to lose my sheet so that she can justify her choice of leaving. And now I'm not sure if that hypothesis stands true. If yes, she is such a pro in scheming and manipulation.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Detachment is hard when you're in the thick of it. You mentioned the fear you are feeling. What are afraid of A? I can promise you that what you are afraid of isn't as bad as it feels right now?
You have to try to accept that fact that you are likely to separate and probably even divorce. Things have to get worse before they will get better.
As for her birthday, yeah your kids are young so you will have to get a little something from them. I know it sux but unfortunately it is what it is.
She may be testing you but odds are she just doesn't care about anyone but herself.
I'm sorry A. This $hit isn't easy. The feeling you have right now doesn't last forever.
Let me ask you this... Would your old wife not want to wake up with her children on her birthday - to have them jump on your best and say Happy Birthday mum etc..
I suspect she would have loved it..
Heres the thing..The wife you knew is gone.. and to a degree ( certainly in my sitch ) the mother to your kids you knew is gone as well..
Replaced by somebody who's actions are pure selfish.. Hence she no longer cares if she wakes up in the house with her kids..
You cant change her or her actions. I suspect these actions will upset the children, so just be there for them.. Prepare for the worst ( divorce ) and plan for being the best father you can be.. Let her enjoy the car crash decissions she makes .
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
Detachment is hard when you're in the thick of it. You mentioned the fear you are feeling. What are afraid of A? I can promise you that what you are afraid of isn't as bad as it feels right now?
You have to try to accept that fact that you are likely to separate and probably even divorce. Things have to get worse before they will get better.
As for her birthday, yeah your kids are young so you will have to get a little something from them. I know it sux but unfortunately it is what it is.
She may be testing you but odds are she just doesn't care about anyone but herself.
I'm sorry A. This $hit isn't easy. The feeling you have right now doesn't last forever.
Thanks LH, I agree with you that it doesn't last forever. I have to take on this feeling head on and get past it.
True enough, my kids were asking me where's mommy when they got back home. I just said, "Mommy's out with her friends."
It really seems like heading to S or D is the path now. And I'm not sure if that will put her at rock bottom or me. I need to be strong to take this sheet and be there for my kids.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Let me ask you this... Would your old wife not want to wake up with her children on her birthday - to have them jump on your best and say Happy Birthday mum etc..
I suspect she would have loved it..
Heres the thing..The wife you knew is gone.. and to a degree ( certainly in my sitch ) the mother to your kids you knew is gone as well..
Replaced by somebody who's actions are pure selfish.. Hence she no longer cares if she wakes up in the house with her kids..
You cant change her or her actions. I suspect these actions will upset the children, so just be there for them.. Prepare for the worst ( divorce ) and plan for being the best father you can be.. Let her enjoy the car crash decissions she makes .
The old W will definitely like to wake up on her birthday morning with the kids greeting her, go for a good meal and have a fabulous cake. She told me me before that a birthday is a must no matter what.
I think it's the fact that I can see her really going to crash and burn with all her decisions yet I cannot help her. I've read NMMNG and I identify as one; which i need to find someone to fix and have a covert contract with in order to gain the love i need. The helplessness in me is out of this world.
I've gotten a good L from a buddy that's pro-men (because laws here in Singapore favors women considerably). I'm gonna have to start to make an appointment to prepare for the worst case in the event of a D.
I really want to slap and shake myself really hard right now. I'm feeling like sheet because I'm weak and fearful. I'm taking baby steps in improving myself and getting back my confidence but the arduously slow pace is wreaking havoc in my mind.
Are there any other books/resources that I can latch on to keep my mind from thinking stupid stuff? I'm finishing up on "The subtle of not giving a F*&(" and some of stuff in there really resonated with me...
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
You mentioned the fear you are feeling. What are afraid of A? I can promise you that what you are afraid of isn't as bad as it feels right now?
Sorry I forgot to address this.
I'm afraid of losing the family as a whole because I was brought with the teachings that children will fare best if both parents are together. I fear that my failure in keeping my W in the marriage will end up hurting my kids in the long run.
I've read threads that mentioned all that matters is how effective a separated couple can co-parent and the damage will be reduced to a bare minimum but all i could think of is, since I can't even save a marriage, how can I be sure I can effectively co-parent with someone that has hurt me so tremendously? Well, given that her rewritten history was me hurting her more, not sure what to make of it now.
And you are right, it doesn't feel as bad as right now... I'm at a lost why this is so. Can you coach me on this?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
That’s one of the biggest lies told. Children will fare better in a two parent home where there is mutual love and respect. You do not have that right now so that makes it a toxic environment.
Coparenting is not that difficult. I only speak to my ex about the kids nothing else. Most is done by text and a few phone calls. I never speak badly about her to my children even though she is being a bad parent right now. I try to minimize the damage for my children.
A my fear is that right now you are still in the denial phase of the stages of grief so I’m not going to lie you have a long road ahead of you. Exercise, eat right, get good sleep and practice self love.
Thanks LH. I think I'm jumping back and forth in the grief stages whenever my W pulls out a new stunt. Messes up my mind pretty bad.
And yes I agree with you that I'm still in denial because I still can't wrap my head around why my W can bear to just drop the kids and live her own fantasy. The kids were her world before she turned into another person. I can't understand the fact that she doesn't realise her trailblazing actions are leaving behind a trail of destruction to her loved ones.
