It's a lot easier to condemn someone else's spouse I've found, and to view them as unworthy, but hard when it's your own spouse in whom you've invested. It's not just about romantic love but there are practical matters as well - financial, child-wise, family-wise, and sunk costs.
Ya, Nicole, I get that. Especially since I suspect the people who looked at my thread are wondered why I'm still pining. It's easy for me to sit behind a keyboard and vilify your H, but I should probably spend a little more time looking in the mirror.
M:23 T:26 Me:53, Wife: 60 S:18 D:16 filed 7/16 W moved out 4/28/17
Nic, i actually read your convo with him the same way as Ovr, asking about commute to his work from your building, maybe he was temp checking. Trying to see if you react, I think you handled it pretty well. The truth is you will have no control over him moving into the vicinity, in my sitch WH is introducing D3 to his 'friend' on video chats in less than a month of moving out. I have brought it up with him that I am not okay with it but again he continues doing it and i have absolutely no control. All I can do is provide stability and love to my Ds while they are with me. As hard as it is, try seeing positives to him moving to your building, your D will have a father she never had around, you will get some time for yourself. Be sure to talk about specific visitations as soon as it is finalized that he is going to move to the same city. Your D needs stability and it is healthy for her to see her dad more often. I feel for you when you say you do not want to be 'excluded' when your D is with him. I went through this too, I cried my eyes out the first 2 weeks he came and took the kids away. From the third week on, I am always ready myself to leave and GAL as soon as he takes the kids. it could be as simple as going to the gym or getting my eyebrows done, any option is better than staying home alone and pining for the children. In 7 weeks' time I actually have a schedule set for as soon as he takes the kids too. Hey when life gives WH, we got to make the most of it right. You are a strong girl, a wonderful mother and a great person. Enrich lives of those people who actually want to be a part of your life too. Hugs.
Davide, thanks. I'll try to tell him something like that. I need to rehearse it a bit more but I do think honest and straightforward requests are best. You know I'm doing great in my career and other aspects of life now but sometimes it doesn't matter. At the end of each day I'm alone once again and I still miss my husband.
Jim, I'm sure you loved your wife and she must have had a lot of great attributes. One of the challenges here is we only get to hear one side of the story. I'm sure your wife had reasons to be unhappy before asking for a divorce just as my husband had his reasons before he left. I'm sure you, I, and everyone here on this forum has our faults that drove our spouses crazy but in most cases married couples work those things out. When someone decides to end their marriage they kind of deserve to be vilified and it's natural to support the one who's been hurt. My husband deserves to be seen as a serial cheater who walked out on his wife and young child which is a despicable thing to do but marriage is about more than just feelings of love when you have joint property and assets, kids, and years of history together. I don't know. I'm trying to think about everything just as it sounds like you've done with the comprehensive divorce process.
Sia, it's nice to see you're one step ahead and you're already sharing custody and you're surviving. I have no idea yet what my husband wants in terms of time with our daughter but dropping by spontaneously can't be an option. I don't think he's planning seriously to live here in the same building. He's never helped with our daughter and I doubt he's willing to give up his freedom to start helping now so I assume his time with her will just be fun visits. I need to think more carefully about what's best for her and what's fair to everyone.
Sia and Ovrrnbw, I don't know if my husband's question about living here and the commute were temp checks. I don't think so, but I do question sometimes whether I'm interpreting his actions correctly. He's done a lot of bad, bad things but in the past six months he's sent all the money I asked him to send, even more than if we'd be divorced on many months. He calls our daughter almost every day now and visits every two weeks. He's moving here to our area. He sent me the car that he knew I wanted, which is nearly $1,000 per month like Ovrrnbw's car. He talks about his employment benefits in terms of "us." He's tried to be friendly and he seems interested in what's happening with me. Is he in limbo himself? Is he looking for signs that I'd be open to reconciling? I think the chance is really slim and more likely he's in another relationship. If that relationship ends though I expect him to consider his options further. I believe he's quite comfortable with how things currently stand - being married and separated with both freedom and a family to fall back on. It's all much better than it was in January 2018 and yet I still have no clue what lies ahead. I'm living as if he's gone forever but having him move nearby right on the verge of our 10th anniversary is going to be another challenge.
He definitely doesn't seem to know what the heck is doing or wanting IMO. I really wonder what is going through his head and heart. It's so hard to say. It's ridiculous too that we have to go through this.
I think keeping your expectations low is still the safest thing. Small improvements are good but it just [censored] to feel stuck forever. I wonder if he says "we/us" to throw you a crumb or what? If he didn't care about you at all he wouldn't be spending the money on you.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Ovvrnbw, my husband has always struggled with making decisions. I used to make all the decisions because he couldn't decide anything. It seems he can only decide something when there's a temptation as strong as a magnet, such as a beautiful 26 year old woman who makes herself easily available and offers him the opportunity to live wild and free. I struggle with making decisions too because none of my options seem good - if one was better than the others then it'd be easy. It's the same for you and your wife. You both need to make some serious decisions in the near future and it's easier to keep postponing them until you're sure that one option is better than the rest.
