Alison, be very, very careful. I don't see anything different this time than all the other times he's turned on the "mister nice guy" routine to try and pull you in again. Expect the abuse cycle to continue to repeat. He needs to do a lot of hard work before he'll be able to be in a serious R again.
I think AS has a great point here. Let him do the hard work.
You don't have to give him the cold shoulder all the time. But be wary. It's going to take consistency and quite a bit of time to prove change.
If he really wants you back, he will give you the time and space you need.
Also I think if he makes true change, it will stand out to you clearly. You may not know exactly what it will look like, but it will feel right. (If that makes sense?)
Thanks both. Your warnings echo a lot of what I am feeling and thinking about myself. Day to day I am fine. I certainly don't feel under any pressure from him to move things forward.
There are differences. Him seeking IC and help from his doctor are new things and as far as I know he is following through with that. He's also taking responsibility and has dropped the blame. It is possible it is just an act to get what he wants - I can accept that. I also know it is very early days and people can pretend to be more or less anything for a short amount of time. I can accept that too.
I guess that sooner or later I will need to either trust his changes and move towards him a little bit with curiosity accepting that there will be some level of risk involved, or I will need to accept that I don't and can't ever trust him no matter what changes he makes or says he will make, and move forward based on that. At the moment I don't feel ready to make either of those decisions, and he seems to be accepting of that right now, and so I guess I need to accept it too.
Hi Alison, in answer to your question there are some good things going on here. But as I said he is only a bloke. In a relationship struggle he will feel tremendous pressure to prove himself quickly. Blokes tend to have a single focus and if he's trying to convince you that he's made the right changes he will expect quicker results than you do. He will be frustrated that you don't see the improvements as he does. It's a simple management problem - catch him doing things right and praise him for it. If he can relax in the knowledge that you have appreciated and support his efforts he can take time to concentrate on completing his transformation. Let him know that you value consistency over speed. It should boost his resolve and confidence that he is making real progress. But keep monitoring to make sure he doesn't get complacent. Good luck.
Last edited by Family Man; 08/13/1909:47 PM.
Now divorced, boys grown up. Now in new failed relationship( never again, please )
Thanks Family Man. I don't get the impression that he's confused or impatient - he seems to be dead set on putting his own mental health and wellbeing first, then his relationships with the children - he isn't pushing for R or to live with me at all. I think that's appropriate given our history - his own head needs to be straight and he needs to be the best father he can be, and then we'll see where we are when he's done that work. I don't get a sense he's frustrated either. I know he wishes I'd trust him a bit more and not always read the worst possible motivation into the changes he's making - but he also accepts I have excellent reason to be wary and things can go at my pace, or not at all. I think you're right about complacency though. It would be very easy for me to get complacent in my own changes and go back to pacifying and placating him for the sake of peace, and lose sight of what I actually want and need for myself. It would also be very easy at the moment to go towards him emotionally, and get that unhealthy dependent dynamic that really damaged our old marriage. I want to be okay in myself no matter what changes he does and doesn't make and there's work for me to do there, and work on not getting complacent about what I've already done.
Interesting Alison, I'm also a bloke and people seem to get a different impression about me from what I know is going on inside. The ploys we advocate on this site often require that we present an image of detachment when we hurt like hell inside. Acting as if is priming oneself to behave in a way we are not quite ready for. That is tiring and second guessing whether his latest change has been understood as he would like is emotionally draining. It seems like you are in charge here( even if he doesn't know it ) and I believe you may be able to help him stay focussed on the changes you want to see with small signs of approval. But don't micro manage him. As regards his priorities - his counsellor would have told him that he needs to get himself into a resourceful state before he embarks implementing meaningful relationship changes. He is following a plan and that has to be positive as long as it's a good one.
Now divorced, boys grown up. Now in new failed relationship( never again, please )
I used to think of it that way too, Family Man. As 'ploys'. There are lots of times that I feel affectionate or needy or upset or mournful and I never ever let my H see anything other than calm, confident, mildly friendly but not attached these days, no matter how I feel. I don't consider this a ploy or manipulative, I consider it a shield of privacy. I have friends who know my heart. I know my own heart. I'm as frank as I can be here. But I show my heart to people who have earned the right to see it. My H has not got that right yet, and the jury is out as to whether he ever will. He needs to make the changes for himself and his own well being and in his own best judgement, not as a ploy to get a certain reaction out of me. I hope that's what he's doing, but only time will tell. I spend more time with him now he speaks to me respectfully than I did when he wasn't able to. He knows 100% that any disrespect from him will involve an immediate end to the conversation and me leaving the situation (I still don't let him spend much time in my home - that's my space and sanctuary). I think in our case actions have spoken much more loudly than words.