At times (more regularly now) I'm just calm where I'm ok with her out of the picture and I'm full of motivation to better myself and be there for the kids. And there are times (like now) where I'm back to square one whenever she pulls a fast one on me and the kids, leaving me speechless.
I've gotten more information from the tenant that she's looking around for apartments and she has shortlisted 2 units. Also got to know that she has told her mom that she's intending to divorce but will want a separation first. I'm puzzled by this statement because she was the one that wants to move this quickly but on the other hand she wants to "slowly" let the kids know about it and wants to give separation a try first and see how it goes. To me it sounds like cake eating, am i wrong?
And I will heed your advice on how to effectively co-parent when things go from bad to worse. This is the best we can do for the kids I guess. I have to be strong for the kids no matter what.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I'm afraid of losing the family as a whole because I was brought with the teachings that children will fare best if both parents are together. I fear that my failure in keeping my W in the marriage will end up hurting my kids in the long run.
I've read threads that mentioned all that matters is how effective a separated couple can co-parent and the damage will be reduced to a bare minimum but all i could think of is, since I can't even save a marriage, how can I be sure I can effectively co-parent with someone that has hurt me so tremendously? Well, given that her rewritten history was me hurting her more, not sure what to make of it now.
This was my biggest fear - I think this is why a lot of people stay together when they really shouldnt.
I can only speak from my personal perspective, but WW leaving was the best thing that ever happened to me and my children. My WW did not have a "fun" childhood - she never went on holiday, dad ran off with OW, mum quickly met another man and got pregnant ( weeks after dad left) - ive realised now, she doesnt really do "fun" things with the children, as it stresses her out.. We never really did "day" trips, as the kids stressed her out. We never ate as a family at the table as "she couldnt enjoy her food with the kids stressing her out" etc... Once the WW is gone, you can be a great father, and do whats best for the kids, when with you.. I cannot stress enough how much better my life and relationship has been since she left. I would never take her back, yet 18 months ago, i was just like you. Look at it this way - Its better for the kids to have 100% happyness, love and security 50% of the time than 10% happyness 100% of the time..
Originally Posted by AKuei
The kids were her world before she turned into another person. I can't understand the fact that she doesn't realise her trailblazing actions are leaving behind a trail of destruction to her loved ones.
Common - and its hard to get your head around - I totally relate, and many LBS spouces will..
BUT
WW wont see this - dont waste your time trying to explain it to them.. The person you knew is gone.
You cant control this or her.. So dont waste energy or time trying.
It will probably get worse - They are selfish beyond belief.
Originally Posted by AKuei
I'm puzzled by this statement because she was the one that wants to move this quickly but on the other hand she wants to "slowly" let the kids know about it and wants to give separation a try first and see how it goes. To me it sounds like cake eating, am i wrong?
Cake eating is correct. She want to keep you as a plan B - Have some self respect and walk away. You dont need people like this in your life.
Originally Posted by AKuei
I have to be strong for the kids no matter what.
This is KEY - dont do the whole "ooohh lets trying dating" etc - Focus on Kids Kids Kids - and You You You.. You will get through this !
Last edited by MrBrside; 10/12/2001:50 PM.
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
At times (more regularly now) I'm just calm where I'm ok with her out of the picture and I'm full of motivation to better myself and be there for the kids. And there are times (like now) where I'm back to square one whenever she pulls a fast one on me and the kids, leaving me speechless.
This is the pain and confusion many refer to as the roller coaster, or three steps forward, two steps back. Today you're having trouble, over all it sounds like you personally are making progress.
The rollercoaster is tough as there are so many different studies and opinions. If we heard that kids can be 100 percent ok in a D, this would be a notch easier. Yet some say its the most awful thing in the world. What helps me a little is some of the times when they say single parent households hurt the kids, its because the father is gone. In some of the cases its no counting coparent households, just often single moms with an absent father.
Everytime I hear a conservative talk family values, it stings, every time I hear a liberal talk values, it stings. There really is no answer besides why LH refers to in being the best dad you can for the kids. Its tough seeing your W go through what she is currently. Especially if youre a positive thinker and remember so many of the good moments. Thinking of yourself and the kids will help. You mentioned rock bottom a few posts back. Maybe you will or already have hit rock bottom. What do you plan on doing about it? What would you like those kids to see happen in someone who was knocked down? Does he get stronger? Does he show you can overcome?
Different subject - I have but havent started "When I say no I feel guilty", which is recommended. Personally cant give my recommendation but others like it. If you browse readytochanges posts, he recommends books in many categories. Ironwill recommended "The Power of Now" to me which is good so far.
I dont know how obtainable it is anymore but work by Hypnotica helped me, especially years before I married. I wish I kept it up. Specifically I think his Collection Of Confidence vids helped the most. Not sure about his newer stuff.
H37, W37 D4, S2 ILYBNILWY 9/19 BD 9/19 EA discovered 10/19 Currently in limbo, no D or S process initiated
This is the pain and confusion many refer to as the roller coaster, or three steps forward, two steps back. Today you're having trouble, over all it sounds like you personally are making progress.