I think everyone here on this forum has a lot to learn about decision making processes and how emotions and perceptions can blind us from good decision making. We were all unprepared to be in the situations we're in and we probably made bad decisions that contributed to where we're at now, but we do have the power to change our own trajectories. The emotional attachments we have to our spouses are just so hard to break.
I've been reading your thread for a while Nicole, but haven't had a chance to weigh in. I am not as active anymore, but I am still keeping up with a few sitches.
What you said about sunk costs a little while back made me want to comment. Sunk costs should never be a consideration in decision making because they generally cannot be recovered. Only relevant costs matter that are happening right now. Sunk costs lead to biased decision-making precisely because the investment is seen as something more than it actually is. Of course you have sunk costs because you have to invest in a marriage to make it work. But that can't be recovered. Even if you R, you are starting a new venture and you cannot let sunk costs dictate how you will approach it because the dynamics have changed.
We hold on to things precisely because of sunk costs and weigh them more than what they are - costs that needed to happen to move forward or function.
So, look at the relevant costs for where you're at right now. How is his behavior currently costing you in terms of your time, emotions, mental stability, etc, and what is the return on you incurring that cost. What is your ROI? Sorry to put it into such crude project management terms, but an analytical approach can be helpful to determine what you should do. You are still operating under the impression that the sunk costs can be recovered if you repair your MR. But what you're not factoring in is current relevant costs that are not giving you a return. In fact, I would say that you, and most of us here, are at some point incurring debt towards ourselves rather than reaping modest rewards.
Sunk costs are necessary, but relevant costs are not.
Also, knowing that your H has been with other women in an intimate way, how are you managing that when thinking about a potential R if it ever happens. I am not wanting you to borrow potential problems from the future that may never come, but at least treat it as an intellectual exercise. Can you be with this man if he has slept with other women?
Hi Maika, thanks for taking the time to respond and share your rationale on sunk costs. You're right. I agree with what you're saying. I think I was approaching it from the angle of having sponsored my husband to come to the US, filled out all his and his family's immigration paperwork, assumed the role of financial provider for many years, etc.. It's hard to think about investing in another man in the future the way I did with my husband only to lose everything again, so in many ways it would be more practical to reconcile with my husband if possible vs. the other options like taking a chance with someone new or being alone. What you're saying is true though - there's currently no ROI (except the financial support and car). I already know my husband slept with other women when he left the first time and surely he's doing that again since he left last year. I could only be with him someday under certain circumstances and even then I'll never be as happy but as they say, the old marriage is dead so if we were to start over it'd be a whole other story. I don't really expect that to happen though, so these are all just mental exercises.
All, after all those posts I wrote, my husband called me the other morning crying and upset saying the job he got here was cancelled. Who knows why. Maybe they found out he was let go at his last job? In any case now he has to start searching all over again so he's back to square one. Apparently he was in the stage of reviewing his contract when they cancelled so he was sure he was moving here but apparently not. That's a relief for me.
Other update - some of you may remember me writing about the guy I met through work who lives in the UK. Well next week he and his colleagues are coming to my city to start our new project together with my company. It also turns out I have a friend from a different source who just got a job at his company (really bizarre!) and today she sent me a picture of her with him at their office. Just as I wrote to him to say I'm happy to see the picture he wrote to me saying he was happy to meet my friend and looks forward to meeting me. He also wrote on a messaging app asking "will I see you?" He's been talking about a dinner now since the first week we met and he started asking which night we can plan it and said we have to ensure we have this dinner (with our colleagues as well I assume!).
Given all the helpful input you've all shared I'd appreciate your help with this message this guy wrote to my friend and I: "As she is American I suggested that we might have a shared music interest (insert name of band). Turns out that was not the case! However I do assume that you are a fan? Shame they are not playing around (name of my city) next week!"
What does that mean? That if the band was playing we could go see them together? But he asked my friend first so he's just being friendly? I responded and said sure I like that band and I asked if he shares my interest in a certain sport. I said if so, I'd like to invite him to a game next week (and I mentioned his colleagues could come as well since they'll all be staying together). He didn't respond yet as it was already late in the UK.
I also told him earlier I'll pick him up at the airport when he arrives and take him to his hotel. He accepted.
Perhaps I'm being too assertive but I'm somewhat determined now to have a great time with this guy. Suddenly I like him again and don't care about his age and it seems he's not quite as young as I thought. If anyone could share their view as to whether he sounds just friendly or interested I'd appreciate it. I'd hate to be totally off-base. This is the first guy I've liked other than my husband in over 12 years so I feel nervous.
Sounds like you are doing well- way to take charge! It's not being too assertive -it is being confident. Look at this as just an outing and go into it with an open mind with no expectations. I'm interested to see how this pans out- please keep us posted. Blessings!
M51 w50 T-20Yrs M-16Yrs S15- mad at W for not trying and giving up 1 Awesum dog BD 10/31/17 separate rooms 02/08/18 wife moved out 05/17/18
Lonewlf, thanks for your encouragement. This is all just for fun so I'll try to keep an open mind and have no expectations. I just hope I can discern between what's friendly and what's a sign of interest. Right now I have no idea!