You strike me as someone very well in touch and in control of your emotions. That is a very strong position to be in.
I'm not particularly worried that you will make a mistake with your vulnerability in either direction (either by shutting out your H or letting him back in). But keep posting if you do have that worry.
It does seem like you feel uncomfortable not knowing which direction to go and maybe that discomfort is taking up a lot of your headspace lately? Just an impression I have -- maybe granting yourself a healthy reprieve to let go of this question for awhile would help you carve out some mental space? Another one of those Zen paradoxical ideas...
I've just skimmed read through your thread, so apologies if I missed anything.
Firstly, you seem much more confident than you were before. I think you now know that you will be OK no matter what happens. When we start, none of us cannot see past a future without our spouses. We all say we can, but we don't really mean it. You also seem to be willing to take less sh!t from him. Before you were full of excuses, he's under a lot of pressure, he's really busy, he's going through some stuff (I'm paraphrasing), but now, you are putting the responsibility for his behaviour on him. That's a pretty significant change in mindset. You don't need to hear it from me, but you're going to be OK.
In regards to your last few posts. It's great that he recognises the need to work on himself and is seeing an IC. But introspection (particularly for people who are not good with taking responsibility for their actions) is a long and painful process. It takes strength to peel away the layers and face your demons. I am guessing he will at times go into himself at other times he will be emotionally needy and at other times he will lash out. Whether you have the strength to wait it out while he does this is up to you. To be honest, all you need to be is to be there (without demanding that you be part of his healing). Validate but don't allow yourself to be the fall guy. You'll either get tired of being his emotional crutch or he'll come round.
Unchien is right. He still occupies too much of your head. Even though your allowing him to be responsible for his actions, you [i] still [i] focus your attention too much on his actions. This is OK by the way, but it would be better if his actions spurred something in you instead of just on him.
Let go of the question of how you move forward and just be. Or, to give another zen-like paradox, the answers will come when you stop asking the question
Oh, well done for making sure he stays out of your home. This is one I am still having problems with (urghh).
It does seem like you feel uncomfortable not knowing which direction to go and maybe that discomfort is taking up a lot of your headspace lately? Just an impression I have -- maybe granting yourself a healthy reprieve to let go of this question for awhile would help you carve out some mental space? Another one of those Zen paradoxical ideas...
That is exactly and precisely it. I don't feel pressured by H and I don't feel worried, really, about his behaviour. I don't really trust him yet and that it what it is. I will interact with him in short doses outside my home while he continues to show me respect and a total lack of abusive behaviours, and I will see what happens. I don't worry about that decision, because I've already made it. I worry about what happens next, and the fact that I don't know. I think you're right and I just have to accept that I don't know and stop trying to unpick it and find an answer for myself.
Originally Posted by FlySolo
Unchien is right. He still occupies too much of your head. Even though your allowing him to be responsible for his actions, you [i] still [i] focus your attention too much on his actions. This is OK by the way, but it would be better if his actions spurred something in you instead of just on him.
Thanks Fly. And it is good to see you back here? You and Dilly and 97Hope went MIA all at the same time and I was a bit lonely here! And yes, I do think my focus is on him. Perhaps not for his own sake, but in terms of analysing his behaviour as a way to see if I can get an answer to what I want. And if I can just accept that I don't have the answer yet and concentrate on making my own life as happy as I can, that will never be wrong.
I have good GAL plans this week. Since H and I have become more relaxed and friendly he will come in the evenings and sit with Youngest (it really isn't great for Youngest to spend the night at his place on a school night or on the nights that H starts work at 7am) and hang out with Eldest a bit while I GAL. He's been very willing and flexible on that, which is great for me. So I am out for dinner with friends on Wednesday night. Thursday I take a visit to a city a couple of hour away for a work meeting, but am going to browse some shops afterwards as H is on childcare duty and no need to hurry home. Friday I am having a friend round to my place for a meal in the evening.