The rollercoaster is tough as there are so many different studies and opinions. If we heard that kids can be 100 percent ok in a D, this would be a notch easier. Yet some say its the most awful thing in the world. What helps me a little is some of the times when they say single parent households hurt the kids, its because the father is gone. In some of the cases its no counting coparent households, just often single moms with an absent father.
Everytime I hear a conservative talk family values, it stings, every time I hear a liberal talk values, it stings. There really is no answer besides why LH refers to in being the best dad you can for the kids. Its tough seeing your W go through what she is currently. Especially if youre a positive thinker and remember so many of the good moments. Thinking of yourself and the kids will help. You mentioned rock bottom a few posts back. Maybe you will or already have hit rock bottom. What do you plan on doing about it? What would you like those kids to see happen in someone who was knocked down? Does he get stronger? Does he show you can overcome?
Different subject - I have but havent started "When I say no I feel guilty", which is recommended. Personally cant give my recommendation but others like it. If you browse readytochanges posts, he recommends books in many categories. Ironwill recommended "The Power of Now" to me which is good so far.
I dont know how obtainable it is anymore but work by Hypnotica helped me, especially years before I married. I wish I kept it up. Specifically I think his Collection Of Confidence vids helped the most. Not sure about his newer stuff.
Thank you so much for your thoughts Core. I practically have no one to talk to except for the folks in this forum and I'm so much calmer now when I see new responses to my thread. You guys are lifesavers, truly.
Yes, overall I feel that I've been making good progress in improving myself. But just hate it when roller coaster ride strikes. I admit I'm not having as much strong willed as the vets here where they are practically unfazed by the spouses actions because they can see right thru them. I can clearly see that I'm struggling on how much my W's actions have an impact on me but i simply couldn't stop my thought train to derail.
On the rock bottom topic, I don't think I'm there yet and I feel I still can take a few more gut punches (maybe I'm being too naive?) Secretly, deep down I am hoping that my W hits rock bottom instead, hoping that can shake her out of her fog (another naive thinking). Let's say IF i do hit rock bottom, I would like my kids to still see me as normal as possible, being around them 24/7 to tide thru this shiitshow. They are innocent and they don't deserve this at all. I do have suicidal thoughts at times but I will consciously shake them off because it's a coward's way to solve the problem. And it doesn't get solved anyway, will only bring more pain to my loved ones.
And many thanks for the reading recommendation! I've just downloaded the 3% man and I'll try to source for the ones you've recommended as well!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
If you are truly having suicidal thoughts then you should seek the help of a professional immediately.
As for us vets we were right where you are right now. I thought my exw was the most wonderful woman in the world and I couldn't live without her and an intact family. I was never more wrong in my life. I love living alone. Yes, I miss my kids at times but when we're together we have so much fun. They are both doing really well in school.
It's gonna take a really long time for your W to hit rock bottom. My ex is in about year 7 of her crisis/change in personality. Her relationship with the kids is bad. They were both crying on the last exchange that they don't like being with her anymore. And it was her birthday! It's sad for my kids but also very predictable. All these situations run on the same script. You have to minimize the damage for your children.
The key is to use the pain to become a better person and the rest will work itself out.
The key is to use the pain to become a better person and the rest will work itself out.
And to be that rock for your children - they WILL need you - As LH says, they all follow a similar script - and unfortunetly in most cases, the WW not only turns out to be a bad relationship / wife choice, but a poor mother as well.. Hence you need to step up - This will give you something to focus on !
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
I have D6 and D4. I'm sure they will have a lot of questions why mommy isn't home tonight later. ... True enough, my kids were asking me where's mommy when they got back home. I just said, "Mommy's out with her friends." ... And yes I agree with you that I'm still in denial because I still can't wrap my head around why my W can bear to just drop the kids and live her own fantasy. The kids were her world before she turned into another person. I can't understand the fact that she doesn't realise her trailblazing actions are leaving behind a trail of destruction to her loved ones.
Originally Posted by AKuei
Originally Posted by MrBrside
AKuei,
Let me ask you this... Would your old wife not want to wake up with her children on her birthday - to have them jump on your best and say Happy Birthday mum etc..
I suspect she would have loved it..
Heres the thing..The wife you knew is gone.. and to a degree ( certainly in my sitch ) the mother to your kids you knew is gone as well..
Replaced by somebody who's actions are pure selfish.. Hence she no longer cares if she wakes up in the house with her kids..
You cant change her or her actions. I suspect these actions will upset the children, so just be there for them.. Prepare for the worst ( divorce ) and plan for being the best father you can be.. Let her enjoy the car crash decissions she makes .
The old W will definitely like to wake up on her birthday morning with the kids greeting her, go for a good meal and have a fabulous cake. She told me me before that a birthday is a must no matter what.
Unfortunately this whole thread of comments regarding the WW's attitude towards the kids and her decisions without regards to the impact on them is not uncommon. In your case it's her birthday, in my case 5 months ago it was Mother's Day. She went away for the weekend to be by herself and had to console my S5 while he looked out the window, tearing up and crying, saying "I just want to spend time with Mommy on Mother's Day." He was so excited to give her cards and presents, and she didn't care at all to be around. Maybe it was because she hated me for whatever reason and not because she didn't love the kids, but either way S5 was crying on my shoulders because his mom wasn't there on Mother's Day.
