Hey Nicole. Thanks for that message. Yeh I don't think I truly understood the core of my issues and where it was coming from until recently, and so probably wasn't able to articulate it well.
I believe that understanding the story that I had created for myself and that I would rely on and tell myself, even subconsciously, really affected how I approached life in general. Achieving goals is part of that, but not the full picture. It's all about the mindset and how I started the race with all this baggage that I didn't really understand. And then not winning the race and blaming the baggage that I was carrying. I didn't know that I could drop the bags and run better. But I liked carrying the baggage because it gave me a safe space and I could blame it for my failures, rather than seeing what's inside the bag and letting it go. And then eventually allowing myself to drop the bag entirely and see that I could still run the race. The whole time the story was that I needed the baggage to run the race, but not recognizing that now in my life I had a choice.
But making that different choice is terrifying because as soon as I let go of the baggage and win the race, it's going to disappear and I can't use it again. And then I have to run this race all by myself and take full ownership of it.
So success, as much as I really want it and know that I can achieve it, gets me scared. And that the person I will be at the end of it will be a different person that has been for the last few decades. And I do want to do that, but I have been afraid of it.
I am working through this right now because telling myself the story of victimhood hasn't served me well.
I agree with you that people deserve to be supported and love, outside of abuse. And even though I was a cloud of depression, I deserved W's support and her to kick my a$$ to get it in gear. Instead of doing that, she decided to bail. I know I should've supported her better and pushed her on the anxiety issues, but I didn't due to my own limitations. However, I took the commitment of marriage seriously and when BD happened, I was more than willing to put in the hard work. Unfortunately, she didn't.
In life, it's always easier to cut and run. Plenty of decisions I can see where that would've been the easy and more comfortable route. But I have in life made that decision to take the harder route because I knew that the gains at the end would be even better.
Just imagine if your H had decided to put in the work with you and struggled together, what type of relationship you would have right now. It would be damn almost unbreakable.
And that's why I have no time for $hit like if this person is right for you or not, or if they have this fault or not etc etc, outside of mental health and addiction and abuse issues. Most likely there were some things about this person that you cherished and liked, and they are still in there with them. Now follow through on the commitment and do the work.
I understand your sentiment about giving H another chance if he turned things around. I feel the same about W. The problem is that their timeline to do that is excruciatingly long, and in that timeline more damage is being inflicted. So, even if they do all the work and are ready to be with you, it's just become too late. What my W would have to do for me to consider a R is not unreasonable, but I know that it is a huge mountain for her to climb and I don't know when she'll be ready for that. And I can't wait for her to figure that out, even if I am moving forward in life while she's figuring it out.
So, that's why the D situation is a bit tricky right now. It's a huge decision on my part. That was not even in the realm of possibility for me when I took the commitment and vows. I was committed to the MR through thick and thin. Now if I file for D, I have to be fairly certain that the decision is coming from an equal place of commitment and strength for me.
I am also a bit curious to why I am hesitating right now to make this decision. She has not given any indication of any turn around. So, I am exploring my hesitation to see what is the road block for me and then see how to address it. It might be the fear of moving to a new chapter in life and leaving that bag on the floor and running. I don't know yet.
My immediate concerns right now are to get healthy and rehab my knee so that I can start working out and climbing again. Also looking to move to a new place to create some financial freedom and stability in the next few months. My current place is too big and expensive for me. I am looking to down size and bring down rent costs so that I can attack my debt and also save.
In the meantime, I am meditating daily, journaling a few times a week and cultivating a positive mindset and repairing my self-esteem and confidence.
M - I firmly believe that not every R is designed to last forever. I believe if a R ends, it ends because you got everything out of it that you could. I believe that the universe works this way.
My two best friends I have known since Kindergarten so almost 40 years. It takes all three of us to make it work and I believe we are still in each other's lives for a reason.
You should know by now whether or not you want to file for D. I am sure you still love your W, I am sure you still don't want a D, and I am sure you are still hoping for RECON. AND THAT IS OK!
"I am also a bit curious to why I am hesitating right now to make this decision."
Buddy you marvel me with your self-introspection, deep analysis, etc on yourself. Stuff that I simply don't have the depth or energy or whatever to do. So please forgive me when I go short and sweet with my opinion:
You are still in love with her and you still have hope inside you. No deep analysis required to explain that and that is OK! That is a MAN knowing his true feelings and while stronger within himself, not ready to give up.
Ain't got nothing to do with any more basic than that. u came here to hopefully not get divorced, allow yourself the grace to appreciate that is at your core.
2x4 me if I'm off base or disregard buddy...just calling this one as best as my untrained mind sees it.
I will have you in my prayers as you go through whatever the future holds for you.
Very good. Very detailed. And proof if you ever needed it that you are better now than you have ever been before.
Even with all the advise in the world - not many people have the ability strip away the many onion layers each of us has to see the truth underneath that we have built an ego/life around to avoid.
J - yeah i agree. the longevity of the R is dependent on the independent and sometimes collective decisions of both people. If one decides differently, then that's that. You know that from first hand experience. I feel intellectually I know what I want when it comes to D, but the issue of small sliver of hope for recon might still be kicking around. Appreciate the affirmation about it being okay. Sometimes through this process it can feel guilty to still have feelings of hope and recon when so much has happened. As you know, I am probably one of the lucky ones where my W didn't go off the handle, and if she did do the GGW thing, it was out of the public eye and me.
B - that's an awesome insight. I honestly did not even think that could be a potential reason. I am going to have to reflect on that and see what to do with it. I am just letting it sit for now as I keep focus on some other immediate things. Also, I hope your insight on this makes you believe in yourself more and trust that you can see things for what they are.
Benni - 'fistbump' for reals. Yeah I know I am a way better person now. My past self is a shadow of what I am now. That trust is huge. Hope things are going well for you man.
