Just wanted to check in although not a lot has changed really. W has stayed over a few times and communication still good (and relationship getting better) but physical side hasn't really improved very far. Still suspect there is ongoing contact with OM that hasn't properly broken off yet although she says it has. W maintains it was all over a long time ago now but if I found out the PA is still active I think I'd have to call it a day as hard as that would be. W still has him on some social media although says communication has stopped. It's just not good enough. Feel a bit in stalemate really but so worn out from everything. I think I need to be stronger and reset some boundaries. W says she is scared of coming home and going back to our previous M incase it doesn't work out.
I think she's scared of getting back and truly getting rid of OM though I don't want to admit that. I worry she's taken OM underground now. Considering all the conversation etc we've had I don't know what I'd do if I found out she's still in contact. Feel I need closure either way. Lots of positive progress regarding our general relationship, but the important part to me is still a big fat no change. W has put up a barrier and said that she doesn't feel right about sharing messages etc as she thinks that's not a healthy restart to the relationship. I think I'm going to have to set it out as an expectation. A small part of me wants to snoop and find out for myself so she isn't in a position to hide or clean it but I know that's probably not healthy. Should I just turn round and give her an ultimatum/set of expectations before she can come home? Should I just demand full access?
OS2, this sounds so much like my own sitch that I can't even tell you. WW who was in an EA and possibly a PA (I may never know) but still had reservations about ending our MR... felt some tugs of guilt and hesitation. Would make baby steps back towards me and then pull back. (Some of this is certainly temp-checking to see if we are still on the hook). We were living in the same house but she was going out and staying out late with GFs from time to time, and we were not always sleeping together. Sometimes she would come in and sleep in MBR with me, and other times she'd sleep in guest room. Sometimes she'd even touch me or come over close to me at night, but nothing more. It is a very difficult/delicate situation to be in... Just from the way you describe it I feel like your W is a bit like my W... heart not hardened all the way through, some of her steps back towards you are perhaps hopeful and not strictly motivated by cake eating or temp-checking. I don't want to get your hopes up here, because one thing you definitely do NOT want to do is turn on the pressure by trying to force things with her (Saying "ILY", actively pursuing her for dates, etc) but, rather, watch, wait, and continue to GAL, 180, and validate towards her where appropriate.
If she shows enough interest and seems genuine (look over Sandi2's threads and posts for the signs to look for that a WW is truly ready to "turn"-- typically when she shows true remorse, complete surrender to transparency measures, willing to do "whatever it takes" to save MR), the next step for y'all, and particularly for her, is likely individual counselling to work through some of her own issues and help her get over the affair. This can sometimes be handled, in appropriate cases, by having IC be a precondition to working on the MR when she voices a willingness. Again, you will know when she is ready for this kind of step but right now i don't think she is... i think she is just mourning the OM and the affair.. my W went through this stage. It can take a while. She needs to miss the MR and to miss you before she is truly remorseful and ready... and the best way you can contribute to that happening is by GAL-ing like a madman, detach, and stop obsessing so much about her.
H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18
"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7
"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
Thanks both, really appreciated. I think W is in quite a bad place now. She's struggling to be motivated in her life and I think it could be grieving the A mixed with the guilt/shame or possibly one more than the other. It's a waiting game.
If the EA is still continuing she is cake eating currently coming over for security/friendship and similar to dual mating as referenced above. She is contemplating moving back in. I told her tonight that a condition of that is total openness of phone and messages. Should I tell her she shouldn't come round for the odd night until she agrees to the terms too? The stalemate is difficult currently and I have no idea whether I'm enabling her playing both sides for the time being. I do feel I've been too nice at times.
The marital home and particularly the marital bed is for the married couple. If she is in an affair or even in contact with someone with whom she had been having an affair, then she is not interested in being in the marriage. You cannot have a "marriage" of three people.
How do you approach that issue when she "wants to come back?" Well, you can't control her, you can only control YOU. So, you set boundaries to protect YOU (and your children if they are minors). Have you set a boundary with her that you won't share your W or live in an "open marriage"? If not, why not? If so, what would the consequences be if she violated that boundary? Other boundaries can be "I will not accept verbal abuse" (If that has been an issue) or "I will not lie to my children to protect your affair" or the like. Boundaries really need to be tailored to protect your own particular/personal value system. I was not awesome at defining and enforcing boundaries, though i think I ended up doing an adequate job in the end. There are alot of threads on these boards about boundaries, some stickied, i think, and you can google the concept as well. It is not unique to DB-ing.
H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18
"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7
"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
Bit of an update. W says she loves me, is attracted to me and wants to be with me but is struggling with emotional attachment/intimacy. I said I thought that would come back in time but she has to comply with my requests before she comes back. (Far better at boundaries thank you). I said I don’t think she has to be totally healed/fixed emotionally but she does need to show total commitment of what she wants long term and that the M will take work but can’t really start until she commits. I think EA is slightly less likely now but still don’t know. W said she’d be devastated without me in her life which makes me think it’ll work out. W said she wants time and will be totally committed if she comes back. Part of me wonders whether she’s running the clock on the EA, although I think some of this was an issue before the A as the M deteriorated from her perspective last year.
More detachment etc. I couldn’t find sandi2’s signs of turn but that would be useful. Will look again.
So to simplify things for you take out her words because they mean absolutely nothing. In her actions is she showing you anything to make you believe she wants to reconcile with you?
24/7 access to her phone, computers, passwords, journals on demand. No GGW or girls night out. Counciling that she initiates. Total financial control. STD panel test. Did I forget anything? People will move heaven and earth to want to be with someone who is a catch and is morally backbones and financially sound. Yes action speaks louder than words. She monkey branched, and lost the branch in the fantasy.
So to simplify things for you take out her words because they mean absolutely nothing. In her actions is she showing you anything to make you believe she wants to reconcile with you?
^^^THIS^^^ It is not at all unusual for a WAS to suddenly express interest in recon and even cry/ beg/ plead only to revert right back to being a full-blown WAS shortly after. Don't believe anything she says and only half of what she does. That still applies.
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
24/7 access to her phone, computers, passwords, journals on demand. No GGW or girls night out. Counciling that she initiates. Total financial control. STD panel test. Did I forget anything? People will move heaven and earth to want to be with someone who is a catch and is morally backbones and financially sound. Yes action speaks louder than words. She monkey branched, and lost the branch in the fantasy.