And two weeks ago my S5 cried out "I want mommy! I want mommy!" for 45 minutes, eventually crying himself to sleep while I hugged him and tried to console him.
I don't know if it's because W is completely oblivious to the pain she is causing, or just doesn't care. Either way it [censored] and I'm sorry you're going through it as well. All we can do is be there for our kids and help them through it as much as possible. Hang in there.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
A, If you are truly having suicidal thoughts then you should seek the help of a professional immediately.
Yes I've engaged a therapist on a monthly basis to tide me thru this situation. I'm not going to let the suicide thoughts take over me. I have a lot of things that I can about apart from my marriage that I can't bear to lose.
Originally Posted by LH19
It's gonna take a really long time for your W to hit rock bottom. My ex is in about year 7 of her crisis/change in personality. Her relationship with the kids is bad. They were both crying on the last exchange that they don't like being with her anymore. And it was her birthday! It's sad for my kids but also very predictable. All these situations run on the same script. You have to minimize the damage for your children.
The key is to use the pain to become a better person and the rest will work itself out.
7 years is freaking long! I don't think i have the stomach to wait that long but who knows? Prior to me meeting my W I was enjoying singlehood to the fullest. And then she came along, got pregnant and I had to step up to be a responsible father and husband. It wasn't a bed of roses, I own 50% of the fault that led to this stage but I was never a violent person. No physical abuse took place; only those common cold wars and screaming when the kids got out of hand. It seems my W isn't that forgiving in that department.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
The key is to use the pain to become a better person and the rest will work itself out.
And to be that rock for your children - they WILL need you - As LH says, they all follow a similar script - and unfortunetly in most cases, the WW not only turns out to be a bad relationship / wife choice, but a poor mother as well.. Hence you need to step up - This will give you something to focus on !
Yes LH, I NEED TO BE THE ROCK. Not that Dwayne Johnson rock (it will be cool though).
She was a good mother prior to this shiitshow; albeit a little bit on the anxious-parenting style type though. She took good care of them and they were the centre of her universe. I used to get jealous because our sex life dwindle because of it and she made me feel that I was never good enough for her.
I am thinking that her moving out is the last straw for me but after reading other sitches here, it might not be the case. Her moving out might kick start her rock bottom because in my "rosy glass" perspective, she was very comfortable with a lot of things. She never had to worry about finances because I was working my ass off to provide and I tried to get her everything she needs. Prior to me marrying her I helped her clear off her CC debts where her mindless spending racked up to 40K++ with her ex BF (we got together after they broke up but the debt remained). I was constantly helping her around the house but I do fumbled at times and I was rather impatient. It's those tiny accumulation of resentment coupled with lack of communication that resulted in this sitch blown out of proportion.
This is a huge lesson for me. I've made poor choices and I'm owning up and cleaning up my act for myself. I like where I am now but there's still a lot more for me to improve on. Now i just need to bite the bullet and let the emotions flow thru me. I need to pivot my thoughts to the notion that separation isn't the end yet. It's tough man.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I am thinking that her moving out is the last straw for me but after reading other sitches here, it might not be the case. Her moving out might kick start her rock bottom because in my "rosy glass" perspective, she was very comfortable with a lot of things. She never had to worry about finances because I was working my ass off to provide and I tried to get her everything she needs. Prior to me marrying her I helped her clear off her CC debts where her mindless spending racked up to 40K++ with her ex BF (we got together after they broke up but the debt remained).
You are still holding onto a false hope.. She is in full WW swing, and its rare - very rare, that they go back to their old self so soon. Steve did post some stats once about the WW regretting their choices, and its a high number.. But its years and years down the line. By that point, most LBS have moved on. The thing is, in the early days, the LBS is sooooo desperate to get them back, that they don't make them work on their issues - and 1 year later, it happens again. Your WW has shown you what type of person she is - and what she is capable of. You need to have a LONG hard think about if you want somebody like this in your life.
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This is a huge lesson for me. I've made poor choices and I'm owning up and cleaning up my act for myself. I like where I am now but there's still a lot more for me to improve on. Now i just need to bite the bullet and let the emotions flow thru me. I need to pivot my thoughts to the notion that separation isn't the end yet. It's tough man.
You learn - Look at this as an education.. Self improvement and decide on what you want to accept as part of your new life going forward..
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I was constantly helping her around the house but I do fumbled at times and I was rather impatient. It's those tiny accumulation of resentment coupled with lack of communication that resulted in this sitch blown out of proportion.
The quote below is LH19 gold.. It will give you an insight into what proabably played out in WWs head. Some people are more resentful than others... Some let it go, others build it up - and up and up.. Until they release this resetment in the worst possible ways - add the guy at work giving the WW the eye and suddenly it all comes together - in their mind, you were a terrible husband and it justifys their WW behavour in their head... Children and family are just calatoral damage to them, as its all about them.
Originally Posted by LH19
When you live with someone, there is a huge motivation to keep the peace. Everyone wants peace in their lives. If you blew up over every little thing that happened between you, you would both be miserable.
As such, you push things down and gloss over them as you live together, and the consequence of that is that resentment builds.
If resentment builds too much over time, eventually it becomes "too much" and people start contemplating an exit from the relationship. During this period, the relationship is really "on trial" but the other party is usually totally unaware of it.