I spent some time journaling again today and it was very helpful. I am moving past the victimhood stage and towards crafting my life for myself that is coming from strength and love.
I also connected with a close friend today and we had a long chat about life and marriage and everything. It was super good to have the connection.
Thanks everyone for entertaining my wild introspective rides. I'm around.
M - No worries....I think sometimes the board over time make the LBS feel that it is not ok to take your spouse back. I know no one comes out and says it but it sometimes is assumed as we tend make the WAW into a villain.
So don't be ashamed to admit that you still love your W and want to recon with her. I am D but I don't carry it around like a badge of honor
I also hope she has not gone off the rails. You will have clarity in time
J - Yeah for sure it can feel like taking back your spouse is not the right move based on the tenor of the board. After reflecting for a while, I believe i have the clarity on it, but I just need to time it correctly. I have a few immediate things I need to take care of and once I can get that settled, D is on the menu.
Saw W today briefly. Afterwards she sends me some texts about and we're discussing an issue back and forth, which was fairly straight forward and calm. In the middle of it, she throws in a massive temp check lol. I've got so experienced with this stuff now that it was like water off the back of a duck. It didn't need responding to and I just kept with the issue at hand and stayed pleasant.
It's easy to see she's not worked through her issues. Being on this side knowing how much effort and time it's taken me to work through things and still putting in good effort to get to the other side, I know this is such a long game that exceeds my timeline. So, I have clarity about it now. Yeh, I still love her and did have hopes of recon alive, even if very dim - that was hard to admit but now once I got past that, it's much more clear.
So, the stuff I want to get sorted out should be by Sept/Oct and then I can file for D. If she does it first, then the ball is rolling.
I have just come to such a more positive place in the last few weeks after doing deep introspection work, that it's all suddenly clicked in place mentally for me. So, I am just going to let that sit and make sure it's consistent, and then make a move.
Maika, just out of curiosity, what was the nature of the temp check?
That's a big achievement to feel like everything clicked in place mentally. It's still wise that you're saving divorce as the last and final option. Letting all this time pass, and even letting a little more time pass after you know what you need to do, is something I'm sure you'll never regret. You waited a long time and it sounds like you could probably easily start dating again but you're taking all the right precautions to do everything in order. It takes a lot of patience and discipline to avoid filing for divorce quickly or trying to take shortcuts just to get out from the pain of your wife leaving.
Nicole - she mentioned to me that she knows that she would be the last person that I would call on for help on anything. It was sandwiched in the middle of discussing a specific issue. I thought about it being an opportunity to validate maybe, but decided that there was nothing to validate. Me responding to it would have opened up a bunch of R issues that I am not going to entertain. I want her to come at me directly rather than using these side steps if she wants to talk about it. So, I kept the convo pleasant and straight forward. She again texted me about something today, which made me chuckle because I have already told her that what she's doing is none of my business unless it affects the kids. I don't care if she is dating or not and what kinda relationship she has with other men - whether friendships or something else. She went out of her way to clarify and it wasn't needed. I am not reading anything into it except maybe she wanted me to know something clearly. Words don't matter to me. Action does. So, until I see some action, this is all riff raff.
About things clicking in place mentally, what I understood is that I was trying to do two things simultaneously and prioritize the wrong thing over the other. I was trying to 'struggle for clarity' and 'struggle for action' at the same time, and I prioritized the latter. What I realized is that unless I have clarity, and know the answers to the why questions deeply, the struggle for action will continue as a struggle because I don't have a deep rooted understanding of why I am able or unable to do it. And that clarity is about deep seated beliefs and trauma and self-narratives. There are always surface reasons why you want to do something, and they are good reasons, but they are not enough to sustain action. Only when deep rooted why's area answered can you flourish in action because you've done the emotional work. For example, my whole thing about the victim narrative in this thread - it blocked me from flourishing in action, no matter how good my reasons were to do it. Only when I identified the root causes, I am able to work through them and make the lasting changes.
And so when I say it clicked mentally and emotionally, it was through a long process of self-introspection, journaling, meditation, and questioning my story that I told myself about who I am. When this happens, your surface reasons are like bonuses that you get in life - better health, better relationships etc. And now because I've fundamentally rooted out the problems and the why's, I don't even need the surface reasons to engage and flourish in action. I already know that I can be a success and victimhood will not define me and my story moving forward.
I hope that makes sense. Sometimes it does in my head but I am not sure if I am explaining it well. This process also allowed me to really come to a better place of detachment and shedding co-dependency because I went from believing the story about myself, to actually trusting it. That chasm between belief and trust is such an important process and once you navigate it, it's like a whole new world has opened up. I trust my talents and my values and virtues, and no longer believe that I am this person and that person. I know I am fully.
The D at this point is inconsequential to me. I've come to a place where that is going to be a fact in my story rather than something that holds me down or back. So, when you take all the power away from the D and give it a new meaning, there is no reason to fear it or accelerate it. In my heart, I am already D'd. The last year has been living as if I've already gotten a D. So, if I made it through the 12 months, the rest of my life is going to be fine. I don't need her any more. I may want her, but not the past 'her'. Just like she wouldn't want the past 'me'. And I am no longer that man. And if I am no longer that man, then I cannot accept her without her going through growth and accountability. This 'me' wouldn't last in that R for a week. That certainty is so freeing.
Nef - haha! that's quite gracious of you. I honestly do feel like I have the force in me now. The last few weeks have been brilliant. My injuries sidelined me from working out and climbing, and so I had to sit with myself and figure this out. I was also desperate and hungry towards my self-actualization goals and once all the external stuff was put on pause, I gave myself the permission to follow through on that path. It's paid massive dividends. I honestly feel like a new man right now.
