Persistent Endurance (Part 5)

[curtis7]

Journaling.

Filling in some gaps in the week leading up to WW's inadvertent text to me about OM3.

Last weekend we held a birthday party for D5. W and I got along well with the setup and hosting the event with friends. It was a very special day for our D. I was thinking to myself throughout that this could be the last family get together that I participate in with her.

Early last week, WW was contacted by OM2 (25 year old pickup artist AP) asking how she was doing. She replied she was thinking of contacting him the night before to see how he was doing but chickened out. They also discussed OM3 and she replied how he snapped a couple times on her, but she would keep going back to him as she said the problem is he is very...persuasive.

Then she texted OM2: "To be honest I was in a bad place for awhile. My pure selfishness hit me hard. Ugly and shameful. I'm so sorry. I really appreciate you telling me you're okay."

I really don't know what to make of this exchange with OM2. She clearly is still thinking of him and OM3. I just don't see her going full NC on her own. I've given her the benefit of the doubt so often since BD and I'm really over it. She needs to do the hard work. Even tonight I'm spinning a bit on whether to extend an olive branch and tell her that I will listen to her explanation about OM3. That lasted for about 10 minutes, before I concluded that it will probably be more lies. The problem I have is this lingering notion in the back of my head that perhaps she is slowly trying to end her contact with the OM and she needs to do it her own way and on her own timeline.

Who knows, I'm not a mind reader, does anyone think I should give her the benefit of the doubt and allow her to explain? If it is less than full disclosure or contains lies, then I end the call/talk immediately? Or do I let this marinate longer and let her come back to me if she ever wants to explain herself?

W and I also reached a milestone last week. 15th wedding anniversary. She did not acknowledge the momentous occasion all day. When I got home from work, she was on the lawn tractor mowing the horse pasture. I guess that was my gift. I did make a 3 picture collage of photos of the kids that she had not seen previously and texted it to her late evening. I included the following text overlay "It's worth remembering we did some things right" and added the anniversary date. She simply replied "awww, thank you." I replied "Thank you for mowing the pasture, I know you have a lot to juggle and don't know how you do it." She replied "You seem to be doing a great job." I wasn't broken up about her not recognizing the anniversary, my primary thought was wondering if there will be a 16th next year.

I've been NC for 48 hours. She has only sent 5 texts during this time which were about watching D5 during S8's baseball assessments, horse feeding instructions from the boarder, kid exchange time, and asking who was feeding horses tonight. I responded to none of the texts. I dropped the kids at her place, watched them walk in the house, and didn't get out of the car.

If I could predict the future, I expect her to contact a L on Monday and start the D process. This is usually her impulsive response or threat when she doesn't like the way I'm treating her or when I'm "icing" her and not responding.

[joejoe1]

Curt,

You keep asking the same questions. I promise you will keep getting the same answers.

You keep doing the same things with you WW, I promise you will keep getting the same results!

You know the answers, I truly believe, you don't won't to deal with the outcome. Guess what, nobody does. Stop doing the same things. If she threatens you with a D, don't let that bother you, why would you, you are her third option right now. Ha third option. I used ha, lol.

So no, don't ask for an explanation!!!! You don't need, you just WANT it.

Please, please, please, start respecting yourself, because your WW sure isn't. How can you expect another person to start respecting you, when you aren't respecting yourself.

It's time to do the hard right!!!!!! It's going to hurt, you are going to spin. It's no way around it, only thru. So buckle up, these roller coaster rides are wild and bumpy as hell.

Onward and upward

[DaB35]

However hard it sounds, you have to be positive for yourself.

Do whatever it takes to keep your mind in a good state, and keep doing that every day. It'll then become part of your daily routine. You'll feel confident and better about yourself.

Don't tell your WW what you're doing, just do it and let her see the changes.

[LH19]

C,

I really don't know what to say to you anymore. Did you really think acknowledging the anniversary was going to make her melt and run back to your arms? You can't play family with her, be her farm hand and her therapist and then go no contact for two days and not answer her routine questions. You're inconsistencies are going to are likely just to piss her off. Don't get me wrong it's ok to piss her off but only when you're commanding respect.

I really wish you would actually try DB but apparently you know better then AS, Sandi, Joejoe, Neffer etc.

Lastly I saw your post on Kikos thread and he gave you great advice. Retroville is not for your situation.