Once the trial is over and the person has more or less resolved to leave, you're on the tail end of a years long process. It goes "things are overall good, but this stuff is annoying" -> "These things are really annoying but not bad enough that I want to leave" -> "These things are really annoying and I don't know if I can stay" -> "These things are really annoying and now I have to get out"
Unfortunately, in many cases the "annoying things" were never even articulated, or if they were, not with enough gravity. Once the "I need to leave" point is reached, whatever those things are get magnified (the coffee incident) and new ones get invented to help convince the departing partner that they are making the right choice, its an act in self-reinforcement which sometimes requires lots of fabrication.
Last edited by MrBrside; 10/13/2008:40 AM.
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
Her moving out is exactly what you want to happen. At bomb drop the LBS best course of action is to hand them a box of their stuff and say "or your leaving me for him/her, good like with that". Then you go in the opposite direction. You build amazing life by being a grant parent, working on yourself physically and mentally, doing things outside your comfort zone. It's really that simple but most LBS can't let go because of the fear of the own known doesn't allow them to let go.
Meanwhile the WW runs off with OP and eventually realizes the OP is human too. Meaning flaws just like they saw in you. Eventually they realize they are in the same situation as before accept without all the history and less support because of all the bridges they burned. The "fading affect bias" comes into play meaning you forget about the negative motions you feel for someone before the positive ones. They start to remember the good times in the marriage. At this point they will start to doubt their decisions. Usually it's too late because too much destruction has been done.
This takes a really long time to play out and the longer you hold on the longer it takes the clock to start. Unfortunately there are no shortcuts so if you want to reconcile you need to start the clock ASAP.
A, If you are truly having suicidal thoughts then you should seek the help of a professional immediately.
Yes I've engaged a therapist on a monthly basis to tide me thru this situation. I'm not going to let the suicide thoughts take over me. I have a lot of things that I can about apart from my marriage that I can't bear to lose.
Originally Posted by LH19
It's gonna take a really long time for your W to hit rock bottom. My ex is in about year 7 of her crisis/change in personality. Her relationship with the kids is bad. They were both crying on the last exchange that they don't like being with her anymore. And it was her birthday! It's sad for my kids but also very predictable. All these situations run on the same script. You have to minimize the damage for your children.
The key is to use the pain to become a better person and the rest will work itself out.
7 years is freaking long! I don't think i have the stomach to wait that long but who knows? Prior to me meeting my W I was enjoying singlehood to the fullest. And then she came along, got pregnant and I had to step up to be a responsible father and husband. It wasn't a bed of roses, I own 50% of the fault that led to this stage but I was never a violent person. No physical abuse took place; only those common cold wars and screaming when the kids got out of hand. It seems my W isn't that forgiving in that department.
Remember, every sitch is different. My W went from "I don't want to be married anymore" to full blown Ring and piecing in about 3 months. I'd say that LH's ex is on the extreme side of length, and my W is on the other end of the extreme spectrum. The point is that it is a MARATHON not a sprint. So buckle in for a long ride. I like to tell LBSs to have a set date of when YOU will take action. Being someone's backup plan and waiting for them for a long period of time is not a fun place to be. I was giving my W one year to work through her stuff, and if she still hadn't moved one direction or the other by then I was going to go file for D myself. The open ended nature of limbo is not a fun place to live long-term.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Thanks for the great insights LH. Like i mentioned earlier, her moving out might be the start of her rock bottom.
I didn't have the courage back then to send her packing because of the kids and the fear of the unknown. I've always been a nice guy and put her on a pedestal, thinking that I can just satisfy her with things she wants (gifts, meals, vacation, etc). I was brought up by my parents that money is quite important and earning them is top priority. So I spent most of my time climbing the corporate ladder.
And you are gonna be mostly right, when she wakes up I probably won't be around anymore because too much damage and too much time has pass.
I really want to go to a place where I can be ok with divorce and living for myself and my kids. I wish that this separation not only gives me the time to bring myself to that place, it also will allow my W to come back to her senses because I can see that she's clearly driving herself off a cliff.
She just sent me a calendar invite titled "House viewing". I felt like she's once again trying to take a swipe at me and bait me into reacting.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Sometime happened earlier on and now i'm kinda feeling defeated on how i reacted.
It's her birthday today and the kids wanted to give her a present and a cake. Brought them out to the mall and gotten those. A small chocolate cake and some jewellery accessories where my girls chose them.
Fast forward back home. I had work calls immediately after dinner and while i was in the middle of the call, i heard my W screaming at my Ds. Apparently they weren't very cooperative in getting into shower and they were wasting soap. Crying ensues and slamming of furnitures.
And then my Ds came into my room which i asked them what happened. Heard their story and explained to them why mommy was angry and they should apologize. A few mins later, D4 came back and told me that mommy doesn't want to blow out the birthday candles and doesn't want to celebrate her birthday.
And that's why i kinda snapped. I walked over to her as she was blow-drying her hair and I told her in a firm voice," The kids picked the cake and the presents and really want to celebrate your birthday and i would appreciate..." I got cut off by her. She exclaimed, "can they wait? I'm busy. I didn't say I don't want to take out the cake."
