What I hear is you are taking care of yourself Cardinal and Wayfarer
Personally, I think it is the highest road to listen to ourselves
Truthfully, there are no real tactics to make a MLCer turn back, but being happy contented confident person can be attractive and getting enough sleep and rest adds to that new person we are becoming
On the other Hand, H will not find the happiness he seeks by running and playing in replay We rarely if ever hear on these boards the MLCer created this great life over time, their new fantasy nife crumbles like sinking sand
Build your house on a strong rock
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
I know H has gone to workshops on how to D in the past, and I want to make sure I feel like I have knowledge as well, so I'm meeting with a different lawyer tomorrow morning for a consult (no one in the area does free consults, unfortunately!). I'm hoping you all might be able to look over these and add any other questions I haven't thought of. I'll include them below.
Quick background: I had a consult with a lawyer who also does mediation a couple months after BD, and at that point I didn't have many specific questions; I remember she said it seemed reasonable that I would stay in the house (we rent, and I couldn't afford to rent a new apt/house in the current market—well, I couldn't afford to support myself in our own house without spousal support, either.) and that I would keep our pets. I have no idea what H's expectations are. We haven't split finances. We were married 10 years in November, and I don't know when he considers our date of separation to be, but BD was in June.
Questions for lawyer: If I am served with papers, is there any case in which I would not have to respond (i.e. default), even if we are planning to come to an agreement? If I don't want this, what is the minimum I can do and still protect myself financially?
If I don't respond to papers, and we don't have an agreement yet, will D be finalized anyway?
If I do respond, what should I keep in mind as I formulate my budget for the expense declaration? Is there a recommended way to estimate car expenses? (We've never made a budget for anything, and I've just been planning on looking over my own expenses in the past several months for estimated budget, but I'm afraid I'll leave out important $).
Can I reasonably expect to stay in the house and keep the pets?
Given the disparity in our income, what is best/average/worst I can expect in terms of spousal support payments? Would this change if my current employment circumstances change before D is final?
Am I entitled to pension/retirement and social security payments?
Anything else I'm entitled to that I should know about?
Previous lawyer mentioned that if I don’t have job w/ health insurance by the time D would be final, judge won’t rush it along. What does this mean?
There is never a case in which you are served with a lawsuit and don't file a response. Regardless of your plans, plans change. Don't rely on the promises of someone suing you or threatening to do so (a divorce is a lawsuit).
If you don't respond he can take a default and have things awarded in a manner that suits him and not you. Not a smart idea.
The lawyer should be able to help provide you with worksheets on expenses if those things matter. It may be that income disparity, length of marriage, and your ability to support yourself will be the deciding factors in whether you get alimony and how much. Some states use income tables.
Do you have disabilities or reasons you are not employable or require training to become employable/more employable?
Not sure a court awards a rental property to any one person. Try to work at least that out with him. Does he want the property still? Can you afford to rent it on your own (generally have to show debt to income ratios to qualify)?
Treatment of pets differs by state. Progressive states may view as similar to children, others will view as property. Does he want the pets? Don't make issues of things he doesn't even want. He will feel like he gave you something (for which he will expect a quid pro quo) and he may not even care. Just casually ask him some of this without telling him your thoughts if you can.
Also ask about social security. Depending on age, etc. you may be able to retain his as a benefit.
Military benefits?
Is there separate property (inheritance, property before marriage, stocks/bonds)? Will your state take this into account (mine will)?
I think the lawyer meant the court may not rush it to give you time to get a job with benefits.
Lawyers don't bite. Find one you like. Given minor assets and no children, find one that will give you a flat rate you are happy with if possible.
So long as you have been married for 10 years, you would qualify to claim spousal benefits based on his work record. This assumes that 1/2 of his social security benefit would be more than your individual benefit - sometimes you would still be better off with your own benefit. But if he were to die, you could claim widow's benefits based on his social security, which would be 71.5-100% of his benefit depending on what age you claim it.
If you are in a community property state, you are entitled to a percentage of his pension based upon a formula (roughly years married during the years earning the pension divided by total years spent earning the pension divided by 2). I don't know what's normal in other states. For example - my ex worked for 28.5 years for his pension. I was married to him for 17.5 of those years (24 years total, but only 17.5 of those while he worked for that company). My percentage of his pension is roughly (pension amount Z x 17.5/28.5) x 0.5 = 30.7% of the total pension amount Z.
If he has moved out, you should be bale to keep your rental if the landlord deems you credit worthy on your own.
Pets he could fight you for, but will he?
Budget - girl, it's way past time to learn to keep a budget. Look at your average sending but also think about big annual or periodic expenses. Add up things like car registration, insurance payments, car repair estimates, veterinary bills, clothing expenses, etc. and divide by 12.