[ovrrnbw]

Curtis,

I've been there and done that when it comes to trying to keep a death grip on my WW. I understand that pain and the resistance to letting go. I read your post yesterday and didn't want to repeat myself, I didn't know what else to say. But yes, your W will get mad and be confused. I think my general message has been the same for at least a month. A while back, you were about to break through and she threw some bread crumbs which you happily named a feast.

Really it's time to DB, time to quit worrying about her. You keep trying to analyze her conversations with other men, why? Sever that connection! Make it to where you can't see it anymore. It keeps setting you back.

You want to know what I make of her convos with the OM? That she is screwed up right now. And that's what the OM think too, but they listen because they want some hanky panky. There is zero point to bring it up ever again unless your W is begging for you back.

Have you set a parenting schedule so that you don't have to text your W about it? Have you figured out a plan to get her horse under her care so that you don't have to text your W about it? These are kind of important things that need to be figured out. Once you have a plan, you stick to it and THEN there is nothing to talk about. But just going NC without taking care of stuff first is strange IMO. When I went NC with my W, there was nothing we needed to discuss anymore. We don't have kids or horses or anything. We knew who was paying what bills basically and that was that.

[curtis7]

I really don't know what to say to you anymore. Did you really think acknowledging the anniversary was going to make her melt and run back to your arms? You can't play family with her, be her farm hand and her therapist and then go no contact for two days and not answer her routine questions. You're inconsistencies are going to are likely just to piss her off. Don't get me wrong it's ok to piss her off but only when you're commanding respect.

I really wish you would actually try DB but apparently you know better then AS, Sandi, Joejoe, Neffer etc.

Lastly I saw your post on Kikos thread and he gave you great advice. Retroville is not for your situation.

LH, no I didn't think the anniversary photo text of my kids would have any bearing on how she feels about me. I sent it for myself. Our wedding day was one of the greatest days of my life. I'm still married to her (legally) and I wanted to acknowledge the occasion and let her know it wasn't all bad and good things did come out of it.

I agree that the family activities and feeding her cake followed by NC seem inconsistent, but there was clearly a catalyst here when she sent me the inadvertent text about OM3 that she should understand.

The Retrouvaille situation was a catch 22 for me. I had zero expectations she would say yes, but didn't want to have regrets in the future that I didn't try everything while fighting for my MR. I was prepared to confront and start the D process and was shocked when she agreed. This extended my timeline again. I realize my situation and where she's at mentally is not conducive for the program to be effective. My thought was if there was even a 1 in 100, 1 in 1000, or 1 in 1,000,000 chance, then it's worth a weekend of my life to try and save my MR and family.

I'm not discounting the DB guidance provided by the experts here. It has done wonders on letting her words and actions have less and less of an impact on me. I've come to grips that my old MR is over and she is so far off in la la land that it may take years for her to come out. I want to be in a loving relationship, if not with her, then with someone else. My patience is gone. I have been mentally tired and drained for months. I have put up with so much poor behavior and disrespect and it devastated my emotional well being for a long time. I have picked myself up and recovered. Rebuilt myself into the man I want to be going forward. My kids will know in the future that I did all I could. I didn't take the easy path, I didn't follow so many others in today's cut and run culture. I stood for what I believe in until I had no fight left. The problem is that I married a quitter and I couldn't force her to change, accelerate her journey, or escape her fantasies and addiction.

[curtis7]

You keep asking the same questions. I promise you will keep getting the same answers.

You keep doing the same things with you WW, I promise you will keep getting the same results!

You know the answers, I truly believe, you don't won't to deal with the outcome. Guess what, nobody does. Stop doing the same things. If she threatens you with a D, don't let that bother you, why would you, you are her third option right now. Ha third option. I used ha, lol.

So no, don't ask for an explanation!!!! You don't need, you just WANT it.

Please, please, please, start respecting yourself, because your WW sure isn't. How can you expect another person to start respecting you, when you aren't respecting yourself.