I looked at my D4 and there she was, face so guilty because she might have told a lie because she wanted to eat the cake badly. I shook my head and walked away.
when i went back to my room i felt this sense of stupidity because i felt like i have made the situation worse because i confronted my W for something trivial all because my D4 lied.
We carried on with the cake cutting and the formalities after 10 minutes. The atmosphere was tense and she at one point mentioned not to take photos of it. I disregarded it and took a few with her and the kids only. I left myself out of the photo op.
I have this feeling that the whole situation could've gone better and i blew it because instead of being calm and find out more from my D4 about the issue, I went straight to the W and sort of gave her a piece of my mind.
Looks like my mr nice guy syndrome is back and the fear of causing the W to be angry is triggering some sort of guilty feelings. Is this normal? Or I'm just blowing things out of proportion?
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Looks like my mr nice guy syndrome is back and the fear of causing the W to be angry is triggering some sort of guilty feelings. Is this normal? Or I'm just blowing things out of proportion?
Yes, this is normal for someone suffering from NGS. Which means you still need to work on that. You need to do what you need to do, her reaction to it is out of your control. The belief that being nice to a WAS will get you what you want is a fallacy of the highest order.
GAL. 180s. Detachment. Those should be your focus. Not her moods.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Thanks Steve. I think my mind was in overdrive and it's thinking that this incident will be noted down in her little book of resentments and justify her reason for moving out.
I am going to push hard to put this behind me and don't care if it's a yay or nay for her. If this confrontation is going to give her the ammo to move out, so be it. i was just being direct and protective of my D4's feelings. It's water under bridge now. Nothing more i can do to control it.
I have tonnes of work to do on myself that's for sure. Sorry for ranting in this board incessantly.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Went for my usual therapist and was expecting the same old stuff; be kind, try to communicate yada yada... but then, plot twist.
My therapist suddenly changed geared and asked me about my insecurities and my negative thinking and then it led to my childhood. I blurted out my deepest secret that I was always trying to have my mom's approval. I never did. I was always no way better than my elder siblings. I'm never enough. And when my mom died, I lost the very person that I was trying to prove my existence to and I guess I shifted it to my W.
I recalled some of my arguments with my W previously I will mention that I'm never enough for her because she has high standards and I can never catch up to her. I was walking on eggshells all the time, trying to gain her approval and got more and more frustrated when I didn't get it. And eventually I gave up and worked on other things (career, hobbies, etc)
Then the floodgates opened. Cried uncontrollably and kept saying I wasn't enough. Therapist told me to imagine that my 13 year-old me beside me and what I would like to say to him. Wiping my tears and mucus I muttered, "Stop chasing anymore, you're enough..."
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
WOW! That is awesome. This is why IC is so important. A good IC will cut through the symptoms to get to the heart of issue. For some that is scary so they avoid it. But these things are emotional cancers. If you had colon cancer, would you want the doctor to give you diarrhea medication and send you on your way? Or would you want him to biopsy and remove the cancer? I do not get those that avoid IC, your experience is exactly why IC is a must...with a good IC! (IE, people shop around. If your IC isn't doing it for you, keep looking until you find one that does.)
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Totally agree with you on this Steve. I'm glad I didn't give up on therapy when the W stopped going. Now that I've let the cat out of the bag about my inner fears, I feel better about myself. Not necessarily about the M but I guess this is at least a start.
I'm taking some time to grief the loss of my M and try to be positive about life without the W in it. As much as I want the M to stay intact, I can only clean up my side of the street and the rest is up to the W.
I was re-reading sandi's threads and alot of things resonated with me now (it didn't happen when I first read it during the initial stages of my sitch). I've practically handed my balls to the W because of my insecurities. She has lost all respect for me because I have no confidence in myself at all. I have to stop saying that the kids will suffer the most in this sitch; they will turn out good/better even with a single parent if I put my best foot forward.
So for a start; any advice on how I can get my balls back? haha!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I do not have concrete evidence that she has EA/PA but I've always assumed she has. Maybe instead of saying open marriage I will change it to that I refuse to be in such a state.
She's going to view an apartment this saturday, if it goes well for her she will be moving out pretty soon.
She has been avoiding family gatherings and events for the past few months; I couldn't care less and I just went ahead with my kids without her.
The only thing I'm frustrated about is her frequent outings with her friends for dinner and drinks and her overnight stays which she never says where she's going. She doesn't even want to spend time with the kids and when she is with the kids, she is usually shouting at them to move their asssses to either shower or eat their food. But I do see there were moments where she was nice and calm to the kids too. Just that the shouting and her impatient moments were more than the calm ones. Should I voice this discontent to her?
Other than that, she has free reign to do whatever the F she wants; I'm not getting in her way in anything she does.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Don’t bother. Just be the rock for your kids. My ex is always yelling at my kids. Guess what house they would rather be at? That’s all you can do A. It will get easier when she moves out. That I promise you.
I do not have concrete evidence that she has EA/PA but I've always assumed she has. Maybe instead of saying open marriage I will change it to that I refuse to be in such a state.
She's going to view an apartment this saturday, if it goes well for her she will be moving out pretty soon.
The only thing I'm frustrated about is her frequent outings with her friends for dinner and drinks and her overnight stays which she never says where she's going.