OwnIt, kml, thanks so much for these thoughts. I'll expand a bit more on points you brought up:
Progressive community property state, yes. No separate property. I received a grant at one time, but it went into our savings account, so I'm sure it's community property too.
House/pets: I really have no idea if H will want pets or to stay in the house. He hasn't moved out and hasn't paid much attention to either since BD, but I can see him not wanting to face the reality of moving out and other changes a D would necessitate from him. I want to be ready for the possibility that he would suddenly insist on staying in house with pets, since I have no idea what to expect of him anymore. We've lived here for a long time with no rent increase, and the landlord is wonderful. I'm sure he knows I want the pets, but I'm not sure what he thinks my feelings are about the house.
Income and and budgeting: without going into too much detail, I'll say that I teach at the college level very part-time and in my field full-time jobs are non-existent; PT does not begin to pay for a life here. H has always supported me and encouraged me to pursue my own projects in between teaching gigs, so I was not prepared at all for the sudden possibility of having to support myself entirely. Right before BD I got a PT minimum wage job to help us save more money, and I've since increased hours to full-time, which would only cover current rent and a bit more, which is why I need spousal support, at least in the meantime. I could also look into getting a roommate if I needed to. Moving out will only mean higher rent. I've had a couple of interviews for career jobs and am hopeful I will be able to find something that will support me in the next six months.
H was really relaxed about money and never wanted to make a budget--it's an argument I let him win. What did I care--I trusted him completely! Now of course it's a problem that I've never had access to our savings account (!). I have been making a list of bills that I'll need to budget for as they come up.
Are you sure that you and your h have a savings account? If you aren't sure, check with the bank. If it is a joint account, you should be able to get info on it. Are you aware if your H has an IRA account in addition to his normal retirement?
Also, be sure to ask about health insurance.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
You are moving in the right direction and a good Divorce L will guide you and answer all those questions
You seem like you will have opportunities with a good FT job in the future with your education and a positive mindset, something will open for you...
As for now, the L will let you know exactly what you stand to get as support and alimony ..
Hang in there
I was so worried I would have nothing after D and have to raise my 2 school age children with a minimum waged job I had not worked in years at that time and was aa stay at home MOm
But All worked out perfectly and better than I could have imagined..today I run our once shared business and XH lives far away
hang in there..
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
job and peace, thank you for the support. Our savings account was opened by his dad as a gift when we married, only in his name though. I never thought anything of that of course. We put all of our wedding money in it and have used it since.
I too worry a lot about money now. It’s scary to go from relative financial stability to worrying about my ability to pay rent. I guess I can always move out of the state, leave the life I’ve built here behind, and live with my parents in an emergency, so there’s that. It feels unfair that he isn’t facing this kind of uncertainty.
I’m probably feeling resentful because I’m circling around to anger at the situation again—having one of those days when I can’t believe this is happening, can’t believe we’re barely talking, can’t believe he doesn’t seem to miss at least the friendship we had. The possibility of ever reconciling feels so far away when we are living as distant roommates. I was reading about couples who D and remarry, and it seems like such a small percentage overall, statistically. But then I also thought: What percentage of people who D are dbing? I think that makes a difference, at least in growth for the LBS. What percentage of divorces involve MLC? A friend is going through an “amicable” divorce after months of MC, in which they’ve both decided to D. Imagine!
I don’t want to lose hope, so I’ve been trying to find my PMA again. Last night I had a dream H did something mean and I started yelling, Who are you? while shaking and hitting him, as if I could snap him out of this back into the man I know. Not much interpretation required there—I know this is what I’ve wanted to do even as I maintain a calm front and strive for empathy!
I’m probably feeling resentful because I’m circling around to anger at the situation again—having one of those days when I can’t believe this is happening, can’t believe we’re barely talking, can’t believe he doesn’t seem to miss at least the friendship we had. The possibility of ever reconciling feels so far away when we are living as distant roommates. I was reading about couples who D and remarry, and it seems like such a small percentage overall, statistically. But then I also thought: What percentage of people who D are dbing? I think that makes a difference, at least in growth for the LBS. What percentage of divorces involve MLC? !
Cardinal, I’ve been feeling the exact same way for the last couple of days as I interview L etc...it just hits me sometimes and seems so unreal and R seems like an impossibility because of the roommate status too. I think for me what hurts the most is trying so hard to detach when he’s right there and I just want to have a reasonable conversation with him (orANY conversation for that matter) knowing that I can’t. I feel like you are correct when you brought up how many people who D are dbing....cause I’ve given this some thought too and believe that most people either wouldn’t take the time to figure out what was really going on and or have the patience and guidance that we are getting from eachother on this site.