Joe, on the third day of NC, why called pissed off that I wasn't responding to her texts about the kids and the horse. So, I'm the bad guy for ignoring her after she sent me an errant text about OM3. I said why would you expect me to respond when you told me your other relationships would be over when you agreed to attend Rville, then I get a text that indicates they are clearly ongoing. From there I mostly listened. She said OM3 was a friend that she likes to talk to and that he was pissing her off. She said even yesterday he was trying to give her parenting advice about our kids. She said he can be a real jerk and flip for no reason, but she still wants to be in contact with him (she must be "in-love"). She admitted to having sex with him. She said the relationship will never work out because he lives 2 hours away, won't leave his job, and she won't give up custody. However, she won't break it off, because she can't get over why she would be doing that if she felt differently about me.

The things she said about the OM were compounding lies. She would speak in half-truths and lie upon lie to cover up her misdeeds to make herself out to be less awful than she's been. I just told her that I need honesty so we can put all of this behind us once and for all and move forward. She said neither of us can get passed this. I told her you don't know what I can and cannot forgive. Forgiveness is for me and that is for me to decide. She said she's had to distance herself from friends and family because they are judging her and say what they think she should be doing (work on the MR), but it doesn't agree with how she feels or what she wants, so she feels guilty and is conflicted.

She justified her feelings by saying my changes are manipulation to get her back, they won't last, and that I won't get what I want. I told her my changes are for me and the person I want to be going forward. She continued on into full MLC spew about always having to wait to get what she wants, that we aren't getting any younger, others judging her and taking my side due to the S, and how the kids will be fine.

I read your post yesterday and didn't want to repeat myself, I didn't know what else to say. But yes, your W will get mad and be confused.

Have you set a parenting schedule so that you don't have to text your W about it? Have you figured out a plan to get her horse under her care so that you don't have to text your W about it? These are kind of important things that need to be figured out. Once you have a plan, you stick to it and THEN there is nothing to talk about. But just going NC without taking care of stuff first is strange IMO.

Yes, parenting schedule is set along with horse care.

I told her that we should limit contact to emergency issues related to the kids only. She said I'm trying to punish her and that me not contacting her and refusing to take care of her horse is vindictive. Then, she accused me of being like divorced BFF's XH. She said we need to be able to talk about the kids. I told her if she calls, I will hand the phone to the kids. Regarding the horse, I said you fired me as your H over 9 months ago, I'm done taking care of your horse.

I told her that I can't continue this arrangement waiting for her to decide. I ended the call by saying as long as you are in contact with OM, then I need to protect myself, and limit my contact with you only as it relates to the kids. She fired back "Other Men", there are not "Other Men, don't make me out to be a f'n whore." I said fine, whatever, OM3.

The call did not go well and was more of the same as expected. I remained calm and collected throughout with some validation. Much of the spew was not deserving of validation. I don't think I'm worse off than I was. She had the opportunity to be open and honest, but once again chose the path of rampant lies. I should have shut it down after the first lie, or at the beginning of the call for that matter, but continued to listen to find out if she had made any positive movement. She reinforced her lack of feelings and respect for me. I feel she still completely resents me, seemingly no progress on that front in 9+ months.

As expected, W met with her L yesterday afternoon for a couple hours to work on sealing my fate. I feel she is setting all of this up according to her initial plan of being physically separated for about 6 months. Making sure she had her own place, could get her feet under her, and live on her own. Then, end the MR, showing friends and family that she gave it time and decided D was the right choice.

I plan to stay dim/dark in the weeks ahead and improve my DBing. She has a ton of work to do on herself. I just don't see her putting in the effort on that front. She's still a long ways off from rock bottom. If she brings up D, or paperwork arrives, I'm prepared emotionally for that outcome. I expect it at this point. I guess you could say my expectations are zero for saving my MR and high for it coming to an end.

[LH19]

Interesting that with OM3 she can't have her way with and he pisses her off and yet she's sleeping with him and then there is her husband and she says "jump" and he says "how high" and she has no respect or attraction to him.

Look Curtis the reality is you never really stood a chance anyway but I think you're going to regret that you never tried to DB. I really hope you can move forward and raise your boys and teach them about respect and honor. If you have ever seen the movie 300 there is a a scene where King Leonidas says to his son "don't forget today's lesson" and his son says "respect and honor".

So you told her you're done taking care of her horse. Are you a man of your word?

[neffer]

Curtis, you are the master of your fate.

You are a role model for your kids. Honor them.

Honor and respect!

[ovrrnbw]

I don't know why you break NC to listen to her BS. Now that you have a schedule set it's on you to leave her alone.

Listen to what LH said about OM3 vs you...