I think its very fair to say "she is" - and 99% of the time, they deny it - even on their childrens lives. To put into context, i spent every night with my WW for over 7 years.. Even after a night out, she came home.. Hit WW world and she feeds me a cock and bull story of "needing a better nights sleep and not wanting the children to wake her up after a night out" - hence stayed "her mums" most saturdays.. Its BS, but you cannot change it.. And i garantee you that they won't see it as an issue or neglecting the kids.. In the selfish WW mindset, she is entitled to do as she wants ...
Originally Posted by AKuei
She doesn't even want to spend time with the kids and when she is with the kids, she is usually shouting at them to move their asssses to either shower or eat their food. But I do see there were moments where she was nice and calm to the kids too. Just that the shouting and her impatient moments were more than the calm ones. Should I voice this discontent to her?
This again is the norm. You need to understand her old mindset is gone. All she will be thinking about is OM.. Waiting for the next text to light up her phone or meetup. To her, you and the children are in the way of this exciting fantasy she now lives in. She is stuck in a home with you in the kids - therefore it is you and the kids that are making her unhappy. Nothing you say or do will change this.
Voicing this will make zero change - You cannot control her actions and you sure has hell will not understand her. So just be the bigger man, and show the kids where their support network lies. Trust me on this - They will see this and know who their rock is.. My relationship with D8 is amazing.. She 6 when i ended the reationship, but she knows full well who have the time for her
Originally Posted by AKuei
Other than that, she has free reign to do whatever the F she wants; I'm not getting in her way in anything she does.
Keep working on you - it gets sooo much better.
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
Thanks for the great advice LH and MrBr. Tough love is hard to comprehend for those with NGS but I'm trying my best to stick to it.
I'm teetering on the anger side and I feel it's not healthy. I have to let go whole heatedly with no anger to support it. Think it's going to take some time.
I'm preparing myself for the next stunt she's going to pull so that I can test my resolve and not go back to the balless sad piece of shiit again. Wish me luck on this.
And just to rant; tomorrow is my d6's graduation ceremony and at that same time she's due to go for room viewing. Talk about priorities. Tsk tsk tsk.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
A little over a month had passed since she mentioned about moving out. She went to view an apartment, tried to convince our current tenant to move in with her to split the cost. Tenant didn't want to move because it's more inconvenient and she has to end up paying more.
Anyway i left it at that and didn't pursue or push at all. Tenant came to me discreetly to tell me that the W told her she will stay for another year and see how it goes. Told her thanks for the update but I don't need updates like this moving forward.
And for someone who is looking to move out because she couldn't stand the sight of me, it's peculiar that she's burning more money on more new stuff; a swanky new dyson hairdryer; a mid-high end mountain bike and looking at installing a bike mount in our small apartment to hang her new bike. Clothes and shoes buying regime still going strong too.
As for me, I'm starting to get more busy and planning to spend more time with my workmates (I manage around 40+ folks in my company) via physical team-building events (spread out in small groups due to social distancing policy) which means I'm out every Friday evenings. Told W she will have to take care of the kids every friday for the next 4-5 Fridays. No push backs whatsoever.
One thing we have in common are the kids; this is something I'm grateful of because I can see that she's still trying to be involved with them. I can see an uptick in her managing the kids stuff(screaming and shouting from her still there but it's getting slightly better). And last weekend she spent an entire afternoon cleaning up the home to make way for her impending bicycle wall mount. The old me will take this as a sign that she's turning back; but now I'm more sceptical than ever because it's not a consistent behavior and too little time has passed as well.
Our R and SSM is in limboland. All my interactions with her were purely business; kids and house stuff. There were a few moments in hindsight that I should say lesser stuff and shut the F up(e.g. probing more on her statements). Still trying to improve on that. We don't interact when we are alone in the house in the mornings; just minding my own business and I leave her to do her stuff.
This limbo is giving me the notion that ultimately I will become a WAH instead if she doesn't come round. This is something i cannot control though. Living day by day right now.
I'm spending a lot time reading through the other threads and I want to say that again the vets here are god-send! Steve85, LH19, Sandi and a few others are so right in so many things. Even though some of us came from different countries and cultures but WS and WAS all behave the same! Simply mind-blowing!
Stay strong peeps!
Last edited by AKuei; 11/03/2006:51 AM.
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
It's not all bed of roses though. I still do have some moments where I have anxiety issues but I'm glad to say that I've kept it to a bare minimum. I'm trying my best not to get affected by the W's actions or words and just concentrate on my kids and myself.
Eventually I want to go to a place where I don't want to save the marriage and instead live out the best for myself and the ones that loves me (the kids and my other family members). If I save my marriage that will be a plus, but if I don't that's fine by me too. Still have a long way to go haha...
I'll try to journal once in a while and will instead spend more time reading and trying to motivate others in this forum too. It's time to give back a little to the forum for all the help that was given to me previously!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Recently went for a keyhole surgery for my right knee and as a result I'm more home-bound than ever. W took over the job of sending and fetching the kids with my car and she also decided to work from home for the time being.
I couldn't bring myself to get her to do things so eventually I still cook for the kids from time to time and also did some chores (I prolly did 30% lesser overall). While she was at home and when I was seated at the dining table eating my lunch she would talk about things happening from work. Validated the sheet out of it and didn't offer any advice because I assumed she didn't need any.
I was due to visit the doctor for a follow up last tuesday and she said she would drive me there but the night before she told me to get my brother to send me over because she had a meeting to attend. I just said sure and I went by my own instead of troubling my brother. No biggie and in fact, i found a coin purse on the road while walking which contain loose change. Turned out that coin purse was an expensive one; a hermes! It had no owner details so unfortunately I couldn't return it to owner. Talk about finders keepers! And that set me thinking; things turned out better than expected! I was a bit bummed out by her last minute change of plans but that coin purse taught me to look for positivities! And it paid off! But then again, it's a ladies coin purse. I have no use for it, haha.
Back to the W, she didn't bring up S or moving out at all, and she seems contented with the status quo. I, on the other hand am just waiting around for the inevitable. At times, it seems unbearable but it's a passing phase. I let it run through me and feel that emotion in that moment. It went away quickly and I was back to doing my own things.
I think I've more or less settled about my situation. If it happens, it happens. The lack of intimacy can really take a toll on you. I'm just putting in all my attention to my kids and myself. I hope I can keep the engine running because like all the vets here say; it's a marathon, not a sprint.
Looking forward to a less craappy 2021 I guess!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
D6 started her grade school this year. W had started to be more involved in prepping the kid for it. Lots of conversation happening between me and the W because of this. No R talks at all. And I was trying my hardest to validate (It's tough man).
W seems to be happy to be in this state of limbo; making home improvements here and there, taking on the responsibility of sending D6 to school in the morning while I take care of D4. Picking them back from school is still my job because I'm the one with the car.
I seemed to be handling it well but sometimes, I may spiral slightly out of control and will have this nagging thinking that maybe I should be the one to file it because I really hate this limbo state. It's either you're in or you're out. My speculation is that she doesn't have the financial means to move out and still be there for the kids so she's buying time to work out an exit plan on her own time. Thus me thinking about pulling the plug and expedite the move.
I still don't think I'm at a place where I'm ok to move forward. I know i'm going at it at turtle pace and I hate myself for it. "It's a marathon, not a sprint" this is the only phrase that is keeping me in check.
Because of my knee surgery, I can't GAL as much anymore but i'll be off crutches next week so I can start to do some GAL-planning! No heavy sports (which i love football and thai kick-boxing) for at least 6 months so I'm figuring out what to GAL alone. Thinking of getting more books to read; head out to a nice cafe to read it instead of being cooped up at home though.
Another thing that is boggling my mind is that she has been asking me to be more involved in some of her events; asking me to go badminton (which i declined because of my knee op; obviously), arranging to bring the kids out together for a swim, started to even coach me on how to fold the laundry, nag at the kids, planning gathering at our place together with me(i didn't actively plan with her, I'm more like a follower because it's her friends not mine). All these are pointing back to her old self; I'm not having high hopes of it because she doesn't seem remorseful for the damage she has done to the family (I assumed she felt oblivious because the kids are not so much affected given the fact that I stepped up the plate to be there for my kids; they are doing fabulous with me to be honest!). All i can say right now is that I'm working to be an effective co-parent with her. I don't want to give the kids mixed signals where I'm opposing her on the way we parent. It's not enabling her because her thought process about parenting is quite mainstream and not controversial which i can get behind. Although a couple of times i did questioned about her actions which i politely declined and told her I will manage the kids my way.
I'm still doing my therapy and reading up on a lot on this forum and other marriage-related portals. Still kept my weight down and doing pretty much ok physically (minus the knee op).
Just one quick question to the vets here; how can i build my self-esteem up? I can't seem to find a way that sticks...
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
I disagree. All those things are pointing to her wanting to cake eat. "I can live the single life, have my own place, etc, but still play family when I miss that part of my life."
AK, you should decline all of these requests. Letting a WAS cake eat is one of the worst things you can do when DBing. Unless, of course, you are okay with it. Some LBSs are. But since you seem unable to move forward with the D yourself, I am guessing you aren't in a place emotionally to handle the roller-coaster ride that is a WAS that wants to cake eat.
AK, as far as your self-esteem. Are you in IC? I know you had knee op, but have you been working out and eating right? When was the last time you updated your wardrobe? What books are you reading for self-improvement? Never stop working on yourself.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I have this slight inkling that she's cake eating and I'm not ok with it but the NGS in me kept wanting to give her the benefit of the doubt. I'll put a stop to all these. And you are right, i'm not fully prepared emotionally on that freaking roller coaster ride; but I want to be able to do it eventually!
I'm in IC since BD; slowly working thru my childhood trauma linked to my mom. I am seeing results but not at the pace that I want though.
I'm still eating right but working out is on a hiatus because I'm on crutches and moving around is a pain in the butt. Focusing now on physio instead.
About wardrobe and reading, these are good advice. I'll try to do that once i'm off the crutches and off to the malls! Just finished a book, "The subtle art of not giving a F**k". Planning to re-read DR sometime soon before more books arrive from Amazon...
And oh! I've started learning Japanese because it's beneficial to my job. I hope that counts as working on myself!
M(36), W(36), D(6), D(4) M-7, T-8 Bomb Drop - Nov 28, 2019 W requested separation - Sep 30, 2020
Last edited by job; 02/02/2104:06 PM. Reason: added link to new thread
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
